The Pre-Trib Rapture

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WPM

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They have already been presented a hundred times. When will people learn that "the Tribulation" is for the unbelieving, the ungodly, and the wicked? Christians will have trials, testings, and tribulations, but they are quite different from "the Tribulation" and "the Great Tribulation". These are periods of divine judgments such as have never been, nor will ever be again: For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. (Mt 24:21).

In His response to the first question in Matthew 24:15-22, He spoke of the end of the 40 year probationary period (AD 70), saying, When ye (the disciples) therefore shall see the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, whoso readeth, let him understand: Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: For then shall be great tribulation [Gr. thlipsis], such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.”

Mark 13:14-20 says, when ye (the disciples) shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains: And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house: And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment. But woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! And pray ye that your flight be not in the winter. For in those days shall be tribulation (thlipsis), such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be. And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.”

This can only refer to the wrath of God being poured out on Jerusalem that destroyed the existing socio-political/cultural/religious system of Judaism, which was an offence to God. This people were decimated. Their religious system was effectively brought to nought. Nothing before AD 70, or after it, could compare in regard to the extent of its demise. Luke 21:20-24 reinforces that we are looking at AD 70.

Luke’s parallel passage, in Luke 21:20-24, records, when ye (the disciples) shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! For there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.”

Please note the close correlation between these 3 accounts of the same event - AD70. A comparison of these three parallel narratives will see the correspondence in teaching. Pay especial notice of what is highlighted in brown. This proves that this is an historic event that pertains to the judgment of Jerusalem as a punishment for their rejection of Christ and has been long fulfilled.

Plainly: the abomination of desolation … standing where it ought not” or standingin the holy place relates to the Roman soldiers that would destroy the city of Jerusalem. Luke adds meat to the bones, saying: “when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.” Here is the warning sign to run! There is also the limitation of that judgment so that the Gospel would spread to the nations. The Gospel spread as Jewish families were spread throughout the world.

The Lord tells us that unless this judgment upon Jerusalem was shortened “there should no flesh be saved” (Matthew 24:22). In essence, what He was saying was, there would have been no possibility of Jewish Christians surviving it and consequently no hope of a lost Gentile world receiving this great Gospel if God’s wrath would not have been limited to a short time-period in relative terms. If the wrath of God would have continued to be poured out on wicked man as it was on Jerusalem then mankind would have been finished. But it was restricted to Christ-rejecting Jerusalem.

How can futurists seriously relate these parallel accounts of the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70, which resulted in the unbelieving Jews being dispersed to “all nations,” to a supposed seven-year end-time persecution of the Church of Jesus Christ? Remember, it was this awful approaching judgment upon the Jews that caused Christ to weep over Jerusalem, crying, “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.”
 
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ewq1938

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Agree...The Church is not present during the Tribulation.

Glory to God,
Taken


The church is the one being persecuted during the trib so of course the church is there.

Satan's wrath and him starting the Great Tribulation which targets Christians:

Rev 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath , because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
Rev 12:13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.
Rev 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.
Rev 12:15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.
Rev 12:16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.
Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed , which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.


The Christian saints killed during Satan's wrathful Great Tribulation:

Rev 13:4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
Rev 13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
Rev 13:6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them : and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

Rev 13:11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
Rev 13:12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.
Rev 13:13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
Rev 13:14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
Rev 13:15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.


The Christian saints killed during Satan's wrathful Great Tribulation are resurrected:

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God , and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years .
 

covenantee

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They have already been presented a hundred times. When will people learn that "the Tribulation" is for the unbelieving, the ungodly, and the wicked? Christians will have trials, testings, and tribulations, but they are quite different from "the Tribulation" and "the Great Tribulation". These are periods of divine judgments such as have never been, nor will ever be again: For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. (Mt 24:21).
When was "then"?

Matthew 24
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

When the Judean Christians saw the abomination of desolation, the Roman armies (Luke 21:20), advancing upon and standing in the holy city of Jerusalem, then they heeded Jesus' warning and fled into the mountains.

In 66 AD.

Thankfully, they were not dispensational futurists, and thus escaped great tribulation which then fell upon Jerusalem and Judea in the period leading up to, and culminating in, 70 AD.

When will people stop denying historically fulfilled Scripture, and attempting to impose their own replacement theories of futurized fantasy and fallacy?
 
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Truth7t7

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Agree...The Church is not present during the Tribulation.

Glory to God,
Taken
Your claim is "False"!

The Church will be present on earth during the tribulation, and witness the second coming of Jesus Christ in the heavens

The pre-trib rapture doctrine is false and deception, found no place in scripture!

Luke 21:25-28KJV
25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
 

Truth7t7

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When was "then"?

Matthew 24
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

When the Judean Christians saw the abomination of desolation, the Roman armies (Luke 21:20), advancing upon and standing in the holy city of Jerusalem, then they heeded Jesus' warning and fled into the mountains.

In 66 AD.

Thankfully, they were not dispensational futurists, and thus escaped great tribulation which then fell upon Jerusalem and Judea in the period leading up to, and culminating in, 70 AD.

When will people stop denying historically fulfilled Scripture, and attempting to impose their own replacement theories of futurized fantasy and fallacy?
I disagree with your "Preterist" interpretation in 66-70AD fulfillment, "Daniel's AOD is future" unfulfilled

It appears you follow the reformed eschatology in Gentry and Riddlebarger's interpretation, equal to that of Darby and Scofield's dispensationalism in error, "my opinion"

In Love

Jesus Is The Lord
 
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covenantee

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I disagree with your "Preterist" interpretation in 66-70AD fulfillment, "Daniel's AOD is future" unfulfilled

It appears you follow the reformed eschatology in Gentry and Riddlebarger's interpretation, equal to that of Darby and Scofield's dispensationalism in error, "my opinion"

In Love

Jesus Is The Lord

Sorry bro, you'd need to present Scripture disproving what I've presented.

Also that of Bro. Paul in post 2961.

You understand the many errors of premil.

Its futurization of the Olivet discourse is one of those many errors.

Also in love.
 

Truth7t7

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Sorry bro, you'd need to present Scripture disproving what I've presented.

Also that of Bro. Paul in post 2961.

You understand the many errors of premil.

Its futurization of the Olivet discourse is one of those many errors.

Also in love.
Daniel's AOD will take place at the time of the end, he the "Antichrist" shall make abominations and desolation to the "Consummation" or (Ultimate End) this didn't take place in 66-70AD, reformed "Preterist" eschatology is in major error, jump ship on Gentry and Riddlebarger, same as Darby & Scofield "Error"!

"The consummation" ultimate end!

Will you now promote reformed eschatology in error, you have been shown the truth?

Daniel's AOD is future "Unfulfilled"!

Merriam-Webster
Definition of consummation


1: the act of consummatingthe consummation of a contract by mutual signaturespecifically : the consummating of a marriage
2: the ultimate end : FINISH

"Even Until The Consummation"!


Daniel 9:27KJV
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
 
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Truth7t7

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In His response to the first question in Matthew 24:15-22, He spoke of the end of the 40 year probationary period (AD 70), saying, When ye (the disciples) therefore shall see the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, whoso readeth, let him understand: Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: For then shall be great tribulation [Gr. thlipsis], such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.”

Mark 13:14-20 says, when ye (the disciples) shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains: And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house: And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment. But woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! And pray ye that your flight be not in the winter. For in those days shall be tribulation (thlipsis), such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be. And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.”

This can only refer to the wrath of God being poured out on Jerusalem that destroyed the existing socio-political/cultural/religious system of Judaism, which was an offence to God. This people were decimated. Their religious system was effectively brought to nought. Nothing before AD 70, or after it, could compare in regard to the extent of its demise. Luke 21:20-24 reinforces that we are looking at AD 70.

Luke’s parallel passage, in Luke 21:20-24, records, when ye (the disciples) shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! For there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.”

Please note the close correlation between these 3 accounts of the same event - AD70. A comparison of these three parallel narratives will see the correspondence in teaching. Pay especial notice of what is highlighted in brown. This proves that this is an historic event that pertains to the judgment of Jerusalem as a punishment for their rejection of Christ and has been long fulfilled.

Plainly: the abomination of desolation … standing where it ought not” or standingin the holy place relates to the Roman soldiers that would destroy the city of Jerusalem. Luke adds meat to the bones, saying: “when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.” Here is the warning sign to run! There is also the limitation of that judgment so that the Gospel would spread to the nations. The Gospel spread as Jewish families were spread throughout the world.

The Lord tells us that unless this judgment upon Jerusalem was shortened “there should no flesh be saved” (Matthew 24:22). In essence, what He was saying was, there would have been no possibility of Jewish Christians surviving it and consequently no hope of a lost Gentile world receiving this great Gospel if God’s wrath would not have been limited to a short time-period in relative terms. If the wrath of God would have continued to be poured out on wicked man as it was on Jerusalem then mankind would have been finished. But it was restricted to Christ-rejecting Jerusalem.

How can futurists seriously relate these parallel accounts of the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70, which resulted in the unbelieving Jews being dispersed to “all nations,” to a supposed seven-year end-time persecution of the Church of Jesus Christ? Remember, it was this awful approaching judgment upon the Jews that caused Christ to weep over Jerusalem, crying, “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.”
I disagree with your reformed "Preterist" eschatology in 66-70AD fulfillment, please refer to my response in post #2967 above
 
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covenantee

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Daniel's AOD will take place at the time of the end, he the "Antichrist" shall make abominations and desolation to the "Consummation" or (Ultimate End) this didn't take place in 66-70AD, reformed "Preterist" eschatology is in major error, jump ship on Gentry and Riddlebarger, same as Darby & Scofield "Error"!

"The consummation" ultimate end!

Will you now promote reformed eschatology in error, you have been shown the truth?

Daniel's AOD is future "Unfulfilled"!

Merriam-Webster
Definition of consummation


1: the act of consummatingthe consummation of a contract by mutual signaturespecifically : the consummating of a marriage
2: the ultimate end : FINISH

"Even Until The Consummation"!


Daniel 9:27KJV
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

We've been through this before, bro. The consummation has been explained. You've not explained the Roman armies and the flight of the Judean Christians and how those presaged the great tribulation of the destruction of Jerusalem and Judea.

Why do you espouse the premil fallacies about those?
 

Truth7t7

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We've been through this before, bro. The consummation has been explained. You've not explained the Roman armies and the flight of the Judean Christians and how those presaged the great tribulation of the destruction of Jerusalem and Judea.

Why do you espouse the premil fallacies about those?
I have nothing to do with pre-mil eschatology as you falsely claim, preterist eschatology in 66-70AD fulfillment is a lie, you have been shown the truth

The AOD takes place at the end, and the antichrist who brings Daniels abomination and desolation will be on earth to the "Consummation" or "Ultimate End"

It appears that you will favor reformed eschatology over presented biblical truth, once again you have been shown the truth, it's before your eyes "Even Until The Consummation" and it didn't take place in 66-70AD Jerusalem

Daniel's AOD is future "Unfulfilled"!

Merriam-Webster
Definition of consummation


1: the act of consummatingthe consummation of a contract by mutual signaturespecifically : the consummating of a marriage
2: the ultimate end : FINISH

"Even Until The Consummation"!


Daniel 9:27KJV
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
 
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Taken

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They have already been presented a hundred times. When will people learn that "the Tribulation" is for the unbelieving, the ungodly, and the wicked?

When? Not today!


Christians will have trials, testings, and tribulations, but they are quite different from "the Tribulation" and "the Great Tribulation".

Believers in Almighty God have been persecuted for centuries;
BY other men.
Believers in The Lord God Almighty have been persecuted for centuries;
BY other men.

The Ignorant, can hear the Truth, but Not understand it.
The Unwise, can hear the Truth, and Reject it.
Those Against God, can hear the Truth, and Rail Against the Truth of God.

Ignorant men, Unwise men, men Against Gods Truth, FOR CENTURIES, have Instigated, Caused....Harm, Oppression, Killing....OF;
Hebrews, Tribes, Jews, Christians....BECAUSE OF THEIR BELIEFS...
......DUH.....Those ARE TRIBULATIONS! Caused BY men!

Can one say, oh, oh, oh....LOOK AT THIS little group of men, establishing a new Nation of men, Called America, Whereby, the Standards and Principles OF the Lord God Almighty SHALL BE the SAME Standards and Principles UNDER WHICH the LAWS of America SHALL BE established!

REVIEW HISTORY...The QUICK rise of Power, Recognition, on the World Stage....and the Prosperity, and the MAJORITY of the Nation of America, Openly, Freely Speaking, Praising, Worshiping, The Lord God Almighty...
In Homes, In Churches, In Schools, In Military, In Governments!

AND OPEN EYES, OPEN EARS, OBSERVE...TODAY in America...
* Deceptive
means to Seat Law Makers.
* Law makers establishing LAWS outside of their Authority.
* Heads of Homes....punished for Teaching Gods Word.
* Churches....Forbidden to assemble. Buildings burned.
* Schools...Forbidden to Speak Gods Word.
* Military...Released from Service for their Godly Beliefs.
* Governments...Not Serving, Rather Dictatorially Against God.


These are periods of divine judgments such as have never been, nor will ever be again: For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. (Mt 24:21).

Correct Enoch111....

The IGNORANT, UNWISE, Men AGAINST Gods Word...
* Have BEEN persecuting, causing; threats, harm, punishments, oppression, silencing, corralling, killing....

DUH....TRIBULATIONS of MEN....AGAINST MEN FOR CENTURIES, BECAUSE of THEIR BELIEFS!

Correct Enoch111...

WARNING, WARNING, WARNING....
Matt 24:21


* The DAY IS COMING....GOD SHALL SEND HIS TRIBULATIONS UPON the INHABITANTS of the Face of the EARTH...BECAUSE...
* The inhabitants upon the Face of the EARTH..
ARE the Ignorant, Unwise, Ungodly men!


Col 3.
[6] For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:

Glory to God,
Taken

 

CadyandZoe

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They have already been presented a hundred times. When will people learn that "the Tribulation" is for the unbelieving, the ungodly, and the wicked? Christians will have trials, testings, and tribulations, but they are quite different from "the Tribulation" and "the Great Tribulation". These are periods of divine judgments such as have never been, nor will ever be again: For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. (Mt 24:21).
You are confusing tribulation with judgment. Two entirely different things.
 

Taken

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The church is the one being persecuted during the trib so of course the church is there.

Uh....The Godly...ie. faithful, Hebrews, Tribes of Israel, and Jews have been persecuted FOR Centuries, BY men!

Uh....The Godly...ie. Faithful, Jews and Gentiles have been persecuted FOR Centuries, BY men!

Really? Men who ARE the CHURCH...ARE the Converted IN Christ.
....Wholly, Body, soul, spirit, mind, heartfully confessed Belief IN the Christ Lord God Almighty!
....Bodily Crucifi-ED With Christ Jesus.
....Soul restored, Sav-ED
....Spirit quickened, Born OF Gods Seed.
....Gods Spirit WITH and IN that man, Baptism of the Holy Spirit.

AND....God IS going to SEND HIS Tribulations, HIS Wrath UPON THEM....BECAUSE....WHY?

 

Enoch111

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You are confusing tribulation with judgment. Two entirely different things.
Not at all. Specific periods of tribulation are in fact judgments. And here is the Scripture which equates tribulation and wrath (divine judgment). But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile (Rom 2:8,9).
 

CadyandZoe

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Not at all. Specific periods of tribulation are in fact judgments. And here is the Scripture which equates tribulation and wrath (divine judgment). But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile (Rom 2:8,9).
In this context, what is the source of the tribulation. Why do such people feel pressured?
 

Taken

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Revelation 7:14?

Revelations 7:
[13] And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
[14] And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Who are THESE?
THESE are they whom were present ON the Earth, WHEN the Tribulation Began.
And UPON Whom, DOES the beginning of the Tribulation affect?

Well, Look to SEE WHO is Sending the Beginning Tribulation....
Rev 6:
[16] And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
[17] For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Why is the Lamb ANGRY?
Why is the Lamb SENDING His Tribulations?
Why are men ON the Earth experiencing the Lambs Wrath?

Simple....Because “THESE” men did NOT believe in the Lamb of God.
WHO, are “THESE” men who did Not believe in the Lamb of God?
....Jews?
....Atheists?
....Muslims?
....Converted IN Christ Jesus?

It is speaking EXPRESSLY of Jews...and any other man, who believed in God, but Rejected the Lamb of God as the Christ Messiah.
Primarily Jews who Believe IN God, but REJECTED the Lamb of God.

And WHAT ABOUT these Jews? Why are they NOW believing in the Lamb of God?

Did the CHURCH, “of Gentiles”... show up after 2,000 years and begin teaching the Jews about The Lamb of God? No.

144,000 Of the Tribes of Israel showed up...(Rev 7: 1-10)
and began Teaching all the Tribesmen (today, all calling themselves Jews)....and, ANY listeners...who believed in God, but Rejected the Lamb of God....The Gospel of Jesus Christ, the Lamb of God, Sent to SAVE their souls, and QUICKEN their spirits.......and ACCEPT THEIR physically DEAD BODY’s when they ARE KILLED.

* WHY do they begin to BELIEVE? BECAUSE they TRUST the TEACHERS...who ARE of the Tribes of Israel.
* Gentiles were NEVER given the appointment to TEACH the Tribes of Israel...about the God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and the Christ Messiah!
(Visa versa....Hebrews, tribes, Jews ... were supposed to Teach the Whole world...)

So...Why would the Lamb of God BE ANGRY with a man Already Converted IN Christ Jesus?

WHY, would a man Already Converted, BE... Again, Confessing Belief In the Lamb of God, Again laying down his bodily life, Again being cleansed in the Blood of Christ Jesus, Again be Saved by the Lamb of God?....
 

Taken

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You are confusing tribulation with judgment. Two entirely different things.

No.
Rightly Divide the Truth...

Does God routinely JUDGE people upon the earth?
Yes! Judges their thoughts, acts, words, behaviors...WHY?

To...bless them, answer prayers, correct them, collect evidence...
If God does not routinely Judge a men...has repented, confessed heartful belief, does charitable works, teaches Gods truths, preaches against Him, blah, blah, blah........

How can He answer prayers, bless men, etc.?

Men cause tribulations against men....all day long.
Men judge men....all day long.

AND..God ALLOWS men to cause tribulations against men...all day long.
AND..God JUDGES men all day long.
AND..God KEEPS RECORDS of men WHO continue “with God”...EVEN WHEN men are causing tribulations AGAINST THEM, because those men.......ARE STICKING WITH God.

AND for 2,000 YEARS...men have been...hearing, learning, listening...
HOW TO....Accept Gods OFFERING...OF STICKING WITH GOD, ASSUREDLY FOREVER....By, Through, Of; Gods POWER...”IN” them.


WHEW...what an AWESOME offering....threats, tribulations of men against me, punishments of men against men.......AND WHAT?
A man is going to YEILD, jump on board, cower down to men, be afraid of men, STOP talking, testifying, praising the Lord God, Believing ....BECAUSE MEN SAY SO? NOPE.....

Why not? They are just peon little men, who can be starved, rounded up, beaten, imprisoned, attacked, slandered, forced out of work, killed..
....YEP!
....But they can NEVER cause that man to Stop Believing.
....But they can NEVER cause that man to Lose His Salvation.
BECAUSE...Gods Power IN them, KEEPS that man IN Belief Forever!

So, Again...WHY is a man IN Christ Jesus, going to be ON Earth, and experiencing the WRATH of the Lamb of God?
 

Taken

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Your claim is "False"!

The Church will be present on earth during the tribulation, and witness the second coming of Jesus Christ in the heavens

AW...:(

IF you are ON the Earth when the Tribulation OF God Begins...
YOU shall Experience the Beginning of Gods Tribulation...

The Tribulations of God.....are revealed;
SEALS, TRUMPS, VIALS...

AW...LOOKIE HERE...
Rev 6: The Lamb of God IN Heaven OPENING THE SEALS, one by one....

Rev 6:
[15] And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;
[16] And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
[17] For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

And which one ARE YOU...THAT THE WRATH OF THE LAMB is UPON YOU?

Are you a great man, rich man, chief captain, a mighty man, a bond man, a free man?

Cause you AIN”T the Church of Christ ON the Earth ....
Cuz the Church of Christ...Already Laid DOWN their Life IN heartful confessed Belief...
And was Already SAVED BY THE LAMB OF God!

While YOU are ON EARTH...LOOKING UP when the Son of Man returns...

The Church will BE WITH their Lord ABOVE the face of the Earth.

Oops...wrong church.
 

Taken

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How can futurists seriously relate these parallel accounts of the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70, which resulted in the unbelieving Jews being dispersed to “all nations,” to a supposed seven-year end-time persecution of the Church of Jesus Christ?


How can futurists”.....WHO are YOU TALKING TO? Imaginary people not participating in this forum? WHY are you speaking for them instead of Quoting them?