WHAT IS THE RAPTURE? WHEN WILL THE RAPTURE OCCUR? The rapture is the phenomenon of the catching up or the gathering of the saints (believers) unto Jesus at his coming (1 Thessalonians 4: 16-17; 2 Thessalonians 2: 1-3). Dr. Tim LaHaye (Left Behind Series), Dr. Jack Van Impe, Dr. David Jeremiah, Hal Lindsey, the Southern Baptist Churches, the Pentecostal Assemblies of Canada, Pentecostal Churches throughout the world, many other denominational churches and numerous Bible Colleges teach a pretribulation rapture. But according to Jesus and the apostle Paul their doctrine is false. Jesus taught that the resurrection of the righteous will take place at the last day, at the end of the age (John 6: 39-40; Luke 20: 34-36). The apostle Paul taught that resurrection of the righteous will take place at the last trumpet (1 Corinthians 15: 50-54). Since the rapture cannot take place before the resurrection of the righteous takes place, then the scriptural conclusion is that the rapture will take place at the last day, at the last trumpet, at the end of the age, at the Second Coming of Jesus (John 6: 39-40; 1 Corinthians 15: 50-54; Luke 20: 34-36; Philippians 3: 20-21). If you have been taught a pretribulation rapture or a midtribulation rapture or a prewrath rapture, please comment on what the apostle Paul and our Lord Jesus Christ taught. Please read all the above Scriptures and ask the Holy Spirit to teach you. If you reject the authority of Scripture, you will be sinning against God. All Scripture is inspired by God (2 Timothy 3: 16). All prophecy is given by the Holy Spirit (2 Peter 1: 21). Blessings.Joseph
The Rapture
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(mahabirjem;49345)
WHAT IS THE RAPTURE? WHEN WILL THE RAPTURE OCCUR? The rapture is the phenomenon of the catching up or the gathering of the saints (believers) unto Jesus at his coming (1 Thessalonians 4: 16-17; 2 Thessalonians 2: 1-3). Dr. Tim LaHaye (Left Behind Series), Dr. Jack Van Impe, Dr. David Jeremiah, Hal Lindsey, the Southern Baptist Churches, the Pentecostal Assemblies of Canada, Pentecostal Churches throughout the world, many other denominational churches and numerous Bible Colleges teach a pretribulation rapture. But according to Jesus and the apostle Paul their doctrine is false. Jesus taught that the resurrection of the righteous will take place at the last day, at the end of the age (John 6: 39-40; Luke 20: 34-36). The apostle Paul taught that resurrection of the righteous will take place at the last trumpet (1 Corinthians 15: 50-54). Since the rapture cannot take place before the resurrection of the righteous takes place, then the scriptural conclusion is that the rapture will take place at the last day, at the last trumpet, at the end of the age, at the Second Coming of Jesus (John 6: 39-40; 1 Corinthians 15: 50-54; Luke 20: 34-36; Philippians 3: 20-21). If you have been taught a pretribulation rapture or a midtribulation rapture or a prewrath rapture, please comment on what the apostle Paul and our Lord Jesus Christ taught. Please read all the above Scriptures and ask the Holy Spirit to teach you. If you reject the authority of Scripture, you will be sinning against God. All Scripture is inspired by God (2 Timothy 3: 16). All prophecy is given by the Holy Spirit (2 Peter 1: 21). Blessings.Joseph
I just like to point out that the word Rapture doesn't exist in the Word of God. Since it's not there, I don't even like using words that God never used.
WHAT IS THE RAPTURE? WHEN WILL THE RAPTURE OCCUR? The rapture is the phenomenon of the catching up or the gathering of the saints (believers) unto Jesus at his coming (1 Thessalonians 4: 16-17; 2 Thessalonians 2: 1-3). Dr. Tim LaHaye (Left Behind Series), Dr. Jack Van Impe, Dr. David Jeremiah, Hal Lindsey, the Southern Baptist Churches, the Pentecostal Assemblies of Canada, Pentecostal Churches throughout the world, many other denominational churches and numerous Bible Colleges teach a pretribulation rapture. But according to Jesus and the apostle Paul their doctrine is false. Jesus taught that the resurrection of the righteous will take place at the last day, at the end of the age (John 6: 39-40; Luke 20: 34-36). The apostle Paul taught that resurrection of the righteous will take place at the last trumpet (1 Corinthians 15: 50-54). Since the rapture cannot take place before the resurrection of the righteous takes place, then the scriptural conclusion is that the rapture will take place at the last day, at the last trumpet, at the end of the age, at the Second Coming of Jesus (John 6: 39-40; 1 Corinthians 15: 50-54; Luke 20: 34-36; Philippians 3: 20-21). If you have been taught a pretribulation rapture or a midtribulation rapture or a prewrath rapture, please comment on what the apostle Paul and our Lord Jesus Christ taught. Please read all the above Scriptures and ask the Holy Spirit to teach you. If you reject the authority of Scripture, you will be sinning against God. All Scripture is inspired by God (2 Timothy 3: 16). All prophecy is given by the Holy Spirit (2 Peter 1: 21). Blessings.Joseph
I just like to point out that the word Rapture doesn't exist in the Word of God. Since it's not there, I don't even like using words that God never used.
- Feb 3, 2007
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1 Thess. 4: 16-17 "caught up" is translated by the verb "rapio" in the Latin Bible from which the word rapture is got. Joseph
(mahabirjem;49345)
WHAT IS THE RAPTURE? WHEN WILL THE RAPTURE OCCUR? The rapture is the phenomenon of the catching up or the gathering of the saints (believers) unto Jesus at his coming (1 Thessalonians 4: 16-17; 2 Thessalonians 2: 1-3). Dr. Tim LaHaye (Left Behind Series), Dr. Jack Van Impe, Dr. David Jeremiah, Hal Lindsey, the Southern Baptist Churches, the Pentecostal Assemblies of Canada, Pentecostal Churches throughout the world, many other denominational churches and numerous Bible Colleges teach a pretribulation rapture. But according to Jesus and the apostle Paul their doctrine is false. Jesus taught that the resurrection of the righteous will take place at the last day, at the end of the age (John 6: 39-40; Luke 20: 34-36). The apostle Paul taught that resurrection of the righteous will take place at the last trumpet (1 Corinthians 15: 50-54). Since the rapture cannot take place before the resurrection of the righteous takes place, then the scriptural conclusion is that the rapture will take place at the last day, at the last trumpet, at the end of the age, at the Second Coming of Jesus (John 6: 39-40; 1 Corinthians 15: 50-54; Luke 20: 34-36; Philippians 3: 20-21). If you have been taught a pretribulation rapture or a midtribulation rapture or a prewrath rapture, please comment on what the apostle Paul and our Lord Jesus Christ taught. Please read all the above Scriptures and ask the Holy Spirit to teach you. If you reject the authority of Scripture, you will be sinning against God. All Scripture is inspired by God (2 Timothy 3: 16). All prophecy is given by the Holy Spirit (2 Peter 1: 21). Blessings.Joseph
You are correct there is no "so called Rapture" there is only a changing at the last trump 7th that is the End when Jesus returns the catching away phrase in first Thess 4 is explained in 2 Thessthe subject here is the gathering to our Lord it is after the man of sin the Son of perdition the falling away these are all terms that are associated with the tribulation it will not come until after the tribulation. That is the second coming of the Lord No One is going anywhere. Then we read in 1 cor.15 We will all be changed in the twinkling of an eye.
WHAT IS THE RAPTURE? WHEN WILL THE RAPTURE OCCUR? The rapture is the phenomenon of the catching up or the gathering of the saints (believers) unto Jesus at his coming (1 Thessalonians 4: 16-17; 2 Thessalonians 2: 1-3). Dr. Tim LaHaye (Left Behind Series), Dr. Jack Van Impe, Dr. David Jeremiah, Hal Lindsey, the Southern Baptist Churches, the Pentecostal Assemblies of Canada, Pentecostal Churches throughout the world, many other denominational churches and numerous Bible Colleges teach a pretribulation rapture. But according to Jesus and the apostle Paul their doctrine is false. Jesus taught that the resurrection of the righteous will take place at the last day, at the end of the age (John 6: 39-40; Luke 20: 34-36). The apostle Paul taught that resurrection of the righteous will take place at the last trumpet (1 Corinthians 15: 50-54). Since the rapture cannot take place before the resurrection of the righteous takes place, then the scriptural conclusion is that the rapture will take place at the last day, at the last trumpet, at the end of the age, at the Second Coming of Jesus (John 6: 39-40; 1 Corinthians 15: 50-54; Luke 20: 34-36; Philippians 3: 20-21). If you have been taught a pretribulation rapture or a midtribulation rapture or a prewrath rapture, please comment on what the apostle Paul and our Lord Jesus Christ taught. Please read all the above Scriptures and ask the Holy Spirit to teach you. If you reject the authority of Scripture, you will be sinning against God. All Scripture is inspired by God (2 Timothy 3: 16). All prophecy is given by the Holy Spirit (2 Peter 1: 21). Blessings.Joseph
You are correct there is no "so called Rapture" there is only a changing at the last trump 7th that is the End when Jesus returns the catching away phrase in first Thess 4 is explained in 2 Thessthe subject here is the gathering to our Lord it is after the man of sin the Son of perdition the falling away these are all terms that are associated with the tribulation it will not come until after the tribulation. That is the second coming of the Lord No One is going anywhere. Then we read in 1 cor.15 We will all be changed in the twinkling of an eye.
(Called 2 Conquer;49413)
congratulations, you have figured out when Jeses is to return to gather up the church. Oops, does the bible say something about the day and the hour can not be known, that ONLY the Father knows when that is. The 7th Trumpet of the tribulation, the last judgement before the bowl or vial judgements which ushers in the great tributation which is the last 3 1/2 years of the total tribulation age. Being that the 7th trumpet judgement effectively ends the first 3 1/2 years of the tribulation what you have claimed is assigning a day and hour to the collection of Christ's church which as I noted before CAN NOT BE KNOWN. BTW the end of the age spoken of the leads up to the pre-trib rapture is the church age which we currently live in. When this age ends the church, which is the body of beleivers WILL ne caught up with Jesus in the air. As Jesus does not touch the earth it will not be the second coming. That event will take place post tribulation pre judgement of anti-christ when He stains the hem of His robe with the blood of the followers of anti-christ.
please provide any scripture that says that. where are we told of two comings?? where are we told of any pre trib rapture?? we are told blessed are the ones that make it to the end. Your scernio is not what my bible says. Where do you think you are going?? flesh and blood can not enter heaven Satan is the prince of the air so where is it you are going be???We are simply told no one knows the hour or the day we are to know the season its why the signs were given to us in matt, luke and Mark we are also told the events in Rev. we are told this because God has foretold us all things except the hour and the day so you idea we cant know its the at the 7th trump is not supported anywhere.
congratulations, you have figured out when Jeses is to return to gather up the church. Oops, does the bible say something about the day and the hour can not be known, that ONLY the Father knows when that is. The 7th Trumpet of the tribulation, the last judgement before the bowl or vial judgements which ushers in the great tributation which is the last 3 1/2 years of the total tribulation age. Being that the 7th trumpet judgement effectively ends the first 3 1/2 years of the tribulation what you have claimed is assigning a day and hour to the collection of Christ's church which as I noted before CAN NOT BE KNOWN. BTW the end of the age spoken of the leads up to the pre-trib rapture is the church age which we currently live in. When this age ends the church, which is the body of beleivers WILL ne caught up with Jesus in the air. As Jesus does not touch the earth it will not be the second coming. That event will take place post tribulation pre judgement of anti-christ when He stains the hem of His robe with the blood of the followers of anti-christ.
please provide any scripture that says that. where are we told of two comings?? where are we told of any pre trib rapture?? we are told blessed are the ones that make it to the end. Your scernio is not what my bible says. Where do you think you are going?? flesh and blood can not enter heaven Satan is the prince of the air so where is it you are going be???We are simply told no one knows the hour or the day we are to know the season its why the signs were given to us in matt, luke and Mark we are also told the events in Rev. we are told this because God has foretold us all things except the hour and the day so you idea we cant know its the at the 7th trump is not supported anywhere.
(Called 2 Conquer;49431)
You claim the rapture is a lie. Personally I would be careful. Prior to Luther posting his 95 Theses, some of which spoke of justifacation which prior to that time no church excepted justifacation as biblical. Also, I did some checking and you support something not mentioned anywhere in the bible. The trinity. nowhere in the bible is the word trinity used yet in several of your posts you support the trinity.From that information I gather and so will others, that while one word that is not in the bible is ok and good (trinity) but that the other is bad and evil (rapture). While I expect you will say its not the word rapture that you have a problem with but that it will happen prior to the tribulation that is wrong. The fact is the bible does support the pre-trib rapture. In later posts, assuming my account is not disabled or that I am banned for daring to disagree with you and Denver I will show you with biblical evidence that shows the the pre-trib rapture is true and sound doctrine.
Kriss and I could careless what Luther has to say. We only care about God and the scriptures has to say. Be careful what you wish for. God doesn't want any preconceived ideas of men. He wants us go to Him like little childrens...
You claim the rapture is a lie. Personally I would be careful. Prior to Luther posting his 95 Theses, some of which spoke of justifacation which prior to that time no church excepted justifacation as biblical. Also, I did some checking and you support something not mentioned anywhere in the bible. The trinity. nowhere in the bible is the word trinity used yet in several of your posts you support the trinity.From that information I gather and so will others, that while one word that is not in the bible is ok and good (trinity) but that the other is bad and evil (rapture). While I expect you will say its not the word rapture that you have a problem with but that it will happen prior to the tribulation that is wrong. The fact is the bible does support the pre-trib rapture. In later posts, assuming my account is not disabled or that I am banned for daring to disagree with you and Denver I will show you with biblical evidence that shows the the pre-trib rapture is true and sound doctrine.
Kriss and I could careless what Luther has to say. We only care about God and the scriptures has to say. Be careful what you wish for. God doesn't want any preconceived ideas of men. He wants us go to Him like little childrens...
(Called 2 Conquer;49435)
Jag I note that you too support the concept of the trinity which I mentioned before is not in the bible period. Just because a word is not in the bible doesn't mean its meaning isn't. As most Christians that take the time to suddy the Word will note many times the scriptures have dual and even multiple meanings depending on where you are in your walk of faith. I have read the (rapture lie) study done by denver and found it filled with more holes than swiss cheese. Could it be that millions of Christians past and present that believe the pre-trib rapture are wrong and that a very few are right and its not a pretrib rapture? Sure, Jesus proved that by putting the establishment on it ear but, and I say this with absolutely no sarcasm, I bet if I looked as your wrists I wouldn't find nail holes in them. Personally I study God's Word daily and have so for a number of years and am currently undergoing training to become a pastor. I keep in touch with every pastor I can and have talk with them extensicely about the various rapture models. All of them agree that the pre-trib rapture is biblical as did Martin Luther, D.L.Moody, Alaster Begg, Dr. Jeramiah, Dr. Swindal, Billy and Franklin Graham, Jerry Faldwell and so many other great biblical teachers. Dallas Thoelogical Seminary actively teaches Pre-trib rapture as do most other seminaries. What you are saying is that the greatest theological minds are all wrong and you are right. I would ask what theological training you have had that leads you to your conclusions? Finally, lets not forget that there is plenty of evidence in the bible that supports the Pre-trib rapture. 1 Thessalonians 4:17, Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.Kriss made the point the Satan is the prince and power of the air which is true however, Revelation 16:15, 15Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame. Being the Jesus is coming into the domain granted to Satan He would come as a thief to take His followers and only reveal Himself with a shout and the trumph to call His sheep to Himself. Remember Jesus said in John 10:14-17 "I am the good shepherd; I know my sheep and my sheep know me— just as the Father knows me and I know the Father—and I lay down my life for the sheep. I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd. The reason my Father loves me is that I lay down my life—only to take it up again. Because the majority of the world do not follow the Lord when the rapture comes they won't hear a thing because they are not His sheep. He who has ears to hear let him hear.
Don't ever claim men's words as Christ's word or the rest of the Word of God. No Pre-Tribulation Rapture existed in the Word of God, nor a Mid-Tribulation Rapture. As I can prove it by scriptures.John 16:33 - These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.Your believe, but I take no comfort in liars.
Jag I note that you too support the concept of the trinity which I mentioned before is not in the bible period. Just because a word is not in the bible doesn't mean its meaning isn't. As most Christians that take the time to suddy the Word will note many times the scriptures have dual and even multiple meanings depending on where you are in your walk of faith. I have read the (rapture lie) study done by denver and found it filled with more holes than swiss cheese. Could it be that millions of Christians past and present that believe the pre-trib rapture are wrong and that a very few are right and its not a pretrib rapture? Sure, Jesus proved that by putting the establishment on it ear but, and I say this with absolutely no sarcasm, I bet if I looked as your wrists I wouldn't find nail holes in them. Personally I study God's Word daily and have so for a number of years and am currently undergoing training to become a pastor. I keep in touch with every pastor I can and have talk with them extensicely about the various rapture models. All of them agree that the pre-trib rapture is biblical as did Martin Luther, D.L.Moody, Alaster Begg, Dr. Jeramiah, Dr. Swindal, Billy and Franklin Graham, Jerry Faldwell and so many other great biblical teachers. Dallas Thoelogical Seminary actively teaches Pre-trib rapture as do most other seminaries. What you are saying is that the greatest theological minds are all wrong and you are right. I would ask what theological training you have had that leads you to your conclusions? Finally, lets not forget that there is plenty of evidence in the bible that supports the Pre-trib rapture. 1 Thessalonians 4:17, Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.Kriss made the point the Satan is the prince and power of the air which is true however, Revelation 16:15, 15Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame. Being the Jesus is coming into the domain granted to Satan He would come as a thief to take His followers and only reveal Himself with a shout and the trumph to call His sheep to Himself. Remember Jesus said in John 10:14-17 "I am the good shepherd; I know my sheep and my sheep know me— just as the Father knows me and I know the Father—and I lay down my life for the sheep. I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd. The reason my Father loves me is that I lay down my life—only to take it up again. Because the majority of the world do not follow the Lord when the rapture comes they won't hear a thing because they are not His sheep. He who has ears to hear let him hear.
Don't ever claim men's words as Christ's word or the rest of the Word of God. No Pre-Tribulation Rapture existed in the Word of God, nor a Mid-Tribulation Rapture. As I can prove it by scriptures.John 16:33 - These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.Your believe, but I take no comfort in liars.
Alanforchrist
Member
- Dec 25, 2007
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(mahabirjem;49345)
WHAT IS THE RAPTURE? WHEN WILL THE RAPTURE OCCUR? The rapture is the phenomenon of the catching up or the gathering of the saints (believers) unto Jesus at his coming (1 Thessalonians 4: 16-17; 2 Thessalonians 2: 1-3). Dr. Tim LaHaye (Left Behind Series), Dr. Jack Van Impe, Dr. David Jeremiah, Hal Lindsey, the Southern Baptist Churches, the Pentecostal Assemblies of Canada, Pentecostal Churches throughout the world, many other denominational churches and numerous Bible Colleges teach a pretribulation rapture. But according to Jesus and the apostle Paul their doctrine is false. Jesus taught that the resurrection of the righteous will take place at the last day, at the end of the age (John 6: 39-40; Luke 20: 34-36). The apostle Paul taught that resurrection of the righteous will take place at the last trumpet (1 Corinthians 15: 50-54). Since the rapture cannot take place before the resurrection of the righteous takes place, then the scriptural conclusion is that the rapture will take place at the last day, at the last trumpet, at the end of the age, at the Second Coming of Jesus (John 6: 39-40; 1 Corinthians 15: 50-54; Luke 20: 34-36; Philippians 3: 20-21). If you have been taught a pretribulation rapture or a midtribulation rapture or a prewrath rapture, please comment on what the apostle Paul and our Lord Jesus Christ taught. Please read all the above Scriptures and ask the Holy Spirit to teach you. If you reject the authority of Scripture, you will be sinning against God. All Scripture is inspired by God (2 Timothy 3: 16). All prophecy is given by the Holy Spirit (2 Peter 1: 21). Blessings.Joseph
According to the original Greek, the Last day Jesus said in John 6: 39-40. Is the end of the dipensation of grace, The end of an era. The pre-tribulation rapture of the Church.Then the world enters the dispnsation of wrath.Pauls's last tump in 1 Corinthians 15: 50--54. Is the last Earthly trumpet that the Church [The ones who are ready] will hear. And has nothing to do with the seventh trupet mentioned in the book of Revelation. Even the mid-trib saints have already gone before the 1st trupet starts.We know from the Bible, that the anti-Christ cannot opperate untill the Church [The ones that are ready] has gone. 2 Thessalonians 2:3, & 6--8.Saddly some Christians will miss the Pre-trib rapture and will go through the tribulation.There are far to many scriptures that tells us that the Christians that are ready will go before the tribulation, for it not to be true.
WHAT IS THE RAPTURE? WHEN WILL THE RAPTURE OCCUR? The rapture is the phenomenon of the catching up or the gathering of the saints (believers) unto Jesus at his coming (1 Thessalonians 4: 16-17; 2 Thessalonians 2: 1-3). Dr. Tim LaHaye (Left Behind Series), Dr. Jack Van Impe, Dr. David Jeremiah, Hal Lindsey, the Southern Baptist Churches, the Pentecostal Assemblies of Canada, Pentecostal Churches throughout the world, many other denominational churches and numerous Bible Colleges teach a pretribulation rapture. But according to Jesus and the apostle Paul their doctrine is false. Jesus taught that the resurrection of the righteous will take place at the last day, at the end of the age (John 6: 39-40; Luke 20: 34-36). The apostle Paul taught that resurrection of the righteous will take place at the last trumpet (1 Corinthians 15: 50-54). Since the rapture cannot take place before the resurrection of the righteous takes place, then the scriptural conclusion is that the rapture will take place at the last day, at the last trumpet, at the end of the age, at the Second Coming of Jesus (John 6: 39-40; 1 Corinthians 15: 50-54; Luke 20: 34-36; Philippians 3: 20-21). If you have been taught a pretribulation rapture or a midtribulation rapture or a prewrath rapture, please comment on what the apostle Paul and our Lord Jesus Christ taught. Please read all the above Scriptures and ask the Holy Spirit to teach you. If you reject the authority of Scripture, you will be sinning against God. All Scripture is inspired by God (2 Timothy 3: 16). All prophecy is given by the Holy Spirit (2 Peter 1: 21). Blessings.Joseph
According to the original Greek, the Last day Jesus said in John 6: 39-40. Is the end of the dipensation of grace, The end of an era. The pre-tribulation rapture of the Church.Then the world enters the dispnsation of wrath.Pauls's last tump in 1 Corinthians 15: 50--54. Is the last Earthly trumpet that the Church [The ones who are ready] will hear. And has nothing to do with the seventh trupet mentioned in the book of Revelation. Even the mid-trib saints have already gone before the 1st trupet starts.We know from the Bible, that the anti-Christ cannot opperate untill the Church [The ones that are ready] has gone. 2 Thessalonians 2:3, & 6--8.Saddly some Christians will miss the Pre-trib rapture and will go through the tribulation.There are far to many scriptures that tells us that the Christians that are ready will go before the tribulation, for it not to be true.
Jerusalem Junkie
New Member
- Jan 7, 2008
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You claim the rapture is a lie. Personally I would be careful. Prior to Luther posting his 95 Theses, some of which spoke of justifacation which prior to that time no church excepted justifacation as biblical.
Luther was a joke plain and simple....
Luther was a joke plain and simple....
(Called 2 Conquer;49431)
You claim the rapture is a lie. Personally I would be careful. Prior to Luther posting his 95 Theses, some of which spoke of justifacation which prior to that time no church excepted justifacation as biblical. Also, I did some checking and you support something not mentioned anywhere in the bible. The trinity. nowhere in the bible is the word trinity used yet in several of your posts you support the trinity.From that information I gather and so will others, that while one word that is not in the bible is ok and good (trinity) but that the other is bad and evil (rapture). While I expect you will say its not the word rapture that you have a problem with but that it will happen prior to the tribulation that is wrong. The fact is the bible does support the pre-trib rapture. In later posts, assuming my account is not disabled or that I am banned for daring to disagree with you and Denver I will show you with biblical evidence that shows the the pre-trib rapture is true and sound doctrine.
I used to believe in that rapture bunk, till you try to find it in the Word,then its not there go ahead give it your best shot, show me what isnt written if you can do without twisting the scripture. There is no evidence I could care less about the Word itself being there in Latain it was never met to mean what or when men teach about it isnt taught. No one has ever been able to prove it to date Thats why its called a "Theroy" there are sites that offer money if anyone can prove it. So you think you can go for it and dont give me words of other men I want scripture and Gods Word. And as far as trinity your right the Word is not there but the concept is taught unlike rapure the Word is there in latain , but the entire concept is never taught. Nor spoken of nor is their anything about it. written anywhere in the Word.If I kicked people off for just disagreeing with me half the people here would have to be kicked off for one reason or another I dont think theres many here that agree on everything.
You claim the rapture is a lie. Personally I would be careful. Prior to Luther posting his 95 Theses, some of which spoke of justifacation which prior to that time no church excepted justifacation as biblical. Also, I did some checking and you support something not mentioned anywhere in the bible. The trinity. nowhere in the bible is the word trinity used yet in several of your posts you support the trinity.From that information I gather and so will others, that while one word that is not in the bible is ok and good (trinity) but that the other is bad and evil (rapture). While I expect you will say its not the word rapture that you have a problem with but that it will happen prior to the tribulation that is wrong. The fact is the bible does support the pre-trib rapture. In later posts, assuming my account is not disabled or that I am banned for daring to disagree with you and Denver I will show you with biblical evidence that shows the the pre-trib rapture is true and sound doctrine.
I used to believe in that rapture bunk, till you try to find it in the Word,then its not there go ahead give it your best shot, show me what isnt written if you can do without twisting the scripture. There is no evidence I could care less about the Word itself being there in Latain it was never met to mean what or when men teach about it isnt taught. No one has ever been able to prove it to date Thats why its called a "Theroy" there are sites that offer money if anyone can prove it. So you think you can go for it and dont give me words of other men I want scripture and Gods Word. And as far as trinity your right the Word is not there but the concept is taught unlike rapure the Word is there in latain , but the entire concept is never taught. Nor spoken of nor is their anything about it. written anywhere in the Word.If I kicked people off for just disagreeing with me half the people here would have to be kicked off for one reason or another I dont think theres many here that agree on everything.
followerofchrist
New Member
- Nov 22, 2007
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Called 2 Conquer I notice that you have yet to supply ANY scripture to support a pre-tribulation rapture. You gave one verse to support the rapture but not a PRE-tribulation rapture. I use to believe in this too, but now I see the truth.
(Alanforchrist;49670)
According to the original Greek, the Last day Jesus said in John 6: 39-40. Is the end of the dipensation of grace, The end of an era. The pre-tribulation rapture of the Church.Then the world enters the dispnsation of wrath.Pauls's last tump in 1 Corinthians 15: 50--54. Is the last Earthly trumpet that the Church [The ones who are ready] will hear. And has nothing to do with the seventh trupet mentioned in the book of Revelation. Even the mid-trib saints have already gone before the 1st trupet starts.We know from the Bible, that the anti-Christ cannot opperate untill the Church [The ones that are ready] has gone. 2 Thessalonians 2:3, & 6--8.Saddly some Christians will miss the Pre-trib rapture and will go through the tribulation.There are far to many scriptures that tells us that the Christians that are ready will go before the tribulation, for it not to be true.
Right on Right on
According to the original Greek, the Last day Jesus said in John 6: 39-40. Is the end of the dipensation of grace, The end of an era. The pre-tribulation rapture of the Church.Then the world enters the dispnsation of wrath.Pauls's last tump in 1 Corinthians 15: 50--54. Is the last Earthly trumpet that the Church [The ones who are ready] will hear. And has nothing to do with the seventh trupet mentioned in the book of Revelation. Even the mid-trib saints have already gone before the 1st trupet starts.We know from the Bible, that the anti-Christ cannot opperate untill the Church [The ones that are ready] has gone. 2 Thessalonians 2:3, & 6--8.Saddly some Christians will miss the Pre-trib rapture and will go through the tribulation.There are far to many scriptures that tells us that the Christians that are ready will go before the tribulation, for it not to be true.
Right on Right on
If you re-read that and include the preceeding verses you will notice that it is the evil ones that are taken away. The good ones are in the ark. This is hard for me too.37As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man.
(crooner49974)
(Alanforchrist;49670)
According to the original Greek, the Last day Jesus said in John 6: 39-40. Is the end of the dipensation of grace, The end of an era. The pre-tribulation rapture of the Church.Then the world enters the dispnsation of wrath.Pauls's last tump in 1 Corinthians 15: 50--54. Is the last Earthly trumpet that the Church [The ones who are ready] will hear. And has nothing to do with the seventh trupet mentioned in the book of Revelation. Even the mid-trib saints have already gone before the 1st trupet starts.We know from the Bible, that the anti-Christ cannot opperate untill the Church [The ones that are ready] has gone.2 Thessalonians 2:3, & 6--8.Saddly some Christians will miss the Pre-trib rapture and will go through the tribulation.There are far to many scriptures that tells us that the Christians that are ready will go before the tribulation, for it not to be true.
Right on Right onCrooner, Alanforchrist is a Pre-Tribulation Rapture believer...He's trying to mislead innocent souls.(Called 2 Conquer;49970)
I know the Rapture, due to its lack of the word actually appearing in the bible is a bit of a problem for some christians. I also point out those that do not believe in the Pre-trib rapture are in the vast minority. Yes being in the minority doesn't always make them wrong. However, Christ will remove the church at the end of the Church age prior to the coming of anti-christ's reign which is the tribulation and great tribulation period taught in Revelation. One passage in Matthew 24 is something the mid-tribers and post-tribers can not explain.It is Matthew 24:40-41, Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left. This speaks of a removal from earth. The precceding verses speak of the signs to come and speak of the day and hour not being known. Why where some taken and some left? Where did they go? Has God ever removed a human from earth while still alive? These are some of the questions that need answers. 1. Why where some taken and some left?When God acts in judgement people die. For examples read of the Isrealies travels between Egypt and Isreal. When God acts for the godly, to spare them, He takes them alive. For examples read of Elijah and Enoch. Elijah and Enoch where both removed or raptured by God. So some will be left from this age because they failed to accept the Gift of Jesus and some will be removed because they have.2. Where did they go?Follow the examples of Enoch and Elijah. If God took them and the bible says He did then those removed from this age will go to the same place; Heaven. Those left with suffer THE tribulation. Yes the Bible says we as Christian will suffer tribulation but it never says we will suffer THE tribulation which is a period of judgment and a last chance for those seperated from God.3. Has God ever removed a human from earth while still alive?Elijah and Enoch are the only ones the bible mentions. There may have been others but I can't comfirm that nor deny it so I will just leave it at that.Matthew 24 states flat out some will be taken while others will remain. Pre-trib shows God's mercy and love by removing His church from the earth before the 7 years of tribulation. Post-trib is kinda pointless. Why would God remove His church after the tribulation which ends by Jesus defeating the armies of anti-christ? Jesus is here bodily, would you want to leave then and would the Father want to take you away from the earthly reign of His Son? No to both I suspect. Mid-trib is just not doable. See once the 7 years begins the seventh trumpet judgemnt becomes predictable which would make Jesus a liar and we know Jesus doesn't lie. He said the day and hour can not be known but the seventh trumpet judment immediately ushers in the great tribulation so it would happen at the 3 1/2 year point. That is knowable. The first seven judgements effect the entire planet, no one is safe from them for sure be they believers or non-believers. The next seven are generally targeted at non-believers and the followers of anti-christ. Why would God make His people endure that? It would be mean and cruel and the God in the bible is Just and loving and mercyful especially to those that follow Him. Also you should know that the last trump or trumpet according to the bible is a sound for gathering or preperation for war. WHile the saints will follow Christ to defeat anti-christ they will not fight in any way shape or form. They are observers only. So that makes the point that the trumpet is used to gather. Jesus will gather His church before THE tribulation to Himself and remove them. In retrospect when probably shouldn't call it the "rapture" but the "gathering" which is exactly what it is.
Your post is in vein. It's vanity and is complete junk...straight from Hell.
(Alanforchrist;49670)
According to the original Greek, the Last day Jesus said in John 6: 39-40. Is the end of the dipensation of grace, The end of an era. The pre-tribulation rapture of the Church.Then the world enters the dispnsation of wrath.Pauls's last tump in 1 Corinthians 15: 50--54. Is the last Earthly trumpet that the Church [The ones who are ready] will hear. And has nothing to do with the seventh trupet mentioned in the book of Revelation. Even the mid-trib saints have already gone before the 1st trupet starts.We know from the Bible, that the anti-Christ cannot opperate untill the Church [The ones that are ready] has gone.2 Thessalonians 2:3, & 6--8.Saddly some Christians will miss the Pre-trib rapture and will go through the tribulation.There are far to many scriptures that tells us that the Christians that are ready will go before the tribulation, for it not to be true.
Right on Right onCrooner, Alanforchrist is a Pre-Tribulation Rapture believer...He's trying to mislead innocent souls.(Called 2 Conquer;49970)
I know the Rapture, due to its lack of the word actually appearing in the bible is a bit of a problem for some christians. I also point out those that do not believe in the Pre-trib rapture are in the vast minority. Yes being in the minority doesn't always make them wrong. However, Christ will remove the church at the end of the Church age prior to the coming of anti-christ's reign which is the tribulation and great tribulation period taught in Revelation. One passage in Matthew 24 is something the mid-tribers and post-tribers can not explain.It is Matthew 24:40-41, Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left. This speaks of a removal from earth. The precceding verses speak of the signs to come and speak of the day and hour not being known. Why where some taken and some left? Where did they go? Has God ever removed a human from earth while still alive? These are some of the questions that need answers. 1. Why where some taken and some left?When God acts in judgement people die. For examples read of the Isrealies travels between Egypt and Isreal. When God acts for the godly, to spare them, He takes them alive. For examples read of Elijah and Enoch. Elijah and Enoch where both removed or raptured by God. So some will be left from this age because they failed to accept the Gift of Jesus and some will be removed because they have.2. Where did they go?Follow the examples of Enoch and Elijah. If God took them and the bible says He did then those removed from this age will go to the same place; Heaven. Those left with suffer THE tribulation. Yes the Bible says we as Christian will suffer tribulation but it never says we will suffer THE tribulation which is a period of judgment and a last chance for those seperated from God.3. Has God ever removed a human from earth while still alive?Elijah and Enoch are the only ones the bible mentions. There may have been others but I can't comfirm that nor deny it so I will just leave it at that.Matthew 24 states flat out some will be taken while others will remain. Pre-trib shows God's mercy and love by removing His church from the earth before the 7 years of tribulation. Post-trib is kinda pointless. Why would God remove His church after the tribulation which ends by Jesus defeating the armies of anti-christ? Jesus is here bodily, would you want to leave then and would the Father want to take you away from the earthly reign of His Son? No to both I suspect. Mid-trib is just not doable. See once the 7 years begins the seventh trumpet judgemnt becomes predictable which would make Jesus a liar and we know Jesus doesn't lie. He said the day and hour can not be known but the seventh trumpet judment immediately ushers in the great tribulation so it would happen at the 3 1/2 year point. That is knowable. The first seven judgements effect the entire planet, no one is safe from them for sure be they believers or non-believers. The next seven are generally targeted at non-believers and the followers of anti-christ. Why would God make His people endure that? It would be mean and cruel and the God in the bible is Just and loving and mercyful especially to those that follow Him. Also you should know that the last trump or trumpet according to the bible is a sound for gathering or preperation for war. WHile the saints will follow Christ to defeat anti-christ they will not fight in any way shape or form. They are observers only. So that makes the point that the trumpet is used to gather. Jesus will gather His church before THE tribulation to Himself and remove them. In retrospect when probably shouldn't call it the "rapture" but the "gathering" which is exactly what it is.
Your post is in vein. It's vanity and is complete junk...straight from Hell.
Ya know what. It really dosen't matter if you believe pre, mid or post trib rapture. It really dosen't. All that is needed for salvation is to believe that Jesus Christ is your Lord and Savior. If you believe, and read His Word for yourself, you will find the truth you are looking for. Be alert and be ready. He is comming for us. Just be ready. Donnie
Sorry Donnie I can not buy that if one isnt aware that Antichrist comes first you are in danger of believing he is Christ come to gather us to him. We are told this in 2 Thess.that the gathering to our Lord is after the man of sin, and the falling away this is the tribulation.If you dont know Antichrist comes in the 5th/6th trump and the true Christ not until the 7th and last. You are in danger of being part of the Whole world that follows after the beast.Daniel is told; BLESSED is he who waits and COMES TO the 1335 days Dan 12:12,
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