Toward Death More Abundantly Instead... of Life?

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Helen

Well-Known Member
Oct 22, 2011
15,476
21,157
113
Faith
Christian
Country
Canada
@Giuliano

Thank you Kerry ...Good word and insight ....with always the added “food for thought” ...there was a few things there that I had never taken stock of before. Excellent . :)

I had forgotten how much I have missed those kind of posts from you.

Blessings....H .
 

icxn

Well-Known Member
Oct 6, 2018
233
352
63
49
Ohio
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Thought of you the other day and discernment. Jonah 4:11 And should not I spare Nineveh, that great city, wherein are more than sixscore thousand persons that cannot discern between their right hand and their left hand; and also much cattle?
Ninevah the great city is a type of the Gentile Church. The one hundred and twenty thousand men in it are those who have come to spiritual maturity and no longer know* (fall into) sins of the body** (left), nor are conceited in mind because of their spiritual accomplishments (sins of the right), but walk the middle path wisely (Ecclesiastes 7:16-17). Cattle are those who are still grazing and plowing the field of their soul with the word of God, but have yet to produce the fruit of righteousness. For these the Lord is equally concerned (Psalms 36:6).

_____
* In the Greek and in some English translation the word used is know.
** Doing wrong or failing to do that which is good.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: amadeus and Helen

Giuliano

Well-Known Member
Aug 4, 2019
5,978
3,676
113
Carlisle
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
@Giuliano

Thank you Kerry ...Good word and insight ....with always the added “food for thought” ...there was a few things there that I had never taken stock of before. Excellent . :)

I had forgotten how much I have missed those kind of posts from you.

Blessings....H .
This may interest you, Helen. It's easier to see in Hebrew but hard in English translations.

Genesis 32:3 And Jacob sent messengers before him to Esau his brother unto the land of Seir, the country of Edom.

Genesis 32:6 And the messengers returned to Jacob, saying, We came to thy brother Esau, and also he cometh to meet thee, and four hundred men with him.

Were those physical men or angels? We aren't told. I tend to think Jacob sent the spiritual kind -- angels. I think when he sent those angels to see what was happening, it drew the interest of Esau's fallen angel who then came to wrestle with Jacob. Thus Jacob truly supplanted Esau because now God could operate lawfully through Jacob since Esau lost his spiritual authority.

Also note that when Joseph had his dream, Jacob appeared as the sun and Rachel as the moon. I think a new kind of spiritual Light came into the world by what those two did. And I think the Jews are right to call her "Mother of all Israel" even if only two tribes were from her. Matthew seems to think it too when he said Rachel wept for her children. What? Jews were her children? Yes, they were. Not according to the flesh though!
 
  • Like
Reactions: amadeus and Helen

Helen

Well-Known Member
Oct 22, 2011
15,476
21,157
113
Faith
Christian
Country
Canada
Thanks Kerry , will share the above post with Dave ...:)
 
  • Like
Reactions: Giuliano

bbyrd009

Groper
Nov 30, 2016
33,943
12,081
113
Ute City, COLO
www.facebook.com
Faith
Christian
Country
United States Minor Outlying Islands
OHHHHHHHhhh and to be lost in the world of bbyrd009... I have no idea what you have said... I will just assume I did NOT earn the cookie I wanted so badly... LOL I highlighted where I got really lost.... LOL
ok well a 501c3 is a corporation right, and corporations have unlimited charters, see, since ol woodrow screwed all that up in like 1913 or whatever, with the federal reserve...anyway, i dont know ok, but i do know that when you give tax breaks to ppl, esp tax-free-ness, well that is naturally going to engender some um bias shall we say?

and again i dont know but i do know 501=6, in a certain kind of spiritual math say, and c3=6 by the same method, and one collects those benefits via a form 1023, so hmm, what might someone anxious to benefit from a 501c3 do, other than present a message that will be popular? Bc an unpopular message will not garner many donations, right

so what sounds perfectly innocent, a way to "help" philanthropic or other orgs supposed to be "for the public good" and "non-profit" thrive, can also be abused in the worst ways, and fwiw i will say that rich ppl do not spend a dime usually unless it is in their llc's umbrella, and the government actually rewards corporations for losses--not talking 501c3s now, but llc's (and other charters), again ostensibly for good reasons, but it is really insane.

you wanna be rich? its really easy; go form an llc, today, monday, whatever, its like $100, and then be a corporation and let the llc buy your car, see, you can deduct practically everything besides groceries, and you dont have to show a profit for like seven years, although i guess that is maybe changing a little, but trust me it wont really change at all lol, and in seven years you just dissolve and form a new one! That is how rich ppl operate.

All rich ppl do this, every single one of them as near (far :) ) as i can tell. Sell as many or as few widgets as you like or can, and whatever you do of course dont show a profit--if you get cash-rich, go buy "capitol improvements," which are basically whatever you want to own, an rv, a castle, doesnt matter. And you buy all those no-money-down, even castles, and the bank that has been fighting you your whole life, basically? They are going to go "oh, he gets it now" and they are going to open their pockets for you, just like they do Trump or whoever, and you, too can be a Bankruptcy King eh

im telling you this works bc this is how our system is set up; losers are rewarded and the honestly productive are punished, "taxed"

so then we get "baptized" and go have a little celebration at Luby's or whatever--for an example--iow a little ego-building exercise, rather than...what "baptism" really is, say, all bc that up there, essentially.

ps imo pls donate to non-tax-deductible "charities" too, or i mean only
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Helen and amadeus

Addy

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2020
4,288
4,467
113
61
Ontario
Faith
Christian
Country
Canada
ok well a 501c3 is a corporation right, and corporations have unlimited charters, see, since ol woodrow screwed all that up in like 1913 or whatever, with the federal reserve...anyway, i dont know ok, but i do know that when you give tax breaks to ppl, esp tax-free-ness, well that is naturally going to engender some um bias shall we say?

and again i dont know but i do know 501=6, in a certain kind of spiritual math say, and c3=6 by the same method, and one collects those benefits via a form 1023, so hmm, what might someone anxious to benefit from a 501c3 do, other than present a message that will be popular? Bc an unpopular message will not garner many donations, right

so then we get "baptized" and go have a little celebration at Luby's or whatever--for an example--iow a little ego-building exercise, rather than...what "baptism" really is, say

I like it when you talk... I just wish I understood ... because I think you have much to say... Thankfully you seem patient... I respond well to COOKIES... as you may have noticed... LOL I live in Canada... I am a recluse... I don't work... and I don't really know anything about Government.... I think you might be suggesting that the church who gets a tax break... also waters down the theology ??? I do not do well with riddles... but I do enjoy them.
 

amadeus

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2008
22,484
31,633
113
80
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Thought of you the other day and discernment. Jonah 4:11 And should not I spare Nineveh, that great city, wherein are more than sixscore thousand persons that cannot discern between their right hand and their left hand; and also much cattle?

(Imo) God is not being sarcastic in saying they can not tell the difference between their right hand and left.


Jonah 4:11 Lexicon: "Should I not have compassion on Nineveh, the great city in which there are more than 120,000 persons who do not know the difference between their right and left hand, as well as many animals?"

Interval, space between...as well as many animals(beast).
Similar to Nineveh of old to whom Jonah preached, people today who really do have a measure of love toward God remained mixtures so that sometimes they work in the Right hand of God and sometimes in the Left.

"Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be." James 3:10

Ought not to be... but as we witness in others and sometimes in ourselves it too often IS!
Beasts, which men are... some still unclean but with hope and some clean but with hope. Have any yet killed all of their own beasts? Is it the beast of us that sometimes does the Left hand work?

For how much longer?

"And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:" Acts 17:30

"And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven,
And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:" Rev 10:5-6
 

amadeus

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2008
22,484
31,633
113
80
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
@bbyrd009 ... NO cookie ???? I said I wanted a cookie... Did I get your meaning wrong ?? post#114

HA @bbyrd009 ... YOU DID respond... I just did not see it... so sorry.... LOL
I was excited to hear from you...
I really have to insist that I have milk with my cookie! There is one for me also, isn't there?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pisteuo

bbyrd009

Groper
Nov 30, 2016
33,943
12,081
113
Ute City, COLO
www.facebook.com
Faith
Christian
Country
United States Minor Outlying Islands
I like it when you talk... I just wish I understood ... because I think you have much to say... Thankfully you seem patient... I respond well to COOKIES... as you may have noticed... LOL I live in Canada... I am a recluse... I don't work... and I don't really know anything about Government.... I think you might be suggesting that the church who gets a tax break... also waters down the theology ??? I do not do well with riddles... but I do enjoy them.
any "church" that would tell the truth of what is in Scripture would be out of business in a week!
knowledge brings sorrow
right, and sorrow does not sell
so we all get raised with a theology-for-money setup, and pastors--good, well-intentioned pastors--get herded into this system and eaten whole, or else they get no audience to speak of. imo.

the truth never comes looking for you imo; you have to go look for truth!
anyone who comes knocking with "truth" and says "you better believe me/this, or else," is a thief and a liar, imo

and you better believe that, or else!
narf
 
  • Like
Reactions: Helen

amadeus

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2008
22,484
31,633
113
80
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
OHHHHHHHhhh and to be lost in the world of bbyrd009... I have no idea what you have said... I will just assume I did NOT earn the cookie I wanted so badly... LOL I highlighted where I got really lost.... LOL
Admitting you are lost, when you are, is a good thing. Remind me to tell you a true story about that at a later time...
 
  • Like
Reactions: mjrhealth and Helen

bbyrd009

Groper
Nov 30, 2016
33,943
12,081
113
Ute City, COLO
www.facebook.com
Faith
Christian
Country
United States Minor Outlying Islands
I like it when you talk... I just wish I understood ... because I think you have much to say... Thankfully you seem patient... I respond well to COOKIES... as you may have noticed... LOL I live in Canada... I am a recluse... I don't work... and I don't really know anything about Government.... I think you might be suggesting that the church who gets a tax break... also waters down the theology ??? I do not do well with riddles... but I do enjoy them.
you might spend some time in that "putting away childish things" link, im still absorbing that myself, but short answer is that the Bible is prolly lying to most of us, on purpose, using idiom that can easily be misunderstood, and other devices, which i know seems counter-productive even, but i guess that is how wisdom is hidden from the wise?
Israelite Origins: putting away childish things | Biblical Historical Context
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: mjrhealth

Addy

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2020
4,288
4,467
113
61
Ontario
Faith
Christian
Country
Canada
any "church" that would tell the truth of what is in Scripture would be out of business in a week!
knowledge brings sorrow
right, and sorrow does not sell
so we all get raised with a theology-for-money setup, and pastors--good, well-intentioned pastors--get herded into this system and eaten whole, or else they get no audience to speak of. imo.

the truth never comes looking for you imo; you have to go look for truth!
anyone who comes knocking with "truth" and says "you better believe me/this, or else," is a thief and a liar, imo

and you better believe that, or else!
narf

With this said.. I am CERTAIN you would love Carter Conlon... He could care less about attendance... and HE is one who WARNS of everything you have stated... YES knowledge brings sorrow... I have always bucked against knowledge.... I have prayed for WISDOM... I find her more useful.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Helen and bbyrd009

amadeus

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2008
22,484
31,633
113
80
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
man, i am in bad shape for this kind of work, and ill admit as much as often as someone lets me lol, but here i would ask for a specific example. I mostly get out of line when professors start insisting on stuff, seems to me, but maybe not, yes
I remember when I was in a student in a college lecture hall and the professor on the podium would not allow any questions. Just take notes, read your text and keep your mouth shut! Kinda' like that huh?
 

Pisteuo

Well-Known Member
Jul 31, 2017
333
595
93
47
Ozarks
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Reminds me of what bbyrd would always say on the other forum...”I’d rather have questions that can’t be answered than answers that can’t be questioned”. To me that is where he differs from most “Christians” as they don’t like their answers questioned. And possibly why I have followed him around, lol.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Helen and amadeus

Addy

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2020
4,288
4,467
113
61
Ontario
Faith
Christian
Country
Canada
Reminds me of what bbyrd would always say on the other forum...”I’d rather have questions that can’t be answered than answers that can’t be questioned”. To me that is where he differs from most “Christians” as they don’t like their answers questioned. And possibly why I have followed him around, lol.

Very lovely to meet another bbyrd fan... I am a newbie here and well...bbyrd and I had a rocky start but ... it had a happy ending... I will try to find the number of the post I shared on here about that... It is quite comical in my opinion... Found it... #108 on this thread... is my bbyrd story. LOL
 

amadeus

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2008
22,484
31,633
113
80
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I like it when you talk... I just wish I understood ... because I think you have much to say... Thankfully you seem patient... I respond well to COOKIES... as you may have noticed... LOL I live in Canada... I am a recluse... I don't work... and I don't really know anything about Government.... I think you might be suggesting that the church who gets a tax break... also waters down the theology ??? I do not do well with riddles... but I do enjoy them.
For your information in the United States the 501c3 is the part of the Internal Revenue Service Code which when applied for will exempt churches from paying taxes. Most churches have applied for it. I believe, that many of them would lose their church buildings at least if the exemption for them were revoked. Also there are other laws in place which may exempt ministers [such as pastors] from paying personal income or Social Security taxes on income derived from their ministry. These are a built-in means of control by the government over the church organizations there that flies in the face of trusting in God. Of course, people will argue for the other side as they will for anything... One day perhaps there will be a more specific definition of what a church is which will be used to disqualify some for the exemption. I used to work for the Social Security Administration and was necessarily very familiar with those provisions of the law. Before I took early retirement they had become part of a thorn in my side.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Addy and Nancy

amadeus

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2008
22,484
31,633
113
80
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Reminds me of what bbyrd would always say on the other forum...”I’d rather have questions that can’t be answered than answers that can’t be questioned”. To me that is where he differs from most “Christians” as they don’t like their answers questioned. And possibly why I have followed him around, lol.
Amen! But... neither do we want to cause him to get a swelled head. LOL
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pisteuo

Pisteuo

Well-Known Member
Jul 31, 2017
333
595
93
47
Ozarks
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Very lovely to meet another bbyrd fan... I am a newbie here and well...bbyrd and I had a rocky start but ... it had a happy ending... I will try to find the number of the post I shared on here about that... It is quite comical in my opinion... Found it... #108 on this thread... is my bbyrd story. LOL
Good to “meet” you as well!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Helen