Where do you find "can be" ? I don't see it, but I see "will be" then read on down to verse 26 "all Israel shall be saved".
The unfaithful servant
- Thread starter Prentis
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If you try to use that Matt.22 example our Lord Jesus gave there against Christian brethren that believe on Jesus, then you would be misusing Christ's Own Message there which He gave to point to the corrupt unbelieving Pharisees. That one that tried to sneak in without a wedding garment does not represent a believer on Him. Misuse that against Christian brethren, and you bring a condemnation upon yourself.
Does that mean the Pharisees will be saved too?
The issue at that point is understanding who Israel, that shall be saved is. Israel is both sticks in God's hand, Judah and Ephraim, (Ezekiel 37).
God saves all Israel means he will save both Jews and Gentiles in Christ. Also, God said he would take Israel into the promised land, of those to whom he promised this, two made it only, others fell because of unbelief.
Yes, he will take their blindness away. But as it was when Christ came, it is a remnant that turns to him and follows him.
The Pharisees, just like the Israelites in the desert, serve as an example of one of the ways man may go.
Is it wrong to warn men, brothers in the Lord, that if we do not continue in the goodness of God, we also will be cut off? That if we do not endure, we will not be given the crown of life?
Tell me, which prophets were condemned by God in the Old Testament, those who cried out against the wrongs of Israel and it's need to turn to God, or those who cried 'peace peace, the Lord is with us'?
If we are to be wise children of the most high, we must heed the many warnings he gives us. It is possible for any of us to become either as the Pharisees, or as Peter, John, and the faithful brethren.
I think if you will look at this scripture with understanding the dispensations or ages I think it will help you.
If you would study all of God's Word asking our Lord for understanding, then you would know why Christ gave that parable as a pointer to the Pharisees who sought against Him, and why it cannot apply to a believer on Christ Jesus. It's not about blinded Israel either. It's about Jude 1:4.
Man has so wished to explain these types of scripture away, that he has assigned it all to a dispensation, or an age, or a specific people... Anything he might find, as long as it absolves any possibility of it being applied to him.
The scriptures show forth an example. When God says to the Ninevites 'Forty days and your city will be destroyed', obviously he's not talking to us. And yet, Paul says all scripture is good for instruction unto righteousness.
How is that? It is because the scriptures show forth an example. The spirits that battle, have they changed? Has God changed? What about the devil?
Though the outer expression might have changed, and though we see an evolution on the surface, the battle is the same. Still today, some are wicked, not knowing God and doing evil, some are filthy, they have knowledge of God but pervert it, some are righteous, they do what is right and love their neighbour, and some are holy, given over to the will of God. When our doctrine puts us in a special position with God, of special favour, we ought to worry, because the Pharisees' doctrine did the same for them.
The scriptures show forth an example. When God says to the Ninevites 'Forty days and your city will be destroyed', obviously he's not talking to us. And yet, Paul says all scripture is good for instruction unto righteousness.
How is that? It is because the scriptures show forth an example. The spirits that battle, have they changed? Has God changed? What about the devil?
Though the outer expression might have changed, and though we see an evolution on the surface, the battle is the same. Still today, some are wicked, not knowing God and doing evil, some are filthy, they have knowledge of God but pervert it, some are righteous, they do what is right and love their neighbour, and some are holy, given over to the will of God. When our doctrine puts us in a special position with God, of special favour, we ought to worry, because the Pharisees' doctrine did the same for them.
Romans 9:6 ¶Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
Israel was the name given to Jacob by reason of Jacob's faith which was so strong that he wrestled tirelessly with an angel to recieve God's promise.
Abraham was given the promise by faith. And we also. That is what makes us Abraham's seed, heirs to the promise, the true Israel of God.
Galatians 3:22 "But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe."
Romans 11:32 says much the same thing but that one need look at what appears in the original text to be able to see that.
Romans 11:32 For God hath concluded [them] all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
See for your self that the word "them" (which personalizes what is said to the fleshly nation) was added:
Romans 11:32 For <G1063> God <G2316> hath concluded <G4788> them <G9999> all <G3956> in <G1519> unbelief <G0543>, that <G2443> he might have mercy <G1653> upon all <G3956>.
And the word there translated "unbelief", <0543>? It more precisely means "disobedient" as in "stubborn".
Everyone tries to make that word "unbelief" out like it is <G0570>
apaistia -- pronounced: ap-is-tee'-ah
from 571; faithlessness, i.e. (negatively) disbelief (lack of Christian faith), or (positively) unfaithfulness (disobedience): KJV -- unbelief.
Paul is not concerned with everyone of natural birth (even as is his point at Romans 9:6), but those he distinguished as the genuine Israel. Those would prove to have fertile soil in their hearts, so that he could plant that small seed of faith which they could then water and feed in cooperation with God's making it grow.
1 Corinthians 3:6 "I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase."
It works no differently for any of us now that the wall of enmity has been torn down through the cross of Christ. That natural flesh is dead.
Galatians 3:26 "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."
1 Peter 2:9 "But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
10 Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy."
That is God's true Israel.
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
Israel was the name given to Jacob by reason of Jacob's faith which was so strong that he wrestled tirelessly with an angel to recieve God's promise.
Abraham was given the promise by faith. And we also. That is what makes us Abraham's seed, heirs to the promise, the true Israel of God.
Galatians 3:22 "But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe."
Romans 11:32 says much the same thing but that one need look at what appears in the original text to be able to see that.
Romans 11:32 For God hath concluded [them] all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
See for your self that the word "them" (which personalizes what is said to the fleshly nation) was added:
Romans 11:32 For <G1063> God <G2316> hath concluded <G4788> them <G9999> all <G3956> in <G1519> unbelief <G0543>, that <G2443> he might have mercy <G1653> upon all <G3956>.
And the word there translated "unbelief", <0543>? It more precisely means "disobedient" as in "stubborn".
Everyone tries to make that word "unbelief" out like it is <G0570>
apaistia -- pronounced: ap-is-tee'-ah
from 571; faithlessness, i.e. (negatively) disbelief (lack of Christian faith), or (positively) unfaithfulness (disobedience): KJV -- unbelief.
Paul is not concerned with everyone of natural birth (even as is his point at Romans 9:6), but those he distinguished as the genuine Israel. Those would prove to have fertile soil in their hearts, so that he could plant that small seed of faith which they could then water and feed in cooperation with God's making it grow.
1 Corinthians 3:6 "I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase."
It works no differently for any of us now that the wall of enmity has been torn down through the cross of Christ. That natural flesh is dead.
Galatians 3:26 "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."
1 Peter 2:9 "But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
10 Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy."
That is God's true Israel.
That will never help explain Christ's parable of the tares of the field He gave in Matthew 13.
The problem with this explanation is, Jesus used parables to speak spiritual truth, a carnal mind, such as a Pharisee, would not and could not understand His parables, that's why all of His parables were for believers, who understand, believers have the veil removed so as to understand spiritual concepts.
Now, if you are speaking that it was for Israel now, then I would agree, because there is no difference between a believing natural Jew and other believers, all believers everywhere are Israel, which make up His Body, which is the Church.
Context is not irrelevant, no. But to use context to try and make the spiritual principle shown forth to not apply to another context is a mistake.
Sorry, I'm not following you here, are you saying that you can use scripture outside of it's context?
If by that you mean that we can, just as an example, use what Jesus says of the Pharisees, and say it can also be true of other men, yes.
Scriptures reveal us something, as Paul says of the Old Covenant that it was a shadow of things to come, and all scripture is good for teaching unto righteousness.
Can we use it out of context in a way that changes the meaning? No. But when the meaning is applied right, it comes to be the same and can be applied to a current situation.
If you noticed the idea of "strange apparel" from the Zephaniah 1:8 Scripture I posted, then that should have revealed where in the OT Jesus was pulling from about the one not having on a wedding garment that tried to sneak in. The righteous clothing is a concept first given back in the Old Testament.
Jesus showed who He was pointing that parable to in the Matt.22:3 and Matt.3:5-8 verses. And it relates to the scribes and Pharisees He specifically mentioned later in next Matt.23 chapter.
Per 1 Chron.2:55, the scribes were of the family of Rechab, the Kenites of Gen.15:19 that dwelt among the Canaanites while the children of Israel were still captive in Egypt. So the scribes were not of the children of Israel.
I brought up the Jude 1:4 verse for this reason...
Jude 1:3-4
3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
(KJV)
What exactly does that mean, "...who were before of old ordained to this condemnation" of being against The One God and His Christ? How is it those were "of old ordained to this condemnation"?
Apostle Peter said the same thing...
1 Pet 2:7-8
7 Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner,
8 And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.
(KJV)
Christ's Salvation is open to all... born in the flesh. So even a 'tare' like those who have been ordained to be against Christ can turn, and believe on Him. Yet because of what our Lord Jesus showed in His parable of the 'tares' of the field, we know they all will not turn to Him.
The parable of the tares of the field Jesus gave in Matt.13 is very important. In real horticulture with wheat, tares which are weeds grow in among the wheat, and look just like real wheat during the growing season. Only during harvest time when both are fully grown do the tares sprout little blackish buds distinguishing them from the real wheat. Per the parable, the good wheat represent God's people. But the tares represent the children of the devil, i.e., the children of iniquity.
The "strange apparel" idea in Zeph.1 represents clothing of the 'tares'. That's essentially what our Lord meant in Matt.22 about the one who didn't have on a "wedding garment", which is the opposite idea of "strange apparel".
Here is one of the most important sections in the Old Testament concerning Israel and the crept in unawares.
Judg 2:1-4
1 And an angel of the LORD came up from Gilgal to Bochim, and said, I made you to go up out of Egypt, and have brought you unto the land which I sware unto your fathers; and I said, I will never break My covenant with you.
2 And ye shall make no league with the inhabitants of this land; ye shall throw down their altars: but ye have not obeyed My voice: why have ye done this?
3 Wherefore I also said, I will not drive them out from before you; but they shall be as thorns in your sides, and their gods shall be a snare unto you.
4 And it came to pass, when the angel of the LORD spake these words unto all the children of Israel, that the people lifted up their voice, and wept.
(KJV)
God gave the children of Israel that specific rebuke because they failed to complete His ordained judgment upon the nations of Canaan that were guilty of all sorts of abominations against Him, and they had failed to repent. Because of that, God said He would not drive those peoples of Canaan away from the children of Israel, but their ways and gods would become snares upon Israel.
As a result of that, look what Israel soon fell to...
Judg 2:11-17
11 And the children of Israel did evil in the sight of the LORD, and served Baalim:
12 And they forsook the LORD God of their fathers, Which brought them out of the land of Egypt, and followed other gods, of the gods of the people that were round about them, and bowed themselves unto them, and provoked the LORD to anger.
13 And they forsook the LORD, and served Baal and Ashtaroth.
14 And the anger of the LORD was hot against Israel, and He delivered them into the hands of spoilers that spoiled them, and He sold them into the hands of their enemies round about, so that they could not any longer stand before their enemies.
15 Whithersoever they went out, the hand of the LORD was against them for evil, as the LORD had said, and as the LORD had sworn unto them: and they were greatly distressed.
16 Nevertheless the LORD raised up judges, which delivered them out of the hand of those that spoiled them.
17 And yet they would not hearken unto their judges, but they went a whoring after other gods, and bowed themselves unto them: they turned quickly out of the way which their fathers walked in, obeying the commandments of the LORD; but they did not so.
(KJV)
Judg 2:20-23
20 And the anger of the LORD was hot against Israel; and He said, Because that this people hath transgressed My covenant which I commanded their fathers, and have not hearkened unto My voice;
21 I also will not henceforth drive out any from before them of the nations which Joshua left when he died:
22 That through them I may prove Israel, whether they will keep the way of the LORD to walk therein, as their fathers did keep it, or not.
23 Therefore the LORD left those nations, without driving them out hastily; neither delivered He them into the hand of Joshua.
(KJV)
God ordained those left of the nations of Canaan to serve as a test upon His people Israel. That's how it is still, to this day.
Judg 3:1-7
1 Now these are the nations which the LORD left, to prove Israel by them, even as many of Israel as had not known all the wars of Canaan;
2 Only that the generations of the children of Israel might know, to teach them war, at the least such as before knew nothing thereof;
3 Namely, five lords of the Philistines, and all the Canaanites, and the Sidonians, and the Hivites that dwelt in mount Lebanon, from mount Baalhermon unto the entering in of Hamath.
4 And they were to prove Israel by them, to know whether they would hearken unto the commandments of the LORD, which He commanded their fathers by the hand of Moses.
5 And the children of Israel dwelt among the Canaanites, Hittites, and Amorites, and Perizzites, and Hivites, and Jebusites:
6 And they took their daughters to be their wives, and gave their daughters to their sons, and served their gods.
7 And the children of Israel did evil in the sight of the LORD, and forgat the LORD their God, and served Baalim and the groves.
(KJV)
In 1 Kings 9 during Solomon's days, those Canaanite peoples were still living among Israel. They later became known as Nethinims, working their way up into the Temple doing menial chores as Temple servants. Then they became priests per Ezra 2 going captive to Babylon with the house of Judah, and returning with the small remnant of Judah back to Jerusalem afterwards. That's how God's Word became corrupted by the time of Christ's first coming. Per the Jewish historian Josephus, even the high priests by then were not of the children of Israel.
Like God has said, He would leave that remnant of the nations of Canaan among Israel, to prove them, to see if they would obey Him or not.
So, what if Israel had obeyed God's command to destroy all the nations of the land of Canaan? Most likely, they would not have fallen into Baal worship over their history, the priesthood of Israel would not have become corrupted, and the false ones of the scribes and Pharisees would not have sought to kill our Lord Jesus. But because this was ordained to happen, it set the stage for our Lord Jesus' first coming to die on the cross. It has also set the stage for the events of the last days, with their beast king they worship coming to exalt himself above God and His Christ.
That's why we should never forget that there are literally children here on earth that worship Lucifer as their god, and it is the very SAME working that those nations of Canaan did of old. We are STILL in that same battle today upon this earth. If the workers of iniquity had never existed, this battle would not be possible, and Israel would not have been led astray.
This is why it's a gross error to think those fallen away of Israel are in the same boat as the pagan Canaanites that worship the devil. The differrence is that many of Israel, out of ignorance, have been led astray by the Canaanites that dwell among them. That's exactly how things are today, even as our Lord showed it will be until He returns...
Zech 14:21
21 Yea, every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah shall be holiness unto the LORD of hosts: and all they that sacrifice shall come and take of them, and seethe therein: and in that day there shall be no more the Canaanite in the house of the LORD of hosts.
(KJV)
Judg 2:1-4
1 And an angel of the LORD came up from Gilgal to Bochim, and said, I made you to go up out of Egypt, and have brought you unto the land which I sware unto your fathers; and I said, I will never break My covenant with you.
2 And ye shall make no league with the inhabitants of this land; ye shall throw down their altars: but ye have not obeyed My voice: why have ye done this?
3 Wherefore I also said, I will not drive them out from before you; but they shall be as thorns in your sides, and their gods shall be a snare unto you.
4 And it came to pass, when the angel of the LORD spake these words unto all the children of Israel, that the people lifted up their voice, and wept.
(KJV)
God gave the children of Israel that specific rebuke because they failed to complete His ordained judgment upon the nations of Canaan that were guilty of all sorts of abominations against Him, and they had failed to repent. Because of that, God said He would not drive those peoples of Canaan away from the children of Israel, but their ways and gods would become snares upon Israel.
As a result of that, look what Israel soon fell to...
Judg 2:11-17
11 And the children of Israel did evil in the sight of the LORD, and served Baalim:
12 And they forsook the LORD God of their fathers, Which brought them out of the land of Egypt, and followed other gods, of the gods of the people that were round about them, and bowed themselves unto them, and provoked the LORD to anger.
13 And they forsook the LORD, and served Baal and Ashtaroth.
14 And the anger of the LORD was hot against Israel, and He delivered them into the hands of spoilers that spoiled them, and He sold them into the hands of their enemies round about, so that they could not any longer stand before their enemies.
15 Whithersoever they went out, the hand of the LORD was against them for evil, as the LORD had said, and as the LORD had sworn unto them: and they were greatly distressed.
16 Nevertheless the LORD raised up judges, which delivered them out of the hand of those that spoiled them.
17 And yet they would not hearken unto their judges, but they went a whoring after other gods, and bowed themselves unto them: they turned quickly out of the way which their fathers walked in, obeying the commandments of the LORD; but they did not so.
(KJV)
Judg 2:20-23
20 And the anger of the LORD was hot against Israel; and He said, Because that this people hath transgressed My covenant which I commanded their fathers, and have not hearkened unto My voice;
21 I also will not henceforth drive out any from before them of the nations which Joshua left when he died:
22 That through them I may prove Israel, whether they will keep the way of the LORD to walk therein, as their fathers did keep it, or not.
23 Therefore the LORD left those nations, without driving them out hastily; neither delivered He them into the hand of Joshua.
(KJV)
God ordained those left of the nations of Canaan to serve as a test upon His people Israel. That's how it is still, to this day.
Judg 3:1-7
1 Now these are the nations which the LORD left, to prove Israel by them, even as many of Israel as had not known all the wars of Canaan;
2 Only that the generations of the children of Israel might know, to teach them war, at the least such as before knew nothing thereof;
3 Namely, five lords of the Philistines, and all the Canaanites, and the Sidonians, and the Hivites that dwelt in mount Lebanon, from mount Baalhermon unto the entering in of Hamath.
4 And they were to prove Israel by them, to know whether they would hearken unto the commandments of the LORD, which He commanded their fathers by the hand of Moses.
5 And the children of Israel dwelt among the Canaanites, Hittites, and Amorites, and Perizzites, and Hivites, and Jebusites:
6 And they took their daughters to be their wives, and gave their daughters to their sons, and served their gods.
7 And the children of Israel did evil in the sight of the LORD, and forgat the LORD their God, and served Baalim and the groves.
(KJV)
In 1 Kings 9 during Solomon's days, those Canaanite peoples were still living among Israel. They later became known as Nethinims, working their way up into the Temple doing menial chores as Temple servants. Then they became priests per Ezra 2 going captive to Babylon with the house of Judah, and returning with the small remnant of Judah back to Jerusalem afterwards. That's how God's Word became corrupted by the time of Christ's first coming. Per the Jewish historian Josephus, even the high priests by then were not of the children of Israel.
Like God has said, He would leave that remnant of the nations of Canaan among Israel, to prove them, to see if they would obey Him or not.
So, what if Israel had obeyed God's command to destroy all the nations of the land of Canaan? Most likely, they would not have fallen into Baal worship over their history, the priesthood of Israel would not have become corrupted, and the false ones of the scribes and Pharisees would not have sought to kill our Lord Jesus. But because this was ordained to happen, it set the stage for our Lord Jesus' first coming to die on the cross. It has also set the stage for the events of the last days, with their beast king they worship coming to exalt himself above God and His Christ.
That's why we should never forget that there are literally children here on earth that worship Lucifer as their god, and it is the very SAME working that those nations of Canaan did of old. We are STILL in that same battle today upon this earth. If the workers of iniquity had never existed, this battle would not be possible, and Israel would not have been led astray.
This is why it's a gross error to think those fallen away of Israel are in the same boat as the pagan Canaanites that worship the devil. The differrence is that many of Israel, out of ignorance, have been led astray by the Canaanites that dwell among them. That's exactly how things are today, even as our Lord showed it will be until He returns...
Zech 14:21
21 Yea, every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah shall be holiness unto the LORD of hosts: and all they that sacrifice shall come and take of them, and seethe therein: and in that day there shall be no more the Canaanite in the house of the LORD of hosts.
(KJV)
And you don't feel your changing the meaning of the scripture in Romans by applying to Christians what Paul said concerning Israel? If those of Israel, who were cut out can be applied to Christians then you must also apply the grafting back in the same manner or you are changing it's meaning.If by that you mean that we can, just as an example, use what Jesus says of the Pharisees, and say it can also be true of other men, yes.
Scriptures reveal us something, as Paul says of the Old Covenant that it was a shadow of things to come, and all scripture is good for teaching unto righteousness.
Can we use it out of context in a way that changes the meaning? No. But when the meaning is applied right, it comes to be the same and can be applied to a current situation.
His applying Christ's parable in Matt.22 to ANY believer on Christ Jesus is grossly wrong, period. The reason is simple, because it's ONLY the believer on Christ Jesus that will have that "wedding garment", not the unbelieving.
Does Paul say 'All who are cut off will be grafted back'? No. We would be changing the scriptures if we applied that meaning to them. He says God can and will regraft those cut off, but careful! He is saying that Jews as a whole are not cut off forever, not that all throughout all time will be grafted back.
We change the meaning of scriptures when we say that the warnings of being cut off are only for Jews, when indeed it was a warning for all who would follow after Christ.
Who does Paul say were "cut (broken) off"? Doesn't Paul say all of Israel will be saved?
You seem to be missing the point Prentis. Your not applying the whole premise here by using only part of it, the "cutting off" and then ignoring the "grafting back in" which is part of the same context. To apply one without the other is to ignore context and misapply.
Read further down, verse 32, "for God has imprisoned everyone in disobedience so he could have mercy on everyone". Now whatever meaning you apply to the "cutting off" must not conflict with verse 32 to keep things within the proper context.
You seem to be missing the point Prentis. Your not applying the whole premise here by using only part of it, the "cutting off" and then ignoring the "grafting back in" which is part of the same context. To apply one without the other is to ignore context and misapply.
Read further down, verse 32, "for God has imprisoned everyone in disobedience so he could have mercy on everyone". Now whatever meaning you apply to the "cutting off" must not conflict with verse 32 to keep things within the proper context.
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