There is more than one set of apocryphas.

[tzcho2]

I can say the same thing of many evangelicals, non denoms, what have you

Some of my Catholic family members have died without knowing Jesus as their Lord and Savior. Other family members that attend the RC church don't even know that Jesus saves, they don't know what that term means, nor born again, they are not familiar with salvation, they think praying to Mary or attending Mass gets them to heaven , or the Priest & congregations prayers for them during their funeral will get them out of Purgatory. The thought of these people ending up in hell is disturbing to me. It is very hard for anyone in the RCC to break free from the heavy brainwashing.
Most Evangelicals and Non-denominations that I know, Know the Gospel of Jesus.

 

[historyb]

Some of my Catholic family members have died without knowing Jesus as their Lord and Savior. Other family members that attend the RC church don't even know that Jesus saves, they don't know what that term means, nor born again, they are not familiar with salvation, they think praying to Mary or attending Mass gets them to heaven , or the Priest & congregations prayers for them during their funeral will get them out of Purgatory. The thought of these people ending up in hell is disturbing to me. It is very hard for anyone in the RCC to break free from the heavy brainwashing.
Most Evangelicals and Non-denominations that I know, Know the Gospel of Jesus.

That is where you and I differ. In Catholicism, Orthodoxy, etc it is the Church that is important (1 Timothy 3:15) and sets things up per Scripture not the single person an in evangelicalism, non denom, etc. I pray the rosary and attend Mass weekly, my Priest and congregation pray for the deceased because the Church has had these things from the beginning, the Church has a Liturgy from the beginning but many evangelicals hate Christian history so much (even though they will lie and say they do) that they throw all the Church has done since ancient times out because they think they can only follow a book. From where I sit it is the Sola Scriptura types that are brainwashed into believing lies.

 

[CoreIssue]

That is where you and I differ. In Catholicism, Orthodoxy, etc it is the Church that is important (1 Timothy 3:15) and sets things up per Scripture not the single person an in evangelicalism, non denom, etc. I pray the rosary and attend Mass weekly, my Priest and congregation pray for the deceased because the Church has had these things from the beginning, the Church has a Liturgy from the beginning but many evangelicals hate Christian history so much (even though they will lie and say they do) that they throw all the Church has done since ancient times out because they think they can only follow a book. From where I sit it is the Sola Scriptura types that are brainwashed into believing lies.

All proofs Catholicism is a cult.

Pray for the dead? What is the point? The dead have already locked in their destination.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Criticizing the Institution of the RCC is equal to hating catholics. The majority of my extended family is Catholic and I don't hate them. I hate the false teachings and brainwashing they are under--that is a vast difference. But guess what we love each other though we do not worship the same. I pray for their souls and they are glad for that.

I have NO problem with people who don't like the Catholic Church - as long as the reasons are legitimate.
What I DO have a problem with are people like CoreIssue and others here who LIE about what the Catholic Church teaches and believes.

So - if YOU don't like the Church - more power to you.
However, if you're going to engage in the same kind of moronic lies that they do - then I will expose you as well . . .

 

[tzcho2]

I have NO problem with people who don't like the Catholic Church - as long as the reasons are legitimate.
What I DO have a problem with are people like CoreIssue and others here who LIE about what the Catholic Church teaches and believes.

So - if YOU don't like the Church - more power to you.
However, if you're going to engage in the same kind of moronic lies that they do - then I will expose you as well . . .

Well, I will respond freely the way I believe is appropriate by using the Word of God as the measurement to which all RC liturgy should be tested against. I can tell you right now, BOL, you won't like my findings. But know I love the people, but oppose the false teachings of the RCC which have brainwashed people & holds too many captive.

 

[tzcho2]

I can say the same thing of many evangelicals, non denoms, what have you

Yes , of course you are free to say that, But , the Bible is the only standard that Christians measure by,
- not measuring by RCC liturgy which equates to the Pharisees who believed their own religious traditions, over what Bible scripture taught, which was why they could not recognize the Messiah the prophets had spoke about (as Jesus pointed out to them).

 

[BreadOfLife]

Well, I will respond freely the way I believe is appropriate by using the Word of God as the measurement to which all RC liturgy should be tested against. I can tell you right now, BOL, you won't like my findings. But know I love the people, but oppose the false teachings of the RCC which have brainwashed people & holds too many captive.

Any time you wish to discuss any of these "false" teachings - you know where to find me . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Yes , of course you are free to say that, But , the Bible is the only standard that Christians measure by,
- not measuring by RCC liturgy which equates to the Pharisees who believed their own religious traditions, over what Bible scripture taught, which was why they could not recognize the Messiah the prophets had spoke about (as Jesus pointed out to them).

Can I ask you a question?
WHO told you that the Bible is the "only" standard that Christians measure by??

Something tells me that you've been listening to the traditions and precepts of mere men . . .

 

[tzcho2]

Can I ask you a question?
WHO told you that the Bible is the "only" standard that Christians measure by??

Something tells me that you've been listening to the traditions and precepts of mere men . . .

The Bible, It testifies to ITSELF that only it is God-breathed. Of course the RCC has tried to denounce & hide this Truth because it invalidates their Priesthood as men squeaking out their traditions as divine.

 

[farouk]

The Bible, It testifies to ITSELF that only it is God-breathed. Of course the RCC has tried to denounce & hide this Truth because it invalidates their Priesthood as men squeaking out their traditions as divine.

Psalm 119.105; John 17.17

 

[tzcho2]

Psalm 119.105; John 17.17

Yes...literally so.

 

[BreadOfLife]

The Bible, It testifies to ITSELF that only it is God-breathed. Of course the RCC has tried to denounce & hide this Truth because it invalidates their Priesthood as men squeaking out their traditions as divine.

You didn't answer my question - soI will ask you AGAIN:
WHO told you that the Bible is the "only" standard that Christians measure by??

 

[farouk]

You didn't answer my question - soI will ask you AGAIN:
WHO told you that the Bible is the "only" standard that Christians measure by??

I'm likely to quote the Word to you; not what religion or science might propose.

 

[tzcho2]

You didn't answer my question - soI will ask you AGAIN:
WHO told you that the Bible is the "only" standard that Christians measure by??

Yep, I DID. The Word of GOD testifies of Itself to it's Divine Authority.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I'm likely to quote the Word to you; not what religion or science might propose.

Then PLEASE do . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Yep, I DID. The Word of GOD testifies of Itself to it's Divine Authority.

No - you didn't.

You showed me that Scripture is authoritative - and Catholics AGREE with that.
HOWEVER - you didn't show that it is the "only standard" by which Christians should live.

Time for a Bible lesson . . .

The Bible itself testifies to the fact that the Bible alone is NOT our “sole authority” or “sole standard” as Christians. In fact – the Bible itself tells us that Christ’s CHURCH is our final Authority on earth:

Matt 16:18-19
I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven. WHATEVER YOU bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and WHATEVER YOU loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven."

Matt. 18:15-18
"If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have won over your brother.
If he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, so that 'every fact may be established on the testimony of two or three witnesses.'
If he refuses to listen to them, tell the CHURCH. If he refuses to listen even to the CHURCH, then treat him as you would a Gentile or a tax collector.
Amen, I say to YOU, WHATEVER YOU bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and WHATEVER YOU loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

John 16:12-15
“I have much more to tell you, but you cannot bear it now.
But when he comes, the Spirit of truth, he will guide you to ALL truth. He will not speak on his own, but he will speak what he hears, and will declare to YOU the things that are coming.
He will glorify me, because he will TAKE from what is MINE and declare it to YOU.
Everything that the Father has is MINE; for this reason I told you that he will TAKE from what is MINE and declare it to YOU.

John 20:21-23
Jesus said to them again, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, so I send you.” And when he had said this, he breathed on them and said to them, “Receive the holy Spirit. Whose sins YOU FORGIVE are forgiven them, and whose sins YOU RETAIN are retained.”

Luke 10:16
Whoever listens to YOU listens to ME. Whoever rejects YOU rejects ME. And whoever rejects ME rejects the ONE who sent ME."

2 Thess 2:15
"Stand firm and hold fast to the Traditions you were taught, EITHER BY an ORAL STATEMENT – OR BY a LETTER from us."


The Bible itself puts Sacred Tradition ON PAR with Scripture as the Word of God:

2 Thess. 3:6
"Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from any brother who is living in idleness and not in accord with the TRADITION that you received from us"

2 Tim. 2:2
"What you have heard from me before many witnesses entrust to faithful men who will be able to teach others also".

1 Cor. 11:2
"I commend you because you remember me in everything and maintain the traditions even as I have delivered them to you".

In fact – NOWHERE does the bible teach the man-made Protestant fallacy of Sola Scriptura.
NOWHERE . . .

 

[tzcho2]

No - you didn't.

You showed me that Scripture is authoritative - and Catholics AGREE with that.
HOWEVER - you didn't show that it is the "only standard" by which Christians should live.

Time for a Bible lesson . . .

The Bible itself testifies to the fact that the Bible alone is NOT our “sole authority” or “sole standard” as Christians. In fact – the Bible itself tells us that Christ’s CHURCH is our final Authority on earth:

Matt 16:18-19
I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven. WHATEVER YOU bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and WHATEVER YOU loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven."

Matt. 18:15-18
"If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have won over your brother.
If he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, so that 'every fact may be established on the testimony of two or three witnesses.'
If he refuses to listen to them, tell the CHURCH. If he refuses to listen even to the CHURCH, then treat him as you would a Gentile or a tax collector.
Amen, I say to YOU, WHATEVER YOU bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and WHATEVER YOU loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

John 16:12-15
“I have much more to tell you, but you cannot bear it now.
But when he comes, the Spirit of truth, he will guide you to ALL truth. He will not speak on his own, but he will speak what he hears, and will declare to YOU the things that are coming.
He will glorify me, because he will TAKE from what is MINE and declare it to YOU.
Everything that the Father has is MINE; for this reason I told you that he will TAKE from what is MINE and declare it to YOU.

John 20:21-23
Jesus said to them again, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, so I send you.” And when he had said this, he breathed on them and said to them, “Receive the holy Spirit. Whose sins YOU FORGIVE are forgiven them, and whose sins YOU RETAIN are retained.”

Luke 10:16
Whoever listens to YOU listens to ME. Whoever rejects YOU rejects ME. And whoever rejects ME rejects the ONE who sent ME."

2 Thess 2:15
"Stand firm and hold fast to the Traditions you were taught, EITHER BY an ORAL STATEMENT – OR BY a LETTER from us."


The Bible itself puts Sacred Tradition ON PAR with Scripture as the Word of God:

2 Thess. 3:6
"Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from any brother who is living in idleness and not in accord with the TRADITION that you received from us"

2 Tim. 2:2
"What you have heard from me before many witnesses entrust to faithful men who will be able to teach others also".

1 Cor. 11:2
"I commend you because you remember me in everything and maintain the traditions even as I have delivered them to you".

In fact – NOWHERE does the bible teach the man-made Protestant fallacy of Sola Scriptura.
NOWHERE . . .

All I see here is a rant --that's probably going to degenerate quickly into an angry melt down. Do you mind toning down ,what to me comes across as emotionalism before I take time out of my busy Saturday to address our differences? ( Bible lesson! Lol!)

 

[farouk]

Then PLEASE do . . .

'Thy Word is truth' (John 17.17).

'There is one God, and one Mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus' (1 Timothy 2.5).

 

[farouk]

Yep, I DID. The Word of GOD testifies of Itself to it's Divine Authority.

The Word is self-authenticating; it does not depend on clerics supposedly giving it authority at their convenience.

 

[BreadOfLife]

'Thy Word is truth' (John 17.17).

The CHURCH is the pillar and foundation of Truth (1 Tim. 3:15).
The CHURCH is the FULLNESS of Christ (Eph. 1:22-23).
Jesus equates His very SELF with His CHURCH (Acts 9:4-5).

'There is one God, and one Mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus' (1 Timothy 2.5).

Yup - only HIS sacrifice can make peace between us and the Father.
HOWEVER - we are ALL called to intercede for one another (1 Cor. 3:9, 1 Tim. 2:1-3, Eph 6:18, James 5:16, 1 John 5:16).

Anything else??