@Christophany The true believer's assurance is so clear from Romans 8, John's First Epistle, etc.
Those who deny Eternal Security
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its up to you since you are the one claiming a sheep turns into a goat,
next............................................
So... You have no answer? It's a metaphor, genius.
A man is not literally a goat or a sheep, so your argument makes no sense.
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
In Luke 12:42-46 Christ described in a parable how a faithful servant could turn into an unfaithful one. After asking, "Who then is that faithful and wise steward, whom his lord shall make ruler over his household . . . ?" Jesus answers His own question: "That servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing . . . he will make him ruler over all that he hath." Then Christ explains how that servant could lose his reward. "But and if that servant say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; and shall begin to beat the menservants and maidens, and to eat and drink, and to be drunken; The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers." Verses 45,46.
Here is a perfect example by the Master Teacher as to how a faithful and wise servant can be punished with the unbelievers. Jesus was talking about a man whom He had seen faithful enough to trust with heavy responsibilities. Undoubtedly, this servant represents those who carefully served the Lord as true believers. But what happened? That very faithful servant departed from the path of faithfulness and reaped eternal ruin and death. Does this not also remind us of the words of Hebrews 10:38, "Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him." The servant in the parable, who was a believer, is now punished with the unbelievers. The faithful can draw back to perdition.
Another parable of Christ spotlights the fact that continued forgiveness is conditional for the believer. The story is found in Matthew 18:21-35, and revolves around the forgiveness of God. A certain king responded to the pleas of his servant and forgave him a large debt. That servant went out and found a fellow servant who owed him a small amount and showed no mercy, throwing him in prison because he could not pay. When the king heard what had happened, he rescinded his cancellation of the large debt and had his servant thrown to the tormentors till he paid in full.
No one can deny the obvious teaching of this parable. Even though God graciously forgives those who apply for it, that forgiveness is not without conditions for the future. We can lose that forgiveness by being unmerciful to others. This is in harmony with the words of the Lord in Ezekiel 33:13, "When I shall say to the righteous, that he shall surely live; if he trust to his own righteousness, and commit iniquity, all his righteousnesses shall not be remembered; but for his iniquity that he hath committed, he shall die for it." The principle is repeated in verse 18, "When the righteous turneth from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, he shall even die thereby."
The secret lies in maintaining the righteous relationship with the Source of salvation. Jesus said, "He that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved." Matthew 24:13. No one will be saved finally who does not hold out against a course of deliberate sin in the power of God. Those who do not endure to the end will have their names blotted out of the book of life. Advocates of eternal security deny it could ever happen, but read the frightening possibility for yourself in Revelation 3:5, "He that overcometh . . . I will not blot out his name out of the book of life." The implication is clear that those who are not overcomers - who do not endure to the end - will have their names blotted out.
Here is a perfect example by the Master Teacher as to how a faithful and wise servant can be punished with the unbelievers. Jesus was talking about a man whom He had seen faithful enough to trust with heavy responsibilities. Undoubtedly, this servant represents those who carefully served the Lord as true believers. But what happened? That very faithful servant departed from the path of faithfulness and reaped eternal ruin and death. Does this not also remind us of the words of Hebrews 10:38, "Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him." The servant in the parable, who was a believer, is now punished with the unbelievers. The faithful can draw back to perdition.
Another parable of Christ spotlights the fact that continued forgiveness is conditional for the believer. The story is found in Matthew 18:21-35, and revolves around the forgiveness of God. A certain king responded to the pleas of his servant and forgave him a large debt. That servant went out and found a fellow servant who owed him a small amount and showed no mercy, throwing him in prison because he could not pay. When the king heard what had happened, he rescinded his cancellation of the large debt and had his servant thrown to the tormentors till he paid in full.
No one can deny the obvious teaching of this parable. Even though God graciously forgives those who apply for it, that forgiveness is not without conditions for the future. We can lose that forgiveness by being unmerciful to others. This is in harmony with the words of the Lord in Ezekiel 33:13, "When I shall say to the righteous, that he shall surely live; if he trust to his own righteousness, and commit iniquity, all his righteousnesses shall not be remembered; but for his iniquity that he hath committed, he shall die for it." The principle is repeated in verse 18, "When the righteous turneth from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, he shall even die thereby."
The secret lies in maintaining the righteous relationship with the Source of salvation. Jesus said, "He that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved." Matthew 24:13. No one will be saved finally who does not hold out against a course of deliberate sin in the power of God. Those who do not endure to the end will have their names blotted out of the book of life. Advocates of eternal security deny it could ever happen, but read the frightening possibility for yourself in Revelation 3:5, "He that overcometh . . . I will not blot out his name out of the book of life." The implication is clear that those who are not overcomers - who do not endure to the end - will have their names blotted out.
Cooper
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The apostle Paul was born with the nature of a goat, but he took on the nature of a sheep. If he was so minded he could have reverted back to being a goat. The gift of salvation is available to all, everyone is elect, but the decision as to whether we accept God's free gift of salvation is ours and ours alone. We make that decision of our own free will. We are not born with the gift of eternal life, the default position is that We choose Christ of our own free will. It is not forced onto us, we are all sinners by nature and therefore damned to eternal destruction from birth. It is a personal decision, and we are all capable of going astray. We are all born goats but God looks on the heart, and it makes absolutely absolutely no difference if we give milk or wool. God want's neither, just our heart, love, and life. He wants our everything, our All, and it is down to us whether we give him our all, or not.
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John 5:21
For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will.
Ephesians 2:1
And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Ephesians 2:5
made us alive with Christ even though we were dead in trespasses. You are saved by grace!
Colossians 2:13
When you were dead in your trespasses and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our trespasses
hope this helps !!!
Cohorting with those who blaspheme the Holy Ghost by saying that tongues are of the devil (or that a specific tongue is of the devil) is tantamount to committing the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost yourself.
But I do not say to you that there is no hope for you, if that is you.
Mar 3:29, But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation:
We can determine from this verse that 1) the person who blasphemes the Holy Ghost is only in danger of eternal damnation;
and that therefore, 2) the equivalent of forgiveness is offered in the following verse.
Act 3:19, Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
But I do not say to you that there is no hope for you, if that is you.
Mar 3:29, But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation:
We can determine from this verse that 1) the person who blasphemes the Holy Ghost is only in danger of eternal damnation;
and that therefore, 2) the equivalent of forgiveness is offered in the following verse.
Act 3:19, Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
If anyone thinks they may have blasphemed the Holy Ghost, let them cast themselves on the mercy of the Holy Ghost; and let Him decide whether He will forgive them or not; or whether He will offer to them the equivalent of forgiveness.
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BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
This would indicate the possibility that there is an exception to every rule that is found in scripture.
Might not the person who confesses the sin of blasphemy against the Holy Ghost be an exception to the rule of "hath never forgiveness" because of 1 John 1:9?
I think that the reason why the unpardonable sin is unpardonable is because the people who commit it are no longer sensitive to the Holy Spirit and therefore they will not confess their sins.
But what if someone had such a mighty encounter with the Holy Ghost at the beginning that even though they may have technically spoken against the Spirit (say, perhaps, in a moment when the subject was "what is the blasphemy of the Holy Ghost?" and they blurted out the answer, because no one in that room respected them as a teacher and therefore they utilized the shock value of saying the words tantamount to it, but afterwards, said, "But I'm not saying that; I'm saying that if anyone said that, it would be the blasphemy of the Holy Ghost"), they later, because their relationship to Him was so strong at the beginning, confessed their sin to Him and asked Him for forgiveness?
Is it not up to Him, and not up to us, as to whether that person will be forgiven or not?
For I am talking, here, about someone that I know and love and care about.
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someone is under a stronghold, a strong delusion.
2 Thess 2:11
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
2 Thess 2:11
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
Cooper
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I hope and pray you realise the scriptures you posted are about the EQUALITY of the Father in heaven with the Son on earth.
Whatsoever the Father does, the Son does also. John 5:19 Meaning, quite literally Father and Son are One. Jesus is God in the flesh.
It is vitally important for people to understand this.
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