Unforgiveable Blasphemy?

[mjrhealth]

I do not but you and others claim individual inspiration, guidance and indwelling by the Holy Spirit producing fruits of division, dissent, differences, disputes, confusion and chaos - twinc

Thats the fruit of mens religion, mens wisdom, mens learning, mens understanding, Jesus is not a liar, neither is the Holy Spirit, you too can be led by teh Spirit, but that takes,"faith". Than you too will be mocked by men just as you do us.

(Gal 4:29) But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.

will never change till we are all changed

 

[forrestcupp]

Haha. I don't need to be validated by some random dude on the internet, named twinc. I know I'm a child of God.

 

[kit]

I think this is on topic with the OP, but it might be a little off topic. Sorry in advance if thats the case.

A number of years ago, I was doing church with a group of Christians who used different language then I'd heard before to describe faith. One word that they used frequently, that until then Id only used in the context of its appearance in Scripture was "anointed" as in 'anointed with the Holy Spirit.' Meaning an extra measure of the Spirit, I think. Now, to be clear I do and always have believed in the reality and importance of the indwelling of the Sprit. I just hadn't used some lexicons for discussing it is all. At the time, I found their use of the "anointed" strange and kinda charming - I thought it was used maybe used too loosely and in a rather folksy way that made me chuckle even. Kinda seemed like whoever was the coolest was said to be the most anointed, in some cases.

The Spirit was very active and easily discernible in my church life at this time. My gifts were being used and developed.

I believe that my initial, suspicious, response to the term 'anointed' did have a negative impact on my Christian journey. That maybe some of the Spirits movement in my life was diminished. I sometimes feel that I came dangerously close to blaspheming the Spirit. But at the same time I know in my heart that it was the precepts of the congregations use of the term that I had issue with. And yet things did change in my journey shortly after.

So, well things have improved again since, Im left wondering if it was a psychological hang up I put on myself when I realized my mistake, or if it was a truly spiritual event where I had fell so close to inadvertently questioning the Spirits presence.

 

[APAK]

Thats the fruit of mens religion, mens wisdom, mens learning, mens understanding, Jesus is not a liar, neither is the Holy Spirit, you too can be led by teh Spirit, but that takes,"faith". Than you too will be mocked by men just as you do us.

(Gal 4:29) But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.

will never change till we are all changed

mjrhealth:

To be blunt, let’s face it, ‘the church’ for the Catholics is effectively its leadership only. The lay folks can use the term if they acknowledge who leads it ‘for them.’ This programming is done subtly, over several years of indoctrination, as in a cult. This is what I have experienced and clearly believe.

I remember as a guest of my Dad, I, with my wife at my side, had the audacity to carry in and expose my KJV Bible in their mass service. My mother and two of my sisters fled from my sight to another pew out of respect for ‘the church’ and the priest. This is how the typical Catholic believes, and there is no one, but no one that can change my mind on this point. If another Catholic says otherwise, I would call them a liar. Yes, it did affect me that day, and it showed me once again how evil, disgusting and conniving the leadership of the Catholic religion really is still.

Yes, I also noticed how others in this loving building separated themselves from me, as I toted my KJV Bible with its white cover, the same Bible I got saved with many years back, out of the building. They saw me as clear stranger and kept their distance. My Dad seemed to be embarrassed at this point as he rushed to the car. The sight of me carrying a Bible and then reading from it during their service made many very uncomfortable.

Now back to twinc, I believe he and many others really thinks that the spirit of God can only come to ‘the church’ with the meaning I just stated above, to its leadership and its hierarchy. I believe he means there is no individual contact with the spirit of God. He mostly cannot tell you how and what the spirit of God does when it arrives with the leadership of ‘the church.’ It’s a shame they are utterly confused. This religion is exceedingly gangrenous by the continual egregious lies it feeds its members.

Bless you,

APAK

 

[forrestcupp]

I think this is on topic with the OP, but it might be a little off topic. Sorry in advance if thats the case.

A number of years ago, I was doing church with a group of Christians who used different language then I'd heard before to describe faith. One word that they used frequently, that until then Id only used in the context of its appearance in Scripture was "anointed" as in 'anointed with the Holy Spirit.' Meaning an extra measure of the Spirit, I think. Now, to be clear I do and always have believed in the reality and importance of the indwelling of the Sprit. I just hadn't used some lexicons for discussing it is all. At the time, I found their use of the "anointed" strange and kinda charming - I thought it was used maybe used too loosely and in a rather folksy way that made me chuckle even. Kinda seemed like whoever was the coolest was said to be the most anointed, in some cases.

The Spirit was very active and easily discernible in my church life at this time. My gifts were being used and developed.

I believe that my initial, suspicious, response to the term 'anointed' did have a negative impact on my Christian journey. That maybe some of the Spirits movement in my life was diminished. I sometimes feel that I came dangerously close to blaspheming the Spirit. But at the same time I know in my heart that it was the precepts of the congregations use of the term that I had issue with. And yet things did change in my journey shortly after.

So, well things have improved again since, Im left wondering if it was a psychological hang up I put on myself when I realized my mistake, or if it was a truly spiritual event where I had fell so close to inadvertently questioning the Spirits presence.

Unless your heart was malicious, I'd lean toward it being more of a psychological hangup. If I understand you correctly, you didn't have issues with the anointing, itself, but with people's erroneous use of the term. The anointing is the effective power of God that emanates from the presence of the Holy Spirit. It's a real thing, and it's tangible. But I agree that it's ridiculous how some people misuse something of God to judge how cool someone is by how "anointed" they are.

I was in a meeting once where the leader came in and said, "We're going to see how close to God each of you are, based on how quickly you can get into the presence of God." Immediately after he said that, you wouldn't believe how many people fell on their faces and started weeping on demand. I refused to participate. The anointing is real, and it's precious, and it's ridiculous any time someone uses it as a measuring stick. We aren't supposed to compare ourselves to each other. We're only supposed to compare ourselves to our own potential.

 

[amadeus]

you do deny that where Peter was and is there is the Church - twinc

What does where Peter was have to do with it? He was a man as we are men. He was called to be an apostle. I am not. From what I know about Peter, he was part of the Church. You may be able to add to that, but at the moment I cannot.

 

[amadeus]

When one jumps in a muddy puddle will they not be covered in mud, when one walks in the rain will not one get wet, when one drops a white cloth into a tin of paint will it not become the colour of the paint. What is it people do not understand as it is written

1Co_6:16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.

What a person is now is known only definitely by God. If a Catholic asks me an honest sincere question and really is interested in my point of view I will usually try to answer him. Why is a person a Catholic rather than being something closer to what I am? This is a hypothetical question and I usually don't like hypothetical questions because they often leaving things that are important to God.

I know about me. I could not go back into the Catholic Church in my present frame of mind considering what God has shown me but I cannot really speak for anyone else specifically. God has reasons for doing things which to me may make no sense at all.

You provided a scripture, but how would that apply to Hosea the prophet who was told by God to join himself to a harlot? Has God changed at any time? Was joining yourself to a harlot more acceptable under the law God gave to Moses than it is now for you or for me?

If one desires to become a JW do they not go to a JW church, when one desires to become a Morman do they not go to a morman church. Dont you know the SDA church cannot produce catholics, nor the Anglican church JWs. And so it is, the only way to become a Christian is to go to Christ, There is no other way, none.

1Co 6:17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.

In the OT there were many written black and white laws, but God did some things we might not understand. Was He wrong because we did understand them?

Dont you know what happens to a cup of water if you put a tea bag in it, it eventually becomes saturated, and so it is with religion, the longer you stay joined to it the more like it you will become, we have some wonderful examples of that here on this forum.

You go back and forth between specifics and generalities at time as if there were never any difference. What man is called to do by God is what he needs to do... even if it seems to conflict with my own convictions for myself or what I believe God would want me to do the a similar situation. The problem is that at best the situation is going to be similar. It is not going to be precisely the same because we are different persons with different experience and different callings to the Body of Christ. Not all parts of the Body of Christ have the same function. Not all parts have the same abilities or experiences, and not all parts are at exactly the same level in the walk or growth toward God. How well do we understand the following verse and how well do we apply it?

"For we dare not make ourselves of the number, or compare ourselves with some that commend themselves: but they measuring themselves by themselves, and comparing themselves among themselves, are not wise." II Cor 10:12

Analogies also do not always work or explain things as well as we might like.

 

[mjrhealth]

mjrhealth:

To be blunt, let’s face it, ‘the church’ for the Catholics is effectively its leadership only. The lay folks can use the term if they acknowledge who leads it ‘for them.’ This programming is done subtly, over several years of indoctrination, as in a cult. This is what I have experienced and clearly believe.

I remember as a guest of my Dad, I, with my wife at my side, had the audacity to carry in and expose my KJV Bible in their mass service. My mother and two of my sisters fled from my sight to another pew out of respect for ‘the church’ and the priest. This is how the typical Catholic believes, and there is no one, but no one that can change my mind on this point. If another Catholic says otherwise, I would call them a liar. Yes, it did affect me that day, and it showed me once again how evil, disgusting and conniving the leadership of the Catholic religion really is still.

Yes, I also noticed how others in this loving building separated themselves from me, as I toted my KJV Bible with its white cover, the same Bible I got saved with many years back, out of the building. They saw me as clear stranger and kept their distance. My Dad seemed to be embarrassed at this point as he rushed to the car. The sight of me carrying a Bible and then reading from it during their service made many very uncomfortable.

Now back to twinc, I believe he and many others really thinks that the spirit of God can only come to ‘the church’ with the meaning I just stated above, to its leadership and its hierarchy. I believe he means there is no individual contact with the spirit of God. He mostly cannot tell you how and what the spirit of God does when it arrives with the leadership of ‘the church.’ It’s a shame they are utterly confused. This religion is exceedingly gangrenous by the continual egregious lies it feeds its members.

Bless you,

APAK

Dont have to explain anything to me, i was born and raised a catholic, I seen it from the inside looks even worse from the outside.

 

[twinc]

Dont have to explain anything to me, i was born and raised a catholic, I seen it from the inside looks even worse from the outside.

not ours to reason why - ours to do or die - twinc

 

[kit]

Unless your heart was malicious, I'd lean toward it being more of a psychological hangup. If I understand you correctly, you didn't have issues with the anointing, itself, but with people's erroneous use of the term. The anointing is the effective power of God that emanates from the presence of the Holy Spirit. It's a real thing, and it's tangible. But I agree that it's ridiculous how some people misuse something of God to judge how cool someone is by how "anointed" they are.

I was in a meeting once where the leader came in and said, "We're going to see how close to God each of you are, based on how quickly you can get into the presence of God." Immediately after he said that, you wouldn't believe how many people fell on their faces and started weeping on demand. I refused to participate. The anointing is real, and it's precious, and it's ridiculous any time someone uses it as a measuring stick. We aren't supposed to compare ourselves to each other. We're only supposed to compare ourselves to our own potential.

Thank you for your insights. Yes, I think you are understanding me correctly; its about peoples misuse of the term. I tend to lean towards understanding my experience as a psychological hang up, but its just such a scary thing: "unforgivable." Im encouraged to hear you suggest the psychological answer too. I wouldn't at all say my heart was malicious, but I would say that I hope to never have that attitude ever again. Its tough though because it was rather backwards and very pervasive.

Whoa, that situation at the meeting you shared would sure take me aback too! I have to imagine that those practices are hurting people and damaging faith. I'm blessed by your words "compare ourselves to our own potential" in the Spirit. I will be meditating on that.

 

[amadeus]

not ours to reason why - ours to do or die - twinc

This my friend is certainly so when we have heard from God, but as you have often said, men sometimes mess up even those in high positions in any church group. God does speak through men, but does everyone hear what is being said by God? Does anyone, even such a highly placed person ever speak his own words instead of God's words? How is a person to know if the person himself never hears from God?

 

[twinc]

This my friend is certainly so when we have heard from God, but as you have often said, men sometimes mess up even those in high positions in any church group. God does speak through men, but does everyone hear what is being said by God? Does anyone, even such a highly placed person ever speak his own words instead of God's words? How is a person to know if the person himself never hears from God?

it seems most do not really understand what is being stated at Hebrews 1:1 and also what is not being stated because already stated in the gospels but also not accepted or understood imho - twinc

 

[mjrhealth]

You provided a scripture, but how would that apply to Hosea the prophet who was told by God to join himself to a harlot? Has God changed at any time? Was joining yourself to a harlot more acceptable under the law God gave to Moses than it is now for you or for me?

Hos 1:2 The beginning of the word of the LORD by Hosea. And the LORD said to Hosea, Go, take unto thee a wife of whoredoms and children of whoredoms: for the land hath committed great whoredom, departing from the LORD.

Because God was demonstrating to the people what they where doing, it is still the same now. When a woman is married too one man but shares her bed with another, is she not be unfaithfull?? Are we not married to Christ??

1Co_6:15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.

Our other "friends " on this forum, are the manifestation of teh worst that religion is, teh antichrist spirit, that spirit of religion. Our very loud friend, has become teh church. no longer just a part, he is, the church and has taken on all that she is all the worst traits, all you read about her, he manifests, he cant burn people at teh stake, but he can kill them spiritually as he does, they do.

Who do we want to be identified with, ? how do we know who the catholics are, it is because all they speak is catholism. how do we know the SDAS when they come. because it is all about teh law, if you go start talking to unbelievers about Christ, they say we are religious, you talk to catholics about Christ, they say you are a protestant, most christians say I cant be a christian because i dont fit the worldly mould of what a christian is, but thats fine all that matters is Jesus knows my name.

As long as one remains in church, he will take on some of the traits of that church, good or bad, like I said., one cannot jump into a muddy puddle and not expect to get muddy.

That desert experience, is one we do alone with Christ.

God bless

 

[twinc]

Hos 1:2 The beginning of the word of the LORD by Hosea. And the LORD said to Hosea, Go, take unto thee a wife of whoredoms and children of whoredoms: for the land hath committed great whoredom, departing from the LORD.

Because God was demonstrating to the people what they where doing, it is still the same now. When a woman is married too one man but shares her bed with another, is she not be unfaithfull?? Are we not married to Christ??

1Co_6:15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.

Our other "friends " on this forum, are the manifestation of teh worst that religion is, teh antichrist spirit, that spirit of religion. Our very loud friend, has become teh church. no longer just a part, he is, the church and has taken on all that she is all the worst traits, all you read about her, he manifests, he cant burn people at teh stake, but he can kill them spiritually as he does, they do.

Who do we want to be identified with, ? how do we know who the catholics are, it is because all they speak is catholism. how do we know the SDAS when they come. because it is all about teh law, if you go start talking to unbelievers about Christ, they say we are religious, you talk to catholics about Christ, they say you are a protestant, most christians say I cant be a christian because i dont fit the worldly mould of what a christian is, but thats fine all that matters is Jesus knows my name.

As long as one remains in church, he will take on some of the traits of that church, good or bad, like I said., one cannot jump into a muddy puddle and not expect to get muddy.

That desert experience, is one we do alone with Christ.

God bless

see post 72 - twinc

 

[mjrhealth]

see post 72 - twinc

And that means what....

You know the worst thing about it twinc, is that we are the"women" the bride, Christ is our Husband, when His bride joins to teh harlot church, not only is she being Adulteresses, but she is having an affair with another women, you know what that is, homosexuality.

Rom 1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
Rom 1:22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
Rom 1:23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
Rom 1:24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
Rom 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
Rom 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
Rom 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

Have a blessed day.

 

[amadeus]

Hos 1:2 The beginning of the word of the LORD by Hosea. And the LORD said to Hosea, Go, take unto thee a wife of whoredoms and children of whoredoms: for the land hath committed great whoredom, departing from the LORD.

Because God was demonstrating to the people what they where doing, it is still the same now. When a woman is married too one man but shares her bed with another, is she not be unfaithfull?? Are we not married to Christ??

1Co_6:15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.

Thank you my friend. I quite understand why, but so many do not. They do not understand why God would tell us not to unequally yoke ourselves and then tell a man of God to do just the opposite thing. This is the problem for anyone who simply studies the Bible or a Catechism or a statement of faith without being led by God. I believe we are in agreement on most of this. But... as you well know... for some to even suggest that the Bible itself might ever lead a person astray would cause trouble.

Our other "friends " on this forum, are the manifestation of teh worst that religion is, teh antichrist spirit, that spirit of religion. Our very loud friend, has become teh church. no longer just a part, he is, the church and has taken on all that she is all the worst traits, all you read about her, he manifests, he cant burn people at teh stake, but he can kill them spiritually as he does, they do.

Yes, this is part of what makes it so difficult for anyone who fails to really recognize the difference between the such a façade and someone who is really in love with God.

Who do we want to be identified with, ? how do we know who the catholics are, it is because all they speak is catholism. how do we know the SDAS when they come. because it is all about teh law, if you go start talking to unbelievers about Christ, they say we are religious, you talk to catholics about Christ, they say you are a protestant, most christians say I cant be a christian because i dont fit the worldly mould of what a christian is, but thats fine all that matters is Jesus knows my name.

I guess you missed my point. Sometimes, God, I believe, wants someone on the inside to reflect His real Spirit on some within who would not even look at someone like you or me on the outside seriously for help in the things of God. When I was an active Catholic [until age 18] no person outside that church could have persuaded me to give up Catholicism.

As long as one remains in church, he will take on some of the traits of that church, good or bad, like I said., one cannot jump into a muddy puddle and not expect to get muddy.

That desert experience, is one we do alone with Christ.

God bless

I do agree that for me there is nothing in there [in the RCC]. I would not however go so far as to say that God would not use a person within to accomplish a single significant work with a single person.

My example is me in the place I am now. While the group I am in does much better than so many other organized churches, still I know that I cannot go along with them wholeheartedly. They would stifle me, except for for one thing. My old pastor, now 92 years old needs me. God knows that and my wife knows that. God has required me to stay until my pastor is finally gone from this natural life. That is my present calling... to help just one man. To leave him and my place by his side in his frailty so as help him stand against the opposition that some people present to him would put me out of God's will. My wife knows all of this as well. She stays because I stay, but when he is gone, which will probably be before another year passes... well then we'll see what God would have us do. We certainly are likely to see a radical change. God knows.

Give God the glory![/QUOTE]

 

[Helen]

When one jumps in a muddy puddle will they not be covered in mud, when one walks in the rain will not one get wet, when one drops a white cloth into a tin of paint will it not become the colour of the paint. What is it people do not understand as it is written

1Co_6:16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.

If one desires to become a JW do they not go to a JW church, when one desires to become a Morman do they not go to a morman church. Dont you know the SDA church cannot produce catholics, nor the Anglican church JWs. And so it is, the only way to become a Christian is to go to Christ, There is no other way, none.

1Co 6:17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.

Dont you know what happens to a cup of water if you put a tea bag in it, it eventually becomes saturated, and so it is with religion, the longer you stay joined to it the more like it you will become, we have some wonderful examples of that here on this forum.

Well said.

 

[Helen]

it seems most do not really understand what is being stated at Hebrews 1:1 and also what is not being stated because already stated in the gospels but also not accepted or understood imho - twinc

twinc, I notice that when you say "most do not"...it means anyone but you!!
So, it seems that you know all thing and have all the answers.
Yet mostly all you do is ask questions that you never intend to answer.
I think this Forum is just a playtime hobby for you.

 

[twinc]

twinc, I notice that when you say "most do not"...it means anyone but you!!
So, it seems that you know all thing and have all the answers.
Yet mostly all you do is ask questions that you never intend to answer.
I think this Forum is just a playtime hobby for you.

I said imho it seems most do not - so how about you maybe you think most do or all do except twinc - twinc

 

[Helen]

I said imho it seems most do not - so how about you maybe you think most do or all do except twinc - twinc

You had written that- "most do not know what is being stated in Hebrews 1."

I said that by you saying "most" indicates they we don't, but you do.

It is plain in Heb 1:1 that God used to speak through the prophets, and in verse #2 it says but now God speaks to us through His Son.

So, we agree, right?