The Case for a Post-Tribulation Second Coming

[TribulationSigns]

You know what, I really don’t think you know much, so here, I’ll post the scripture for you:

Revelation 3:10-13 (NKJV) 10 “Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth. 11 “Behold, I am coming quickly! Hold fast what you have, that no one may take your crown. 12 “He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And [I will write on him] My new name. 13 “He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.” ’

You already quoted that Scripture before. You stonewalled by not answer the question directly. Let try this again:

1.) What is the hour of trail? What is it?
2.) Who will God keep from the hour of trail? And why?
3.) And for what purpose is the hour of trail?
4.) And why will it test on everyone on Earth?

Speak up.

 

[Sel@h]

You already quoted that Scripture before. You stonewalled by not answer the question directly. Let try this again:

1.) What is the hour of trail? What is it?
2.) Who will God keep from the hour of trail? And why?
3.) And for what purpose is the hour of trail?
4.) And why will it test on everyone on Earth?

Speak up.

What is trail? Are you trying to spell “trial”—??? I can’t really take you seriously.

 

[Sel@h]

You don’t understand what the hour of temptation is, and yet you can’t just be honest about it and just ask me nicely.

 

[TribulationSigns]

What is trail? Are you trying to spell “trial”—??? I can’t really take you seriously.

Are you blind or what? Can't you read the Scripture that YOU quoted? Your scripture says the "hour of trail." Quit stonewalling and making a fool of yourself.

You don’t understand what the hour of temptation is, and yet you can’t just be honest about it and just ask me nicely.

No, that is not how this works. I asked you a direct question because I came across your post and wanted to determine whether you actually understand the Scripture YOU chose to quote. Quoting a Bible verse is one thing; understanding its meaning and being able to explain it from Scripture is another. Selah!

I have repeatedly asked you straightforward questions, yet you continue to dodge them instead of providing biblical answers. Stop stonewalling and answer the questions.

1. What exactly is the “hour of temptation” (or trial)? Explain what it is according to Scripture.
2. Who does God promise to keep from that hour, and why?
3. What is the purpose of that hour of trial? What is it intended to accomplish?
4. Why does God say that this hour will come upon the whole world to test those who dwell on the earth?

These are not trick questions. They are direct questions about the very Scripture you quoted. If you understand the passage, you should be able to explain it in its biblical context rather than repeatedly avoiding the questions.

Let me be blunt: if you are going to quote Scripture to make a point, you should be prepared to defend your interpretation with Scripture. Get it? You can NOT simply post a verse, refuse to explain what it means, and expect others to accept your interpretation without question. This is not how it works here.

If you continue to refuse to answer these basic questions, then your refusal raises a legitimate question about whether you have actually studied the passage carefully or merely repeated what someone else has taught you. Please answer the questions directly instead of evading the discussion.

Selah!

 

[Sel@h]

Are you blind or what? Can't you read the Scripture that YOU quoted? Your scripture says the "hour of trail." Quit stonewalling and making a fool of yourself.



No, that is not how this works. I asked you a direct question because I came across your post and wanted to determine whether you actually understand the Scripture YOU chose to quote. Quoting a Bible verse is one thing; understanding its meaning and being able to explain it from Scripture is another. Selah!

I have repeatedly asked you straightforward questions, yet you continue to dodge them instead of providing biblical answers. Stop stonewalling and answer the questions.

1. What exactly is the “hour of temptation” (or trial)? Explain what it is according to Scripture.
2. Who does God promise to keep from that hour, and why?
3. What is the purpose of that hour of trial? What is it intended to accomplish?
4. Why does God say that this hour will come upon the whole world to test those who dwell on the earth?

These are not trick questions. They are direct questions about the very Scripture you quoted. If you understand the passage, you should be able to explain it in its biblical context rather than repeatedly avoiding the questions.

Let me be blunt: if you are going to quote Scripture to make a point, you should be prepared to defend your interpretation with Scripture. Get it? You can NOT simply post a verse, refuse to explain what it means, and expect others to accept your interpretation without question. This is not how it works here.

If you continue to refuse to answer these basic questions, then your refusal raises a legitimate question about whether you have actually studied the passage carefully or merely repeated what someone else has taught you. Please answer the questions directly instead of evading the discussion.

Selah!

You're asking for my understanding (which, by the way, I do have), but your tone is very aggressive and condescending. I don't respond to rude demands. If you'd like to have an iron-sharpening-iron discussion let me know.

 

[TribulationSigns]

You're asking for my understanding (which, by the way, I do have), but your tone is very aggressive and condescending. I don't respond to rude demands. If you'd like to have an iron-sharpening-iron discussion let me know.

Oh, give me a break!

Asking you to explain what the “hour of trial” means in the very Scripture YOU quoted is not condescending. It is a legitimate biblical question. If you truly understand the passage, you should be able to explain your interpretation from Scripture, regardless of whether you like my tone.

You say you are willing to have an iron-sharpening-iron discussion, yet when I ask you straightforward questions about the verse you used to make your point, you shift the discussion from the meaning of Scripture to "how you feel about my tone." That does not answer the biblical questions I asked.

Let's be honest: I suspect you are using the tone argument to deflect from the actual issue because you cannot adequately explain the passage in its biblical context or answer my four honest questions. Playing the victim does not establish that your interpretation is correct, nor does taking offense make my questions any less legitimate.

So, let's get back to the Scriptures. What exactly is the “hour of trial” in Revelation 3:10? Who is God promising to keep from it, why will it come upon the whole world, and what is its purpose? Please explain your answers from Scripture.

I am willing to discuss the passage, but an iron-sharpening-iron discussion requires both sides to engage with the biblical text and answer reasonable questions. It cannot consist of quoting a verse, refusing to explain it, and then making the other person's tone the issue.

The question remains: What does the “hour of trial” actually mean according to Scripture? Else you really do not know the biblical answer.

Selah!

 

[ewq1938]

And this happens prior to the revealing of the antichrist.

No, Paul said the Apostasy and revealing of the MoS happen before the rapture does.

 

[Sel@h]

Oh, give me a break!

Asking you to explain what the “hour of trial” means in the very Scripture YOU quoted is not condescending. It is a legitimate biblical question. If you truly understand the passage, you should be able to explain your interpretation from Scripture, regardless of whether you like my tone.

You say you are willing to have an iron-sharpening-iron discussion, yet when I ask you straightforward questions about the verse you used to make your point, you shift the discussion from the meaning of Scripture to "how you feel about my tone." That does not answer the biblical questions I asked.

Let's be honest: I suspect you are using the tone argument to deflect from the actual issue because you cannot adequately explain the passage in its biblical context or answer my four honest questions. Playing the victim does not establish that your interpretation is correct, nor does taking offense make my questions any less legitimate.

So, let's get back to the Scriptures. What exactly is the “hour of trial” in Revelation 3:10? Who is God promising to keep from it, why will it come upon the whole world, and what is its purpose? Please explain your answers from Scripture.

I am willing to discuss the passage, but an iron-sharpening-iron discussion requires both sides to engage with the biblical text and answer reasonable questions. It cannot consist of quoting a verse, refusing to explain it, and then making the other person's tone the issue.

The question remains: What does the “hour of trial” actually mean according to Scripture? Else you really do not know the biblical answer.

Selah!

I’m placing you on ignore.

 

[TribulationSigns]

I’m placing you on ignore

LOL!!! I knew it! When the questions get too uncomfortable to answer, out comes the “victim card,” followed by the dramatic exit.

“I’m placing you on ignore” — translation: “I don’t have an answer, so I’m ending the conversation and calling it a victory!”

Go figure! Some people would rather hit the ignore button than the reply button.

 

[The Light]

It’s getting close; the latter days are already here. Let’s not be deceived.

Well, you are off to a bad start.

The gathering of believers to Christ will only occur after the Antichrist has reigned.

This is correct. The gathering from heaven and earth will only occur after the Antichrist is revealed. This has nothing to do with the rapture of the Church.

The popular "Rapture" theory, specifically the Pre-tribulation view, suggests that Christ will remove the church before the tribulation begins.

The Church will be removed before the Great Tribulation.............according to the Word of God.

This view claims believers will be whisked away to safety, avoiding all the fear and chaos of the Antichrist. However, this idea lacks biblical support and suggests a cowardice inconsistent with the faith of those who have died defending the truth.

I prefer to believe the written Word of God. The Word says that we can ESCAPE ALL THESE THINGS that come to pass and STAND BEFORE THE SON OF MAN.

Luke 21
36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

I'm going to have to go with the Word of God on this. Seems simple enough.

Our protection comes from God, our Rock, not from physical hiding places like caves in Petra.

It is those in the nation of Israel that flee to a place of protection during the great tribulation and the wrath of God. The Church is already in heaven before the great tribulation begins and are certainly not here during Gods wrath. The place of protection is for the people of Israel that are instructed to flee.

Isaiah 26
20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast.

Scripture is clear that the return of Christ happens at the last trump,

This is correct. But this has nothing to do with the 7th trumpet blown by an angel.

The last trump is blown on the Feast of Trumpets and is a fall harvest feast. This occurs at the 6th seal.

after the "man of sin" is revealed. In 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8, Paul explicitly warns believers not to be deceived: the Day of Christ cannot come until there is a great falling away and the son of perdition is revealed. This false messiah will exalt himself and sit in the temple of God, claiming to be God.

The day of Christ is the Day of the Lord and has nothing to do with the rapture of the Church. The Day of the Lord is Armageddon.

While some theorists claim that the "restrainer" mentioned in 2 Thessalonians 2:7 is the Holy Spirit being removed during a Rapture, this is very poor scholarship. The context makes it clear that the restrainer is holding back Satan, not the church. In reality, the Archangel Michael is the one restraining Satan in heaven.

You are very confused. If you are correct, that would mean that Michael the Archangel would be taken out of the way. When in fact, Michael casts Satan to the earth.

Satan’s spirit is active on earth, but he himself is not yet here in person. He will be cast out by Michael and his angels, arriving on earth first to reign as the false christ.

Great. What does that have to do with the restrainer taken out of the way?

Only after this event will the gathering to Christ occur. Do not be deceived by theories; rely solely on the Word of God.

The gathering is a gathering from heaven and earth which occurs at the 6th seal.........not the 7th trumpet blown by an angel.

Mark 13
27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

Remember, Jesus Christ IS NOT returning until the great apostasy (falling away) occurs AFTER Satan, the son of perdition (meaning the son who will perish), is revealed.

Remember, the Lord is coming in an hour that you think not. Do you not believe Him?

Matthew 24
44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

You are very confused. You need to learn the difference between the Lord Himself coming for His bride at the trump of God or voice of God and the Lord sending His angels to gather the elect from heaven and earth at the last trump which is blown on the Feast of Trumpets.

 

[Davidpt]

I prefer to believe the written Word of God. The Word says that we can ESCAPE ALL THESE THINGS that come to pass and STAND BEFORE THE SON OF MAN.

Luke 21
36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

I'm going to have to go with the Word of God on this. Seems simple enough.

That is not meaning great tribulation. It is meaning the DOTL which follows after great tribulation

The hour of temptation involves the 42 month reign of the beast, IMO. The snare Jesus mentioned in Luke 21 is meaning the day and hour that no man knoweth. It is meaning after the 42 month reign, not at the beginning of it instead. It is meaning 1 Thessalonian 5:3 which is also meaning 2 Peter 3:10-12. The DOTL doesn't come like a thief in the night multiple times and at different times.

Matthew 24 and 2 Peter 3 have the following in common---both accounts mention Noah's flood. And since the DOTL comes like a thief in the night, 2 Peter 3 has something else in common with Matthew 24---this day and hour that no man knoweth. Prove me wrong if you disagree. Tell us the day and hour the DOTL comes as a thief in the night. Obviously, you can't. No man can.

Luke 21:31 So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand.
32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.
33 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
34 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.
35 For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.
36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

Mark 13:34 For the Son of man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch.
35 Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning:
36 Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping.
37 And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch.

 

[Davidpt]

Oh, give me a break!

Asking you to explain what the “hour of trial” means in the very Scripture YOU quoted is not condescending. It is a legitimate biblical question. If you truly understand the passage, you should be able to explain your interpretation from Scripture, regardless of whether you like my tone.

You say you are willing to have an iron-sharpening-iron discussion, yet when I ask you straightforward questions about the verse you used to make your point, you shift the discussion from the meaning of Scripture to "how you feel about my tone." That does not answer the biblical questions I asked.

Let's be honest: I suspect you are using the tone argument to deflect from the actual issue because you cannot adequately explain the passage in its biblical context or answer my four honest questions. Playing the victim does not establish that your interpretation is correct, nor does taking offense make my questions any less legitimate.

So, let's get back to the Scriptures. What exactly is the “hour of trial” in Revelation 3:10? Who is God promising to keep from it, why will it come upon the whole world, and what is its purpose? Please explain your answers from Scripture.

I am willing to discuss the passage, but an iron-sharpening-iron discussion requires both sides to engage with the biblical text and answer reasonable questions. It cannot consist of quoting a verse, refusing to explain it, and then making the other person's tone the issue.

The question remains: What does the “hour of trial” actually mean according to Scripture? Else you really do not know the biblical answer.

Selah!

Why can't you accept that it is the way you went about it that is the issue? She made that crystal clear in post #125. In this case you deserved what you received in the end, that she put you on ignore.

 

[TLHKAJ]

It's next to impossible to have a civil discussion anymore. Sadly, condescension and insults are the order of the day.

 

[amigo de christo]

It's next to impossible to have a civil discussion anymore. Sadly, condescension and insults are the order of the day.

let us never suckle from the paps of a harlot .
As i am darn sure you do agree with that .
But sister we just gonna have to put on our big boy and big girl pants and learn to d eal with words .
You do realize i am a man not loved at all by most all folks . No need to worry about me sister .
And no need to weep for me either . Folks gonna do as folks gonna do and folks gonna believe exactly
what their hearts desire to beleive .
BUT SHEEP GONNA BELEIVE JESUS and their love is for the TRUTH , For GOD has put that love
upon their hearts so as they do that which is pleasing to GOD .
So if folks call me names , they call me names .
if folks put me on ignore it just gives me more time to speak and type truth without them constantly remarking against it .
SISTER SHEEP BELEIVE TRUTH . everyone else beleives whatever their heart d esire to be their truth .
And that my near and dear sister BE and IS , A SOLID fact . now to them trenches . Let us never once
pull the poor me victim card . STAND THINE GROUND with a forehead of flint .
Cause if we thinks words are harsh , OH me oh my WE AINT SEEN Nothing yet . They gonna KILL many of us sister .
And i mean kill as in no more air for us to breath in this world . But dont let that worry or concern you sister .
JUST THINK about the HOME we go to at the end of our faith . PREPARED BY GOD and HIS CHRIST for the sheep .
Now some call it paradise and others heaven , ME I CALL IT HOME and have longed for JESUS coming a long time .

 

[TribulationSigns]

Why can't you accept that it is the way you went about it that is the issue? She made that crystal clear in post #125. In this case you deserved what you received in the end, that she put you on ignore.

Oh, please! So now the issue is no longer the biblical question, but whether I deserved to be put on ignore?

I understand perfectly well that she disliked my approach. That does NOT magically answer the questions I asked about Revelation 3:10. Acknowledging that someone dislikes your tone is not the same as establishing that their biblical interpretation is correct. Those are two entirely different issues.

If you believe my questions were inappropriate, explain why. But simply defending her decision to ignore me does nothing to address the actual Scripture under discussion.

She claimed to be willing to engage in an iron-sharpening-iron discussion. Yet when I asked her to explain the passage she quoted, the discussion shifted to my tone, and now you are defending her decision to walk away. Notice what is still missing? An explanation of the text. Funny!

Putting someone on ignore is a personal choice, not a biblical argument. And defending that choice does not prove her interpretation right or mine wrong.

So, unless you can explain what the “hour of trial” means in Revelation 3:10, whom it concerns, and why it comes upon the whole world, you are defending her reaction rather than addressing the biblical issue. Interesting.

Feel free to discuss my tone all you like. But the Scripture remains unanswered.

 

[amigo de christo]

No, Paul said the Apostasy and revealing of the MoS happen before the rapture does.

the only thing i have to say is
folks better put on the grown up pants and be prepared to be hated like never before .
And if we run and hide in a corner due to words on a computer screen ,
WHAT WILL YE DO when they come f or your blood .
WE MAKE OUR LAST HOUR STAND and we do it against anything ecumeincal incluisive interfaith .
Many are not gonna make it and are falling in love with a god who has promised them their sin and salvation .
ONLY THAT AINT JESUS , IT AINT GOD .
And now it brings them together
by means of incluisive love . And more and more buy the lie
of the all inclusive god . DO understand why said god and bodly with all my heart WILL NOT say GOD .
IT IS SATAN preparing them all unto the last hour
wherein the peak hour cometh and the great tribulation , the greatest tribiulation
to ever STRIKE the church , WILL Be more blood than ever upon the sheep who refused
to conform to the incluisive god and his peace plan .
Empowerd by a fully functional and highly powerful AI digital system .
WE ABOUT TO BLEED FOR JESUS . and this generatoin has no idea
who they made their bed , their ecuemincal inclusive intefaith bed with .
Think its gonna be bad for us . THINK HOW MUCH WORSE it is for those souls
who loved a lie on JESUS day . far worse a punishemnt awaits them .
And far worse it be than any man can do to us . Man has only power to kill the body .
GOD has power to both kill and destroy body and soul in hells fire . second death is far worse .