In those days, the Catholic Church still held a certain sway over even Protestant doctrine.
The myth of grace-only & easy-believism shattered forever
- Thread starter Zachary
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Illuminator
Well-Known Member
Too long. No one's going to play this just in order to hear the gripes of Catholics.
Nowhere in Scripture does it say the blood of Christ prevents a believer from committing serious sins. If that were the case, there would be no need for Paul to warn believers that their sins can result in them not inheriting the kingdom of God (Gal 5:19-21). 1John 1:8 says, “If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us” (1John 1:8). Believers can even commit “deadly” sins (1John 5:16), which causes the loss of justification.
Furthermore, consider 1Peter 1:14-17,
“As obedient children, do not be conformed to the passions of your former ignorance, but as He who called you is holy, be holy yourselves in all your conduct, since it is written, ‘YOU SHALL BE HOLY, for I am holy’. And if you invoke as Father Him who judges each one impartially according to his deeds, conduct yourselves with fear throughout the time of your exile.”
In this passage, Peter is commanding believers to “be holy”, because God will judge them according to how they behave, and therefore they should conduct themselves “with fear”. If the blood of Jesus means believers will not commit serious sins, there would be no need for Peter to issue this warning.
In Matt 7:21-22, Jesus is talking to Christian believers, so of course He knows them. Therefore, when Jesus says, “I never knew you”, He is not speaking literally, but is using a figure-of-speech that means, “I am disowning you - so it’s as if I never knew you at all.”
That’s right - the Catholic Church is the “bride of Christ”.
According to Matt 7:21-23, Jesus will say to certain lawless believers, “I never knew you” - which suggests not all believers will saved.
I never said only those in the Catholic Church will be saved.
Nevertheless, what the 1st century Church taught must have been taught by the Church later on, in the centuries that followed. Unfortunately for your claims, the only pre-Reformation Church that historians can find in the centuries after the 1st century is the Catholic Church.
Furthermore, nowhere in the NT does it say all the beliefs, doctrines and practices of the 1st century Church are recorded therein, so the NT cannot be used as a definitive guide for identifying the 1st century Church.
Funny, I was brought up Catholic and I never once prayed to a statue or even in front of a statue. Nor did I ever witness a priest telling anyone to pray to a statue.
The man, Christ Jesus is the one mediator between God and man, but the Church is “the body (and) the fullness” of Christ Jesus (Eph 1:22), who is the “head” of the Church (Col 1:18). Since the Church is the “fullness” of Christ, and since the head cannot be separated from the body, the Church shares (albeit in a lesser way) in the roles and powers of Christ, such as the role of mediator between God and man. However, the Church’s role as mediator is subordinate to Christ’s role as mediator, since the head controls the body.
Furthermore, where does the Bible say there can be no mediators between man and “the man, Christ Jesus”?
In Luke 1:43, Elizabeth calls Mary “the mother of my Lord”.
Who is “my Lord”? (Here’s a clue: In the context, “Lord” always refers to God.)
If Jesus is not God, why does Col 1:16 says “all things were created THROUGH HIM and FOR HIM”?
And why does Col 1:19 says “ALL the FULLNESS OF GOD was pleased to dwell” in Jesus?
St. Ignatius, the third Bishop of Antioch, in a letter to the Smyrnaeans, dated circa 110 AD, refers to his Church as “the Catholic Church”. So “the Catholic Church” existed centuries before Constantine made the Catholic Church the “Roman state church”.
If so, why did Jesus, just before he died, place Mary under the care of one of the apostles (John 19: 26-27)? That makes no sense if Mary had other children to look after her.
Really? Which part of 2Tim 3:15 says the Bible is the only word of God?
Furthermore, the context of that verse means it is referring to the OT.
I am a Catholic and I agree with you that some Catholics and some Catholic schools are a "disgrace". And I will go further … a lot of what has been going on in mainstream Catholic culture since the 1960's is a disgrace. Many Catholic teachers have very weak faith or even no faith at all, and most of the clergy are cultural Marxists and devoted disciples of political correctness - their corrupt mentality is reflected in their preaching and their schools ... if you want your son or daughter to get brainwashed into thinking just like the secular Loony Left, just send them along to a Catholic school!I come across many a RCC who do as the Protestants claim however. my children went to RC schools and I can say that them schools were a disgrace I never met one genuine Christian in all who I came across, not one wanted to talk about Jesus Christ and the last Principle was a total Atheist creep and the Last Priest was a total moron, the only thing that they were peddling was Social indoctrination Political Correctness and never sanding up for Jesus Christ, as they claim that he is 'a' way, not 'the' Way ! it's all Politically Correct now, so not to offend anyone or the Devil himself I may add.
The Priest claimed that he had a job, I pointed out that it was not a job at all, but a vocation, not to mention that he claimed that everyone was awesome ! Wrong ! he would start off in Church with you are all Awesome !that's totally wrong, not to mention Satanic. but if the truth was in him he could claim we are all Sinners and we need Jesus Christ at the foremost of our lives. but that would not go down well with all the awesome people
The spiritual corruption on display in the Catholic Church doesn’t prove the Catholic Church is not the Lord’s one true Church, nor does it prove that the what the CC teaches as doctrine is false - it merely means that during the Great Apostasy (2Thess 2), the devil is having a field day inside God’s Church.
Hearing this is painful, but it doesn’t surprise me at all … one of the greatest evils that crept into the Church after Vatican II (1960’s) is what they call “Interfaith Dialogue” - a Modernist movement which promotes a very unhealthy respect for non-Christian religions (which are actually “antichrist” religions - 1John 4).
Respect for non-Christian religions is a product of the so-called Enlightenment … it took a few centuries, but this poison managed to not only worm its way into God’s Church, but it rose right to the very top and infected the minds of Popes. The late Pope John Paul II (the “Koran Kisser”) took it upon himself to obsessively promote this satanic poison for decades. He succeeded in single-handedly destroying the missionary spirit of the Church, which had been active for thousands of years (my uncle was a Catholic priest who served as a (so-called) missionary” in India. He told me he never tried to convert anyone to the Catholic faith - instead he tried to make Hindus “better Hindus”! He was dead against conversion and any mention of the ‘c’ word actually made him very angry … as I found out!).
Since the death of Pope John Paul II, his precious pagan-loving movement has thankfully withered on the vine, but there are still many brainwashed clergymen who foolishly support it - unlike traditionalist Catholics (the faithful remnant) who find the whole thing appalling, absurd and repulsively alien to their faith.
Demonic assaults on the Catholic faith such as “Interfaith Dialogue” may have their day in the sun, but they will not succeed in destroying the Catholic Church or polluting her doctrines - Jesus promised that “the gates of Hell will not prevail against” His Church (Matt 16:18).
Last edited:
Depends on what type of believer. The nominal, shallow, or lukewarm believer can indeed fall away (Luke 8:13).
However, the Christian with the fear of the LORD (Jeremiah 32:38-40, Psalms 19:9) who has a heart faith that is unto righteousness (Romans 10:10), cannot (John 5:24, John 6:47, John 10:27-30) (here we go again...)
The blood of Jesus does indeed sanctify (Hebrews 13:12, Hebrews 10:29, 1 John 1:7)...if you would be willing to look up the verses.
That makes no sense at all. What He is saying is that Christian believers who say to Him Lord, Lord, and do not do what He says are not true Christians at all...He literally has never known them.
You do understand that Jesus is God? There is only one mediator between God and man.
So you are saying that Mary is the mother of Jesus' Deity? That would make Mary God in some fashion...and I suppose that this is the next doctrine to broach the Catholic spectrum of belief.
I don't think that @Truther believes that Jesus isn't God...he is Oneness: among the ranks of those who believe that Jesus is the Father.
It does in my book.
You should take a wild look at some Protestant churches...you won't find the same apostasy there...but a moving of the Holy Spirit (not in all Protestant denominations; but in some: you just need to have a keen eye for knowing living water when you see it).
Last edited:
Just as Protestants do not follow after the Catholics in making idols out of saints, we do not make idols out of Luther, Calvin, and Zwingli. We go by what the Bible says.
Similar threads
