True Trinity.

[101G]

Jesus is called a mighty God and he is, but he isn't ever called the Almighty God. At Isaiah 10:21Jehovah is referred to as “mighty God,” just as Jesus is in Isaiah 9:6; but only Jehovah is ever called “God Almighty.”—Gen. 17:1.

don't mean to get into your conversation with JBF, but your assertion above must be challenge, scripture,
Revelation 1:8 "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty". is this not the Lord Jesus? yes, well he's the "ALMIGHTY".

PICJAG.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

By the way Jane what doctrine you hold concering the Godhead? since you said that you're not a Trinitarian.

PICJAG,

I and Athanasian Christians (aka Christians that believe the Athanasian Creed) both believe:

Every single word about Christ in the Bible.
The Son of God, Jesus Christ is 100% divine.
The Father is 100% divine.
The Holy Spirit is 100% divine.
The Father, Son, and Spirit are all without beginning nor end.
The Father is not the Son, nor vice verse. Christ doesn’t pray to Himself. Neither of them are the Spirit. They are 3 different persons.
The Father, Son, and Spirit together are 1 God (are monotheists).
Christ was/is the great I Am, the Only Begotten Son of God.
Christ was one with the Father before the Earth was created. He then created the Earth, was born of a virgin, lived a mortal life with lots of suffering, took the world’s sins upon Himself, died on a cross, rose again on the 3rdday, later rose to heaven, and is coming back again.

The difference comes in:
I believe that the Father, Son, and Spirit are 1 God through unity.
Athanasian Christians believe that the Father, Son, and Spirit are 1 God through consubstantiation (Consubstantiality - Wikipedia).

What difference does this make in the day to day:
Not much. Realistically, a lot of people sitting in Trinitarians pews have never even heard of the Athanasian Creed. This is a level of deeper theology which doesn’t really affect day-to-day.

 

[justbyfaith]

First thanks for the reply. I do really mean that. second, NO, it's just trinity, you can drop the "TRUE" because,

1 Timothy 6:16 "Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen".

that right there eliminated any trinity, "TRUE" or "False".

unless you have something that contridict this scripture.

PICJAG.

The Father is an eternal Spirit and not a created being. Therefore He does not need immortality. His nature is eternal rather than everlasting.

However, He became a Man; took on human flesh, even a created nature: and Jesus Christ, who is the Father come in human flesh, will in fact live forever in His created human body. Thus He has immortality as a created being. For He was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; while in His Spirit and in His Deity He remains uncreated. In His human nature His nature is everlasting rather than eternal; while His Spirit is the eternal Spirit.

 

[justbyfaith]

@BARNEY BRIGHT,

You must consider that there is one Lord (Ephesians 4:5, 1 Corinthians 8:6);

and that this Lord is the Father (Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21);

While no one can say that Jesus is the Lord except by the Holy Ghost (1 Corinthians 12:3 (kjv)).

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

justbyfaith quoted Isaiah 9:6,7
unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, the everlasting Father, The Prince of peace. Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.[/Quote\]

How Jesus is our Everlasting Father: Adam the first man was the father Jehovah God provided back there in the garden of Eden. But that father brought death upon all of us his children by not staying perfect and entitled to life. He broke his Creator’s command and law. So Adam proved to be a death-giver, not a life-giver for us. He died because of his sin. All the generations of his offspring have died one after the other, and we are dying. So Adam did not become our everlasting father. The one whom our Creator provides is his own living Son, Jesus Christ, who died as a perfect man for us but who now lives as an immortal spirit in his original heavenly home. “It is even so written: ‘The first man Adam became a living soul.’ The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.” (1 Cor. 15:45) On earth Jesus Christ was a Jew by nationality, and the Jews were separated from the other nations by their God-given law. But Jesus fulfilled the purpose of that law. By dying as a sacrifice, not for Jews only but for all mankind, he took away the division between Jew and every other nation. He made it possible for people of all nations to become Christians and become one flock in the united worship of the one God, Jehovah.—Eph. 2:11-19.
In the coming new world Jesus will become the immortal father of all mankind to give them perfect human life on a paradise earth. By being born as a perfect human and sacrificing his human life as a High Priest he heals the breach between us and our Creator. Just as all mankind are now one flesh and family because of coming from the first man Adam, so all rescued mankind will become one in the new world because of becoming children of the Governor and Prince of Peace, the “Everlasting Father.” His own Father is God the Creator. Through Jesus, therefore, all saved mankind will have one Grand Father or Great Father, Jehovah.

Jesus is called a mighty God and he is, but he isn't ever called the Almighty God. At Isaiah 10:21Jehovah is referred to as “mighty God,” just as Jesus is in Isaiah 9:6; but only Jehovah is ever called “God Almighty.”—Gen. 17:1.

If a certain title or descriptive phrase is found in more than one location in the Scriptures, it should never hastily be concluded that it must always refer to the same person. Such reasoning would lead to the conclusion that Nebuchadnezzar was Jesus Christ, because both were called “king of kings” (Dan. 2:37; Rev. 17:14); and that Jesus’ disciples were actually Jesus Christ, because both were called “the light of the world.” (Matt. 5:14; John 8:12) We should always consider the context and any other instances in the Bible where the same expression occurs.

How Jesus is our Lord- while on earth, Jesus Christ referred to himself as “Lord of the sabbath.” (Mt 12:8) Appropriately, he used the Sabbath for doing the work commanded by his heavenly Father. That work included healing the sick. (Compare Mt 8:16, 17.) Jesus knew that the Mosaic Law, with its Sabbath requirement, was “a shadow of the good things to come.” (Heb 10:1) In connection with those “good things to come,” there is a sabbath of which he is to be the Lord.

Jesus said: “You address me, ‘Teacher,’ and, ‘Lord,’ and you speak rightly, for I am such.” (Joh 13:13) As his disciples, these apostles were his learners, or pupils. Thus he was their Lord, or Master.

Especially after Jesus’ death and resurrection did his title Lord take on great significance. By means of his sacrificial death, he purchased his followers, this making him their Owner. (Joh 15:13, 14; 1Co 7:23; 2Pe 2:1; Jude 4;Re 5:9, 10) He was also their King and Bridegroom to whom they were subject as their Lord. (Ac 17:7; Eph 5:22-27; compare Joh 3:28, 29; 2Co 11:2; Re 21:9-14.) When Jehovah rewarded his Son for faithfulness to the point of dying a shameful death on a stake, he “exalted him to a superior position and kindly gave him the name that is above every other name, so that in the name of Jesus every knee should bend of those in heaven and those on earth and those under the ground, and every tongue should openly acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father.” (Php 2:9-11) Acknowledgment of Jesus Christ as Lord means more than simply calling him “Lord.” It requires that an individual recognize Jesus’ position and follow a course of obedience. (Compare Joh 14:21.) As Jesus himself said: “Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the kingdom of the heavens, but the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will.”—Mt 7:21.

Jehovah God also granted immortality to his faithful Son. Therefore, although many men have ruled as kings or lords, only Jesus Christ, the “King of kings and Lord of lords,” has immortality.—1Ti 6:14-16; Re 19:16.

Since Jesus has the keys of death and Hades (Re 1:17, 18), he is in position to release mankind from the common grave (Joh 5:28, 29) and from the death inherited from Adam. (Ro 5:12, 18) He is therefore also the ‘Lord over the dead,’ including King David, one of his earthly ancestors.—Ac 2:34-36; Ro 14:9.

 

[justbyfaith]

There is one Lord (Ephesians 4:5, 1 Corinthians 8:6).

Therefore if Jesus is the Lord, He is the one Lord.

The scripture declares that the Father is the Lord (Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21).

And Jesus is the Lord (1 Corinthians 8:6, 1 Corinthians 12:3, Philippians 2:10-11).

 

[101G]

I and Athanasian Christians (aka Christians that believe the Athanasian Creed) both believe:

Every single word about Christ in the Bible.
The Son of God, Jesus Christ is 100% divine.
The Father is 100% divine.
The Holy Spirit is 100% divine.
The Father, Son, and Spirit are all without beginning nor end.
The Father is not the Son, nor vice verse. Christ doesn’t pray to Himself. Neither of them are the Spirit. They are 3 different persons.
The Father, Son, and Spirit together are 1 God (are monotheists).
Christ was/is the great I Am, the Only Begotten Son of God.
Christ was one with the Father before the Earth was created. He then created the Earth, was born of a virgin, lived a mortal life with lots of suffering, took the world’s sins upon Himself, died on a cross, rose again on the 3rdday, later rose to heaven, and is coming back again.

The difference comes in:
I believe that the Father, Son, and Spirit are 1 God through unity.
Athanasian Christians believe that the Father, Son, and Spirit are 1 God through consubstantiation (Consubstantiality - Wikipedia).

What difference does this make in the day to day:
Not much. Realistically, a lot of people sitting in Trinitarians pews have never even heard of the Athanasian Creed. This is a level of deeper theology which doesn’t really affect day-to-day.

First, thanks for the reply and the explination. second, do you stand only on this belief, based on scripture? if so good, then, for ------- I have a few questions that I want to be clear about. not for argument, but for discussion.

and yes, this is the first time hearing of this version of the trinity, "we learn something new every day".

if you don't mind I'm copying this for future references.

and again thank you.
PICJAG.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

justbyfaith quoted:
1 Corinthians 8:6, But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.[/Quote\]

The person who became known as Jesus Christ did not begin life here on earth. He himself spoke of his prehuman heavenly life. (Joh 3:13;6:38, 62; 8:23, 42, 58) John 1:1, 2 gives the heavenly name of the one who became Jesus, saying: “In the beginning the Word [Gr., Loʹgos] was, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god [“was divine,” AT; Mo; or “of divine being,” Böhmer; Stage (both German)]. This one was in the beginning with God.” Since Jehovah is eternal and had no beginning (Ps 90:2; Re 15:3), the Word’s being with God from “the beginning” must here refer to the beginning of Jehovah’s creative works. This is confirmed by other texts identifying Jesus as “the firstborn of all creation,” “the beginning of the creation by God.” (Col 1:15; Re 1:1; 3:14) Thus the Scriptures identify the Word (Jesus in his prehuman existence) as God’s first creation, his firstborn Son.

That Jehovah was truly the Father or Life-Giver to this firstborn Son and, hence, that this Son was actually a creature of God is evident from Jesus’ own statements. He pointed to God as the Source of his life, saying, “I live because of the Father.” According to the context, this meant that his life resulted from or was caused by his Father, even as the gaining of life by dying men would result from their faith in Jesus’ ransom sacrifice.—Joh 6:56, 57.

If the estimates of modern-day scientists as to the age of the physical universe are anywhere near correct, Jesus’ existence as a spirit creature began thousands of millions of years prior to the creation of the first human. (Compare Mic 5:2.) This firstborn spirit Son was used by his Father in the creation of all other things. (Joh 1:3; Col 1:16, 17) This would include the millions of other spirit sons of Jehovah God’s heavenly family (Da 7:9, 10; Re 5:11), as well as the physical universe and the creatures originally produced within it. Logically, it was to this firstborn Son that Jehovah said: “Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness.” (Ge 1:26) All these other created things were not only created “through him” but also “for him,” as God’s Firstborn and the “heir of all things.”—Col 1:16; Heb 1:2.

 

[101G]

The Father is an eternal Spirit and not a created being. Therefore He does not need immortality. His nature is eternal rather than everlasting.

However, He became a Man; took on human flesh, even a created nature: and Jesus Christ, who is the Father come in human flesh, will in fact live forever in His created human body. Thus He has immortality as a created being. For He was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; while in His Spirit and in His Deity He remains uncreated. In His human nature His nature is everlasting rather than eternal; while His Spirit is the eternal Spirit.

first thanks for the reply. second, you have a problem then.
#1. you said, "The Father is an eternal Spirit and not a created being. Therefore He does not need immortality. His nature is eternal rather than everlasting". the term "Immortality" means, the ability to live forever; eternal life. Immortality is synonym with, perpetual, and what do you know, it also means Everlasting life. well if what you say is true, (and it's not), and the Father is not the Son then you have two eternal, or "EVERLASTING" beings or Spirits, and according to John 4:24a God is "A" Spirit. which according to you is TWO Spirits. which is polytheism plain and simple. but you have another problem. there is only one Father, not TWO. scripture, OT first. Malachi 2:10 "Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us? why do we deal treacherously every man against his brother, by profaning the covenant of our fathers?". did you not say that the one whom you calls the Father is not the Son? well lets check the record. Micah 5:2 "But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting". well this is speaking of the Lord Jesus, the Son.

so JBF, you now have two "EVERLASTING" .... Fathers, and the bible clearly say it's only one. the bible do not line up with your doctrine. so you know what that means.... but if you have something to counter these scriptures please put them on the table.

but until then you're in polytheism.

PICJAG.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

First, thanks for the reply and the explination. second, do you stand only on this belief, based on scripture? if so good, then, for ------- I have a few questions that I want to be clear about. not for argument, but for discussion.

and yes, this is the first time hearing of this version of the trinity, "we learn something new every day".

if you don't mind I'm copying this for future references.

and again thank you.
PICJAG.

Feel totally free to copy it down.

A quick big picture thing: I'm really big into understand other people (hence why I asked you about your beliefs, honest curiosity) and into discussion things. I'm really not into "debate" which to me... frankly comes off (at best) as pointless ego-centric squabbles.

Now to actually address your question:
I do find scripture to support my views (hence why I have that view), but not solely scripture. God Himself still lives and I'm big on ask Him for His guidance and understanding. I acknowledge that you're really into word-type studies and that's totally chill, but such techniques don't resonate with me personally.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

don't mean to get into your conversation with JBF, but your assertion above must be challenge, scripture,
Revelation 1:8 "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty". is this not the Lord Jesus? yes, well he's the "ALMIGHTY".[/Quote\]

Actually he's not.
Whom does this title properly belong? (1) At Revelation 1:8, its owner is said to be God, the Almighty. In verse 11 according to KJ, that title is applied to one whose description thereafter shows him to be Jesus Christ. But scholars recognize the reference to Alpha and Omega in verse 11 to be spurious, and so it does not appear in RS, NE, JB, NAB, Dy. (2) Many translations of Revelation into Hebrew recognize that the one described in verse 8 is Jehovah, and so they restore the personal name of God there. So the title Alpha and Omega isn't being applied to Jesus it's being applied to his Father and God Jehovah. Which is understandable since the first verse in Revelation 1:1 tells us that this is a revelation from Jesus Christ which God gave him. If Jesus were the Almighty God he wouldn't need anybody to give him any kind of revelation. Almighty God can reveal anything without anyone's help.

 

[justbyfaith]

He pointed to God as the Source of his life, saying, “I live because of the Father.”

You have failed to give a reference for this.

“In the beginning the Word [Gr., Loʹgos] was, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god [“was divine,” AT; Mo; or “of divine being,” Böhmer; Stage (both German)]. This one was in the beginning with God.”

I'm sorry but I hold to a kjv-superior viewpoint; and therefore I hold that the kjv's rendering of this verse is more accurate.

Not to mention, if your version is inaccurate, you will have hell to pay over having believed it. For Jesus said that unless you believe that He is the great I AM, you will die in your sins (John 8:24).

If I am wrong and you are right, there are no eternal consequences for me, over that I believe the kjv over and above the NeWT. But if I am right and you are wrong, you will die in your sins, over the fact that you believe the NeWT over and above the kjv. Please consider what the scripture says your fate will be:

Mat 13:41, The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
Mat 13:42, And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Mat 13:49, So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just,
Mat 13:50, And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

I believe that this will be the everlasting punishment that is spoken of in Matthew 25:46.

Mat 25:46, And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

In context:

Mat 25:41, Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

 

[justbyfaith]

first thanks for the reply. second, you have a problem then.
#1. you said, "The Father is an eternal Spirit and not a created being. Therefore He does not need immortality. His nature is eternal rather than everlasting". the term "Immortality" means, the ability to live forever; eternal life. Immortality is synonym with, perpetual, and what do you know, it also means Everlasting life. well if what you say is true, (and it's not), and the Father is not the Son then you have two eternal, or "EVERLASTING" beings or Spirits, and according to John 4:24a God is "A" Spirit. which according to you is TWO Spirits. which is polytheism plain and simple. but you have another problem. there is only one Father, not TWO. scripture, OT first. Malachi 2:10 "Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us? why do we deal treacherously every man against his brother, by profaning the covenant of our fathers?". did you not say that the one whom you calls the Father is not the Son? well lets check the record. Micah 5:2 "But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting". well this is speaking of the Lord Jesus, the Son.

so JBF, you now have two "EVERLASTING" .... Fathers, and the bible clearly say it's only one. the bible do not line up with your doctrine. so you know what that means.... but if you have something to counter these scriptures please put them on the table.

but until then you're in polytheism.

PICJAG.

No, I believe in one everlasting Father. He is the same Spirit that inhabiteth eternity, who dwells in the human flesh of Jesus Christ.

Now when I say that the Father is not the Son, I am defining the Son as the human Jesus; as the Father come in human flesh.

His goings forth are indeed from everlasting, before He took on human flesh. Before He was the Son He was the Father, by His experience (while God is outside of time; and therefore "before" and "after" are not things that He is even bound by).

So, the difference between eternal and everlasting: eternal is not bound by time; while everlasting continues to flow forward without ever ending. Jesus being immortal means that He has everlasting life; while the Father being eternal means that He is not subject to time.

 

[justbyfaith]

@BARNEY BRIGHT,

It will not do for you to pick apart the scriptures that I have laid forth in posts #1-#5 one-by-one.

For they are intended to be taken together, as a singular message.

Much of your learning from these messages will come from the biblical hermeneutic found in 1 Corinthians 2:13, if you will learn from them.

1Co 2:13, Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

But if you will not learn from scripture the way that the Holy Ghost teaches, then the following is true of you:

1Co 2:14, But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

 

[Grailhunter]

What is funny is that you guys have stumbled across one the biggest arguments among the early Christians. It is inaccurate to say that at that time, there was something called "Mainstream Christianity, due to the various beliefs that existed before and after the ecumenical councils. These disagreements hindered their efforts to denounce Gnosticism. The facts will escape you, if you do not know the history and evolution of these beliefs.

 

[justbyfaith]

What is funny is that you guys have stumbled across one the biggest arguments among the early Christians. It is inaccurate to say that at that time, there was something called "Mainstream Christianity, due to the various beliefs that existed before and after the ecumenical councils. These disagreements hindered their efforts to denounce Gnosticism. The facts will escape you, if you do not know the history and evolution of these beliefs.

I believe it is important that we derive our doctrine from the holy scriptures.

Understanding the history of how a belief system has developed can be helpful; but not as helpful as going directly to the scriptures.

 

[Grailhunter]

JBF you and I agree that the scriptures are important. Most people on this forum agree that the scriptures are important or they would not be here. So we are not the only ones that think that the scriptures are important.

But there is clearly more than one way to interpret the scriptures and the "hows" and the "whys" those interpretations occurred that have formed our beliefs 2000 years later, can shed some light on a more accurate understanding of the scriptures.

That is up to you....the debates and arguments you see here on this forum is a true testament to this fact. Perpetually chasing their tails and growling at each other as they do. Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye. shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh. findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. lol KJV for ya. You have to care enough to look or you will be one of many that just chase their tails.

 

[101G]

Feel totally free to copy it down.

A quick big picture thing: I'm really big into understand other people (hence why I asked you about your beliefs, honest curiosity) and into discussion things. I'm really not into "debate" which to me... frankly comes off (at best) as pointless ego-centric squabbles.

Now to actually address your question:
I do find scripture to support my views (hence why I have that view), but not solely scripture. God Himself still lives and I'm big on ask Him for His guidance and understanding. I acknowledge that you're really into word-type studies and that's totally chill, but such techniques don't resonate with me personally.

GINOLJC, to all.
First, thanks for your reply. second, no need to debate, nor argue. third, we who trust in the Lord Jesus for our salvation is sure of his promise, that's not going to change. fourth, edification and enlightenment is for our benfit in service to him, the King.

as my motto states at the end of every post, "where there is knowledge, stay not ignorant". as the Lord through his apostle Paul said,
Romans 1:13 "Now I would not have you ignorant, brethren, that oftentimes I purposed to come unto you, (but was let hitherto,) that I might have some fruit among you also, even as among other Gentiles". or 1 Corinthians 12:1 "Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant". the Lord is always telling us not to be "ignorant" of his holy word.

that's why these christian forums or Boards are available to us. so that we can Learn the TRUTH, and no longer walk in DARKNESS. so discussing our Beliefs, (not arguing), but discussing our belifs bring harmony to the body of Christ. there have been many here on this site that has open my eyes to somethings that I didn't know completely before. so as said, no one is above God, we all are learning. some God have given understanding to one in a area, and another, another area. so we all can learn together. but I warn you about me. as the Lord spoke throught the apostle Paul, "I'm all things to all men". meaning, if one wants an intelligent conversatation of anything concering God, I'm Game. but if one wants to go pork, I can slang mud also, without getting dirty. but if one truly seek the truth of God, as said, I'm all in. I can hold an intelligent .... Discussion with anyone who really wants to hold one. but I will not put up with vain babbling.

the only place where I draw the line at is when someone come in with any wind of doctrine, (and they can), and have no scriptural bases for it then I will challenge it. people are tossed to and fro for way too long, as said, "where there is knowledge, stay not ignorant". if one want to stay ignorant, that's their business, (I done). my Job is done in telling you the truth. after that it's on you what you do with the Information. now if one is serious in seeking the truth, GREAT, because all can learn.

so I'm looking forward to hearing and discussing with you your Athanasian beliefs. (as you, I'm curious also of other's belifs).

PICJAG.


"

 

[101G]

Actually he's not.
Whom does this title properly belong? (1) At Revelation 1:8, its owner is said to be God, the Almighty. In verse 11 according to KJ, that title is applied to one whose description thereafter shows him to be Jesus Christ. But scholars recognize the reference to Alpha and Omega in verse 11 to be spurious, and so it does not appear in RS, NE, JB, NAB, Dy. (2) Many translations of Revelation into Hebrew recognize that the one described in verse 8 is Jehovah, and so they restore the personal name of God there. So the title Alpha and Omega isn't being applied to Jesus it's being applied to his Father and God Jehovah. Which is understandable since the first verse in Revelation 1:1 tells us that this is a revelation from Jesus Christ which God gave him. If Jesus were the Almighty God he wouldn't need anybody to give him any kind of revelation. Almighty God can reveal anything without anyone's help.

First thanks for your reply. second, I must challenge your assessment here.
Revelation 1:8 "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

The “Alpha and Omega” is the “ALMIGHTY” right. Now this

Revelation 22:13 "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

So the First and the Last is the Alpha and Omega, who is the “Almighty”, right,
Now who is the “First” and the “Last?” answer,
Revelation 1:17 "And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:
Revelation 1:18 "I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.
So the Lord Jesus is the First and the last, which means he's the Alpha and Omega, which means he the "ALMIGHTY". just trace the Alpha and Omega, and you will come to the end of your search at JESUS.


NEXT, So are you ready to admit that your Jehovah died? Yes or No.

And while we’re at it, the one who is the “Almighty “tasted” death….. say what!, yes, the one whom inhabit “eternity” tasted death. are you crazy 101G? you must be kidding, ……. nope. (smile).

Now, since you used my bible the KJV, likewise I will use your New World Translation. you said, "in Revelation 1:1 tells us that this is a revelation from Jesus Christ which God gave him. If Jesus were the Almighty God he wouldn't need anybody to give him any kind of revelation. Almighty God can reveal anything without anyone's help".

well according to your Bible, (the NWT), in Revelation 1:1 God gave the Lord Jesus the revelation? NO, and here's why. your Jehovah whom you calls the Father is JESUS. now still using your NWT, Revelation 22:6 says, according to the angel, that Jehovah, the God who inspired the prophets sent his angel to John. go and read it. so Jehovah sent the angel, correct, but according to your NWT, right in the same chapter, at verse 16 it says "I JESUS sent my angel". well Barney you have a big problem. if you follow your NWT, the Lord Jesus is the one whom you ignorantly calls Jehovah.

LOOK don't get mad at 101G, he didn't write your NWT. now is not the NWT the bible of the JW? well then your own bible calls the LORD JESUS, the almighty, your Jehovah. please read it for yourself.

now for your other part of your question,"If Jesus were the Almighty God he wouldn't need anybody to give him any kind of revelation. Almighty God can reveal anything without anyone's help".

I'm going to put that reply in a different post from this one. I will edit it from my notes.

Just give me a few good minutes.

PICJAG.


PICJAG

 

[Jane_Doe22]

so I'm looking forward to hearing and discussing with you your Athanasian beliefs. (as you, I'm curious also of other's belifs).

Clarifying here: I do not believe the Athanasian Creed, which is the academic/historical understanding of the historical / Creedal Trinitarian views. I specifically reject this, specifically on the point of *how* three are one.