There is more than one set of apocryphas.

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BreadOfLife

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The Word is self-authenticating; it does not depend on clerics supposedly giving it authority at their convenience.
Really??
That's NOT what the Bible says . . .

2 Pet. 1:20

But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation.

2 Pet. 3:16
He (Paul) writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.
 
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mjrhealth

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Really??
That's NOT what the Bible says . . .

2 Pet. 1:20

But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation.

2 Pet. 3:16
He (Paul) writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.
Ye BOL please take note of that...
 
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BreadOfLife

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Ye BOL please take note of that...
Ummmmm, I just DID by showing that the Scripture doesn't always reveal itself.
This is the false, man-made doctrine of your Protestant Fathers called "Perspecuity".

Pay attention . . .
 
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mjrhealth

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Ummmmm, I just DID by showing that the Scripture doesn't always reveal itself.
This is the false, man-made doctrine of your Protestant Fathers called "Perspecuity".

Pay attention . . .
Yes BOL revelation does, not studying....
 

tzcho2

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2 Pet. 1:20
But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation.
Your answer above was the response to Farouk's statement "The Word is self-authenticating; it does not depend on clerics supposedly giving it authority at their convenience."
Your interpretation is not correct on 2Pet 1:20 It seems you are attempting to yank a scripture out of context and trying to use it to disavow that the Word of GOD is of Divine authority and like farouk stated: " it does not depend on clerics supposedly giving it authority when it's convenient. ---when that's exactly what Peter was stating. However you are trying to say that the Protestants whom you are speaking to are taking the scripture out of context --- well no.

Peter is speaking of himself & the apostles that they are not speaking from themselves nor have they followed cunningly devised fables but were eye witnesses to the glory of GOD in Jesus Christ. Peter the man is not just speaking but as directed by the Holy Spirit.

The other problem is that RC have been taught wrongly that the Roman Church is "the church" mentioned in the Bible and that is false & they think that their Pope's are the lineage from Peter --again False RC teaching

If we read from Verse 16 :
Peter states, 2Pet 1: 16 " For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the Power and coming of our Lord Je'sus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of His majesty.
17. For He received from God the Father honor and glory, when there came such a voice to Him from the excellent glory. THIS IS MY BELOVED SON, IN WHOM I AM WELL PLEASED. 18.And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with Him in the holy mount.
19.We have also a more sure word of prophecy; where unto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts;
20. Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
21. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man; but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Ho'ly Ghost."


The biggest problem you (RC) and me (Bible believing Protestant) will have is in communicating, is be because since you are a follower of Roman Catholicism the liturgy it is based upon very much is outside of what is Biblical, so from the onset our foundations are different. Mine is based upon the words of the scriptures only and yours will be based upon Roman Catholicism and the religious RC traditions it has taught you.

Jesus words come from the Bible not from anywhere else ( AS in HIS words have been recorded and written down for us. The RCC has no God given authority to pretend it has any divine authority nor has right to change JESUS words as Pope Francis keeps trying to do and as Pope's in the past have added to scripture their own false teachings or interpretations.

The Bible scripture is the ONLY written Divine authority, written by godly men - as directed by GOD and nothing & no other human authority is to be looked to as equal to it- not the Pope not the Vatican, not the RCC's writings or traditions.

Another Faulty premise that Roman catholicism is based upon is the belief that the Roman church is the "the spiritual church of Christ" referred to in the Bible and that Peter passed down his Apostolic lineage to the Popes and that again is a falsehood that has been constructed by Rome to give their Papacy , Vatican & celibate priesthood & a man-designated counterfeit "holiness" and legitimacy as speaking with divine authority. The RCC is Not "The Church" and it does not represent Christianity.

I know this will all go over with you like a rock, but hopefully these different views can be discussed in a manner that is on an intellectual basis and stay away from getting angry.
 
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mjrhealth

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???
Not
making sense again . . .
I know because you missed this bit

Gal_1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

and this bit

2Ti 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
2Ti 3:6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
2Ti 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
..
 

BreadOfLife

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Your answer above was the response to Farouk's statement "The Word is self-authenticating; it does not depend on clerics supposedly giving it authority at their convenience."
Your interpretation is not correct on 2Pet 1:20 It seems you are attempting to yank a scripture out of context and trying to use it to disavow that the Word of GOD is of Divine authority and like farouk stated: " it does not depend on clerics supposedly giving it authority when it's convenient. ---when that's exactly what Peter was stating. However you are trying to say that the Protestants whom you are speaking to are taking the scripture out of context --- well no.

Peter is speaking of himself & the apostles that they are not speaking from themselves nor have they followed cunningly devised fables but were eye witnesses to the glory of GOD in Jesus Christ. Peter the man is not just speaking but as directed by the Holy Spirit.

The other problem is that RC have been taught wrongly that the Roman Church is "the church" mentioned in the Bible and that is false & they think that their Pope's are the lineage from Peter --again False RC teaching

If we read from Verse 16 :
Peter states, 2Pet 1: 16 " For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the Power and coming of our Lord Je'sus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of His majesty.
17. For He received from God the Father honor and glory, when there came such a voice to Him from the excellent glory. THIS IS MY BELOVED SON, IN WHOM I AM WELL PLEASED. 18.And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with Him in the holy mount.
19.We have also a more sure word of prophecy; where unto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts;
20. Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
21. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man; but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Ho'ly Ghost."


The biggest problem you (RC) and me (Bible believing Protestant) will have is in communicating, is be because since you are a follower of Roman Catholicism the liturgy it is based upon very much is outside of what is Biblical, so from the onset our foundations are different. Mine is based upon the words of the scriptures only and yours will be based upon Roman Catholicism and the religious RC traditions it has taught you.

Jesus words come from the Bible not from anywhere else, the Bible scripture is the only written Divine authority, and nothing & no other human authority is to be looked to as equal to it- not the Pope not the Vatican, not the RCC's writings or traditions.
Another faulty premise Roman catholicism is based upon is the belief that the Roman church is the "the spiritual church of Christ" referred to in the Bible and that Peter passed down his Apostolic lineage to the Popes and that again is a falsehood that has been constructed by Rome to give their Papacy , Vatican & celibate priesthood & a man-designated counterfeit "holiness" and legitimacy as speaking with divine authority. I know this will all go over with you like a rock, but hopefully these different views can be discussed in a manner that is on an intellectual basis and stay away from getting angry.
WHO told you that Jesus's words came from the BIBLE - and "nowhere" else??
This is not only heretical - it's blasphemous.

The Bible was written down by MEN inspired by the Holy Spirit - and Jesus didn't get His words FROM the Bible. NOWHERE does the Bible ever claim to be the ENTIRE Word of God - just the written Word (Scripture). He is GOD.

Now - back in post #56 - I gave you a Bible lesson - and you have addressed NONE of it.
I showed you that:

The Bible itself testifies to the fact that the Bible alone is NOT our “sole authority” or “sole standard” as Christians. In fact – the Bible itself tells us that Christ’s CHURCH is our final Authority on earth:
Matt 16:18-19
Matt. 18:15-18
John 16:12-15
John 20:21-23
Luke 10:16
2 Thess 2:15


I showed you that the Bible itself puts Sacred Tradition ON PAR with Scripture as the Word of God:
2 Thess. 3:6
2 Tim. 2:2
1 Cor. 11:2

In fact – NOWHERE does the bible teach the man-made Protestant fallacy of Sola Scriptura.
NOWHERE.

Please address these points.
 
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mjrhealth

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The Bible was written down by MEN inspired by the Holy Spirit - and Jesus didn't get His words FROM the Bible. NOWHERE does the Bible ever claim to be the ENTIRE Word of God - just the written Word (Scripture). He is GOD.
You got this bit right but

this bit,

The Bible itself testifies to the fact that the Bible alone is NOT our “sole authority” or “sole standard” as Christians. In fact – the Bible itself tells us that Christ’s CHURCH is our final Authority on earth:

It actually states

1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

and again

Joh_14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

it is the Holy Spirit, denied by so many, who is the authority, not mens religions and there leaders.
 

BreadOfLife

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I know because you missed this bit

Gal_1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

and this bit

2Ti 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
2Ti 3:6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
2Ti 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
..
Yes - PAUL was taught directly by Christ - not YOU.

Jesus told the leaders of HIS Church to TEACH all nations and baptize them (Matt. 28:19).
Maybe in your ignorant arrogance - you missed this "bit" . . .

1 Cor. 12:27-31
Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it. And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets, third TEACHERS, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping, of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues. Are all apostles? Are all prophets? ARE ALL TEACHERS? Do all work miracles? Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues? Do all interpret? Now eagerly desire the greater gifts.

We learn from Christ's CHURCH . . .
 
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BreadOfLife

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You got this bit right but
this bit,

It actually states

1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

and again

Joh_14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

it is the Holy Spirit, denied by so many, who is the authority, not mens religions and there leaders.
R*E*A*D my last post (#70), Einstein.
I obliterated that argument already . . .
 

mjrhealth

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Yes - PAUL was taught directly by Christ - not YOU.

Jesus told the leaders of HIS Church to TEACH all nations and baptize them (Matt. 28:19).
Maybe in your ignorant arrogance - you missed this "bit" . . .

1 Cor. 12:27-31
Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it. And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets, third TEACHERS, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping, of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues. Are all apostles? Are all prophets? ARE ALL TEACHERS? Do all work miracles? Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues? Do all interpret? Now eagerly desire the greater gifts.

We learn from Christ's CHURCH . . .
I just never missed this but

Joh 10:26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
Joh 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
Joh 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
Joh 10:29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

you used to be a pain now you are just fun, when people want to know what a pharisee is, i can just point them to your posts.

Enjoy the day, i surely will.
 

FHII

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Any time you wish to discuss any of these "false" teachings - you know where to find me . . .
Last time I interacted with BOL it didn't go so well. But despite that and our differences otherwise, I gotta say he can and will give thorough and civil answers when you ask them in a non abrasive manner. I've had several such exchanges with him both on the forums and via pm. Didn't always agree with him and he didn't seem to mind.
 

tzcho2

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WHO told you that Jesus's words came from the BIBLE - and "nowhere" else??
This is not only heretical - it's blasphemous.

The Bible was written down by MEN inspired by the Holy Spirit - and Jesus didn't get His words FROM the Bible. NOWHERE does the Bible ever claim to be the ENTIRE Word of God - just the written Word (Scripture). He is GOD.

Now - back in post #56 - I gave you a Bible lesson - and you have addressed NONE of it.
I showed you that:

The Bible itself testifies to the fact that the Bible alone is NOT our “sole authority” or “sole standard” as Christians. In fact – the Bible itself tells us that Christ’s CHURCH is our final Authority on earth:
Matt 16:18-19
Matt. 18:15-18
John 16:12-15
John 20:21-23
Luke 10:16
2 Thess 2:15


I showed you that the Bible itself puts Sacred Tradition ON PAR with Scripture as the Word of God:
2 Thess. 3:6
2 Tim. 2:2
1 Cor. 11:2


In fact – NOWHERE does the bible teach the man-made Protestant fallacy of Sola Scriptura.
NOWHERE.

Please address these points.
Seriously do you purposefully try to misunderstand and misrepresent? You misperception is really over the top. What has the deceptive Priesthood been feeding you about Protestants? When did I say Jesus got His words from the Bible? Though, Jesus did quote the scripture a lot. But, tell me , where did you first hear or read the Gospel? in a fortune cookie? or perhaps a unicorn told you? The precious words of Jesus have been recorded and written in the Holy scripture.
It's really ironic that you love to over do your posts with scriptures that you take out of context, thinking they back up your point of view.
 
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mjrhealth

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Last time I interacted with BOL it didn't go so well. But despite that and our differences otherwise, I gotta say he can and will give thorough and civil answers when you ask them in a non abrasive manner. I've had several such exchanges with him both on the forums and via pm. Didn't always agree with him and he didn't seem to mind.
BOl has no interest in the truth, He loves his religion and he will go to the grave for it. I have watched him tear down far to many innocent people.
 
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