Tongues and Related Issues

[Waiting on him]

Is that what Paul said? Did Christ say that the Holy Spirit would come and edify us?

Absolutely

 

[Grailhunter]

Get what is being said about the gift of tongues...so far what seems to be the experience for me was as Tabletalk mentioned ...i wouldn’t say so much evil (to me) but chaos and confusion. Every one so far I’ve heard has the gift of tongues is quick to point out those with fake tongues. Saying that is not them but a counterfeit. So far ...cannot say the gift of tongues displayed today has held up to profiting the whole in if God’s Spirit is in it ...why is what is being said not being brought out into the light?

1 Thessalonians 5:11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.
^ paul asked how this edification of the whole is possible when there is chaos and confusion and everyone edifying themselves in some “unknown tongue”? When it is meant to be when the body gathers together ...it is “together”. Also have to consider the warning of having tables at home and coming together to feast and the poor go away hungry...while another is drunk. Paul urged how would one come in off the street and be met with chaos and not leave saying “they are mad”...meaning by feeding themselves others left completely confused at the disjointed tongues of self edification.

Ephesians 5:19-20 Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord; [20] Giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
^ can be done where others see and hear and understand your joy and God is glorified? How is that possible if ...everyone has a prayer language only between him and God and then together...there is not “together”.

1 Corinthians 14:6-19 Now, brethren, if I come unto you speaking with tongues, what shall I profit you, except I shall speak to you either by revelation, or by knowledge, or by prophesying, or by doctrine? [7] And even things without life giving sound, whether pipe or harp, except they give a distinction in the sounds, how shall it be known what is piped or harped? [8] For if the trumpet give an uncertain sound, who shall prepare himself to the battle? [9] So likewise ye, except ye utter by the tongue words easy to be understood, how shall it be known what is spoken? for ye shall speak into the air. [10] There are, it may be, so many kinds of voices in the world, and none of them is without signification. [11] Therefore if I know not the meaning of the voice, I shall be unto him that speaketh a barbarian, and he that speaketh shall be a barbarian unto me. [12] Even so ye, forasmuch as ye are zealous of spiritual gifts, seek that ye may excel to the edifying of the church. [13] Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret. [14] For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful. [15] What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also. [16] Else when thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that occupieth the room of the unlearned say Amen at thy giving of thanks, seeing he understandeth not what thou sayest? [17] For thou verily givest thanks well, but the other is not edified. [18] I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all: [19] Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.

“For thou verily givest thanks well, but the other is not edified. “

Hold that thought.

 

[Grailhunter]

Absolutely

So tell me, how do you think the Holy Spirits comes and does what Christ said the Holy Spirit would do?

 

[Waiting on him]

So tell me, how do you think the Holy Spirits comes and does what Christ said the Holy Spirit would do?

He the Spirit manifest through each of us to profit the whole ( a tree doesn’t eat its own fruit).

 

[Grailhunter]

He the Spirit manifest through each of us to profit the whole ( a tree doesn’t eat its own fruit).

Well that is pretty vague and not what Christ or Paul as talking about. Care to try again?

 

[Waiting on him]

Well that is pretty vague and not what Christ or Paul as talking about. Care to try again?

Ok, there’s a always a common message from Christ as well as Paul.
Eat me.

 

[Grailhunter]

Ok, there’s a always a common message from Christ as well as Paul.
Eat me.

lol

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Ok, there’s a always a common message from Christ as well as Paul.
Eat me.

2 Corinthians 4:11-12
[11] For we which live are alway delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh. [12] So then death worketh in us, but life in you.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Ok, there’s a always a common message from Christ as well as Paul.
Eat me.

Eat me. ...That is power.

 

[Waiting on him]

Eat me. ...That is power.

It’s the whole gospel summed up in two words.

 

[Waiting on him]

2 Corinthians 4:11-12
[11] For we which live are alway delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh. [12] So then death worketh in us, but life in you.

He’s manifested.

 

[Grailhunter]

It’s the whole gospel summed up in two words.

lol No offense taken, put let us all delete this...no one needs to read it.

 

[Waiting on him]

lol No offense taken, put let us all delete this...no one needs to read it.

Blessed is he who is not offended in me.

 

[Grailhunter]

Blessed is he who is not offended in me.

ok

 

[Waiting on him]

ok

Ok

 

[VictoryinJesus]

lol No offense taken, put let us all delete this...no one needs to read it.

Why should it be deleted? 1 Corinthians 9:12-13 If others be partakers of this power over you, are not we rather? Nevertheless we have not used this power; but suffer all things, lest we should hinder the gospel of Christ. [13] Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?

God turns stones in to bread. Ezekiel 11:19-20 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh: [20] That they may walk in my statutes, and keep mine ordinances, and do them: and they shall be my people, and I will be their God.

How else do you deal your bread out to the poor? How else are the children manifest as He is in the world so are they? Do you not read about partaking of all He endured and suffered..yet “eat me” is offensive. 1 Corinthians 10:17
[17] For we being many are one bread, and one body: for we are all partakers of that one bread.

What do you think He means by “his body broken”? 1 Corinthians 11:24
[24] And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

Revelation 12:11
[11] And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

Philippians 2:8
[8] And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

 

[amadeus]

Your first example might also benefit the person as well as being praise to God. I doubt we can outdo God. If someone praises Him, God will outdo that person and give him back more in return.

Indeed, we cannot out or out give God. It is not easy to go back and pick out what He has given as result of my daily in tongues connection with Him, when really anything I have that is good came from Him. How do we sort it all out, especially when the brain has slowed down to dead slow these day. That slowness does not matter to God. The freight train will overtake the express if that's the way He wants it.

I have read more than one post on forums where a person has described his inability to grow in the things of God any more after serving Him for many years. The point was intended to say that God would not him to continue to grow. I don't believe that. I would say the limit for any person is himself. If he ask for help in that in the right way, God will not refuse to give it. Man is certainly limited, but God is unlimited. I have run up against walls myself in the past, but I refuse to quit and eventually the wall was gone.

It might not work to praise God wanting something back. That wouldn't be really praising God or giving Him something in the best way.

The only time I remember asking for something back was when I had been away from God [backslid] for about 10 years. I had not spoken in tongues nor read my Bible during that time. When I did come back I asked to be given some things back, such as tongues, and it was... but some things, like all of the scriptures I knew by memory were gone. I simply surrendered and He gave me much and in some things more than what I had but the memorized verses have never returned. I came back to Him in 2002. I retain the memory of those lost verses to remind me of my errors...and how He brought me back.

Receiving ideas from God can sometimes be overwhelming. The meaning may be too big to grasp at once. I think people can receive wisdom from God in the first case that later gets digested and revealed over time.

Especially during my early morning time with God, usually when I am praying in tongues, I will receive an image which explains a question I did have or one I did not have before. I don't try to write them down, but when I need it, it comes to forefront and I can use it in my own life or in order to help someone else. Of course, sometimes I don't know what I need, but God always does. This is why regular communication with Him is so important. People may want me to stop praying in tongues, but I cannot do that, not and stay in His will.

The overwhelming things for me at times are theological questions I see being discussed on this and other forums. I seldom participate because I cannot keep hold of or even understand all that another person is saying or meaning in order to discuss it... but it is not always so. Once in a while I do jump in and God is with me on it. Once in a while I jump in on my own [my flesh leading] and get into trouble with God. The Bible itself is overwhelming but not to God. If He is in us and we are NOT quenching His Spirit, we will not err in our words or in our silence.

As for "bad" examples of speaking in tongues? I think the Dark Side has its lying signs and wonders, I've no doubt about that from some videos I've seen; but by their fruits, you shall know them.

I have seen many people manifest "bad" examples of tongue talking where I have been in attendance, but to openly criticize such a thing must be done correctly or not at all. When does a person have the right to open his mouth and criticize others...according to God?

Many years ago I can remember when it was me speaking it tongues when I should have been silent. God talked to me about that and things have improved. It is very similar to young children in school who are expected to be silent when the teacher is speaking to them and not asking yet for a response. When she does ask for a response usually she expects it to be done in a proper way such as raising a hand and waiting to be acknowledged. The difficulty in a "church" setting is when the people, including or especially God's ministers do not really understand His order.

What is God's Order? For the children of Israel the proper marching [moving] order is seen in Numbers chapter 2; the proper camping order is found Numbers chapter 10. Can people knows God's order when they gather together to worship Him? They can because I don't believe He would hide that, but people like to arrange their order according to their own... and very often do, calling it His.

 

[Waiting on him]

Why should it be deleted? 1 Corinthians 9:12-13 If others be partakers of this power over you, are not we rather? Nevertheless we have not used this power; but suffer all things, lest we should hinder the gospel of Christ. [13] Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?

God turns stones in to bread. Ezekiel 11:19-20 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh: [20] That they may walk in my statutes, and keep mine ordinances, and do them: and they shall be my people, and I will be their God.

How else do you deal your bread out to the poor? How else are the children manifest as He is in the world so are they? Do you not read about partaking of all He endured and suffered..yet “eat me” is offensive. 1 Corinthians 10:17
[17] For we being many are one bread, and one body: for we are all partakers of that one bread.

What do you think He means by “his body broken”? 1 Corinthians 11:24
[24] And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

Who having a son asking for bread would give him a stone?
I would say the self centered who only have a stone to offer.

 

[Grailhunter]

Why should it be deleted? 1 Corinthians 9:12-13 If others be partakers of this power over you, are not we rather? Nevertheless we have not used this power; but suffer all things, lest we should hinder the gospel of Christ. [13] Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?

God turns stones in to bread. Ezekiel 11:19-20 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh: [20] That they may walk in my statutes, and keep mine ordinances, and do them: and they shall be my people, and I will be their God.

How else do you deal your bread out to the poor? How else are the children manifest as He is in the world so are they? Do you not read about partaking of all He endured and suffered..yet “eat me” is offensive. 1 Corinthians 10:17
[17] For we being many are one bread, and one body: for we are all partakers of that one bread.

What do you think He means by “his body broken”? 1 Corinthians 11:24
[24] And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

Revelation 12:11
[11] And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

Philippians 2:8
[8] And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

lol No the phrase "eat me" is not good. lol

 

[Grailhunter]

Get what is being said about the gift of tongues...so far what seems to be the experience for me was as Tabletalk mentioned ...i wouldn’t say so much evil (to me) but chaos and confusion. Every one so far I’ve heard has the gift of tongues is quick to point out those with fake tongues. Saying that is not them but a counterfeit. So far ...cannot say the gift of tongues displayed today has held up to profiting the whole in if God’s Spirit is in it ...why is what is being said not being brought out into the light?

1 Thessalonians 5:11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.
^ paul asked how this edification of the whole is possible when there is chaos and confusion and everyone edifying themselves in some “unknown tongue”? When it is meant to be when the body gathers together ...it is “together”. Also have to consider the warning of having tables at home and coming together to feast and the poor go away hungry...while another is drunk. Paul urged how would one come in off the street and be met with chaos and not leave saying “they are mad”...meaning by feeding themselves others left completely confused at the disjointed tongues of self edification.

Ephesians 5:19-20 Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord; [20] Giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
^ can be done where others see and hear and understand your joy and God is glorified? How is that possible if ...everyone has a prayer language only between him and God and then together...there is not “together”.

1 Corinthians 14:6-19 Now, brethren, if I come unto you speaking with tongues, what shall I profit you, except I shall speak to you either by revelation, or by knowledge, or by prophesying, or by doctrine? [7] And even things without life giving sound, whether pipe or harp, except they give a distinction in the sounds, how shall it be known what is piped or harped? [8] For if the trumpet give an uncertain sound, who shall prepare himself to the battle? [9] So likewise ye, except ye utter by the tongue words easy to be understood, how shall it be known what is spoken? for ye shall speak into the air. [10] There are, it may be, so many kinds of voices in the world, and none of them is without signification. [11] Therefore if I know not the meaning of the voice, I shall be unto him that speaketh a barbarian, and he that speaketh shall be a barbarian unto me. [12] Even so ye, forasmuch as ye are zealous of spiritual gifts, seek that ye may excel to the edifying of the church. [13] Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret. [14] For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful. [15] What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also. [16] Else when thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that occupieth the room of the unlearned say Amen at thy giving of thanks, seeing he understandeth not what thou sayest? [17] For thou verily givest thanks well, but the other is not edified. [18] I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all: [19] Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.

“For thou verily givest thanks well, but the other is not edified. “

So how do those scriptures compare to these scriptures?
1st Corinthians 12:4-10 Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit. And there are varieties of ministries, and the same Lord. There are varieties of effects, but the same God who works all things in all persons. But to each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good. For to one is given the word of wisdom through the Spirit, and to another the word of knowledge according to the same Spirit; to another faith by the same Spirit, and to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit, and to another the effecting of miracles, and to another prophecy, and to another the distinguishing of spirits, to another various kinds of tongues, and to another the interpretation of tongues.