The devil's lie in Christian music

[DuckieLady]

Most Christian, no all of the Christian music, is secular which causes people too have a feeling... it doesn't really produce any spiritual growth, what does though is actually reading the bible. I was thinking earlier, a person I use to watch basically said this.

"If you know how to love properly, you don't even need the bible anymore." I would agree.

Christian (Secular) Music, does nothing for the hearer most of the time.

It just sucks for people who are misaligned and also the CHARLATANS out there making a mockery out what is truth founded in the bible.
Fake miracles, bogus stories of false hope, on and on and on... as though loving your neighbor is not even the full gospel...

This is a very good video to check out personally as I took a moment to do so last night.

This was uploaded 24 hours ago.

Amazing, humans, us, that God loves.

I'm a little confused.

Am I understanding what you're saying correctly? It sounds like you're saying you hate Christian music that is made for Christian entertainment, but you are unoffended by secular music.

Is that right?

 

[MatthewG]

I just see it as a money income supply, just as any other musical artistry. It doesn't mean it causes any spiritual growth what so ever. Besides people can't even be Christian unless they believe, in the death, burial, and resurrection. That hasn't stopped people abusing the name of God, or Jesus for their own profit and gain. @DuckieLady all Christian music is secular itself. There is no Gospel within those lyrics. Except if you're actually singing the words from the bible itself, I can see that as a little different.

Like singinging - Romans 8:11And if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit, who lives in you.


That has a higher spiritual growth value - than Oh Jesus my love, I love you so much, whatever secular stuff. None of that has anything virtually spiritual within it...

 

[DuckieLady]

I just see it as a money income supply, just as any other musical artistry. It doesn't mean it causes any spiritual growth what so ever. Besides people can't even be Christian unless they believe, in the death, burial, and resurrection. That hasn't stopped people abusing the name of God, or Jesus for their own profit and gain. @DuckieLady all Christian music is secular itself. There is no Gospel within those lyrics.

Mr. Duck@SERVANTedu would like to ask if you've listened to to Wolves at the Gate - The Father's Bargain? He's requested you look at the lyrics.

 

[MatthewG]

Mr. Duck@SERVANTedu would like to ask if you've listened to to Wolves at the Gate - The Father's Bargain? He's requested you look at the lyrics.

Tell Mr Duckie, I said please reread the former post. Hopefully you'll understand why I consider all "Christian" music - Secular.

 

[MatthewG]

I will say "Can supposed Christian (secular) music" or even Secular music - call back to ones memories of what Yeshua had done, within the personal heart of a person. Absolutely, but that is not based on a feeling, it's based on an understanding.

 

[DuckieLady]

Tell Mr Duckie, I said please reread the former post. Hopefully you'll understand why I consider all "Christian" music - Secular.

I think that what he is hinting to is painting with such a wide brush is unwarranted.

For myself, having been in touch with a few people in the entertainment industry throughout my life, they're usually not rich. Especially Christian entertainment. People have to survive and it takes money to be able to do that. If you want to use your callings for God full time and be able to put food on the table and have the ability to share God's blessings with others less fortunate, it's going to take money to do that, and that means that will be your career - if you are lucky.

 

[MatthewG]

Hope ya understand, an music ain't gonna grow anyone spiritually, it's the Gospel itself. Doesn't matter what one may sing. It will always turn back to the Lord Yeshua, and what he desires for us to do, to love God and to love others, and that is only possibly by abiding in him. REgardless of what someone does, be it building concrete statues of David, or whatever @DuckieLady. Thanks for the question. We reap what we sow, materially and spiritually. Yes we do need material funds to get by, but to neglect our spiritual growth is costly isnt it?

 

[MatthewG]

Remember when Jesus said count the cost?

The Cost of Being a Disciple​

25 Large crowds were traveling with Jesus, and turning to them he said: 26 “If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters—yes, even their own life—such a person cannot be my disciple. 27 And whoever does not carry their cross and follow me cannot be my disciple.

28 “Suppose one of you wants to build a tower. Won’t you first sit down and estimate the cost to see if you have enough money to complete it? 29 For if you lay the foundation and are not able to finish it, everyone who sees it will ridicule you, 30 saying, ‘This person began to build and wasn’t able to finish.’

31 “Or suppose a king is about to go to war against another king. Won’t he first sit down and consider whether he is able with ten thousand men to oppose the one coming against him with twenty thousand? 32 If he is not able, he will send a delegation while the other is still a long way off and will ask for terms of peace. 33 In the same way, those of you who do not give up everything you have cannot be my disciples.

34 “Salt is good, but if it loses its saltiness, how can it be made salty again?

~~ So do we need to give up everything even money? Should we disregard our families? No, it's just a matter of ones priorities in life.

 

[DuckieLady]

Hope ya understand, an music ain't gonna grow anyone spiritually, it's the Gospel itself. Doesn't matter what one may sing. It will always turn back to the Lord Yeshua, and what he desires for us to do, to love God and to love others, and that is only possibly by abiding in him. REgardless of what someone does, be it building concrete statues of David, or whatever @DuckieLady. Thanks for the question. We reap what we sow, materially and spiritually. Yes we do need material funds to get by, but to neglect our spiritual growth is costly isnt it?

Material wise, it's the opposite. It's good for a family to prosper and the parents to leave behind something for their children. It's not about living lavishly and excessive materialism - it's about practical service. You can give $450 for a purse, or you can give it to a widow. A wise person of faith will know the difference.

Charles Spurgeon and his wife had hens to lay eggs, but would only sell. Never give away. So they were criticized and called greedy. It wasn't until AFTER their death that it was revealed that the money was given to a window, but "But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing."

So they endured the judgment of people who had no idea what they were talking about. If artists are truly following Christ and living in obedience, you will not know


And what did God do for Solomon and was God's blessing evil? Or was God's blessing ... Blessed?

 

[MatthewG]

Material wise, it's the opposite.

I don't understand.

It's good for a family to prosper and the parents to leave behind something for their children.

Sure, there is nothing wrong with wanting to do such.

It's not about living lavishly and excessive materialism

To some people it is.

- it's about practical service.

Oh thank you for the good feelings in playing a song? A song doesn't mean much compared to a life that is filled with God, and constantly trusting him in faith. Giving doesn't mean anything if you do it just so you can say "you remember when I did that for ya?"

You can give $450 for a purse, or you can give it to a widow. A wise person of faith will know the difference.

Neither one of them make a difference if it is not spiritually growing a person. Anyone can do good to the poor at any time, the poor is always with us.

Charles Spurgeon and his wife had hens to lay eggs, but would only sell.

That is irrelevant.

Never give away. So they were criticized and called greedy.

It's irrelvant.

It wasn't until AFTER their death that it was revealed that the money was given to a window,

Doesn't matter, it doesn't make him some great man.

but "But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing."

Sure, also don't blow your trumpets for the marketplaces to grace you for your oh so good deeds.

So they endured the judgment of people who had no idea what they were talking about.

Don't know what any of this has to do with anything.

If artists are truly following Christ and living in obedience, you will not know

I don't know if anyone here has faith or not, just people chatting amongst one another.

And what did God do for Solomon and was God's blessing evil? Or was God's blessing ... Blessed?

Don't know.

 

[Kokyu]

The song is "articulating praise" because the lyrics are giving God all the Credit for the Prayer being answered.
She's not taking the credit.

But the song doesn't do this, actually. It doesn't give any praise to God for answering the singer's prayers. It's just a song about all that the singer will do by way of prayer for another person.

Post that NT verse, that says God wont hear the Prayers of a born again Christian.

1 Peter 3:12
12 For the eyes of the Lord are over the righteous, and his ears are open unto their prayers: but the face of the Lord is against them that do evil.

Here, Peter, writing to his Christian brethren, says that God's face is set against those who do evil. Peter offers this warning as part of his exhortation to his brethren, indicating that God will oppose them - and their prayers - if they live unrighteously.

1 John 5:14
14 This is the confidence which we have before Him, that, if we ask anything according to His will, He hears us.

And if we ask in contradiction to God's will what will He do? James gives us an answer:

James 4:3
3 You ask and do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, so that you may spend it on your pleasures.

God's "ears" are not open to the prayers of those who ask contrary to His will, seeking to satisfy their own personal pleasure. James, too, was writing to fellow believers.

The song is a universal prayer for others.
Its not a theology lesson.

It's not worship of God, that's for sure, since it offers almost nothing about Him in its lyrics.

"Jesus came to heal the broken hearted".

Also, most Prayers offered in a real Church, are for the sick or for the lost.

So, again, this song is not a Theology Lesson....its a Prayer, set to music.

I've never asserted that the song was a theology lesson, or was supposed to be one. But it ought at least to extol God, if it is intended as a worship song, and maintain careful alignment with His Truth. Also, it doesn't matter what most prayers are in a "real church," but what God says about prayer in His word. Also, how do you define what a "real church" is, and how do you know with such confidence what the substance is of most prayers in those churches?

She names the "what".
= The various healings.

Jesus is not just our sin bearer, but He's also, "by Jesus stripes we were healed"....
The lyrics in the song, understand this.......and so the prayer song is based on Jesus who heals, God who heals, God and Jesus who deliver.

There is no biblical promise of healing in the Atonement. In every instance where the sacrifice of Christ on the cross is associated with healing it is spiritual healing that is clearly in view, not physical healing. See Isaiah 53, or 1 Peter 2:24-25. And the record of Scripture also indicates that physical healing was not an expected benefit of being a Christian. Was Paul's counsel to Timothy concerning his stomach issues to claim healing? No, he told Timothy to take some wine as a remedy for his stomach complaints. Did Paul heal his companion, Epaphroditus, when he fell ill? No. Instead, Epaphroditus' illness progressed to the point where it nearly took his life. God spared him from death, but there was no miraculous healing for Epaphroditus (Phil. 2:25-27). The same was true of Trophimus who fell ill while journeying with Paul and had to be left behind (2 Ti. 4:20). He was not miraculously healed, either, but had to recover from his illness naturally. And then, there's Dorcas, who not only was not miraculously healed when she became ill but died from her illness (Acts 9:36-41). Fortunately, Peter was nearby and resurrected her from the dead. But none of the other believers around Dorcas even attempted miraculous healing upon her.

Paul, too, was left physically disabled by God (a "thorn in the flesh") so that Paul would understand, and live in, the truth that in his weakness God would be his strength (2 Cor. 12:7-10).

In light of these things, it is seriously unbiblical to encourage folks in song (or sermon) to think God wants and intends to heal them physically. It may very well be that it serves His purposes far better to leave His child crippled and weak. Just consider Joni Eareckson Tada, as a modern example.

Anyway, I don't mean to rain on your parade. I am simply wanting to be as truly worshipful toward God as possible and this requires worship of Him in truth and holiness, as His word commands.

 

[Kokyu]

"Beloved, Gaius , I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth," """

See that? So, if you set that to music..... then its the same as the song in the video., and neither Katy nor Paul are "taking credit" for anything. They are giving Credit, to the one who will Answer the Prayer.

It was the apostle John who wrote this to Gaius, not Paul, as you asserted. (3 John 1:1-2)

And John did not offer this remark to Gaius as a "worship song," performed before hundreds or thousands, did he? No, he didn't.

 

[Kokyu]

Of course largely that would be a matter of opinion.

No. The rightness of praise is ajudicated by the truth of God's word, not opinion.

 

[Grailhunter]

My mom is 95. She is in the nursing home now. But she has told me many things about the past. she talked about how blacks were not allowed in to churches and how my uncle had his house windows broken out by people throwing rocks at them…just because he was a preacher of a church who allowed blacks into his church. My mom tells about her aunt who judged any woman who didn’t wear clothing that covered the entire arms and legs down to your ankles and necklines that hid the neck…anyone who didn’t do the same dress code, would never amount to anything. The craziest most interesting one I’ve heard about the past is how women never cut their hair. it was praised for a woman to have hair never cut. What is interesting is some women who were poor would cut their hair to sell their hair to the rich, because long hair was a sought after thing. It’s very telling to me that the poor sold their hair to the rich. it’s been a long history of so much of what is said or promoted as to be holy. I’m sure I would be shocked and that is just the tip of all that has been promoted as what we must do to please God.

For the “Bible Only” it comes as a shock that Christianity was and is an evolving religion. Not that the “Bible Only" people know the Bible….LOL

During biblical times…..there were two distinct denominations. The Jewish-Christians and the Gentile-Christians.

The Bible never put a moritorum on polygamy or concubinage….
So both were practiced by Christians for centuries after the biblical times.

Fathers chose their daughters husband and groom bought their wives from their fathers….I could say for centuries but that practice is still in place limitedly.

The Bible never placed a requirement for a wedding ceremony to be married.

The Catholic Church in the Middle Ages finally put an end to polygamy and concubinage.

The Catholic Church had no use for wedding ceremonies and would not allow them in their Churches.

It was the Protestants that made a Church Wedding Ceremony a requirement to be married in the 16th century and the Catholic Church followed their lead.

We are still working on women’s rights.

 

[Grailhunter]

No. The rightness of praise is ajudicated by the truth of God's word, not opinion.

And there is your opinion

 

[MatthewG]

No. The rightness of praise is ajudicated by the truth of God's word, not opinion.

Reminds me of a bible verse:

Hebrews 13:15-16 New International Version (NIV) Through Jesus, therefore, let us continually offer to God a sacrifice of praise—the fruit of lips that openly profess his name. And do not forget to do good and to share with others, for with such sacrifices God is pleased.

 

[Dash RipRock]

Not you, or any person here, can know the heart and efforts of a person from a small detail.

Why not accept what the Lord says in His Word first and foremost and compare what others say to what God says in order to understand who is in line with what God says verses who is in opposition to what God says?

In the end this is how the Lord is going to judge people and their works is based on whether they lived in agreement with Him or in opposition to Him.

Those not aware of the difference aren't being led by the Holy Spirit of the Jesus Christ of the Bible and instead are being led by an imposter who claims all people that claim to be Christians actually are even those who teach and worship in opposition to the knowledge of the Lord found in scripture.

Feel free to play like we cannot know the difference between being in agreement with the Lord verses being in opposition to the Lord.

That's keeping the door open for the old devil to get in.

 

[Dash RipRock]

"If you know how to love properly, you don't even need the bible anymore." I would agree.

You might want to re-think what you are agreeing to because that statement is totally bogus man!

as though loving your neighbor is not even the full gospel...

Yeah, let's love people only and put them before the Lord.

No need to love the Lord or put Him first or anything.

He's requested you look at the lyrics.

Why not just post the lyrics?

Charles Spurgeon

False teacher, purveyor of false calvinist teachings.

And what did God do for Solomon and was God's blessing evil? Or was God's blessing ... Blessed?

Solomon turned away from the Lord and there's no record he ever returned so the blessing caused him to turn away because he was a fool according to what the Lord said in Proverbs 14:16

Of course this was not the Lord's fault, it was Solomon's fault.

There is no biblical promise of healing in the Atonement.

Just because some people have been tricked by the devil into rejecting physical healing (causing them to not have access to this promise thru unbelief) doesn't mean it's not the Lord's will for His children.

Paul, too, was left physically disabled by God (a "thorn in the flesh") so that Paul would understand, and live in, the truth that in his weakness God would be his strength (2 Cor. 12:7-10).

That's lies of the devil. Paul was stoned numerous times and left for dead and received healing and got up and continued his ministry so Paul does agree with the lies of the devil claiming God decided to not heal him. The thorn was a messenger of satan sent to buffet Paul, to try and stop the Lord from using him by stirring up trouble against Paul every where he went.

It may very well be that it serves His purposes far better to leave His child crippled and weak

That's what the devil wants everyone to think, that God is not good and it's His will for us to be be sick weak or even crippled.

I'm glad that I learned this was not true years ago which has enabled me to walk in health all this time. I don't get sick because God watches over His Word to perform it and did in fact promise healing. Those that learn how to stand for God's promises can receive what He promised, and those that don't won't.

Anyway, I don't mean to rain on your parade. I am simply wanting to be as truly worshipful toward God as possible and this requires worship of Him in truth and holiness, as His word commands.

I guess some people praise the Lord for making them sick, but sadly have been deceived in to believing it was God making them sick when in reality it was the devil doing it and then he conned them in to blaming God! Amazing!

But, according to their faith it will be done unto them.

 

[Dash RipRock]

The Bible never put a moritorum on polygamy or concubinage….

That's pretty funny that anyone claiming to know the Lord would not know the Lord crated marriage between one man and one woman.

We are still working on women’s rights.

Is it a woman's "right" before the Lord to murder her baby? God calls that murder and He says murderers go to hell.

 

[Grailhunter]

That's pretty funny that anyone claiming to know the Lord would not know the Lord crated marriage between one man and one woman.

God never said that and that is not what happened. The Laws regulated polygamy and concubinage