The Elect

[Taken]

You said "Man chooses". I am sorry but that is not what HE has said to me.

Perhaps you should wonder WHO was talking to you.

Election - synonyms; choosing, picking...

2 Pet 1:10
YOUR calling
YOUR election

1 Thes 1:4
YOUR election of God.

The Lord chooses mankind....BUT NOT ALL of mankind CHOOSES Him.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Perhaps you should wonder WHO was talking to you.

I have. Maybe you should do the same.

Who created the tree of the knowledge of good and evil in the midst of the garden.

If Gods plan is to give man "free will" for man so "man" can be different from the angels. Then how did Satan decide to reject and abandon what he was created for and fall, taking other angels with him?

Ephesians 1:4-5
[4] According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: [5] Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

Did you choose or did God?

Job 37:7
[7] He sealeth up the hand of every man; that all men may know his work.

Romans 12:3
[3] For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Romans 10:1-3
[1] Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. [2] For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. [3] For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

There is nothing wrong with my "hearts desire" being prayer...for all.

 

[APAK]

I have. Maybe you should do the same.

Who created the tree of the knowledge of good and evil in the midst of the garden.

If Gods plan is to give man "free will" for man so "man" can be different from the angels. Then how did Satan decide to reject and abandon what he was created for and fall, taking other angels with him?

Ephesians 1:4-5
[4] According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: [5] Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

Did you choose or did God?

Job 37:7
[7] He sealeth up the hand of every man; that all men may know his work.

Romans 12:3
[3] For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Romans 10:1-3
[1] Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. [2] For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. [3] For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

There is nothing wrong with my "hearts desire" being prayer...for all.

VictoryinJesus:

The spirit of God has led me to respond to some of your questions in this way..

(Eph 1:3) Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places,

(Eph 1:4) even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love

(Eph 1:5) he predestined us for adoption to himself as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will,

(Eph 1:6) to the praise of his glorious grace, with which he has blessed us in the Beloved. (All ESV)


Ephesians 1:4-5 as it says, God applied his will and his election to choose those that would accept the spirit of God during their lives. The chosen had no choice in the matter. The unchosen have no choice in the matter. And those he chose in this earthly body have free will as others that were not chosen. He wooed the chosen to salvation by his spirit before he dwelt in their hearts.

For the chosen, their free will is curtailed or limited as they already decided and gave up their free will to allow the spirit of God to run our lives. It is impossible for a believer, a chosen one, to perform the will of God always, every second. Although in the chosen mature one, there is a marked evidence that they have increased their desire to execute God’s will in their lives. Their divine nature and spirit has enlarged.

Even though the chosen stray ‘many’ times, and ignore the will of God, as they choose the will of their ‘old’ human nature or will, they are soon wooed back and redirected back to the will of God. It is this way while on this earth. The power of the spirit of God in this body is limited because of the competing human carnal nature, and the spiritual heart is weak in this body (being in the flesh).

In the heavens in heavenly bodies this power is drastically expanded. And we have no more human nature/ component and physical body to tempt us.

We, as the saints, in our own spirit bodies, all ‘speak’ directly to each other, to all creature in the heavens, including Jesus, the angels and God Almighty, We possess our own spiritual divine nature and partake of the divine spirit of God (the living waters, the tree of life…etc.).

For the unchosen, their will is free to choose ONLY their natural will and nature. Their will is not spiritual, it is secular and carnal. It will die upon physical death.

What and how the saints will be in the heavens, the angels were already created that way from the start.

Satan decided to use his own spiritual will or power over God’s power at some point and cause separation and sin. He was given more spiritual power that any other angel. The power to do independent work over time, independent of the will of God became overwhelming. He likes what he was doing. Many angels mimicked his actions.

God never chose the angels before he created them as some human beings. Angelic beings used their own divine will to follow God, as Jesus was also born already with the divine nature of God (along with his human nature). His divine nature was more powerful than his human nature right from birth. We on the other hand from birth and during life, have a more powerful corrupted human nature, and start with a weak divine nature that grows over time.

Bless you,


APAK

 

[Taken]

I have.

I know. You said your understanding is man does not CHOOSE God.

I disagree.

Maybe you should do the same.

Do the same as you? No.
I do the same as what the Word of God teaches. Then showed you the Word of God, that men DO CHOOSE GOD.

Who created the tree of the knowledge of good and evil in the midst of the garden.

God of course. He is the creator of all things.

If Gods plan is to give man "free will"

Not IF. Men have free will to choose.

for man so "man" can be different from the angels.

Mankinds difference from angels, has nothing to do with CHOICE.
Both mankind and angels have free will to Choose.

Then how did Satan decide to reject

He like all the angels have free will to choose.

and abandon what he was created for and fall, taking other angels with him?

Satan has free will. Other angels have free will.

Ephesians 1:4-5
[4] According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: [5] Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

Did you choose or did God?

What don't you get?

God is God.
Men are men.

Each has to make the CHOICE.
God chooses men.
And?

Do you not consider the man must also make a Choice...to Choose God.

Or do you think because God chooses men...
He then FORCES the man "WITHOUT" consideration IF THE MAN CHOOSES HIM?

Job 37:7
[7] He sealeth up the hand of every man; that all men may know his work.

Off-point.

Romans 12:3
[3] For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Off-point

Romans 10:1-3
[1] Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. [2] For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. [3] For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

Off-point.

There is nothing wrong with my "hearts desire" being prayer...for all.

Off-point.

Point being CHOOSING.

God Chooses men.
Do you still believe a man DOES NOT ALSO CHOOSE God, even when Scripture teaches they do?

God Bless,
Taken

 

[Taken]

Celestial beings are CREATED "HOLY".
They have FREEWILL to remain HOLY or FALL AWAY FROM BEING HOLY.

Terrestrial beings (mankind) were CREATED
"VERY GOOD".

Terrestrial beings (mankind) were CREATED male and female to REPRODUCE their same KIND of thing.

The First male and female FELL AWAY from being VERY GOOD.

THEREAFTER what they procreated was NOT VERY GOOD.

The Lord has provided a "WAY" for mankind to again BECOME "GOOD".....AND...."HOLY".

The Lord CHOSE everyman to Hear and Know, HOW A MAN CAN BECOME "Good" and BECOME "Holy"....

And it is the individual man WHO MUST CHOOSE GOD, to receive the EFFECTS of God WAY.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I know. You said your understanding is man does not CHOOSE God.

I disagree.



Do the same as you? No.
I do the same as what the Word of God teaches. Then showed you the Word of God, that men DO CHOOSE GOD.



God of course. He is the creator of all things.



Not IF. Men have free will to choose.



Mankinds difference from angels, has nothing to do with CHOICE.
Both mankind and angels have free will to Choose.



He like all the angels have free will to choose.



Satan has free will. Other angels have free will.



What don't you get?

God is God.
Men are men.

Each has to make the CHOICE.
God chooses men.
And?

Do you not consider the man must also make a Choice...to Choose God.

Or do you think because God chooses men...
He then FORCES the man "WITHOUT" consideration IF THE MAN CHOOSES HIM?



Off-point.



Off-point



Off-point.



Off-point.

Point being CHOOSING.

God Chooses men.
Do you still believe a man DOES NOT ALSO CHOOSE God, even when Scripture teaches they do?

God Bless,
Taken

My fault. Obviously man would choose God ONCE he is able to see God. The point is: man can not see God until God reveals God to man. The point is: God opens the eyes of the blind.

1 Timothy 5:21 KJV
[21] I charge thee before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, and the elect angels, that thou observe these things without preferring one before another, doing nothing by partiality.

 

[Taken]

My fault.

Keep learning, always benefits us and glorifies God.

Obviously man would choose God ONCE he is able to see God.

Nope. Precisely we can not SEE God.
We have ONE main thing, for which we can decide to Believe.

1) All the things WE CAN SEE. Sun, Moon, Stars, mountains, seas, animals, trees, sky, etc. And Choose to Believe they are Gods creations or not.

2) And the Word of God WE CAN HEAR and READ. And Choose to Believe or not.

The point is:

The Point was Choice. I think you have realized it TWO WAY, God chooses us, We have the freewill to choose Him (or not).

man can not see God until God reveals God to man.

Refer back to 1) and 2).
Man has NO EXCUSES.
God Created all things. Men can see.
God proclaims He created all things. Men can choose to believe, or not.

The point is: God opens the eyes of the blind.

Yes Absolutely He can, and does.
And consider the eyes of WHAT MEN God does open their eyes...

TO a man who vehemently REJECTS HIM?
Or a man who desires to BELIEVE?

1 Timothy 5:21 KJV
[21] I charge thee before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, and the elect angels, that thou observe these things without preferring one before another, doing nothing by partiality.

ELECT ANGELS?
Not a mystery. Angels who CHOOSE to remain Holy and Faithful Are Gods ELECT Angels.

DO NOTHING BY PARTIALITY?
Not a mystery. Are men ALL-KNOWING?
No. So do not be partial, (between God, the Lord Jesus Christ, and the ELECT Angels,) in what was being taught, in 1 Tim 5.

IOW ~ What a man is doing, is seen the same, before God, Lord Jesus Christ & the elect Angels.


God Bless,
Taken

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Yes. I thought of this passage also.

Romans 1:17-22
[17] For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. [18] For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; [19] Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. [20] For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: [21] Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. [22] Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

Is this not a contradiction? How can truth be rejected when the world cannot receive or see the truth...which is Christ.

John 14:17
[17] Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

I am so confused.

 

[tabletalk]

You said "Man chooses". I am sorry but that is not what HE has said to me. I've heard the same argument over and over. Two men visited our home yesterday and sat across from my husband and I...saying the same thing "man chooses" even to go as far as saying: God didn't blind them, they blinded themselves. But God did blind them and He did it to fulfill the word.

Romans 11:15
[15] For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be , but life from the dead?

"Reconciling of the world"

It is not by the will of man:

John 1:13
[13] Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

"Will" there means: choice or pleasure.

John 1:13
[13] Which were born, not of blood, nor of the (choice) of the flesh, nor of the (choice) of man, but of God.

John 3:5-8
[5] Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. [6] That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. [7] Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. [8] The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

Meaning God has to say: TODAY is your Birth Day.

God is in charge of the conception.
God controls the birth pangs (contractions).
God decides the time: day and hour.
As with a new born traveling down the birth canal during a natural birth: the new born does not conceive itself, the new born does not choose when the contractions begin, and the new born does not choose the time, the hour or the day of its birth.

What the new born does do: the new born feels when the time is near, the new born does not resist the birth process, the new born experiences the contractions, follows the birth canal, and participates. The new born does what God created the new born to do which is to be born of God. Wake up. Happy Birthday. The new born asks "what did I do?" God says: I delivered you.

Just to add, about blinding:
2Corinthians 4: 3. But even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, 4. whose minds the god of this age has blinded, who do not believe, lest the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine on them.

 

[Taken]

Yes. I thought of this passage also.

Romans 1:17-22
[17] For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. [18] For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; [19] Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. [20] For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: [21] Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. [22] Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

Is this not a contradiction? How can truth be rejected when the world cannot receive or see the truth...which is Christ.

John 14:17
[17] Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

I am so confused.

B-R-E-A-T-H :)

Keep everything in perspective.

God; Eternal, ALL knowing, Creator, Life, Giver of Life, Taker of Life.

Man; the Created, the dust body created from the dust of his own created habit. Everything he needs to be sustained; God provides.

The Body - (natural) given its own life, ie BLOOD.
God requires the life (BLOOD) of every man.

The soul - made by God, given life from God.
The Living Soul imparted into a body, via Gods Breath - the body's life (blood) begins functioning. (Organs, nerves, bodily systems, etc.)

The spirit - (natural) = mans natrual truth in his heart.

These three "parts" makeup the WHOLE of one man.

The body is natural, the spirit is natural, and the living soul, from God is supernatural.
And the mans habitat is natural.

Every part of man was CREATED VERY GOOD.
Mankinds HABITATE was CREATED VERY GOOD.

Every part of mankind has become Corrupt.
Mans habit has become Corrupt.

Now WHAT IS Gods PLAN?
Restoration.

Restoration of Every part of Individual men.
Restoration of the Earth, the World.

Because THIS IS WHAT GOD WANTS, and GODS PLAN, does not mean it is what INDIVIDUAL MEN may Want.

Thus comes the reasoning for FREEWILL for mankind.

A man has his own Life(Blood)-Time to hear, learn, decide, pick, choose....WHAT He wants.

God has provided the means for a man TO hear, learn, decide, pick, choose....God....or simply REJECT God.

It obviously requires a MAN to BELIEVE IN GOD; Before a man can ACCEPT Gods provisions of Changing a man FROM "not good", TO good and holy.

And that is where the WHOLE crux of the matter lies........Believe in God or Not...
Receive from God or Not.

A man WHO believes - can believe TWO WAYS.

1) from his mind, by using what makes sense to him, logically concluding.

2) from his spirit in his HEART, by what his heart believes is True.

No doubt, men hear, learn, cipher, think, wonder, guess, believe, doubt, challenge, deny, weigh back and forth, make logical conclusions from thoughts in his MIND.....which IS the natural way men learn about pretty much everything.

When a man is hearing, learning About the Word of God....the man is being "enlightened". Not only hearing, but everything he is hearing, he is receiving FAITH from God.

If the man STOPS hearing, STOPS learning, STOPS believing.....he has FALLEN from faith, because he is no longer receiving Faith from God.

This man can hear, believe, stop, return, hear, believe, stop, return, hear, believe, stop, return.....repeatedly. He puts himself in jeopardy, of NOT becoming Saved....precisely because of his wishy washy back and forth repetitiveness.

It is WHEN a man concludes that he BELIEVES in his HEART....is when, the man is PREPARED to call on the Lord, ELECT /Choose the Lord, to Be His Savior.

And ONCE a man accomplishes his Election From the thoughts in his Heart.....
Everything for that man CHANGES permanently.

That man becomes Forgiven.

His body becomes DEAD to Sin.
(Washed, Sanctified, kept with Christ, until it is glorified).
His soul is restored. (Ie saved)
His spirit is quickened. (Ie born again from Gods incorruptable Seed.
That man is forever in full Faithfulness to THEE LORD GOD ALMIGHTY.
That man is forever WITH the Lord.
And the Lord is forever WITHIN that man.
Via God imparting his Holy Spirit into the man.

Nothing can separate that man from the Lord.
That man is Forever KEPT by the Power of the Lord.

That man SHALL SEE God as He is.
That man SHALL inhabit Gods restored earth forever.

IF you ARE Saved and Born Again...then you must learn to Divide the TRUTH in Scripture.

Which is to say; All Scripture is TRUTH, but not all Scripture will apply to you.

For example:
John 14:17 (a), would not apply.
John 14:17 (b), would apply.

And thereafter you continue learning, the things (works) that Glorifiy God, and IF you do those things, God shall bless you and reward you.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[Davy]

Yes. I thought of this passage also.

Romans 1:17-22
[17] For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. [18] For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; [19] Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. [20] For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: [21] Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. [22] Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

Is this not a contradiction? How can truth be rejected when the world cannot receive or see the truth...which is Christ.

John 14:17
[17] Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

I am so confused.

Paul was speaking of God's creation having given them proof of His existence. The idea of 'when'... they knew God, that you will have to ask Taken.

 

[101G]

Correct.

Jesus was never OF this earthly world.
Jesus was never OF the heavenly world.

He was Not created or made.

The Word of God came forth out from God; and Created the WorldS.

the last part of what I selected from you is very interesting. U said, "The Word of God came forth out from God; and Created the WorldS".

Not saying that you're right or wrong, but consider this. is not the WORD of God, God himself? Isaiah 44:24 "Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself".

the one who maketh all things is verified in John 1:3 "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made". the him here is the Word.

so are you saying that the WORD of God is the LORD, yes or no?.

PCY.

 

[Davy]

the last part of what I selected from you is very interesting. U said, "The Word of God came forth out from God; and Created the WorldS".

Not saying that you're right or wrong, but consider this. is not the WORD of God, God himself? Isaiah 44:24 "Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself".

the one who maketh all things is verified in John 1:3 "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made". the him here is the Word.

so are you saying that the WORD of God is the LORD, yes or no?.

PCY.

You're not having trouble realizing that our Lord Jesus is God, are you?

The full Godhead is God The Father, God The Son, and God The Holy Spirit. All three are One. This is especially shown when God was born in the flesh as Jesus of Nazareth, "God with us" on earth.

 

[101G]

You're not having trouble realizing that our Lord Jesus is God, are you?

The full Godhead is God The Father, God The Son, and God The Holy Spirit. All three are One. This is especially shown when God was born in the flesh as Jesus of Nazareth, "God with us" on earth.

no I'm not but maybe you can answer the question is the LORD all cap the WORD of God yes or no?.

PCY

 

[Davy]

no I'm not but maybe you can answer the question is the LORD all cap the WORD of God yes or no?.

PCY

Rev 19:11-16
11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and He That sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He doth judge and make war.

12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns; and He had a name written, that no man knew, but He Himself.

13 And He was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and His name is called The Word of God.
KJV

Of course that is about our Lord Jesus Christ.

So I ask you... then, is Jesus of Nazareth God?

 

[101G]

Rev 19:11-16
11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and He That sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He doth judge and make war.

12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns; and He had a name written, that no man knew, but He Himself.

13 And He was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and His name is called The Word of God.
KJV

Of course that is about our Lord Jesus Christ.

So I ask you... then, is Jesus of Nazareth God?

This is the resurrected Jesus of Nazareth who is God.

now back to my question, is the LORD all cap the WORD of God yes or no?.

PCY

 

[Davy]

This is the resurrected Jesus of Nazareth who is God.

now back to my question, is the LORD all cap the WORD of God yes or no?.

PCY

Thank you. You indirectly answered my last question, whether you realize it or not.

When you say the Rev.19 title of Jesus is about the "resurrected Jesus" as God, you automatically infer that He was NOT God before His resurrection, which of course is a false idea, especially per John 1.

Heb 13:8
8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
KJV

Jesus of Nazareth was God before He was born through Mary's womb, and He was God before He was crucified and resurrected, as shown by OT Scripture like Isa.7:14 and Isa.9:6, and in NT Scripture like Matt.1:23 with His name "Emmanuel" which means "God with us".

 

[101G]

Thank you. You indirectly answered my last question, whether you realize it or not.

When you say the Rev.19 title of Jesus is about the "resurrected Jesus" as God, you automatically infer that He was NOT God before His resurrection, which of course is a false idea, especially per John 1.

Heb 13:8
8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
KJV

Jesus of Nazareth was God before He was born through Mary's womb, and He was God before He was crucified and resurrected, as shown by OT Scripture like Isa.7:14 and Isa.9:6, and in NT Scripture like Matt.1:23 with His name "Emmanuel" which means "God with us".

No I did not, in flesh with blood he is God. but you qualified your question by quoting Rev 19.

and you still did not answer my original question. now you jump to Hebrews.

ok, let's stay in Hebrews. scriptures.

Hebrews 1:8 "But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. 9 "Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows. 10 "And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands”.

Isaiah 51:13 "And forgettest the LORD thy maker, that hath stretched forth the heavens, and laid the foundations of the earth; and hast feared continually every day because of the fury of the oppressor, as if he were ready to destroy? and where is the fury of the oppressor?

Now, can you answer the question, WHO laid the FOUNDATION of the EARTH? was it the LORD (all caps) as Isaiah 51:13, or was it the Lord, (only cap "L") the Son as Hebrews 1:10 states, your answer please?.

PCY

 

[Davy]

No I did not, in flesh with blood he is God. but you qualified your question by quoting Rev 19.

and you still did not answer my original question. now you jump to Hebrews.

ok, let's stay in Hebrews. scriptures.

Hebrews 1:8 "But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. 9 "Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows. 10 "And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands”.

Isaiah 51:13 "And forgettest the LORD thy maker, that hath stretched forth the heavens, and laid the foundations of the earth; and hast feared continually every day because of the fury of the oppressor, as if he were ready to destroy? and where is the fury of the oppressor?

Now, can you answer the question, WHO laid the FOUNDATION of the EARTH? was it the LORD (all caps) as Isaiah 51:13, or was it the Lord, (only cap "L") the Son as Hebrews 1:10 states, your answer please?.

PCY

Oh, I answered your original question alright. And you answered mine, indirectly with making a distinction of Christ's name of The Word of God being for AFTER... His resurrection, when John 1 revealed that was His name also before... His crucifixion. That shows you hold to some idea like some believers of the Jews, that Jesus wasn't really God until later.

 

[101G]

Davy, no excuse. the Lord is the LORD without flesh, and the LORD is the Lord with flesh. it's the same person, only in diversity of himself...... :cool:. you might want to read my topic "diversified Oneness".

PCY.