Traditions (No. 1) That repentance is a requirement for obtaining eternal life? True or false?

[MatthewG]

It’s the Gospel of Christ that is the power of God unto Salvation.


“For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭1:16‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

Repentance defined is change of mind.

If you change your mind from not accepting the Gospel of Christ; to accepting. You have repented. You have changed your mind.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Hello there,

Looking through, www.believer.com, a site that I particularly like, I came upon a section on commonly held traditions, in which it discussed, among other traditions, the belief that repentance is a requirement for obtaining eternal life, to which it gave the following response, which is in line with what I too believe, and thought it would be worth considering with you here:-

​

Other traditions discussed can be found here:- Believer.comTraditions Examined | Right Division | Teachings You may be interested in discussing those too.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

My short answer is: Yes, repentance is a requirement for eternal life. But I have a longer answer.

The more I come to understand the teachings of Jesus and the Apostles, the more I am convinced that "eternal life" is a quality of life characterized by the permanent, enduring, fulfilling aspects of our existence. For instance, Paul the apostle said "these three remain: faith, hope and love." A few years ago I coined the term "aionic life" based on the Greek word for Eternal, which roughly translated means, "life in the age of ages." What will life be like in The Age of Ages? What qualities of life today will endure into the next age, hope? faith? Love? truth? joy? humility? Charity? Patience?

Eternal life is that quality of life wherein less is made of transient joys, while lasting joys are most desired. For this reason, I now believe that repentance is not so much a requirement of eternal life, as it is an aspect of eternal life. Those who repent are experiencing an enduring aspect of life in The Age of Ages.

For example, those who like to take day hikes in the woods will certainly wear the right shoes and clothing, perhaps take a walking stick and a small bag filled with water and snacks. Such things are required for the hike. But then, the actual hike begins with the first step and the next and the next.

In my view, eternal life is like the hike; it's the journey. Some of us believe that repentance is a requirement for the journey like the shoes or the walking stick. But I can now see that repentance is like the first step of the journey. Once someone repents, the journey begins.

 

[Grailhunter]

There are some warning here that point out some red flags.
Studying Revelation and prophecies you can come up with some imaginative beliefs. In college we went through 4 district interpretations of Revelation and Daniel and other prophecies. They each had their points but along the way we discussed that there were areas that you could divert to interpretations that could lead to some Klondike beliefs.

Some of these beliefs would lead you away from the most well understood theologies. And end up weaving a belief that has biblical references, but the meaning is so different. You need to keep yourself anchored with the truth, the central meaning of the scriptures, in light of the Spirit of the Gospels.

I am not against imagination and speculation...shelved in that category, but they do not want to change foundational beliefs. There is a interpretation of Revelation that says that the 144,000 will be the only ones saved. They tie that with Matthew 7:14 But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it......Of course that would be a very pessimistic view.

The warnings that are given here are good advise.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Hello @Mungo,

The Kingdom is in abeyance now, with the departure of Israel into the darkness of unbelief at Acts 28:25-28, and salvation has been sent to the Gentiles (v.28). The covenant with it's blessings all await a future day, the day when Israel come to repentance, and take up their role as Priests unto God among the nations.

The Church which is the Body of Christ is being called out today, the knowledge of which is made known by Paul in his later epistles (Eph. Phil. Col. 1 & 2 Timothy, Titus and Philemon). Christ among us are is now our hope of glory.

John's gospel is the vehicle through which so many have come to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, It was written 'That ye may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and believing may have life through His Name.'

Christ is now the Head of the Church which is His Body, and He in us is our hope of glory.

Praise His Holy Name!

In Christ Jesus
Chris

Yes, I agree with what you said here. I would also like to add an observation concerning John's gospel that might be helpful.

As far as I know, John was the last living apostle among the original 12 and he lived a very long time. As it happened, John not only ministered to many families in Asia minor, he ministered to their children also. That is, John's ministry extended to a second generation of believers. The children of believing couples became believers themselves under John's guidance. We know the Lord gifted John with a ministry to the children of believers, because we can see this in his letters. Several times he calls them "my little children" referring to those born of believing parents.

As such, many have noticed (including myself) that the central focus of John's gospel is the question, "why should I believe?" This question is highly relevant to those who hear the story of the Gospel second hand. Most of the people who were around at the time when Jesus walked the earth are no longer with them. Many have died. And so eye witness testimony is hard to find. Without living witnesses, faith becomes that much more difficult. And so this becomes the central theme of John's gospel.

We see this most profoundly at the end of John's gospel where Thomas encounters the risen Lord.

John 20:27-29
Then He says to Thomas, “Reach here with your finger, and see My hands; and reach here your hand and put it into My side; and do not be unbelieving, but believing.” Thomas answered and said to Him, “My Lord and my God!” Jesus says to him, “Because you have seen Me, have you believed? Blessed are they who did not see, and yet believed.”

Jesus' statement here speaks to second generation believers, and the rest of us that followed. Why did people of that day believe? Did first hand experience give them an advantage? What actually explained the difference between those who believed and those who didn't? This is the central theme John explores in his gospel, which is a gospel written to a new generation.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Now this is a very confusing statement, and it does trouble me a little like it apparently does Enoch exactly where some of this stuff could be coming from. But the kingdom of Heaven is alive and well right now, and everyone departing this world in Christ is heading immediately there to begin experiencing their eternal reward, and eternal life in Him. I don't know what to make of your leading statement here, but like the one about the kingdom of Heaven being closed, I am kinda afraid to ask.

I haven't read the site so I can't respond to it directly. I do know, from many conversations over the the years that there remains a wide spectrum of ideas concerning the kingdom of God out there. Some people argue, for instance, that the New Testament makes a distinction between the kingdom of God and the kingdom of Heaven. I don't think this is true, but I do agree with Charity that the central theme of the early gospel period was a focus on one particular realization of the kingdom, which will be characterized by Jesus' rule from Mt Zion in Jerusalem over the entire world and Jewish hegemony. When Jesus and the disciples preached, "repent for the kingdom of God is at hand," the kingdom in view was the Millennial Kingdom, when Jesus will physically rule from Jerusalem, the Apostles will judge the twelve tribes of Israel, and the nations will come to worship the king and seek his wisdom.

If someone would argue that God foreclosed on that version of the kingdom the moment Jesus ascended to heaven, I can sympathize with that argument, though I no longer agree with it. In a sense, and from a certain point of view, the hope of a millennial style kingdom was "closed" at the ascension of Jesus. But Paul argues in Romans that the word of God hasn't failed. The ascension of Jesus doesn't preclude an earthly rule of Christ sometime in the future.

As you say, from another point of view, the kingdom has always existed in the hearts and minds of Jesus' followers, who already obey him and love him.

 

[Mungo]

Hello @Mungo,

The Kingdom is in abeyance now, with the departure of Israel into the darkness of unbelief at Acts 28:25-28, and salvation has been sent to the Gentiles (v.28).

The kingdom is now.
Jesus is king.

The covenant with it's blessings all await a future day, the day when Israel come to repentance, and take up their role as Priests unto God among the nations.

The Covenant is now.

The Church which is the Body of Christ is being called out today, the knowledge of which is made known by Paul in his later epistles (Eph. Phil. Col. 1 & 2 Timothy, Titus and Philemon). Christ among us are is now our hope of glory.

Jesus founded the Church on the apostles with Peter the leader.
The Church was well under way before Paul was called.

John's gospel is the vehicle through which so many have come to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, It was written 'That ye may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and believing may have life through His Name.'

But not just John's gospel.

Christ is now the Head of the Church which is His Body, and He in us is our hope of glory.

What do you mean Jesus is now Head of the Church?
He always was the Head from the moment he founded it.

P.S. What about the quotes I gave you from Acts, 2Cor and 2Pet?

 

[Robert Gwin]

Hello there,

Looking through, www.believer.com, a site that I particularly like, I came upon a section on commonly held traditions, in which it discussed, among other traditions, the belief that repentance is a requirement for obtaining eternal life, to which it gave the following response, which is in line with what I too believe, and thought it would be worth considering with you here:-

​

Other traditions discussed can be found here:- Believer.comTraditions Examined | Right Division | Teachings You may be interested in discussing those too.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Jehovah does not even allow unrepentant sinners to even be among His people maam.
(Romans 2:3-5) . . .do you suppose, O man, that while you judge those who practice such things and yet you do them, you will escape the judgment of God? 4 Or do you despise the riches of his kindness and forbearance and patience, because you do not know that God in his kindness is trying to lead you to repentance? 5 But according to your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath for yourself on the day of wrath and of the revealing of God’s righteous judgment.
(1 Corinthians 5:11-13) . . .I am writing you to stop keeping company with anyone called a brother who is sexually immoral or a greedy person or an idolater or a reviler or a drunkard or an extortioner, not even eating with such a man. 12 For what do I have to do with judging those outside? Do you not judge those inside, 13 while God judges those outside? “Remove the wicked person from among yourselves.”

 

[Wrangler]

On what basis do you say: "when we read John's gospel which is to and for Gentiles after the kingdom was closed to any more members, and which is the only book in the Bible for unbelievers in need of everlasting life,"

I too reject the premise of the article.

People on both sides of the spectrum get funny about doing any work to be saved.

 

[farouk]

It’s the Gospel of Christ that is the power of God unto Salvation.


“For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭1:16‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

Repentance defined is change of mind.

If you change your mind from not accepting the Gospel of Christ; to accepting. You have repented. You have changed your mind.

@MatthewG I thought of this verse also:

"For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death." (2 Corinthians 7.10)

 

[Desire Of All Nations]

The very first recorded statement from Christ's ministry was for people to repent. Orthodox Christianity has regressed to a point where even the plainest passages are now dismissed as heresy. I can understand how someone could not understand bible prophecy, but how does a person claiming Christianity dismiss one of the plainer doctrines Christ taught as not being necessary?

This is Satan talking. This is not a "tradition" but Gospel truth. So whenever you see someone bring up "traditions" or "organized religion", it is more than likely that a cultist is on the scene.

Using your tremendously flawed logic, Paul was a "cultist" since he spent 2 letters talking about how and why God's Church is organized. Protestants overuse that word as a means to denigrate people who don't share their beliefs and have no idea what it actually means. I have news for you: Christianity was once considered a cult by the more mainstream religions. The irony of Protestants overusing this word is that most of all of their beliefs and traditions came from pagan cults.

 

[Cassandra]

It’s the Gospel of Christ that is the power of God unto Salvation.


“For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭1:16‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

Repentance defined is change of mind.

If you change your mind from not accepting the Gospel of Christ; to accepting. You have repented. You have changed your mind.

Repentance is done with sorrow and tears as well. We must be truly sorry. We must be convicted of sin, and knowing that we have done great disservice to our Maker, and have displeased Him. It is not something done lightly--He can see right through that.

 

[Enoch111]

Using your tremendously flawed logic...

Really? Kindly show me the flawed logic of exposing false beliefs? So do you agree with those cultists? Yea or Nay?

 

[Pythagorean12]

What is Sin? Biblical Meaning and Definition

Sin pre-existed Adam and Eve.
What is the purpose of repentance?
We regret God making us what we are?


What is Repentance? Biblical Definition and Meaning

 

[MatthewG]

Repentance is done with sorrow and tears as well. We must be truly sorry. We must be convicted of sin, and knowing that we have done great disservice to our Maker, and have displeased Him. It is not something done lightly--He can see right through that.

Crying is a good thing. God can most certainly see the heart of an individual.

 

[Desire Of All Nations]

Really? Kindly show me the flawed logic of exposing false beliefs? So do you agree with those cultists? Yea or Nay?

I already showed you how flawed your logic is by telling you what Paul said about how God's religion is organized in Corinthians and Ephesians. It is completely logical to conclude that if God is about order like Paul said He is, His religion would naturally be built to prevent doctrinal confusion like Ephesian says. Protestants are so drunk on their "freedom" that anything resembling order comes across as being "cultish" to them.

You want to act like my post was about you "exposing false doctrine", but in the second sentence you said that anyone who even mentions traditions or organized religion is likely in a cult. You are getting defensive and hostile towards me because you didn't expect anyone to call you out on the lies in your own post. Say what you will about Catholics, but even they know the Bible clearly shows God's Church has a government structure. And here you are, doubling down on your own falsehoods instead of accepting correction. Accusing people who don't agree with Protestant lies a "cultist" may allow you to feel better about yourself, but it won't magically make your lies biblical.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Hello there,

Looking through, www.believer.com, a site that I particularly like, I came upon a section on commonly held traditions, in which it discussed, among other traditions, the belief that repentance is a requirement for obtaining eternal life, to which it gave the following response, which is in line with what I too believe, and thought it would be worth considering with you here:-

​

Other traditions discussed can be found here:- Believer.comTraditions Examined | Right Division | Teachings You may be interested in discussing those too.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

As Mungo pointed out, scripture says "repentance is granted" by God. We turn from our sins and ways of life TO GOD.
God chose us first. He enabled us to turn to Him. This is His drawing power, a process that involves many years and sometimes a lifetime of messages sent by Him through witnesses, ministers of the Word, hearing the Word, over and over and having it penetrate, lie dormant for a time when He opens our eyes. This all works in conjunction with lessons through experiences of good and evil that we must go through. He prepares our soil for His seed to take root. We turn to Him because He convinces us that our way doesn't work and we realize it. Now we turn to Him because it finally makes sense. We begin to let go of our ways and let God in. We desire something more and are drawn to Him for life. Along our paths through life He helps us to look at our sins and realize that there is nothing we can do to get rid of them, that only Christ can.
At this precipise in life, wr epent of course, it is the only rational thing to do. People don't because they either aren't ready or they are reprobate. It is of God, He empowers/enables us to come when He calls.

 

[atpollard]

[Act 11]
11 "And behold, at that moment three men appeared at the house in which we were staying, having been sent to me from Caesarea. 12 "The Spirit told me to go with them without misgivings. These six brethren also went with me and we entered the man's house. 13 "And he reported to us how he had seen the angel standing in his house, and saying, 'Send to Joppa and have Simon, who is also called Peter, brought here; 14 and he will speak words to you by which you will be saved, you and all your household.' 15 "And as I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell upon them just as He did upon us at the beginning. 16 "And I remembered the word of the Lord, how He used to say, 'John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.' 17 "Therefore if God gave to them the same gift as He gave to us also after believing in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could stand in God's way?" 18 When they heard this, they quieted down and glorified God, saying, "Well then, God has granted to the Gentiles also the repentance that leads to life." [NASB]​

Repentance is part of the gift from God, not a prerequisite for His grace.