Spiritual etymology

[stunnedbygrace]

Pride is etymological. Fear is also.
I think fear is the root of selfishness.…

 

[stunnedbygrace]

So Devin, selfishness is the same as greed. It’s root is fear?

 

[Raccoon1010]

So Devin, selfishness is the same as greed. It’s root is fear?

We are all different I think and raised differently. What is a problem for one person is not necessarily a problem for another person. When I was LDS they would give use Patriarchal blessings. And each was different and supposed to be tailored for each person in a personal way from God. Mine regarded anger as a thing I should be careful of.

I notice that drug and alcohol addiction creates a selfishness. And sins of selfishness.

Fear can lead to not helping people if you are afraid to do it. Or afraid of letting go of what you have. But I think selfishness is different than fear. I think if you don't have much of something and someone else is in need of it, like food, then perhaps fear can be the motivator to not help, fear of going hungry. One thing I learned about pain, since I have suffered traumatic pain during my life, is that pain can cause fear. This is probably why Isaiah taught to fast from food and to give that food to the poor, to combat that fear.

Selfishness can be taking that drink when you know it's going to hurt others. Or in the extreme, committing adultery or killing someone when you know it's going to hurt others.

The fear of going hungry can be rooted in selfishness of saying your life is more important than another person so that I eat and you starve. Or my pain and suffering is more important than another persons. The Lord said, there is no other greater love than this, to lose your life to save another.

 

[lforrest]

So if I determine that I did something with a heart motivation of greed, my attack would be the practice of and prayer for…generosity? And a war tactic could be to treat my flesh roughly, along the lines of, if you don’t shut up I will be so generous as to give it ALL away!

I'm not sure, I had no plan just a vague feeling of a gap in knowledge. But it does seem like it could help to target prayers.

Every sin sould have one or more motivations behind it. I'm unaware of any sin itself being a motivation, they are actions.

I think that motivations can be reduced to prime examples of a higher order. Or perhaps the intersection of multiple higher order motives.

 

[lforrest]

So Devin, selfishness is the same as greed. It’s root is fear?

If we look at Jesus words about the commandments, the greatest were love of God and Neighbor. As the rest could be hung from these.

And it stands to reason, and is biblical, that if we love God we will also love our neighbor, as this is God's commandment, and if we love God we obey his commandments.

 

[lforrest]

Pride is etymological. Fear is also.
I think fear is the root of selfishness.…

Fear has to do with punishment.

When exposed to God's Holiness or an angel who has been in the presence of God people are afraid as a natural response.

Or when confronted with a dangerous animal people are afraid. Or predatory people may incite fear.

It seems that fear may be from the flesh, and it there for self preservation.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

I’m both enjoying this thread and exhausted by this thread. :) I’m pretty sure I’ll be returning to it often as I think about all this.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

It seems that fear may be from the flesh, and it there for self preservation.

That is very plain to see (in spirit I’m talking about now) in discussions of the warnings in the Bible and mens reactions to discussion of those warnings. They fight to preserve, excuse and establish their flesh…

 

[lforrest]

It occurs to me that care should be taken to be specific about certain motives due to the inadequacies of our language.

We could say Love is a prime motive, because God is love. But obviously the love of money is not from God. That is not the same kind of love, it's more of a covetous desire.

 

[lforrest]

I am interested in the motivations behind Proselytism, or seeking converts to your religion or belief.

And I am not only speaking in the positive sense, but also the negative. Such as in Matthew 23:15. Let's put the cart before the horse and speak to the proper motivations, instead of actual because I don't know what everyone else thinks about this.

This is my list of what I believe proper motivations for Proselytism should be:
1. Faithfulness to God, because we love him and he tells us to make disciples of all nations.
2. Loyalty towards the Kingdom of God, that we desire to see it grow and the king glorified.
3. Love for our neighbor, that they should find salvation and avoid hell.
4. Joy because of a burning love for God, we just can't shut up about him.


This is what I think motivations for Proselytism should not be:
1. Fear that you must convert others or face consequences from God.
2. Increasing your numbers, to increase power, and influence.
3. Raising your income from donations.
4. Peer pressure, because someone else wants you to convert others.
5. Your own ego, getting others to believe or follow your lead gives you a dopamine rush.
6. Allegiance to an evil spirit that desires to lead others down any path other than Jesus.

 

[marks]

Every sin sould have one or more motivations behind it. I'm unaware of any sin itself being a motivation, they are actions.

Romans 8:6-7 KJV
6) For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7) Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

I think that the simple fact that God defines righteousness His way causes the fleshy mind to rebel against that.

Much love!

 

[marks]

It occurs to me that care should be taken to be specific about certain motives due to the inadequacies of our language.

We could say Love is a prime motive, because God is love. But obviously the love of money is not from God. That is not the same kind of love, it's more of a covetous desire.

Agapeo is God's love, in the passage in Timothy, "the love of money", phileo is used.

Much love!

 

[MatthewG]

It seems to me that there is an unnamed and undiscovered art in this world.

Spiritual discernment can be applied to any idea. And from that the spirit or spirits behind it exposed. All the way down to the roots. Sort of like an etymology.

An example that is probably not correct or complete, but will give you an idea of what I'm on about:

The idea of Marxism stems from envy and rebellion. Envy comes from pride and doubt. Rebellion, pride, and doubt all come directly from Satan.

So by breaking down an idea to it's spiritual roots we can form insights about it. Insights about how to categorize it, and how to attack or defend against it.

Not so sure those things stem from the devil as much it could be our own, soul.

Jesus made this remark,

“And having called near all the multitude, he said to them, ‘Hearken to me, ye all, and understand; there is nothing from without the man entering into him that is able to defile him, but the things coming out from him, those are the things defiling the man. If any hath ears to hear — let him hear.’ And when he entered into a house from the multitude, his disciples were questioning him about the simile, and he saith to them, ‘So also ye are without understanding! Do ye not perceive that nothing from without entering into the man is able to defile him? because it doth not enter into his heart, but into the belly, and into the drain it doth go out, purifying all the meats.’ And he said — ‘That which is coming out from the man, that doth defile the man; for from within, out of the heart of men, the evil reasonings do come forth, adulteries, whoredoms, murders, thefts, covetous desires, wickedness, deceit, arrogance, an evil eye, evil speaking, pride, foolishness; all these evils do come forth from within, and they defile the man.’”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭7‬:‭14‬-‭23‬ ‭YLT98‬‬

Mark 7:14-23 And having called near all the multitude, he said to them, ‘Hearken to me, ye all, and understand; there is nothing from without the man entering into him that is able to defile him, but the things co | Young's Literal Translation 1898 (

And having called near all the multitude, he said to them, ‘Hearken to me, ye all, and understand; there is nothing from without the man entering into him that is able to defile him, but the things co

bible.com

Within a person lies all the things of the heart which Jesus mentions to the people that he is around at this moment. From out of the heart of man, come evil reasonings. And these things correlate to darkness, the hardness of heart that needs to be lightened and only can be done so by the messiah coming. Into work on a person.


When it comes to spiritual discernment; wouldn’t that just be in the aspect of being wise by the spirit to an ability to realize the things that cause harm to others, like gossip, or trying to get on over on someone, if another person is bringing forth these things which are by the fleshly; to deflect by the spiritual nature in offering to do good, instead of bad by bringing in the spirit to the conversation when you are with that person, they may simply need someone to hear them out on their problems.

That is how it always seems to be with my understanding which may be wrong.

 

[lforrest]

Not so sure those things stem from the devil as much it could be our own, soul.

Jesus made this remark,

Within a person lies all the things of the heart which Jesus mentions to the people that he is around at this moment. From out of the heart of man, come evil reasonings. And these things correlate to darkness, the hardness of heart that needs to be lightened and only can be done so by the messiah coming. Into work on a person.


When it comes to spiritual discernment; wouldn’t that just be in the aspect of being wise by the spirit to an ability to realize the things that cause harm to others, like gossip, or trying to get on over on someone, if another person is bringing forth these things which are by the fleshly; to deflect by the spiritual nature in offering to do good, instead of bad by bringing in the spirit to the conversation when you are with that person, they may simply need someone to hear them out on their problems.

That is how it always seems to be with my understanding which may be wrong.

IMO Spiritual discernment more specifically refers to the ability to see spirits, be they angels or demons. While this subject may have more to do with wisdom, but is perhaps influenced by spiritual discernment to some degree. Especially if we are recalling how they manifested.

Yes, it does appear that many sins have motivation in the flesh and are not the direct progeny of evil spirits. But let us not forget that desire was awakened by Satan in the garden. And temptations may still have origins in the demonic. But we act on those when we are enticed.

 

[MatthewG]

Oh, do respect you and your aspect of the ability to see angels or demons. My self have never seen one, though being in and through graveyards and supposed haunted houses, and using an oujia board; my experience learned to teach me that there was no one there at the grave yard and there was no one there at the supposed haunted houses, and when using the ouija board I believe it all depends on the mind of the people around you, because even using it alone it brought to fact common fact knowledge that was already known to myself; thus it can happen with others, it’s really strange and unique how it works, but I don’t play that game anymore lol. No point.

Would you consider the possibility of there being those whom are in spiritual darkness (death) in need to come out to the light (life), to become renewed with the Lord bringing in the light to bring newness of mind, heart, soul heavenly information then from the land of darkness which they had come from, in the shadow of death?

I would agree though also the spiritual darkness if that exists then for people who are unbelievers. They are blind to even knowing really who Jesus was, yet to be born again until the change is made in the heart and a person experiences liberation in Christ to be encouraged to walk by faith and to pray for everyone you know asking God to help you by the spirit. Which one draws closes to God translating from darkness into light because of his son.

There also seems to me to be spirits of the world that are also darkness; which lead to hatred, greed, fraud, malicious, stealing, mistreating, sorrow, woe, pain. You know like now schools have “team spirit”, those listed above are the ones which attack us by our flesh in my opinion and lead people down dark paths by the dark heart of others, @iforrest.

And John says the wolrd
Only offers up the lust of the eye, flesh, and pride of life.

You are right about temptations, and how the soul of the individual makes their decision which correlates bi-curious through the flesh and the flesh does chosen action, or feeling, or emotion either by verbally or by sign language. In which Jesus says that evil thoughts reside in the heart of man; and what comes from the heart is what defiles a person.

 

[lforrest]

Oh, do respect you and your aspect of the ability to see angels or demons. My self have never seen one, though being in and through graveyards and supposed haunted houses, and using an oujia board; my experience learned to teach me that there was no one there at the grave yard and there was no one there at the supposed haunted houses, and when using the ouija board I believe it all depends on the mind of the people around you, because even using it alone it brought to fact common fact knowledge that was already known to myself; thus it can happen with others, it’s really strange and unique how it works, but I don’t play that game anymore lol. No point.

Would you consider the possibility of there being those whom are in spiritual darkness (death) in need to come out to the light (life), to become renewed with the Lord bringing in the light to bring newness of mind, heart, soul heavenly information then from the land of darkness which they had come from, in the shadow of death?

I would agree though also the spiritual darkness if that exists then for people who are unbelievers. They are blind to even knowing really who Jesus was, yet to be born again until the change is made in the heart and a person experiences liberation in Christ to be encouraged to walk by faith and to pray for everyone you know asking God to help you by the spirit. Which one draws closes to God translating from darkness into light because of his son.

There also seems to me to be spirits of the world that are also darkness; which lead to hatred, greed, fraud, malicious, stealing, mistreating, sorrow, woe, pain. You know like now schools have “team spirit”, those listed above are the ones which attack us by our flesh in my opinion and lead people down dark paths by the dark heart of others, @iforrest.

And John says the wolrd
Only offers up the lust of the eye, flesh, and pride of life.

You are right about temptations, and how the soul of the individual makes their decision which correlates bi-curious through the flesh and the flesh does chosen action, or feeling, or emotion either by verbally or by sign language. In which Jesus says that evil thoughts reside in the heart of man; and what comes from the heart is what defiles a person.

To be clear I have not seen spirits with my eyes. My belief in the nature of this gift is mainly from what I've heard about it from others. The gift is commonly used in deliverance ministries to determine what demon is affecting someone, if any. In order to prevent it from coming back repentance is required in the domain that demon has influence over.

Regarding those leaving darkness to enter the light, this deals manly in allegiance. By choice we believe on the Lord Jesus for Salvation, and by choice we invite him into our heart. By making that choice we have expressly chosen a side, the side of light and life. One can also choose to continue in darkness.

Yes, Jesus clarified that we are defiled by what comes out of our mouths. So people are defiled by sin for their words, and actions as well I would presume. Any form of expression.

But also consider that God hates a heart that hatches evil schemes. And God knows the heart, so perhaps it is something that God hates, but it is not a sin? Though I would hate to have a heart hated by God. And from the principal above, someone with a wicked heart is sure to sin when they open their mouth.

Now what comes into the heart can include temptation. So long as it is resisted I don't see it as defiling someone either.

 

[lforrest]

Romans 8:6-7 KJV
6) For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7) Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

I think that the simple fact that God defines righteousness His way causes the fleshy mind to rebel against that.

Much love!

Gal 5:19-21
19 Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, 21 envy,[a] drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

I believe these works of the flesh can be analyzed in more detail.

Sexual immorality stems from sexual desires, which are biological. It surely can become corrupted, but how that happens exactly is a question.

 

[lforrest]

Gal 5:19-21
19 Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, 21 envy,[a] drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

I believe these works of the flesh can be analyzed in more detail.

Sexual immorality stems from sexual desires, which are biological. It surely can become corrupted, but how that happens exactly is a question.

Unnatural affection comes from a reprobate mind. God hands us over to it when we forget about him and worship the creation over the creator.

Let us think of this from a higher position than ground level. What I see behind this is a spirit that is mocking God. Saying to God look at your creation, isn't this design better? As the creation is knowingly corrupted into something unprofitable. The spirit is given leave to use man to mock God, because man is himself mocking God by worshipping himself.

 

[GTW27]

Unnatural affection comes from a reprobate mind. God hands us over to it when we forget about him and worship the creation over the creator.

Let us think of this from a higher position than ground level. What I see behind this is a spirit that is mocking God. Saying to God look at your creation, isn't this design better? As the creation is knowingly corrupted into something unprofitable. The spirit is given leave to use man to mock God, because man is himself mocking God by worshipping himself.

Indeed it is a spirit, a spirit that has entered in. This I have witnessed. The gift of discernment of spirits not only discerns The Lord, but also the enemy. This gift to me is The Lord(The Holy Spirit) seeing and perceiving what man can not. The mystery of unnatural affection is no mystery unto The Lord but it is to the world.

 

[MatthewG]

Indeed it is a spirit, a spirit that has entered in. This I have witnessed. The gift of discernment of spirits not only discerns The Lord, but also the enemy. This gift to me is The Lord(The Holy Spirit) seeing and perceiving what man can not. The mystery of unnatural affection is no mystery unto The Lord but it is to the world.

Trading off evil for Good and the betterment, of one’s not only life but overall attributes to others by the spirit.