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Various Questions

Discussion in 'NonChristian Help Forum' started by Pildit, Feb 20, 2008.

  1. Pildit

    Pildit New Member

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    (Wakka;37310)
    Evolution:1. Where did matter come from?2. Where did space for the universe come from?3. Where did the laws of the universe come from (gravity, inertia, etc.)?4. How did matter get so perfectly organized?5. Where did energy come from to do all of the organizing?6. When, where, why, and how did life come from dead matter?7. Where, when, why, and how did life learn to reproduce itself?8. Is it possible that similarities in design between different animals prove a commmon Creator instead of a common ancestor?
    To sum this up in one sentence: No-one knows how the universe came into existence. We've no idea. We've no evidence at this time. I admit that but this also means that God is just a theory amongst many that has no evidence to prove this is how the universe came into existence. The same applies for the science quote you gave me.The numbers don't add up. Sorry but there is no way without actually being there that you can an accurate probabilty of Jesus been born in bethlehem. Not to mention this could apply to any human being on the planet to some degree.They only calculate on the facts given in the bible.How likely is it that an author writing a story, when he has a character suggest or state something early in the book... he has some event or character fulfill this later in the book. Very likely I would think.Furthermore it doesn't prove the existence of God.
    This scripture dating from way before the crucifixion details Christ's death. And we all know that Christ did die on the cross, and that he was real.
    Read above.
     
  2. Pildit

    Pildit New Member

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    I didn't say it would solve all their problems or yours but talking to Him would be the beginning. You must make that step. Why would talking to your Father and asking Him to help a friend be deceiving them? You aren't making promises....they aren't yours to give.
    Because they think I'm helping and I'm not. They think that pray has worked for me before. I've prayed, cried and begged for things before to God and nothing.
    Many things have been spoken and written Pildit but you should put your trust in no man :naughty:. Even if it sounds intelligent, wonderful, inspiring....."Take heed that ye be not deceived:" [Luke 21:8]
    My point being, that the bible is a book... written by someone and therefore it isn't any mircle that something mentioned earlier in it, happens later in it.Frankly and I mean no offense in saying this, the "trust no man" policy is scary, it's like saying stick your fingers in your ears, don't listen because what they say might make sense to you and you'll stray. It's like keeping reigns on people. It's quite scary.
    The first prophecy of Gen. 3:15 was laying out the whole story of what will be. And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her Seed; It shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise His heel."In the beginning two lines were begun in this world. That of Christ and that of Satan. Eve was the mother of both lines but with different fathers. The line of Satan continues today through Cain, just as the line of Adam through Seth. That is THE CONTROVERSY. That is why we are here. We must make a decision on following her Seed (Christ), or Satan's seed.As is written....God placed "enmity" between the two lines and that struggle continues today and shall until He arrives again. Satan bruised the heel of Christ on the cross but Christ will bruise the head of Satan and that is a killing blow.......Whirlwind
    See above.
     
  3. whirlwind

    whirlwind New Member

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    Because they think I'm helping and I'm not. They think that pray has worked for me before. I've prayed, cried and begged for things before to God and nothing.
    As I said before....it isn't necessary to tell them you pray for them. Also things you ask for may not be in the cards for you. Always pray in His will, that His will be done, because He knows the overall plan and where you fit into it.
    My point being, that the bible is a book... written by someone and therefore it isn't any mircle that something mentioned earlier in it, happens later in it.
    Pildit....the Bible is not a "book." It is the divine Word of God. It took 1600 years from the start to the finish with the same theme running throughout. Forty different men wrote sixty-six different books and the message is the same. It is not just a book. :bible:
    Frankly and I mean no offense in saying this, the "trust no man" policy is scary, it's like saying stick your fingers in your ears, don't listen because what they say might make sense to you and you'll stray. It's like keeping reigns on people. It's quite scary.
    It should not be frightening at all. By "listen to no man" what Christ meant is always test it against His Word. That Word will guide you in all things. If someone gives you some new teaching they should always show you where it is written....if they can't document what they teach then "listen to no man." There are many false teachers and churches out there and they can't wait to mislead you but He will "never leave you nor forsake you," because He is the Word. We always have His Word.It is up to you to partake of that food He offers in what you term as a "book." There is milk for those like you that are just learning and there is meat when you are ready. As you study, if you study, you will see that there are different levels to His Word. When you can digest that stronger food it is there waiting for you. :study:.......Whirlwind
     
  4. Pildit

    Pildit New Member

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    As I said before....it isn't necessary to tell them you pray for them. Also things you ask for may not be in the cards for you. Always pray in His will, that His will be done, because He knows the overall plan and where you fit into it.
    Then there's no point in praying because God will have his will anyway.
    Pildit....the Bible is not a "book." It is the divine Word of God. It took 1600 years from the start to the finish with the same theme running throughout. Forty different men wrote sixty-six different books and the message is the same. It is not just a book. :bible:
    Something been written over a number of years by different people and the message being the same, doesn't make it a miracle. Don't forget, all or the vast majority of people who wrote this book already had the belief and they could still read what had been written before, and fulfill things just so.By all means there is some great advice in the bible and I don't mean to undermine it's significance in religion, but I still have two bibles, both have pages, a cover, stories within them... both are mass produced. It's a book and from this perspective, like I said... written before, fulfilled afterwards in writing... isn't so impressive.
    It should not be frightening at all. By "listen to no man" what Christ meant is always test it against His Word. That Word will guide you in all things. If someone gives you some new teaching they should always show you where it is written....if they can't document what they teach then "listen to no man." There are many false teachers and churches out there and they can't wait to mislead you but He will "never leave you nor forsake you," because He is the Word. We always have His Word.
    Science is documented, but if it doesn't agree with religion then it becomes evil.I'm aware that different churches teach different things and yes I can understand where some must be wrong in their teachings, this is one of the reasons I never attended church regularly, but it seems this gets expanded into something like "don't take any notice of ANYTHING except the bible", not just in a church sense but to anything in life.
    It is up to you to partake of that food He offers in what you term as a "book." There is milk for those like you that are just learning and there is meat when you are ready. As you study, if you study, you will see that there are different levels to His Word. When you can digest that stronger food it is there waiting for you. :study:
    Like I've said before, I've read the Bible a fair bit. It has some nice stories and some great teachings for life in general.I even started to study it. I started with Pslams as I could start with shorter things to see how it worked out. I'd write it out, list the words I wasn't sure of and look them up in the dictionary, write their meaning down, then re-read it with my better understanding of the words. Then write down a summary of what it was saying, then think through what was supposed to be learnt from it.
     
  5. Pildit

    Pildit New Member

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    Another question:So I think I gather that first millenium all those who believe, are good... in the end go to heaven. Then those who don't believe but who lived a good life, then known God and Jesus are real and then have to live out another 1000 years within rules and righteousness, etc and believe in Jesus and all before they die in order to get into Heaven. (Excuse the sloppy summary but you get my point)What about those that die before the millenium has ended?
     
  6. Wakka

    Wakka Super Member

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    To sum this up in one sentence: No-one knows how the universe came into existence. We've no idea. We've no evidence at this time.
    We do know that God is real. YOU don't know, because you have never experienced Him. You're still blind from the truth.
     
  7. whirlwind

    whirlwind New Member

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    Then there's no point in praying because God will have his will anyway.
    God will have His way. It is His way to have. The "point" in praying is not to ask for things. It is to talk to Him, to thank Him for what He has already given you, to ask for understanding and knowledge that will enable you to help others.11 Chronicles 1:11 And God said to Solomon, "Because this was in thine heart, and thou hast not asked riches, wealth, or honour, nor the life of thine enemies, neither yet hast asked long life; but hast asked wisdom and knowledge for thyself, that thou mayest judge My People, over whom I have made thee king:Proverbs 8:10 Receive my instruction, and not silver; And knowledge rather than choice gold.11.For wisdom is better than rubies; And all the things that may be desired are not to be compared to it.17.I love them that love me; And those that seek me early shall find me.
    Something been written over a number of years by different people and the message being the same, doesn't make it a miracle. Don't forget, all or the vast majority of people who wrote this book already had the belief and they could still read what had been written before, and fulfill things just so.By all means there is some great advice in the bible and I don't mean to undermine it's significance in religion, but I still have two bibles, both have pages, a cover, stories within them... both are mass produced. It's a book and from this perspective, like I said... written before, fulfilled afterwards in writing... isn't so impressive.
    Proverbs 18:2 A fool hath no delight in understanding, But that his heart may discover itself.11 Timothy 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.16. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
    Science is documented, but if it doesn't agree with religion then it becomes evil.I'm aware that different churches teach different things and yes I can understand where some must be wrong in their teachings, this is one of the reasons I never attended church regularly, but it seems this gets expanded into something like "don't take any notice of ANYTHING except the bible", not just in a church sense but to anything in life.
    The science that is documented, such as the age of the earth, doesn't disagree with the Bible at all. Our earth is ancient. The "theory" of evolution however is just that...a theory and a truly flimsy one at that.No one, at least from this side of the key board, is telling you not to notice anything except the Bible. What I have said is when you are learning about Him always document it with His Word. Don't be misled.
    Like I've said before, I've read the Bible a fair bit. It has some nice stories and some great teachings for life in general.I even started to study it. I started with Pslams as I could start with shorter things to see how it worked out. I'd write it out, list the words I wasn't sure of and look them up in the dictionary, write their meaning down, then re-read it with my better understanding of the words. Then write down a summary of what it was saying, then think through what was supposed to be learnt from it.
    That sounds like a good plan Pildit:proverbs 30:5 Every word of God is pure: He is a shield unto them that put their trust in Him.......Whirlwind
     
  8. helenp19

    helenp19 New Member

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    Hi,I have a friend like you. She's a scientist and cannot believe in God, instead she believes in Science. Christianity and Science are not mutually exclusive from another. You don't have to make a choice between the two - science explains how the world is made, thats all. Lets take the Darwin Theory for an example - so we were all fish, and before that? and before that? maybe you could trace it right down to a couple of atoms that bonded with each other. so who/what put the atoms there? was it the big bang? so who/what created the big bang? another universe? so who/what created the other universe? At the end of it all you must acknowledge that someone, somewhere, created something. re: homosexuals. i can't vouch for God as only He knows why he doesn't like it, but in my view, if we were all gay then the human race would end, and maybe thats why God doesn't like it?suffering: is it really God's doing? Are you sure it wasn't caused by your or another human's sin? miracles: you are asking people a very personal question there. God rescued me from a situation where I was going to be murdered. It wasn't my time to go and He delivered me.i am the stage where i am always asking questions. at first I started questioning it as I had so many questions. After answering the initial questions I now have a whole load more, but its not as to the validity of Jesus, its more to do with why? I would highly recommend that you read the Bible. The more you read the more impressed you are with it. Do that, before you write it off completely. At least then you will have weighed up both arguments and made a valid decision. You will also understand the comments you have read on here, ie there are only 2 routes - believing or not believing.I wish you well and truly hope that you search the answers for yourself. Please please please just open your mind. The problem with you and my friend is that you are looking for short answers to kind of 'pigeon hole' the question - unfortunately this is a trait in sicentists (I think!) you kind of do an experiment, predict the outcome, then look at the results and come to a conclusion. the answer is in fact a whole lot deeper than that and cannot be treated like an experiment.i hope i haven't offended as i really don't mean to. i'm just trying to help. good luck.
     
  9. Pildit

    Pildit New Member

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    We do know that God is real. YOU don't know, because you have never experienced Him. You're still blind from the truth.
    You know. I understand what you think is truth. But you don't understand what I want/need in terms of evidence. So I think unless you have anything else to say, we've come to a stand still.
     
  10. Pildit

    Pildit New Member

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    11 Chronicles 1:11 And God said to Solomon, "Because this was in thine heart, and thou hast not asked riches, wealth, or honour, nor the life of thine enemies, neither yet hast asked long life; but hast asked wisdom and knowledge for thyself, that thou mayest judge My People, over whom I have made thee king:Proverbs 8:10 Receive my instruction, and not silver; And knowledge rather than choice gold.11.For wisdom is better than rubies; And all the things that may be desired are not to be compared to it.17.I love them that love me; And those that seek me early shall find me.Proverbs 18:2 A fool hath no delight in understanding, But that his heart may discover itself.11 Timothy 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.16. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:The science that is documented, such as the age of the earth, doesn't disagree with the Bible at all. Our earth is ancient. The "theory" of evolution however is just that...a theory and a truly flimsy one at that.
    But religion is also just a theory. Given that a theory is something that is not (yet) proven.
    No one, at least from this side of the key board, is telling you not to notice anything except the Bible. What I have said is when you are learning about Him always document it with His Word. Don't be misled.
    I didn't mean you personally. I just meant from all the answers I'm getting collectively. This is how it comes across. Apologises.
     
  11. Pildit

    Pildit New Member

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    (helenp19;37456)
    Hi,I have a friend like you. She's a scientist and cannot believe in God, instead she believes in Science. Christianity and Science are not mutually exclusive from another. You don't have to make a choice between the two - science explains how the world is made, thats all. Lets take the Darwin Theory for an example - so we were all fish, and before that? and before that? maybe you could trace it right down to a couple of atoms that bonded with each other. so who/what put the atoms there? was it the big bang? so who/what created the big bang? another universe? so who/what created the other universe? At the end of it all you must acknowledge that someone, somewhere, created something.
    I already addressed this. Please read previous posts.
    re: homosexuals. i can't vouch for God as only He knows why he doesn't like it, but in my view, if we were all gay then the human race would end, and maybe thats why God doesn't like it?
    The flaw with that theory being though that we aren't all gay. I asked this question to homosexuals... I asked if it was a choice, they said if a person really was homosexual it wasn't a choice, just how they were. I have no doubt that there's people who choose it, but for the majority that don't well they were born that way.
    suffering: is it really God's doing? Are you sure it wasn't caused by your or another human's sin?
    Notice how I used the word "allow". Maybe it's God. I don't know. I do like to think people have the freewill to make choices on their own, of course some of those are bad ones so hence I used the word "allow".
    miracles: you are asking people a very personal question there. God rescued me from a situation where I was going to be murdered. It wasn't my time to go and He delivered me.
    Miracles may come into a personal experience for someone and if you or anyone else doesn't want to share it for that reason then I understand that.
    i am the stage where i am always asking questions. at first I started questioning it as I had so many questions. After answering the initial questions I now have a whole load more, but its not as to the validity of Jesus, its more to do with why?
    Please expand on this.
    I would highly recommend that you read the Bible. The more you read the more impressed you are with it. Do that, before you write it off completely. At least then you will have weighed up both arguments and made a valid decision. You will also understand the comments you have read on here, ie there are only 2 routes - believing or not believing.
    Like I said. I have but it does help when people point you to the parts that show you what they believe.But quoting the Bible doesn't (or hasn't yet) given me any evidence.
    I wish you well and truly hope that you search the answers for yourself. Please please please just open your mind. The problem with you and my friend is that you are looking for short answers to kind of 'pigeon hole' the question - unfortunately this is a trait in sicentists (I think!) you kind of do an experiment, predict the outcome, then look at the results and come to a conclusion. the answer is in fact a whole lot deeper than that and cannot be treated like an experiment.
    Evidence comes in many forms, if I hear God and I'm 100% sure that I'm sane. If he speaks to me and it can't be explained by something else, then sure I'll believe that. It's not ALL about scientific evidence, although that is also something that I look for.
    i hope i haven't offended as i really don't mean to. i'm just trying to help. good luck.
    You haven't offended me, don't worry. I'm kinda tired right now so I do apologise if my reply is a bit blunt. Thank you for your help (and any future help).
     
  12. followerofchrist

    followerofchrist New Member

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    I already addressed this. Please read previous posts.The flaw with that theory being though that we aren't all gay. I asked this question to homosexuals... I asked if it was a choice, they said if a person really was homosexual it wasn't a choice, just how they were. I have no doubt that there's people who choose it, but for the majority that don't well they were born that way.Notice how I used the word "allow". Maybe it's God. I don't know. I do like to think people have the freewill to make choices on their own, of course some of those are bad ones so hence I used the word "allow".Miracles may come into a personal experience for someone and if you or anyone else doesn't want to share it for that reason then I understand that.Please expand on this.Like I said. I have but it does help when people point you to the parts that show you what they believe.But quoting the Bible doesn't (or hasn't yet) given me any evidence.Evidence comes in many forms, if I hear God and I'm 100% sure that I'm sane. If he speaks to me and it can't be explained by something else, then sure I'll believe that. It's not ALL about scientific evidence, although that is also something that I look for.You haven't offended me, don't worry. I'm kinda tired right now so I do apologise if my reply is a bit blunt. Thank you for your help (and any future help).
    From my first post:"2) I have had many people ask me this question before, I have a friend at school who is an agnostic and who's parents are athiest so he is full of mixed up lies. First of all God didn't create evil, evil started when lucifer challenged God and lucifer and his angels were cast down to earth. In the Garden of Eden nothing bad ever happened to Adam and Even until they fell into Lucifers trap, this is when evil was introduced to human kind. We brought evil upon ourselves! I would like to ask you a question, if God went ahead and stopped anything bad from ever happening do you think you would look to God? Probably not! Why would you, if you had everything you wanted and nothing bad ever happened to you then you would have no reason to look to God. God desires a relationship with us, and the evils of this world lead us to him. Again God didn't create evil, he isn't cursing us to trick us into coming to him. Satan is the cause of alot of the evil that happens in our lives, we ourselves even bring evil into our lives. Satan unknowingly pushes us closer to God by doing these "bad things" to us. So if you wanna say God 'allows' these things to happen, then he allows them to happen for our benefit! So we can have a relationship with him and gain eternal life!?"
     
  13. Pildit

    Pildit New Member

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    (followerofchrist;37470)
    From my first post:"2) I have had many people ask me this question before, I have a friend at school who is an agnostic and who's parents are athiest so he is full of mixed up lies. First of all God didn't create evil, evil started when lucifer challenged God and lucifer and his angels were cast down to earth. In the Garden of Eden nothing bad ever happened to Adam and Even until they fell into Lucifers trap, this is when evil was introduced to human kind. We brought evil upon ourselves! I would like to ask you a question, if God went ahead and stopped anything bad from ever happening do you think you would look to God? Probably not! Why would you, if you had everything you wanted and nothing bad ever happened to you then you would have no reason to look to God. God desires a relationship with us, and the evils of this world lead us to him. Again God didn't create evil, he isn't cursing us to trick us into coming to him. Satan is the cause of alot of the evil that happens in our lives, we ourselves even bring evil into our lives. Satan unknowingly pushes us closer to God by doing these "bad things" to us. So if you wanna say God 'allows' these things to happen, then he allows them to happen for our benefit! So we can have a relationship with him and gain eternal life!?"
    Don't worry I haven't dismissed this. I was just stating my perspective on things on the subject of "evil/bad things", so we had an understanding from which to discuss more if necessary.
     
  14. followerofchrist

    followerofchrist New Member

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    Ok, I was just making sure you had not forgotten.
     
  15. Pildit

    Pildit New Member

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    Ok, I was just making sure you had not forgotten.
    Of course not. One of the good things about having all this written down is I can read it again if I wish to.
     
  16. followerofchrist

    followerofchrist New Member

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    Do you have any questions still, that I haven't tried to answer?
     
  17. Pildit

    Pildit New Member

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    Do you have any questions still, that I haven't tried to answer?
    Yes. Read here:(Pildit;37420)
    Another question:So I think I gather that first millenium all those who believe, are good... in the end go to heaven. Then those who don't believe but who lived a good life, then known God and Jesus are real and then have to live out another 1000 years within rules and righteousness, etc and believe in Jesus and all before they die in order to get into Heaven. (Excuse the sloppy summary but you get my point)What about those that die before the millenium has ended?
     
  18. whirlwind

    whirlwind New Member

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    Another question:So I think I gather that first millenium all those who believe, are good... in the end go to heaven. Then those who don't believe but who lived a good life, then known God and Jesus are real and then have to live out another 1000 years within rules and righteousness, etc and believe in Jesus and all before they die in order to get into Heaven. (Excuse the sloppy summary but you get my point)What about those that die before the millenium has ended?
    There is only one millennium. Everyone, all souls, are in a spiritual body but some of those souls are immortal. They have eternal life. The others, also in a spiritual body, are not immortal. They are still liable to die spiritually. They are the ones that must be tested at the end of the millennium. That is the last test.At the end of that 1000 years God judges if they will or will not have eternal life (as the others already have).....No one will die before the millennium has ended as everyone is in their spiritual body. After the millennium begins the only death possible is that of our soul and no souls are judged until it concludes. Then....the eternity........Whirlwind
     
  19. Pildit

    Pildit New Member

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    (whirlwind;37488)
    There is only one millennium. Everyone, all souls, are in a spiritual body but some of those souls are immortal. They have eternal life. The others, also in a spiritual body, are not immortal. They are still liable to die spiritually. They are the ones that must be tested at the end of the millennium. That is the last test.At the end of that 1000 years God judges if they will or will not have eternal life (as the others already have).....No one will die before the millennium has ended as everyone is in their spiritual body. After the millennium begins the only death possible is that of our soul and no souls are judged until it concludes. Then....the eternity........Whirlwind
    Okay let me get this straight, physical body dies... but everyone who is physically dead still has their soul and that's just hangin' out somewhere until the end of the millenium to be judged?
     
  20. followerofchrist

    followerofchrist New Member

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    Basically yeah
     
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