The Second Death

[Michael S. Blanchard]

The Lake of Fire. Those who do not make Jesus's Standards are thrown into the lake of fire, they experience the Second Death. So, what would the first death be? I think I read somewhere that Jesus said, "Unless you are born first of water, You cannot be born again. So I always thought that in order to be born twice, I had to live my life and die. Then be born again in the world of God to be judged by him who earned the right to rule the Earth. My Mother gave birth to me with her water, everyone is born in water the first time. The born again concept in modern religion was introduced in the evangelistic period of the late 1960's and 1970's. We all should embrace being born again when we die. If we live our lives according to the laws of God, we have nothing to fear, and everything else is just......Nada

 

[marks]

The Lake of Fire. Those who do not make Jesus's Standards are thrown into the lake of fire, they experience the Second Death. So, what would the first death be? I think I read somewhere that Jesus said, "Unless you are born first of water, You cannot be born again. So I always thought that in order to be born twice, I had to live my life and die. Then be born again in the world of God to be judged by him who earned the right to rule the Earth. My Mother gave birth to me with her water, everyone is born in water the first time. The born again concept in modern religion was introduced in the evangelistic period of the late 1960's and 1970's. We all should embrace being born again when we die. If we live our lives according to the laws of God, we have nothing to fear, and everything else is just......Nada

Hi Michael,

I'm not sure what you mean when you say, "the born again concept in modern religion", I suppose that could mean different things depending on who is saying it.

Regardless, I find that the Bible has some relevant passages.

1 Peter 1:3-5 KJV
3) Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4) To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5) Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

1 Peter 1:23 KJV
23) Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

John 1:12-13 KJV
12) But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
13) Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

These are a few which tell me that rebirth is something that happens here in our terrestrial life. That we can be in a state of having already been reborn.

2 Corinthians 5:17-18 KJV
17) Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
18) And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

Ephesians 4:23-24 KJV
23) And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
24) And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

This new man, this is the one born from God.

Much love!

 

[GISMYS_7]

All men die and that physical death is the first death but unbelieving God rejectors will be judged and suffer separation from God in the lake of fire=he second death. Separation from God =spiritual death.

 

[Enoch111]

If we live our lives according to the laws of God, we have nothing to fear, and everything else is just......Nada

The new birth (to be born again) is what is essential to enter into, and to see, the Kingdom of God. However, when Jesus said we must be born of water and of the Spirit, he was NOT referring to the natural birth. This "water" was a metaphor for the Gospel -- the Word of God (1 Peter 1:23-25). So it is not perfect obedience to the laws of God which will guarantee your entry into Heaven (since none can obey perfectly). However, by repenting and believing on the Lord Jesus Christ, you will be born again (John 1:12,13). And you will become a child of God, with your citizenship in Heaven. And in order to believe on Christ one must hear the Gospel and obey the Gospel.

 

[Michael S. Blanchard]

There was no "born again" in Christianity in my life of following God, (Jesus), until the early 1960's. See The era of "Jesus Christ Superstar". i lived it, born after the war, raised on Billy Graham Crusades, Camp meetings, The Catholic Church, every T.v, evangelist, Good or bad, Seeking God and the answer to the question Who am I, Why am I here? Never went to a public school, even High School. Have read and studied the bible al of my life. It does not make any difference what I know or what I believe. I will be judged according to MY works. My aim is to make Christians read their bible and let God show them the mysteries and pieces of the puzzle that are in the Bible. Read The words of Jesus, in the New Testament. He is the God who wrote the words in the Old Testament. "I am here to do the will of my Father" Find it, it's in the New Testament. Jesus was doing the "will of my Father". God the Father told us of his will. Jesus will return, having earned the right to "Judge the living and the dead". please, everyone, overcome "the king of the air", do not get thrown into the "Lake of Fire". Accept Jesus and ask God to forgive you for your iniquities. P.S. Our country should pray for our country's iniquities, a National hour of prayer, where we ask God to forgive us for our sins against Him. Maybe its the way to change the weather. He controls the weather not us. We are as nieve as the Babalonians who were making a tower to God because they thought that they were great. We believe in "Science".........Not God!..I trust God will show you....if you read his word in the New and Old Tesatament.

 

[Michael S. Blanchard]

The new birth (to be born again) is what is essential to enter into, and to see, the Kingdom of God. However, when Jesus said we must be born of water and of the Spirit, he was NOT referring to the natural birth. This "water" was a metaphor for the Gospel -- the Word of God (1 Peter 1:23-25). So it is not perfect obedience to the laws of God which will guarantee your entry into Heaven (since none can obey perfectly). However, by repenting and believing on the Lord Jesus Christ, you will be born again (John 1:12,13). And you will become a child of God, with your citizenship in Heaven. And in order to believe on Christ one must hear the Gospel and obey the Gospel.

OK

 

[GISMYS_7]

There was no "born again" in Christianity in my life of following God, (Jesus), until the early 1960's. See The era of "Jesus Christ Superstar". i lived it, born after the war, raised on Billy Graham Crusades, Camp meetings, The Catholic Church, every T.v, evangelist, Good or bad, Seeking God and the answer to the question Who am I, Why am I here? Never went to a public school, even High School. Have read and studied the bible al of my life. It does not make any difference what I know or what I believe. I will be judged according to MY works. My aim is to make Christians read their bible and let God show them the mysteries and pieces of the puzzle that are in the Bible. Read The words of Jesus, in the New Testament. He is the God who wrote the words in the Old Testament. "I am here to do the will of my Father" Find it, it's in the New Testament. Jesus was doing the "will of my Father". God the Father told us of his will. Jesus will return, having earned the right to "Judge the living and the dead". please, everyone, overcome "the king of the air", do not get thrown into the "Lake of Fire". Accept Jesus and ask God to forgive you for your iniquities. P.S. Our country should pray for our country's iniquities, a National hour of prayer, where we ask God to forgive us for our sins against Him. Maybe its the way to change the weather. He controls the weather not us. We are as nieve as the Babalonians who were making a tower to God because they thought that they were great. We believe in "Science".........Not God!..I trust God will show you....if you read his word in the New and Old Tesatament.

Believe God's Word!!
Ephesians 2:8 (KJV) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Ephesians Not of works, lest any man should boast.

 

[BarneyFife]

I trust God will show you....if you read his word in the New and Old Tesatament.

We trust God will show you, too.

Is that fair?

 

[Enoch111]

I will be judged according to MY works.

There is a big difference between being judged "according to your works" and having your works judged in order to receive (or not receive) rewards from Christ.

As we see in Revelation 20, it is the unsaved who are judged "according to their works". But there is no condemnation for those who are Christ Jesus, since Christ took our judgment upon Himself at the cross. The Bible says that He (who knew no sin) was made SIN for us so that we might be made the righteousness of God in Him. So God imputes righteousness to the one who repents and believes on the Lord Jesus Christ (Romans 4). Therefore we are justified by grace through faith, and our works follow after. And eternal life is the GIFT of God (Rom 6:23).

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. (Ephesians 2:8-10)

 

[quietthinker]

The Lake of Fire. Those who do not make Jesus's Standards are thrown into the lake of fire, they experience the Second Death. So, what would the first death be? I think I read somewhere that Jesus said, "Unless you are born first of water, You cannot be born again. So I always thought that in order to be born twice, I had to live my life and die. Then be born again in the world of God to be judged by him who earned the right to rule the Earth. My Mother gave birth to me with her water, everyone is born in water the first time. The born again concept in modern religion was introduced in the evangelistic period of the late 1960's and 1970's. We all should embrace being born again when we die. If we live our lives according to the laws of God, we have nothing to fear, and everything else is just......Nada

Firstly Michael you are broaching two topics.
You need to read the text John 3:1-21

The Spirit is God's agency which convicts and sets in motion a new way for the heart to see. Nothing you do is involved except embracing it when it occurs.
Water is the element or symbol of regeneration/cleansing of our understanding/ our ability to see. It progressively gives us the same view of ourselves that God has of us......a view which reassures us of being accepted in the beloved....a view which makes us desire to be obedient rather than rebellious.

The first death is the death we are all subject to...babies die, healthy people die, we all die....the scripture calls this death a sleep because all will be resurrected from it.....some to life some to destruction.

The second death is the death of those who refuse the promptings of God's Spirit....they are the living dead so to speak....they refuse their eyes to be opened though they make much noise about them being opened, deceiving themselves with copious religious talk and practice.

The second death is reference to destruction.

WE are all given life when we are born from our mothers.....we have no choice in being born but to breath. If we do not breath we die.
The new birth is a Spiritual birth where the same principles apply.

The second death is a death chosen in the process of refusing the regenerating Spirit God draws all men with.

A time is reserved for the destruction of all that creates and loves sin.

 

[Enoch111]

A time is reserved for the destruction of all that creates and loves sin.

While the word "destruction" is used frequently in the NT. it does NOT mean annihilation. It means eternal damnation (Mark 16:16 and other passages). That is conscious torment --day and night -- in the Lake of Fire.

And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. (Rev 20:10)

While Gehenna -- the Lake of Fire -- also called "Hell" was created for the devil and his angels, it is also reserved for the unsaved dead who are not written in the Lamb's Book of Life. And that is exactly why the Gospel must be preached in all the world to every creature.

 

[ScottA]

The new birth (to be born again) is what is essential to enter into, and to see, the Kingdom of God. However, when Jesus said we must be born of water and of the Spirit, he was NOT referring to the natural birth. This "water" was a metaphor for the Gospel -- the Word of God (1 Peter 1:23-25). So it is not perfect obedience to the laws of God which will guarantee your entry into Heaven (since none can obey perfectly). However, by repenting and believing on the Lord Jesus Christ, you will be born again (John 1:12,13). And you will become a child of God, with your citizenship in Heaven. And in order to believe on Christ one must hear the Gospel and obey the Gospel.

1 Peter 1:23-25 refers to the word of God as the means leading to being born again...not first as is the case with being born of water.

If a metaphor helps, consider: "Thus God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament; and it was so." Genesis 1:7

I would say that Jesus was equating being born of water as of those waters below, as born of women rather than of God, saying that both must be. Which is according to our experience: "However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural, and afterward the spiritual." 1 Corinthians 15:46

 

[quietthinker]

While the word "destruction" is used frequently in the NT. it does NOT mean annihilation. It means eternal damnation (Mark 16:16 and other passages). That is conscious torment --day and night -- in the Lake of Fire.

I suppose it's like the word 'death' not meaning death? Twisting the meaning of plain words Enoch is an old game.

 

[Behold]

I suppose it's like the word 'death' not meaning death? Twisting the meaning of plain words Enoch is an old game.

When God told Adam 'you shall surely die" if you take that Apple........ this was on one hand, true literal death.
As Adam's body died, and so will yours.

But there is the symbolic death......that is to become separated from God's Spirit........which is the "fall of Adam", into the "Adamic nature"
See that?
That is a death, but its not an end.......its a separation or a lost spiritual union between Adam's Spirit and God.

When Jesus tells you that you must be born again.....this means you must be reborn spiritually , as Adam was, before he became spiritually separated from God.
See that?
To be BORN AGAIN, and Jesus told you that you must be born again, to go to heaven......is the birthing of your spirit as born again into the Spirit of God, by the Holy Spirit.
End result? "ONE WITH GOD"..."IN CHRIST".

If this never happens to you before you die, then your SPIRIT ends up where you go when you have never been born again, = HELL..... as your BODY will be in a hole in the ground.

 

[GISMYS_7]

Separation from God is spiritual death and then there is physical death of the body.

 

[Behold]

Separation from God is spiritual death and then there is physical death of the body.

But your spirit does not die.
Its eternal.....so, the "death"......is the "Separation", and when the spirit is again joined to God.....it is BORN AGAIN....as "One with God". .IN Christ"

See that?
That is to become a CHRISTian.

 

[GISMYS_7]

But your spirit does not die.
Its eternal.....so, the "death"......is the "Separation", and when the spirit is again joined to God.....it is BORN AGAIN....as "One with God". .IN Christ"

See that?
That is to become a CHRISTian.

Again!!! Separation from God is spiritual death=your spirit can be alive but dead to God.

 

[Behold]

Again!!! Separation from God is spiritual death=your spirit can be alive but dead to God.

And to regain this, that you wrote. is to become LIKE 1st ADAM, before he rebelled.
Water baptism can't do that for you, can't cause that to happen.

Here is how it happens...
2nd Adam, who is Christ, is God as a man living a holy life, sinless, and this is provided on the Cross as our Salvation. as "the Gift of Salvation"

To get this applied to you so that you become "ONE with God"..."born again"..... you do this...
= "the work of God is that you BELIEVE on Jesus, whom God sent".

1.) To BELIEVE is to give God your FAITH, in Christ, and He will take it, as : "'FAITH is counted as righteousness"

2.) "As Righteousness": means that God sees what JESUS DID.....His HOLY LIFE, as if you did it..

This is to be "MADE RIGHTEOUS"
This is to receive....= "the Gift of Righteousness".

 

[quietthinker]

When God told Adam 'you shall surely die" if you take that Apple........ this was on one hand, true literal death.
As Adam's body died, and so will yours.

But there is the symbolic death......that is to become separated from God's Spirit........which is the "fall of Adam", into the "Adamic nature"
See that?
That is a death, but its not an end.......its a separation or a lost spiritual union between Adam's Spirit and God.

When Jesus tells you that you must be born again.....this means you must be reborn spiritually , as Adam was, before he became spiritually separated from God.
See that?
To be BORN AGAIN, and Jesus told you that you must be born again, to go to heaven......is the birthing of your spirit as born again into the Spirit of God, by the Holy Spirit.
End result? "ONE WITH GOD"..."IN CHRIST".

If this never happens to you before you die, then your SPIRIT ends up where you go when you have never been born again, = HELL..... as your BODY will be in a hole in the ground.

Cobbling a statement to validate an idea which is not directly connected to that statement is a slippery exercise.
The fact remains that death as per God's plain and transparent statement is the result of disobedience. To confirm this the word 'surely' is included in God's statement; 'you shall surely die'

 

[Behold]

Cobbling a statement to validate an idea which is not directly connected to that statement is a slippery exercise.
The fact remains that death as per God's plain and transparent statement is the result of disobedience. To confirm this the word 'surely' is included in God's statement; 'you shall surely die'

When you continue to state what you can't prove, you continue to play a fool's game
So, cobble that, quietthinker.

And Adam's body did die, as i wrote, but his spirit, did not......it only lost union with God's which is defined as a "death", but its not the same as the death of a mortal body,.. and that is because your spirit will never die.
its eternal., and once it leaves your dead body, its going to God.
Will it stay there?
Only if your spirit is born again. as Jesus told you that you must be born again., and water baptism can not cause this to happen.