The Seventh Seal

[Ronald Nolette]

I have a list of 117 Bible Prophesies that describe the terrible Day of the Lord's vengeance and wrath and they can all be literally fulfilled by a Coronal Mass Ejection. There is no other natural event which can do what the Prophets say will happen on that sudden and shocking Day.

The Sixth Seal must be caused by a natural event, so as the godless peoples can continue on in their rejection of God.

If it is a natural phenomenon. But we do not see in Rev. or elsewhere millions dying from a massive CME. We see the heavenlies dimmed by 1/3 and then men being scorched, but not dying-

It may be a CME or it may be a supernatural event God orchestrates. You are too hung up on your own analysis. I have read dozens of booklets and books from others just like yourself who make declarations as to teh what of future events with absolute certainty. Thatr is human pride.

The Sixth Seal must be caused by a natural event, so as the godless peoples can continue on in their rejection of God.

Well it will be worked out in nature, but it just as well may be God forcing the earth to convulse! YOU DO NOT KNOW! What God does always reflects on the earth but that does not mean it was naturally caused.

But I and others, do refute you with Bible proofs. You simply ignore them.
For example, Jesus said six times that people can and will never go to live in heaven. After the Millennium, God and therefore heaven, will come to us on earth. Revelation 21:1-7
You just keep on rattling on about the false 'rapture to heaven' rubbish. Expect to have to explain to God why you promoted such nonsense.

Yes heaven in Revelation 21 does come down from heaven to be with man. but you forget passages in REv. 19 where the bride of Christ is in heaven for the marriage ceremony.

You also forget John 14:

John 14

King James Version

​

14 Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

Because you seem to reject a dispensational hermeneutic to understanding SCripture, you spiritualize these away to say people will not inhabit heaven, Jesus said your opinion is just not so!

Paul also refutes this in Cor.:

2 Corinthians 5

King James Version

​

5 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.
2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven:
3 If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked.
4 For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life.
5 Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit.
6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:
7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight
8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

So unless you hold to the false doctrine of soul sleep, Paul absolutely declared that when one is absent from the body- they are present with the Lord. It is that simple and does not need an Ovaltine decoder ring to understand.

Whenever God allows them to do so. Rev 6:10, Rev 19:1-8

Nice non-answer answer

Jesus opened the first Five Seals at His Ascension. Revelation 5:5-9,
Proved by the historical record of all those things having happened over the last nearly 2000 years. They could hardly have been much worse.

The Four horsemen are simply symbolic of what God will allow to happen as described. Jesus will Return, riding on a Spiritual horse.

All four plagues of the horsemen have been happening long before Jesus came to earth. what makes His leaving different.

and that is a hugew spiritualization of REv. 5 to declare he opened those seals at His ascension. YOu seem to forget that john wrote these words over 60 years after jesus ascended and the seals were things that must come afterward- shoots down your rewrite of SCripture.

Both Jesus and the Shekinah glory of God in the Temple, will withdraw from the earth during the 3 1/2 years allowed for Satan to have world control. Rev 11:2
This is shown to us in Revelation 12:7-10. where Satan comes down to the earth and Jesus is proclaimed King in heaven. Then after the 42 months, Jesus will Return to take up His rule.

I will grant you have a talent for rewriting Scripture and inserting implications not even hinted at by the Inspired Writers.

This is gross error and shocking false teaching. You really show your wrong beliefs, when you add to Revelation 19:5-9
The place for the Marriage Supper is not mentioned, but it has to be on earth; after Satan is chained up, Rev 20:1-3, and after Jesus has Returned.

And you err for you do not read things as written but reinterpret them as you wish! I am talking about the marriage ceremony itself. Not the Wedding Supper. I know th esupper is on earth, but the marriage takes place in heaven.

You probably will not read this, but this is an enormously informative manuscript of Jesus and His espoused according to the Jewish wedding system. It matches perfectly!

https://arielcontent.org/dcs/pdf/mbs113m.pdf

 

[Ronald Nolette]

The Biblical proof that the tribulation is over before the wrath of God begins can be found in these verses. The signs of the sun, moon and stars mark the event of the coming of Jesus at the 6 seal before wrath begins. As the Word says, the tribulation is OVER.

Have you ever read the OT?

Joel 2:

30 And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke.

31 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and terrible day of the Lord come.

32 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the Lord hath said, and in the remnant whom the Lord shall call.

The tribulation is called the day of the Lord numerous times in the OT. And the sun and moon do their thing BEFORE the day.

Matthew 24 shows them repeating this when Jesus returns and that is after the trumpets and vials.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Even Jesus? Well there is great tribulation after the Antichrist enters the Temple. And then the tribulation ends and Jesus returns for a harvest at the 6th seal, and then the wrath of God begins when the 7th seal is opened.

So you believe that Jesus returns as described in REv. 19 after the opening of the sixth seal?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Don't you think that Armageddon is over and Jesus has returned when the kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord?

Of course not! If they did they would not be reported on much later by John and God. According to you we have to bounce back and forth in Revelation to get the right events in the right time frame. god is not the author of confusion and does such silly things.

The trumpets and bowls occur in the same time frame. They are both the wrath of God.

Just can't happen. It is foolish to think they are concurrent. Yes they are both part of the wrath of god but that doesn't mean they happen together.

And Petra is found when one does a complete study of Eschatology through the whole bible. The fact that Israel flees to Petra is proven in the OT and verified they flee to a pre-prepared place in Rev.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Here is how I understand the 7th Seal:

View attachment 28681

7th SEALed In Powerpoint : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

7th SEALed In PowerpointYOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCplWZcKcFd1tNbHYPS-5t9wINTERNET ARCHIVE: ...

archive.org

7th Sealed In by brother Aaron Earnest : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

7th Sealed In by brother Aaron EarnestYOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCplWZcKcFd1tNbHYPS-5t9wINTERNET ARCHIVE: ...

archive.org

7th SEALed In Revelation 8 Vs 1 In Type & Anti Type Snapshot : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

7th SEALed In Revelation 8 Vs 1 In Type & Anti Type SnapshotYOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCplWZcKcFd1tNbHYPS-5t9wINTERNET ARCHIVE: ...

archive.org

Point 17 is FALSE making 1 to 17 false --- all FRAUD

 

[The Light]

Have you ever read the OT?

Joel 2:

30 And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke.

31 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and terrible day of the Lord come.

All you have done is prove my point. And yet you do not understand that you proving my point. So the sun turns dark and the moon to blood before the day of the Lord.

And yet Matthew 24 says that the tribulation is over before the signs of the sun, moon and stars.

Matthew 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

The tribulation is called the day of the Lord numerous times in the OT.

Can you provide Biblical proof of this statement? I will be surprised if you can find any verses that prove this. I'm thinking just a misunderstanding of the text and many incorrect teachings of a multitude of Biblical teachers.

And the sun and moon do their thing BEFORE the day.

Exactly. And it is IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE TRIBULATION of those days

Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

Matthew 24 shows them repeating this when Jesus returns and that is after the trumpets and vials.

This statement is one of the sources of your misunderstanding. I know this is taught by many, many, many people. And it is wrong, wrong, wrong. The coming of Jesus in Matthew 24 is NOT the coming of Jesus that occurs after the trumpets and vials. I don't care how many times you have heard this. I don't care how many men of God have proclaimed this in their teaching. It is in error. We can prove this is in error. One more time. Look at the following verses. TRIBULATION IS NOT WRATH.

Matthew 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Revelation 6

12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;

16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

What can we conclude???????????????????????????

We can conclude from Matthew 24 that IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE TRIBULATION the signs of the sun, moon and stars happen.

We can conclude from Revelation 6 that the 6th seal is opened and then we have the signs of the sun, moon and stars.

We can also conclude from Revelation 6 that the WRATH OF GOD happens AFTER the signs of the sun, moon and stars.

So Matthew 24 tells you that the tribulation is over before the signs of the sun, moon and stars and Revelation 6 tells you that the wrath of God begins AFTER the signs of the sun, moon and stars.

So tribulation is not wrath.

We can also conclude that Jesus returns at the 6th seal. This return is before the wrath of God which is before the trupets and vials, so the coming of Jesus in Matthew 24 is not the coming of Jesus in Revelation 19

 

[The Light]

So you believe that Jesus returns as described in REv. 19 after the opening of the sixth seal?

I believe that Jesus returns as described in Revelation 19 at the end of the wrath of God. I also believe that Jesus return at the 6th seal before the wrath of God begins. The 6th seal coming of Jesus is not the same as the Revelation 19 coming of Jesus.

According to you we have to bounce back and forth in Revelation to get the right events in the right time frame. god is not the author of confusion and does such silly things.
Just can't happen. It is foolish to think they are concurrent. Yes they are both part of the wrath of god but that doesn't mean they happen together.

Silly things? Go read Genesis 7. It is short. How many times did Noah load the animals? How many floods were there? Noah only in reality loads the animals one time, yet we are given three different views of the loading and each time we receive more information. We see the earth flooded three times and yet in reality there was only one flood. Revelation is written in the same style. We are given two different views of the tribulation and two different view of the wrath of God. In reality, there is only one tribulation and one wrath of God.

 

[ewq1938]

And somehow you think that the Great Tribulation ends up after the 1000 years.

I said no such thing.

 

[ewq1938]

I believe that Jesus returns as described in Revelation 19 at the end of the wrath of God. I also believe that Jesus return at the 6th seal before the wrath of God begins. The 6th seal coming of Jesus is not the same as the Revelation 19 coming of Jesus.

The so-called two second comings which by definition is wrong. The 6th seal only speaks of teh second coming, not that it happens right then just like the second coming was described before but didn't happen at that time. The second coming is described many times in various ways but in real time or present tense action is only in Rev 19.

There is ONE SECOND COMING, not two.

 

[The Light]

I said no such thing.

Sorry. Misread your post.

The so-called two second comings which by definition is wrong. The 6th seal only speaks of teh second coming, not that it happens right then just like the second coming was described before but didn't happen at that time. The second coming is described many times in various ways but in real time or present tense action is only in Rev 19.

There is ONE SECOND COMING, not two.

Okay. What's this?

Revelation 14

14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.

18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.

19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

 

[ewq1938]

Sorry. Misread your post.

Okay. What's this?

One of many descriptions of the second coming and surrounding events. It's not happening at the Rev 14 "timeframe" though. Only Rev 19 shows the actual real time events of the coming. The 6th seal and part of Rev 14 describe it in various ways just as Christ described it in the OD but the second coming did not take place in the timeframe of Matthew 24.

One key to the seals is understanding they are knowledge of future events not events themselves. They describes events that actually take place in the various trumps such as the second coming happens at the 7th trump, earlier described in the 6th seal from the perspective of the unsaved and in Rev 14 in the symbolism of a harvest.

 

[The Light]

One key to the seals is understanding they are knowledge of future events not events themselves. They describes events that actually take place in the various trumps such as the second coming happens at the 7th trump, earlier described in the 6th seal from the perspective of the unsaved and in Rev 14 in the symbolism of a harvest.

I hear many claim that the seals are not events, and yet the 1st 6 seals are the tribulation period and the 7th seal is the wrath of God. Since no wrath happens until the 7th seal is opened. That means what you are saying has to be error.

 

[ewq1938]

I hear many claim that the seals are not events, and yet the 1st 6 seals are the tribulation period

The seals speak of the actions of the trumps...plus the tribulation is just one of the trumpets.

and the 7th seal is the wrath of God.

Not according to the 7th seal, which is a half hour of silence in heaven.

Since no wrath happens until the 7th seal is opened. That means what you are saying has to be error.

Nothing I said disagrees with that. God's wrath comes at the last trump, not before it.

 

[The Light]

The seals speak of the actions of the trumps...plus the tribulation is just one of the trumpets.

Absolutely incorrect brother.

Not according to the 7th seal, which is a half hour of silence in heaven.

There is silence in heaven for about a half hour before the trumpets of wrath begin.

Nothing I said disagrees with that. God's wrath comes at the last trump, not before it.

No sir. Every trumpet is wrath. Every vial is wrath.

 

[ewq1938]

No sir. Every trumpet is wrath.

Nope. God's wrath starts at the 7th trump:

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Rev 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
Rev 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

Here it clearly states that God's wrath has come (arrives) after the 7th trump sounds. Clearly God's wrath hadn't been coming for a long time before this or else the statement would be meaningless.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

All you have done is prove my point. And yet you do not understand that you proving my point. So the sun turns dark and the moon to blood before the day of the Lord.

And yet Matthew 24 says that the tribulation is over before the signs of the sun, moon and stars.

Matthew 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

But you miss that the day of the Lord is also called
Jacobs trouble
Day of darkness
Day of gloom
70th week of Daniel
the tribulation etc.

There are siimply two times when the sun darkens and the moon turns to blood-

Before the wrath of God and right before Jesus returns. It is that simple.

Can you provide Biblical proof of this statement? I will be surprised if you can find any verses that prove this. I'm thinking just a misunderstanding of the text and many incorrect teachings of a multitude of Biblical teachers.

I(f I take the time to dig them and post them- will you read them? There are very many.

so you think you and yo0ur teachers are correct and have proper understanding of all the eschatological verses. It seems you have not even bothered to research what god has to say about the end times in the OT where there are scads o0f info

This statement is one of the sources of your misunderstanding. I know this is taught by many, many, many people. And it is wrong, wrong, wrong.

I await your detailed rebuttal then and will forego answering other things until you deliver your rebuttal Scriputrally.
.

 

[ewq1938]

There are siimply two times when the sun darkens and the moon turns to blood-

Before the wrath of God and right before Jesus returns. It is that simple.

But that is wrong. There is one time, one day when that happens and it is the day Christ returns. But you will say, "it says BEFORE". Before has two meanings including "going before a judge" which is not before in time but right then and there to FACE the judge.


Joel 2:31 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.


6440

06440 paniym {paw-neem'} pl. (but always as sing.) of an unused
noun [paneh{paw-neh'}

from 06437; TWOT - 1782a; n m

AV - before 1137, face 390, presence 76, because 67, sight 40,
countenance 30, from 27, person 21, upon 20, of 20, ...me 18,
against 17, ...him 16, open 13, for 13, toward 9, misc 195; 2109

1) face
1a) face, faces
1b) presence, person
1c) face (of seraphim or cherubim)
1d) face (of animals)
1e) face, surface (of ground)
1f) as adv of loc/temp
1f1) before and behind, toward, in front of, forward, formerly,
from beforetime, before
1g) with prep
1g1) in front of, before, to the front of, in the presence of,
in the face of, at the face or front of, from the presence of,
from before, from before the face of


This means to come BEFORE a judge which would be at that very time, right in front, or to FACE a judge.

Here is the same word being used, and its clear it is not "before" as in previous


Ezekiel 43:24 And thou shalt offer them BEFORE the LORD, and the priests shall cast salt upon them, and they shall offer them up for a burnt offering unto the LORD.


That means to offer them TO the lord, or TO his FACE, which means to come to him directly and offer. Same word and meaning in Joel.

 

[Keraz]

But that is wrong. There is one time, one day when that happens and it is the day Christ returns. But you will say, "it says BEFORE". Before has two meanings including "going before a judge" which is not before in time but right then and there to FACE the judge.

But your premise is wrong, as the people say: Hide us from the face of the One who sits on the Throne....... Revelation 6:16
They all take shelter as they see their doom approaching.
The Sixth Seal event is at least 10 years before Jesus Returns. You re-arrange Revelation to make it at the Return. Bad you.

There are siimply two times when the sun darkens and the moon turns to blood-

Before the wrath of God and right before Jesus returns. It is that simple

Plainly and evidently wrong.
The sun does darken at the Return, but the moon will not give its light.... Matthew 24:29

The moon only glows bright red one time; at the Sixth Seal Day of the Lord's fiery wrath, Joel 2:31, Revelation 6:12
The moon will be red before the Lord strikes the earth, for just a few hours, as the huge mass of superheated hydrogen ejected from the sun travels toward the earth.
This terrible disaster will set the scene for all the Prophesied things to happen, leading up to the glorious Return. When all the wrath of Gid will be over. Revelation 15:1

 

[ewq1938]

But your premise is wrong, as the people say: Hide us from the face of the One who sits on the Throne....... Revelation 6:16
They all take shelter as they see their doom approaching.

You didn't read the passage correctly. They are not "taking shelter".

The Sixth Seal event is at least 10 years before Jesus Returns. You re-arrange Revelation to make it at the Return.

The 6th seal speaks of the second coming from the perspective of the unsaved. The seal is opened thousands of years before the Coming happens.

Plainly and evidently wrong.
The sun does darken at the Return, but the moon will not give its light.... Matthew 24:29

The moon only glows bright red one time;

It cannot glow at all because the sun will be dark.

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

 

[Keraz]

You didn't read the passage correctly. They are not "taking shelter".

Yes they are and we too are warned to get under cover. Isaiah 26:20-21

The 6th seal speaks of the second coming from the perspective of the unsaved. The seal is opened thousands of years before the Coming happens.

Not the Sixth Seal. The cosmic things and earthly devastations, remain unfulfilled.

It cannot glow at all because the sun will be dark.

It will shine brightly red from two effects; The reflection of the initial flash. Isaiah 30:26a, and from the hit by the mass of superheated hydrogen plasma, causing a thermolumiscent reaction.

This will happen years before Jesus Returns as per Matthew 24:29-30. Revelation 19:11-14