Truth7t7
Well-Known Member
- Jan 2, 2014
- 10,872
- 3,283
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
- Country
- United States
Scripture teaches Jesus Christ returns in fire and final judgment (The End) as seen below in post #3042
Last edited:
The Pre-Trib Rapture
- Thread starter marks
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Truth7t7
Well-Known Member
- Jan 2, 2014
- 10,872
- 3,283
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
- Country
- United States
Jesus Christ Returns In Fire And Final Judgement, Dissolving This Existing Earth By Fire, Immediately After The Tribulation
This Existing Heaven And Earth Will Be (Replaced) By The New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem, A New Creation, At The Return Of Jesus Christ
(Behold, I Make All Things New)
2 Peter 3:10-13KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
Revelation 21:1-5KJV
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
Matthew 24:29-30KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
1 Corinthians 3:13KJV
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.
2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:
Psalm 46:6KJV
6 The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted.
Psalm 50:3KJV
3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.
Psalm 97:5KJV
5 The hills melted like wax at the presence of the Lord, at the presence of the Lord of the whole earth.
Isaiah 66:15KJV
15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.
Zechariah 14:12KJV
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.
Nahum 1:5-6KJV
5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.
6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.
Revelation 20:9KJV
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
Timtofly
Well-Known Member
Of course it does. You cannot discern between great tribulation, the entire Church age of the last 1992 years, and The GT, after the Second Coming.
The GT is the final harvest when Jesus is on the earth with His angels. But you have the earth burned to a crisp, so you cannot even have a GT, nor Satan's AoD. The time of the church's great tribulation, has to finish before the GT can even start. The Second Coming is after the church's time of trouble, the tribulation of those days. Those days is not the GT. Those days is the end of the NT church, the fulness of the Gentiles, those days of tribulation which started at Pentecost and ends at the Second Coming.
The GT cannot start until Jesus and the angels are on earth for the final harvest. This harvest is described in the Trumpets and Thunders in Revelation. The AoD is the 42 months leading up to the very end, Armageddon when the last of Adam's dead corruptible flesh is killed. Revelation 19 is not the Second Coming. It is the final winepress of earth's harvest concerning Adam's 6,000 years.
The only reason the rapture happens before the GT is because the church is not on earth with Jesus and His angels. The church is removed when the angels and Jesus come at the time Jesus splits the Mount of Olives and re-arranges the whole geographical area of Jerusalem at the Second Coming. Armageddon does not deal with Jerusalem nor an earthquake. Armageddon deals with those people on earth, only if Satan is allowed 42 months. No 42 months, no Armageddon.
Daniel 9:27 will not even happen until the 7th Trumpet is sounding. So the first 6 Trumpets and the 7 Thunders have to sound first before there can even be an AoD. Most here want the 7th Trumpet to sound before the 1st Seal and all the other events. The AoD if it happens, certainly does not happen first. The parable of the fig tree happened first in 1948. This generation will not pass away until all the above happens, including Armageddon. King Charles was born in 1948. He could very well be one of the Kings at Armageddon, assassination, not withstanding. That generation will not all pass away. As we can see, even the generation prior to 1948 is quickly passing away.
No one said that the Lords 1,000 yr reign is His eternal reign!
Obviously you fail to comprehend Christ Jesus’ Reign IS HE sitting as KING of kings.......who do you think the “kings” are?
They ARE MORTALS ! They are kings over their nations, their people.
They BEGIN conducting their own kingships ACCORDING TO the Word of God. They operate in peace amongst themselves....Generations pass, men prosper, men become greedy AGAIN, men become underhanded, men not listening to the Word of God AGAIN. Satan is loosed, AGAIN with his trickery and lies he encourages the Nations to Come Against Christ Jesus Kingdom.
Every thing is tested. Those mortals are tested for 1,000 years of generations....and VOID of Satan’s influence for 1,000 years...manKIND AGAIN fAILS. NO EXCUSE. With satan presence, without satan’s Presence....With the Lords presence, without the Lords presence....
Men are GREEDY, EVEN when they have plenty, they will backstab to take from others. Nothing new. There are about 300 men NOW so filthy rich, with a want or need of nothing....YET they shall not rest UNTIL THEY have instigated every fathomable means to Downsize the “USELESS” population of the world, who is to them, unsightly garbage waste to be disposed of. They are the Puppet Masters, of every war, disease, hoax, fear mongering, lies. They control the strings of the Nations “kings”, and the “kings” control the propaganda media outlets...
And day after day, you will hear their “catch phrases” of hate, fear, threats, lies, repeated word for word, 24-7.
....The 1,000 year reign of Christ Jesus, WILL BEGIN wholesome, good.....and turn AS UGLY as it is NOW...AND the last of the uppity mortals will be defeated once and for all...and Satan and his minions, defeated once and for all.
Everything is according to Gods WILL, not yours, not mine....
You denying Christ Jesus’ 1,000 yrs reign, Only affects you.
It is expressly revealed in Scripture. And you not only DENY, but come Against those who BELIEVE the Word of God.
Yes don’t be ignorant, 1,000 years to a man IS 1,000 years....to the Lord, whose existence is without beginning, A 1,000 years is but a blip of time. Men are not the Lord.
@Taken I do think that 1 Cor. 11.26 is clearly speaking of the church in relation to the Rapture; those other Scriptures about future events are clearly distinct.
Timtofly
Well-Known Member
The Light
Well-Known Member
Thanks for answering Paul.
I'm pretty sure you should realize that your answer is in error based on the scriptures.
Matthew 24
14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
We see in the above verses that those in Judea are told to flee. However, the Word also says there will be great tribulaiton such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
I doubt that the destruction in 70 AD was so great that there would never be any like it, forever.
It also says that except the days be shortened, no living flesh would receive salvation. That could not have happened in 70 AD either.
So in summary, you are not correct in the presentation you gave regarding the two questions the disciples asked.
Truth7t7
Well-Known Member
- Jan 2, 2014
- 10,872
- 3,283
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
- Country
- United States
A 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom on this earth is found no place in scripture, its a fabricated man made fairy tale
Not so. I am in good company.
Matthew Henry says:
Then shall be great tribulation; then when the measure of iniquity is full; then when the servants of God are sealed and secured, then come the troubles; nothing can be done against Sodom till Lot is entered into Zoar, and then look for fire and brimstone immediately. There shall be great tribulation. Great, indeed, when within the city plague and famine raged, and (worse than either) faction and division, so that every man's sword was against his fellow; then and there it was that the hands of the pitiful women flayed their own children. Without the city was the Roman army ready to swallow them up, with a particular rage against them, not only as Jews, but as rebellious Jews. War was the only one of the three sore judgment s that David excepted against; but that was it by which the Jews were ruined; and there were famine and pestilence in extremity besides. Josephus's History of the Wars of the Jews, has in it more tragical passages than perhaps any history whatsoever.
(1.) It was a desolation unparalleled, such as was not since the beginning of the world, nor ever shall be. Many a city and kingdom has been made desolate, but never any with a desolation like this. Let not daring sinners think that God has done his worst, he can heat the furnace seven times and yet seven times hotter, and will, when he sees greater and still greater abominations. The Romans, when they destroyed Jerusalem, were degenerated from the honour and virtue of their ancestors, which had made even their victories easy to the vanquished. And the wilfulness and obstinacy of the Jews themselves contributed much to the increase of the tribulation. No wonder that the ruin of Jerusalem was an unparalleled ruin, when the sin of Jerusalem was an unparalleled sin-even their crucifying Christ. The nearer any people are to God in profession and privileges, the greater and heavier will his judgment s be upon them, if they abuse those privileges, and be false to that profession, Amos 3:2.
(2.) It was a desolation which, if it should continue long, would be intolerable, so that no flesh should be saved, v. 22. So triumphantly would death ride, in so many dismal shapes, and with such attendants, that there would be no escaping, but, first or last, all would be cut off. He that escaped one sword, would fall by another, Isaiah 24:17-18. The computation which Josephus makes of those that were slain in several places, amounts to above two millions. No flesh shall be saved; he doth not say, "No soul shall be saved," for the destruction of the flesh may be for the saving of the spirit in the day of the Lord Jesus; but temporal lives will be sacrificed so profusely, that one would think, if it last awhile, it would make a full end.
But here is one word of comfort in the midst of all this terror-that for the elects' sake these days shall be shortened, not made shorter than what God had determined (for that which is determined, shall be poured upon the desolate, Daniel 9:27), but shorter than what he might have decreed, if he had dealt with them according to their sins; shorter than what the enemy designed, who would have cut all off, if God who made use of them to serve his own purpose, had not set bounds to their wrath; shorter than one who judged by human probabilities would have imagined. Note,
[1.] In times of common calamity God manifests his favour to the elect remnant; his jewels, which he will then make up; his peculiar treasure, which he will secure when the lumber is abandoned to the spoiler.
[2.] The shortening of calamities is a kindness God often grants for the elects' sake. Instead of complaining that our afflictions last so long, if we consider our defects, we shall see reason to be thankful that they do not last always; when it is bad with us, it becomes us to say, "Blessed be God that it is no worse; blessed be God that it is not hell, endless and remediless misery." It was a lamenting church that said, It is of the Lord's mercies that we are not consumed; and it is for the sake of the elect, lest their spirit should fail before them, if he should contend for ever, and lest they should be tempted to put forth, if not their heart, yet their hand, to iniquity.
And now comes in the repeated caution, which was opened before, to take heed of being ensnared by false Christs, and false prophets; (v. 23, etc.), who would promise them deliverance, as the lying prophets in Jeremiah's time (Jeremiah 14:13; 23:16-17; 27:16; 28:2), but would delude them. Times of great trouble are times of great temptation, and therefore we have need to double our guard then. If they shall say, Here is a Christ, or there is one, that shall deliver us from the Romans, do not heed them, it is all but talk; such a deliverance is not to be expected, and therefore not such a deliverer.
Adam Clarke says:
[For then shall be great tribulation] No history can furnish us with a parallel to the calamities and miseries of the Jews:-rapine, murder, famine, and pestilence within: fire and sword, and all the horrors of war, without. Our Lord wept at the foresight of these calamities; and it is almost impossible for any humane person to read the relation of them in Josephus without weeping also. Luke 21:22, calls these the days of vengeance, that all things which were written might be fulfilled.
1. These were the days in which all the calamities predicted by Moses, Joel, Daniel, and other prophets, as well as those predicted by our Saviour, met in one common center, and were fulfilled in the most terrible manner on that generation.
2. These were the days of vengeance in another sense, as if God's judgment s had certain periods and revolutions; for it is remarkable that the temple was burned by the Romans in the same month, and on the same day of the month, on which it had been burned by the Babylonians. See Josephus, War, b. 6 c. 4.
Jamieson, Fausset, and Brown says:
For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.
For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be. Such language is not unusual in the Old Testament with reference to tremendous calamities. But it is matter of literal fact, that there was crowded into the period of the Jewish War an amount and complication of suffering perhaps unparalleled; as the narrative of Josephus, examined closely and arranged under different heads, would show.
Truth7t7
Well-Known Member
- Jan 2, 2014
- 10,872
- 3,283
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
- Country
- United States
Your response is Laughable!
My post shows Jesus Christ returning in fire and final judgment (The End)
There won't be a future Millennial Kingdom on this earth at the return of Jesus, it will be (The End)!
Barnes' says:
For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
[There shall be great tribulation] The word "tribulation" means calamity or "suffering." Luke (Luke 21:24) has specified in what this tribulation would consist: "They shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations, and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles shall be fulfilled." That is, until the time allotted for the Gentiles "to do it" shall be fully accomplished, or as long as God is pleased to suffer them to do it.
The first thing mentioned by Luke is, that they should fall "by the edge of the sword" - that is, would be slain in war, as the sword was then principally used in war. This was most strikingly fulfilled. Josephus, in describing it, uses almost the very words of our Saviour. "All the calamities, says he, which had befallen any nation from the beginning of the world" were but small in comparison with those of the Jews. - Jewish Wars, b. i. preface, section 4.
He has given the following account of one part of the massacre when the city was taken: "And now, rushing into the city, they slew whomsoever they found, without distinction, and burned the houses and all the people who had fled into them; and when they entered for the sake of plunder, they found whole families of dead persons, and houses full of carcasses destroyed by famine, then they came out with their hands empty. And though they thus pitied the dead, they had not the same emotion for the living, but killed all they met, whereby they filled the lanes with dead bodies. "The whole city ran with blood," insomuch that many things which were burning were extinguished by the blood." - "Jewish Wars," b. 6 chapter 8, section 5; chapter 9, section 2,3. He adds that in the siege of Jerusalem not fewer than "eleven hundred thousand" perished (Jewish Wars, b. 6 chapter 9, section 3) - a number almost half as great as are in the whole city of London. In the adjacent provinces no fewer than "two hundred and fifty thousand" are reckoned to have been slain; making in all whose deaths were ascertained the almost incredible number of "one million three hundred and fifty thousand" who were put to death.
These were not, indeed, all slain with the sword. Many were crucified. "Many hundreds," says Josephus ("Jewish Wars," b. v. chapter 11, section 1), "were first whipped, then tormented with various kinds of tortures, and finally crucified; the Roman soldiers nailing them (out of the wrath and hatred they bore to the Jews), one after one way and another after another, to crosses, "by way of jest," until at length the multitude became so great that room was lacking for crosses, and crosses for the bodies." So terribly was their imprecation fulfilled - "his blood be on us and on our children," Matthew 27:25. If it be asked how it was possible for so many people to be slain in a single city, it is to be remembered that the siege of Jerusalem commenced during the time of the Passover, when all the males of the Jews were required to be there, and when it is estimated that more than "three million" were usually assembled. See Josephus, Jewish Wars, b. 6 chapter 9, section 3,4
Thomas Newton (1754) and others wrote on the connection :
"As a general in the wars (Josephus) must have had an exact knowledge of all transactions, and a Jewish priest he would not relate them with any favour of partiality to the Christian cause. He designed nothing less, and yet as if he had designed nothing more, his history of the Jewish wars may serve as a larger comment on our Saviour's prophecies of the destruction of Jerusalem." (Newton, p. 433)
John Wesley (1754)
"Josephus' History of the Jewish War is the best commentary on this chapter (Matt. 24). It is a wonderful instance of God's providence, that he, an eyewitness, and one who lived and died a Jew, should, especially in so extraordinary a manner, be preserved, to transmit to us a collection of important facts, which so exactly illustrate this glorious prophecy, in almost every circumstance." (Explanatory Notes Upon the New Testament)
William Whiston (1737)
"Josephus speaks so, that it is most evident he was fully satisfied that God was on the Romans' side, and made use of them now for the destruction of the Jews, which was for certain the true state of this matter, as the prophet Daniel first, and our Saviour himself afterwards had clearly foretold."
Philip Schaff (1877)
"The destruction of Jerusalem would be a worthy theme for the genius of a Christian Homer. It has been called "the most soul-stirring of all ancient history." But there was no Jeremiah to sing the funeral dirge of the city of David and Solomon. The Apocalypse was already written, and had predicted that the heathen "shall tread the holy city under foot forty and two months." (p. 397-398 )
F.W. Farrar (1882), Archbishop of the Anglican church, wrote on the account as follows:
"the Fall of Jerusalem and all the events which accompanied and followed it in the Roman world and in the Christian world, had a significance which it is hardly possible to overestimate. They were the final end of the Old Dispensation.
Truth7t7
Well-Known Member
- Jan 2, 2014
- 10,872
- 3,283
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
- Country
- United States
We Agree!
Reformed Preterist Eschatology in 70AD fulfillment of Daniel's AOD and The Great Tribulation is "Error" these are future events unfulfilled
Truth7t7
Well-Known Member
- Jan 2, 2014
- 10,872
- 3,283
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
- Country
- United States
We Disagree
"Preterism" In Reformed Eschatology In 66-70AD Fulfillment Is A "False Doctrine"
Matthew 24:15 (Daniel's AOD), And Matthew 24:21 (The Great Tribulation) Are "Future" Events Unfulfilled!
Scripture teaches (Daniel's AOD) in verse 15 causes (The Great Tribulation) in verse 21
Preterist Reformed Eschatology Problem:
Immediately After The Tribulation In Matthew 24:21, Jesus Returns In The Clouds Of Heaven As Seen Below in Matthew 24:29-30
Pretty Hard To Have A 66-70AD Great Tribulation, And Jesus Literally Returning In The Clouds Immediately After It
(The Reformed Eschatology Lie)
Now Reformed Eschatology Removes The Literal, Visible, Second Coming Seen In Matthew 24:29-30 Below Through Symbolic Allegory, To Make Way For Their False Preterist Teaching In 66-70AD Fulfillment
Yes Reformed Eschatology In 66-70AD Fulfillment, "Is As Much A Lie" As A Pre-Trib Rapture Or Millennial Kingdom Taught In Dispensationalism
Jesus Is The Lord!
Matthew 24:15-31KJV
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
25 Behold, I have told you before.
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
You should stop embarrassing yourself and read the Word of God.
It’s not all about you and your arbitrary thoughts.
Gods People ISRAEL from the beginning were given Covenants that which all shall be fulfilled.
We Disagree
"Preterism" In Reformed Eschatology In 66-70AD Fulfillment Is A "False Doctrine"
Matthew 24:15 (Daniel's AOD), And Matthew 24:21 (The Great Tribulation) Are "Future" Events Unfulfilled!
Scripture teaches (Daniel's AOD) in verse 15 causes (The Great Tribulation) in verse 21
Preterist Reformed Eschatology Problem:
Immediately After The Tribulation In Matthew 24:21, Jesus Returns In The Clouds Of Heaven As Seen Below in Matthew 24:29-30
Pretty Hard To Have A 66-70AD Great Tribulation, And Jesus Literally Returning In The Clouds Immediately After It
(The Reformed Eschatology Lie)
Now Reformed Eschatology Removes The Literal, Visible, Second Coming Seen In Matthew 24:29-30 Below Through Symbolic Allegory, To Make Way For Their False Preterist Teaching In 66-70AD Fulfillment
Yes Reformed Eschatology In 66-70AD Fulfillment, "Is As Much A Lie" As A Pre-Trib Rapture Or Millennial Kingdom Taught In Dispensationalism
Jesus Is The Lord!
Matthew 24:15-31KJV
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
25 Behold, I have told you before.
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
For info: i am not Preterist. I am an Idealist. But what I am arguing is held by most Amils.
jeffweeder
Well-Known Member
Preterist Reformed Eschatology Problem:
Immediately After The Tribulation In Matthew 24:21, Jesus Returns In The Clouds Of Heaven As Seen Below in Matthew 24:29-30
Pretty Hard To Have A 66-70AD Great Tribulation, And Jesus Literally Returning In The Clouds Immediately After It
I believe the GT began for the Jews when Rome destroyed the temple and led the survivor's captive in exile. Tribulation didnt stop there for them but continued abroad.
Similar to this...,
Deut 28
64 “And the Lord will scatter you among all peoples, from one end of the earth to the other, and there you shall serve other gods of wood and stone, which neither you nor your fathers have known. 65 And among these nations you shall find no respite, and there shall be no resting place for the sole of your foot, but the Lord will give you there a trembling heart and failing eyes and a languishing soul. 66 Your life shall hang in doubt before you. Night and day you shall be in dread and have no assurance of your life. 67 In the morning you shall say, ‘If only it were evening!’ and at evening you shall say, ‘If only it were morning!’ because of the dread that your heart shall feel, and the sights that your eyes shall see.
Lk 21
20 But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know and understand that its desolation has come near.
21 Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, and let those who are inside [the city] get out of it, and let not those who are out in the country come into it;
22 For those are days of vengeance [of rendering full justice or satisfaction], that all things that are written may be fulfilled.
23 Alas for those who are pregnant and for those who have babies which they are nursing in those days! For great misery and anguish and distress shall be upon the land and indignation and punishment and retribution upon this people.
24 They will fall by the mouth and the edge of the sword and will be led away as captives to and among all nations; and Jerusalem will be trodden down by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled (completed).
25 And there will be signs in the sun and moon and stars; and upon the earth [there will be] distress (trouble and anguish) of nations in bewilderment and perplexity [without resources, left wanting, embarrassed, in doubt, not knowing which way to turn] at the roaring (the echo) of the tossing of the sea,
26 Men swooning away or expiring with fear and dread and apprehension and expectation of the things that are coming on the world; for the [very] powers of the heavens will be shaken and caused to totter.
27 And then they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with great (transcendent and overwhelming) power and [all His kingly] glory (majesty and splendor).
28 Now when these things begin to occur, look up and lift up your heads, because your redemption (deliverance) is drawing near.
32 Truly I tell you, this generation (those living at that definite period of time) will not perish and pass away until all has taken place.
33 The sky and the earth (the universe, the world) will pass away, but My words will not pass away.
34 But take heed to yourselves and be on your guard, lest your hearts be overburdened and depressed (weighed down) with the giddiness and headache and nausea of self-indulgence, drunkenness, and worldly worries and cares pertaining to [the business of] this life, and [lest] that day come upon you suddenly like a trap or a noose;
35 For it will come upon all who live upon the face of the entire earth.
Last edited:
Truth7t7
Well-Known Member
- Jan 2, 2014
- 10,872
- 3,283
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
- Country
- United States
You Promote The False Teaching In Zionist Dual Covenant Theology, Two Peoples Of God
Truth7t7
Well-Known Member
- Jan 2, 2014
- 10,872
- 3,283
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
- Country
- United States
Do you believe Daniel's AOD Matthew 24:15, or The Great Tribulation Matthew 24:21 has been fulfilled, if so when?
Do you believe a "Future" literal, visible, second coming of Jesus Christ is seen in Matthew 24:29-30?
Last edited:
Similar threads
