Traditions (No. 1) That repentance is a requirement for obtaining eternal life? True or false?

[charity]

Hello there,

Looking through, www.believer.com, a site that I particularly like, I came upon a section on commonly held traditions, in which it discussed, among other traditions, the belief that repentance is a requirement for obtaining eternal life, to which it gave the following response, which is in line with what I too believe, and thought it would be worth considering with you here:-

One of the most common traditions we meet with today is that repentance is a requirement for obtaining eternal life. This has come about because folks have been careless. They equate eternal life with entrance into the kingdom of heaven. When John the Baptist was announcing the kingdom, he called for Israel to repent, or change their minds. And remember that it was Israel's Kingdom and King that was being proclaimed. Later the Lord Himself, along with the 12 and the 70, made the same assertion, Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. On the contrary, when we read John's gospel which is to and for Gentiles after the kingdom was closed to any more members, and which is the only book in the Bible for unbelievers in need of everlasting life, repentance is not mentioned.

Other traditions discussed can be found here:- Believer.comTraditions Examined | Right Division | Teachings You may be interested in discussing those too.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Mungo]

Hello there,

Looking through, www.believer.com, a site that I particularly like, I came upon a section on commonly held traditions, in which it discussed, among other traditions, the belief that repentance is a requirement for obtaining eternal life, to which it gave the following response, which is in line with what I too believe, and thought it would be worth considering with you here:-

​

Other traditions discussed can be found here:- Believer.comTraditions Examined | Right Division | Teachings You may be interested in discussing those too.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

On what basis do you say: "when we read John's gospel which is to and for Gentiles after the kingdom was closed to any more members, and which is the only book in the Bible for unbelievers in need of everlasting life,"

Also what about
Acts 11:15 When they heard this they were silenced. And they glorified God, saying, “Then to the Gentiles also God has granted repentance unto life.”
Acts 17:30 The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all men everywhere to repent,
Acts 2:21 testifying both to Jews and to Greeks of repentance to God and of faith in our Lord Jesus Christ
2 Cor 7:10 For godly grief produces a repentance that leads to salvation and brings no regret, but worldly grief produces death.
2 Pet 3:9 The Lord is not slow about his promise as some count slowness, but is forbearing toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance.

 

[Enoch111]

One of the most common traditions we meet with today is that repentance is a requirement for obtaining eternal life.

This is Satan talking. This is not a "tradition" but Gospel truth. So whenever you see someone bring up "traditions" or "organized religion", it is more than likely that a cultist is on the scene.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Hello there,

Looking through, www.believer.com, a site that I particularly like, I came upon a section on commonly held traditions, in which it discussed, among other traditions, the belief that repentance is a requirement for obtaining eternal life, to which it gave the following response, which is in line with what I too believe, and thought it would be worth considering with you here:-

​

Other traditions discussed can be found here:- Believer.comTraditions Examined | Right Division | Teachings You may be interested in discussing those too.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

hello @charity.

Of course this is only an opinion but I would say yes fully repentance is necessary. Again, only an opinion of what it has come to mean to me. To clarify I’m not meaning a ritual of every day reciting over and over every sin…but a heart changed? A heart changed where what comes out from those changes are genuine and sincere “be you transformed by the renewing of the mind”?

too many scriptures to post but consider what it means to humble yourselves and He will lift you up. Or what it means to be child-line in maliciousness. Or where Paul said he wailed over those who had sinned and not yet repented. You ask a hard question because what is repentance? To say or suggest there doesn’t have to be a change or turning from our own ways toward His way…because of the definition of reciting in emptiness daily as a routine a mantra of flaws, does that definition take away from…there must be a submission to His way as being better than our own ways? Take an apology…where every action contradicts the words spoken in the apology. An apology is given in words only, but the person on the receiving end is baffled because the actions(even the tone) of the words do not line up as being sincerely repentant? The person is asked to receive the apology regardless of whether or not it is an sincere one. How do you know if it is an sincere regret or agreement to the core of that person …and not just, an apology, is what they think will move them past the (inconvenient) hassle and nothing at all has changed? Does that make sense?
1 Corinthians 5:8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

Sincerity?

 

[Enoch111]

Other traditions discussed can be found here:- Believer.comTraditions Examined | Right Division | Teachings You may be interested in discussing those too.

This is not a Bible believers' web site but a cult's. So how come you are posting cultic teachings, Charity? Here is one example: "There is a tradition that immediately when men die they either go to heaven or to hell".

There is absolutely no question that upon death, souls and spirits either go to Heaven or to Hades. But these rascals are denying that. So beware of this deceptive website and do not waste time looking at all their FALSE DOCTRINES. They are all from Satan.

 

[Aunty Jane]

This is not a Bible believers' web site but a cult's. So how come you are posting cultic teachings, Charity? Here is one example: "There is a tradition that immediately when men die they either go to heaven or to hell".

Can you tell me where we can find that information in the Bible, because right from the beginning, Adam was told that he would simply “return to the dust” when he died....there is no mention of heaven or hell which, and if such existed, wouldn’t God have been remiss not to mention the possibility of eternal damnation in hell?

There is absolutely no question that upon death, souls and spirits either go to Heaven or to Hades. But these rascals are denying that. So beware of this deceptive website and do not waste time looking at all their FALSE DOCTRINES. They are all from Satan.

I don’t think you would know a false doctrine or even a true one if you fell over them....you are too busy judging everyone by your own views. You never back up what you say with scripture and we are left with only your stinging opinion. You leave no one with anything to debate.....

 

[Aunty Jane]

Hello there,

Looking through, www.believer.com, a site that I particularly like, I came upon a section on commonly held traditions, in which it discussed, among other traditions, the belief that repentance is a requirement for obtaining eternal life, to which it gave the following response, which is in line with what I too believe, and thought it would be worth considering with you here:-

​

Other traditions discussed can be found here:- Believer.comTraditions Examined | Right Division | Teachings You may be interested in discussing those too.

Except for a few minor points, I agree with what this site reveals....how refreshing to know that other Christians actually expose these false traditions and acknowledge these truths. (Matthew 15:7-9)

 

[marks]

I don’t think you would know a false doctrine or even a true one if you fell over them....you are too busy judging everyone by your own views. You never back up what you say with scripture and we are left with only your stinging opinion.

I think you've just swept yourself up in the same net.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Looking through, www.believer.com, a site that I particularly like,

I see they are dispensational. Naturally!

Much love!

 

[Hidden In Him]

On what basis do you say: "when we read John's gospel which is to and for Gentiles after the kingdom was closed to any more members, and which is the only book in the Bible for unbelievers in need of everlasting life,"

I found that an odd statement as well. When has the kingdom of Heaven been closed to any more members?

 

[Wynona]

But...repentance is required!

 

[Cassandra]

But...repentance is required!

Yep! How would someone change, unless they were truly sorry?

 

[charity]

On what basis do you say: "when we read John's gospel which is to and for Gentiles after the kingdom was closed to any more members, and which is the only book in the Bible for unbelievers in need of everlasting life,"

Also what about
Acts 11:15 When they heard this they were silenced. And they glorified God, saying, “Then to the Gentiles also God has granted repentance unto life.”
Acts 17:30 The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all men everywhere to repent,
Acts 2:21 testifying both to Jews and to Greeks of repentance to God and of faith in our Lord Jesus Christ
2 Cor 7:10 For godly grief produces a repentance that leads to salvation and brings no regret, but worldly grief produces death.
2 Pet 3:9 The Lord is not slow about his promise as some count slowness, but is forbearing toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance.

Hello @Mungo,

The Kingdom is in abeyance now, with the departure of Israel into the darkness of unbelief at Acts 28:25-28, and salvation has been sent to the Gentiles (v.28). The covenant with it's blessings all await a future day, the day when Israel come to repentance, and take up their role as Priests unto God among the nations.

The Church which is the Body of Christ is being called out today, the knowledge of which is made known by Paul in his later epistles (Eph. Phil. Col. 1 & 2 Timothy, Titus and Philemon). Christ in or among us is now our hope of glory.

John's gospel is the vehicle through which so many have come to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, It was written 'That ye may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and believing may have life through His Name.'

Christ is now the Head of the Church which is His Body, and He in us is our hope of glory.

Praise His Holy Name!

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[charity]

hello @charity.

Of course this is only an opinion but I would say yes fully repentance is necessary. Again, only an opinion of what it has come to mean to me. To clarify I’m not meaning a ritual of every day reciting over and over every sin…but a heart changed? A heart changed where what comes out from those changes are genuine and sincere “be you transformed by the renewing of the mind”?

too many scriptures to post but consider what it means to humble yourselves and He will lift you up. Or what it means to be child-line in maliciousness. Or where Paul said he wailed over those who had sinned and not yet repented. You ask a hard question because what is repentance? To say or suggest there doesn’t have to be a change or turning from our own ways toward His way…because of the definition of reciting in emptiness daily as a routine a mantra of flaws, does that definition take away from…there must be a submission to His way as being better than our own ways? Take an apology…where every action contradicts the words spoken in the apology. An apology is given in words only, but the person on the receiving end is baffled because the actions(even the tone) of the words do not line up as being sincerely repentant? The person is asked to receive the apology regardless of whether or not it is an sincere one. How do you know if it is an sincere regret or agreement to the core of that person …and not just, an apology, is what they think will move them past the (inconvenient) hassle and nothing at all has changed? Does that make sense?
1 Corinthians 5:8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

Sincerity?

Hello @VictoryinJesus,

With respect, I believe that the Holy Spirit does indeed bring us to repentance, it is His work and He will do it, but it is all part of the salvation process, and faith can enter before repentance comes as a work in the heart. The work in the heart secures the believer in Christ Jesus, through faith in His work of redemption. Repentance is not a pre-requisite for salvation.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[charity]

This is not a Bible believers' web site but a cult's. So how come you are posting cultic teachings, Charity? Here is one example: "There is a tradition that immediately when men die they either go to heaven or to hell".

There is absolutely no question that upon death, souls and spirits either go to Heaven or to Hades. But these rascals are denying that. So beware of this deceptive website and do not waste time looking at all their FALSE DOCTRINES. They are all from Satan.

Hello @Enoch111,

That is an accusation which is extremely serious. I think that you should be very careful to be sure of your ground before you make such an accusation. I know that what you say is untrue. I share their view in regard to the example you have given, so are you going to tar me with the same brush? They do not declare false doctrines as you assert.

I appreciate the love that lies behind the warning, but I do not share your concern.

May God give grace
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[charity]

I found that an odd statement as well. When has the kingdom of Heaven been closed to any more members?

Hello @Hidden In Him,

Please read my response to Mungo.

It is not the gospel of the Kingdom that saved you and me, @Hidden In Him: but the gospel of the grace of God. The gospel of the Kingdom of God will again be preached at the end of the age, when the door to that Kingdom will again be open: but during this period it is the Church which is the Body of Christ that is being called out. Read Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, 1 & 2 Timothy and Titus, the later epistles of Paul, in which He makes known what is the hope of this calling, and the inheritance awaiting it, in Christ Jesus it's Head.

The Kingdom which is of Heaven is in abeyance now, following the departure of Israel into the blindness of unbelief, so are the covenants and the blessings associated with it. It is Christ in or among us which is our hope of glory now - In Christ Jesus our Lord.

Praise God!

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[farouk]

hello @charity.

Of course this is only an opinion but I would say yes fully repentance is necessary. Again, only an opinion of what it has come to mean to me. To clarify I’m not meaning a ritual of every day reciting over and over every sin…but a heart changed? A heart changed where what comes out from those changes are genuine and sincere “be you transformed by the renewing of the mind”?

too many scriptures to post but consider what it means to humble yourselves and He will lift you up. Or what it means to be child-line in maliciousness. Or where Paul said he wailed over those who had sinned and not yet repented. You ask a hard question because what is repentance? To say or suggest there doesn’t have to be a change or turning from our own ways toward His way…because of the definition of reciting in emptiness daily as a routine a mantra of flaws, does that definition take away from…there must be a submission to His way as being better than our own ways? Take an apology…where every action contradicts the words spoken in the apology. An apology is given in words only, but the person on the receiving end is baffled because the actions(even the tone) of the words do not line up as being sincerely repentant? The person is asked to receive the apology regardless of whether or not it is an sincere one. How do you know if it is an sincere regret or agreement to the core of that person …and not just, an apology, is what they think will move them past the (inconvenient) hassle and nothing at all has changed? Does that make sense?
1 Corinthians 5:8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

Sincerity?

@VictoryinJesus Paul has a treatise on repentance in Romans 2, linked with the very goodness of God...

 

[Cristo Rei]

Unless you believe in predestination then repentance is a requirement for salvation I think

 

[Enoch111]

They do not declare false doctrines as you assert.

You have already given us two glaring examples of their false doctrines:
1. Repentance is NOT necessary for salvation.
2. Souls and spirits do NOT go to either Heaven or Hell (Hades) after they die.

So do we need to dredge up all their other false teaching to expose them as a cult? Here are a few more doozies:

3.Denying that Elijah went to Heaven when the Bible plainly says so
"There is an old tradition that Elijah went up to heaven in a chariot of fire."

4. Denying that there is a literal eternal torment in Hell, when the Bible plainly says so:
"There is a tradition that there is eternal conscious torment in hell awaiting the unbeliever"

5. Denying that the Second Death is eternal separation from God, when the Bible plainly says so:
"There is a tradition that death is simply a separation from God. Also coupled with this is the idea that those who do not believe will be forever separated from God."

So what we have here are cultists trying to pass themselves off as Bible believers with their false website name, and trying to deceive and mislead Christians.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Hello @Hidden In Him,

Please read my response to Mungo.

It is not the gospel of the Kingdom that saved you and me, @Hidden In Him: but the gospel of the grace of God.

Well, i read through your response to Mungo and I actually have no problem with any of that. But the above response to me doesn't ring true. I got saved by simply coming into relationship with the Lord Jesus Christ and then making Him Lord over my life. I entered into increasing obedience to Him as Lord, and in so doing, I was perfectly comfortable with both the gospel of grace and the gospel of the kingdom. Neither were preached to me but I read both in the Bible, and I really never saw a difference between the two in practical terms. We receive His grace to enter the kingdom, and in so doing we enter under His Lordship, with the price for our sins having been paid by the spotless Lamb.

The gospel of the Kingdom of God will again be preached at the end of the age

See, here is my problem with separating the two gospels: The kingdom of God is here now. The millennial reign will just be a physical manifestation of it, but the simple fact that you and I are here as believers today means that the kingdom of God is already here in a sense. So I have a hard time separating them out into two different gospels.

The Kingdom which is of Heaven is in abeyance now, following the departure of Israel into the blindness of unbelief, so are the covenants and the blessings associated with it.

Now this is a very confusing statement, and it does trouble me a little like it apparently does Enoch exactly where some of this stuff could be coming from. But the kingdom of Heaven is alive and well right now, and everyone departing this world in Christ is heading immediately there to begin experiencing their eternal reward, and eternal life in Him. I don't know what to make of your leading statement here, but like the one about the kingdom of Heaven being closed, I am kinda afraid to ask.

Don't think I'm rejecting you over any of this, but I'm not sure I wanna know what you are into with all this stuff. It sounds theologically a little disturbing to me, and I fear taking a good look at that link because it may make me even more concerned.

God bless,
- H