Was Jesus learning to become like his Father?

[MatthewG]

Hello to you and welcome,

This question pertains to "was Jesus learning to become like his Father?"

While I am of the firm standing belief, that Yeshua, is noted as the Lord God Almighty, however this title, is only noted in the Revelation.

Before, in the Old Testament the only title known is Gen_17:1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect. Almighty God. The Prophet Isaiah prophecies about Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Isa 9:7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this. Of a time which the Son of God would come, and also be seen as the mighty God.

Something to note is that before being sent down from heaven by the Father, the Word of God, was with the Father ever since the beginning, and the holy spirit of God was hovering above the face of the deep. Considering the Word having left the former state, now being born in the Flesh of Yeshua, and the Word of God, and the Holy Spirit resides within Jesus to help him over come things in the flesh that come as a temptation which led away from doing the Fathers will. It seems that was Jesus main stay, while reading John last night, there are very interesting conversations going on, Jesus was primarily focused on doing his Fathers will. This is where the question comes in, considering that Jesus is now living on earth, which the Word was used to being there in heaven near the Father, which in turn makes Jesus also now the right-hand man of God. However, when all things were said to be overcame, there was a mention noted by Paul about what would happen.

1Co 15:25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
1Co 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
1Co 15:27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.

Jesus would reign, until all enemies are placed under his feet. The last enemy to be destroyed is death. For when this happened, the until part remains. Today, I believe all enemies have been placed under his feed, and that death has been destroyed, and when all things are placed under his feet. That does not mean that God is put under Jesus, who put all things under him. Now, I am not sure what you believe when it comes to the name of God, but Yahava is a choice that I use, and Yahava is the God Almighty, He is the Father, and He sent His Word who was his Son, and all things were subjected underneath him as all enemies today have been conquered over. You can see here that the Son and the Father have their place, and the Son is not over the Father.

While Jesus was going in his life, and doing the very will of the Father despite his own will (all while enjoying company, fellowship, having sadness over loss, helping others, feeding, and washing the feet of his disciples). Was Jesus learning to become like his Father?

Because there is a promise made, in Revelation which Jesus speaks,

Rev 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
Rev 3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

To those in Laodicea, those who heard the knock, and let Yeshua in, those who would overcome would be granted to sit with him in his throne (right hand of God), even as I also overcame (he has overcame), and am set down with my Father in his throne.

With this, in the very next chapter you have the word that was mentioned in the first sentence, the title "Lord God Almighty" this is my overview of the subject at hand, hope that you consider what is written and that perhaps anyone who has comments would like to share. I could be right, I could be wrong, may the Holy spirit of God guide.

 

[MatthewG]

Let me also add the final touch, with using Revelation 4, and let's just see what is there.

Rev 4:1 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.

John, probably going through a vision here, looked, a door was opened in heaven (this reminds me of when Jesus was baptized by John - and heaven was opened)

and the first voice which I heard was as it were a trumpet talking with me; (what a weird sound to hear, and the first voice is talking saying to John,

Come up here, and I will show thee things which must be hereafter. Who is the first voice?

Rev 4:2 And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.

And immediately John says that he was in the spirit; and behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.
Now you are seeing a vision here of a throne, and there is only one sitting on it. It was in heaven, and John is beholding this sight.

Rev 4:3 And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and there was a rainbow round about the throne, in sight like unto an emerald.

And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper, and a sardine stone; (elements that I am not sure about to consider); and there was a rainbow round the throne (symbolism for peace? When God sent the Rainbow to signify the peace that he desired with all mankind, and this has been made possible because of his Son, who chose to do his will. With the rainbow all around the throne, which there was one who was sitting there, in sight like unto an emerald.

Rev 4:4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

And round about the throne were four and twenty seats; and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of God, do not know who these elders are, all that is know is there are seats that around sitting around the one throne, with one who sits upon it, and there is no mention of any other throne on the right hand of God here. They were all dressed in white raiment, and they had on their heads crowns of God (Crown of life?)

Rev 4:5 And out of the throne proceeded lightning and thunderings and voices: and there were seven lamps of fire burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God.

And out of the throne which is in heaven, proceeded lightings, and thundering's, and voices; and there were seven lamps of fire burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God. What these seven spirits of God are? I don't know, what this could be.

Rev 4:6 And before the throne there was a sea of glass like unto crystal: and in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne, were four beasts full of eyes before and behind.

And before the throne which proceeded lightings and thunderings and voices, there was a sea of glass like unto crystal: and in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne, with the rainbow, jasper, emerald. There were four beasts full of eyes before and behind (scary scene here John sees, seems shocking.)

Rev 4:7 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.

And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the four beast was like a flying eagle, (there is a lot to digest here.)

Rev 4:8 And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come.

And the four beast had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within; and they rest not day and night, saying Holy, Holy, Holy, Lord God Almighty, which was and is and is to come.

Rev 4:9 And when those beasts give glory and honour and thanks to him that sat on the throne, who liveth for ever and ever,

And those beasts give glory and honour and thanks to him that sat on the throne, who lives forever and ever.

Rev 4:10 The four and twenty elders fall down before him that sat on the throne, and worship him that liveth for ever and ever, and cast their crowns before the throne, saying,

The fourty and twenty elders who were around the throne, dressed in white, and sitting in chairs, fall down before him who is sitting on the throne, and worship him that liveth for ever and ever, and cast their crowns before the throne saying,

Rev 4:11 Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

Thou are worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou has created all things, and for thy pleasure they were created.

Did the Son, who got to sit with his Father, become one again just like they were before in the beginning, of God, become the Lord God Almighty, having to learn from his Father, to do his will, and to subject himself obedient until death, holding up the law, for all people, overcoming Satan, demons, sin, all things including death. And the Son gave everything back to his Father, in order that God be all in all, and that with this Yahava, the God of Israel, has been able to reconcile the world back to what Adam had lost in the Garden of Eden, in making peace, and being able to allow people to make their choices as they go about life.

Who is the one who is on the throne?

Thank you for viewing.

 

[MatthewG]

Does anyone find the information any use?

 

[MatthewG]

Someone once told me, its the faith that Jesus had in His Father and his overall will, to make and set forth a heavenly kingdom which is now today established forever, with gates that never close, having all mankind reconciled back to God because of being in Christ to help (Jesus) learn his will and also to fulfil the law, and the propheices of the prophets, in which allows all people now to be able to partake in the death, burial, and resurrection becoming adopted by Yahava, the Father, God Almighty, as a child of his because of partaking in faith, newness of life is produced, by Christ now in you, the hope of glory.

The whole narrative, and the context of the Bible as a whole is need of consideration, starting with the fall of mankind, and ending in restoration; though all of us live in a fallen world, God is pleased with everyone being reconciled to himself, which allows anyone who decides to trust God in their life and look to him, God is then pleased seeing people trust him in faith, and he rewards those who diligently seek after thr LORD.

Everything today revovles around trusting Yahava, day by day, having a relationship, and also fellowshiping with Him and also His Son, Jesus, who words which he had spoke are spirit and life; telling of many things which all should be encouraged to look into; including things that mentioned in Revelation; as hard as it can be to read its worth looking over and really consider what is being shared by John, which is a revelation made know to Jesus; when his time had come nearer to approach and save the generation of the tweleve tribes and some gentiles to be rescued when he would return and have gathered the bride saving them from the wrath of God which included the destruction of Israel, as Gods first bride.

Because of victory, over all things, death (even second death), sheol or hell, satan, the false prophet, the beast, and all things being placed beneath Jesus feet, it seems the Father allows His Son to return to his achieved glory, becoming once again, with the Father as the Word of God known as the Lord God Almighty.

The Garden of eden state has been obtained because of the Lord Jesus Christ, and his Faith in His Father to achieve he goal which has always been for the good of mankind, in which all from the farthests parts of earth to the nearest Gods glory is spoken of through the creation which was created by the very Word of God which was spoken, since “Let there be light.”

 

[amadeus]

Does anyone find the information any use?

Consider this in comparing Jesus with his Father:

Lu 2:52

And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man.

Jesus increased in wisdom, stature and favour, but has the unchangeable Father ever increased in those things?

Mal 3:6

For I am the LORD, I change not; ...

 

[MatthewG]

The only unchangable thing about God, Yahava, @amadeus , is his unfailing love for mankind. Think about how the Son, expressed this love for all mankind, dying on the cross, even asking His Father to forgive them.

 

[MatthewG]

Consider this in comparing Jesus with his Father:

Lu 2:52

And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man.

Jesus increased in wisdom, stature and favour, but has the unchangeable Father ever increased in those things?

To your question, I dont think so.

 

[amadeus]

To your question, I dont think so.

Neither do I believe that the Father has changed. From what I can see, Jesus did.

And what we to do? Consider what the Baptist said here:

Joh 3:30

He must increase, but I must decrease.

 

[amadeus]

The only unchangable thing about God, Yahava, @amadeus , is his unfailing love for mankind. Think about how the Son, expressed this love for all mankind, dying on the cross, even asking His Father to forgive them.

Jesus always loved people. He loves you and me, but unlike his Father, Jesus changed. Jesus grew. Jesus increased. He set the example for us to follow.

 

[MatthewG]

Jesus always loved people. He loves you and me, but unlike his Father, Jesus changed. Jesus grew. Jesus increased. He set the example for us to follow.

Yes, Yeshua, he was a person who loved, he cried, wept, helped, had feasts with others, had his disciples, which he called his friends, who left him, then came back again to proclaim the gospel of Christ and the promises which were going to be fulfilled in that day. Jesus did learn and grow, as you stated that is right. He while learning from his Father was also lead in to way of righteousness, which his righteousness, which makes a person who has faith right with God, and they are able to have peace with God because of that.

When mentioning of the LORD GOD, I also would like to share that He is amazing in that he is unchangeable in love. Because God is love, and God is good. God could never fail in his love, nor could he ever change in his love. Which was what was brought to mind when you shared that passage about the LORD not changing, because the LORD God does change his mind, several times throughout the narrative, but his love, never changed. He desired people to look towards him, his own people that he lead out of egypt with Moses, and fed mana in the wilderness, and they became greedy, and desired other things to do besides look towards God, and he put up with it for along time, until the promise within Malachi would come true, which was most likely taught all through the 400 years of silence they call it because Israel was still going, and people were still doing things by the law in those days, because then here comes Jesus whom was born under the law, and the Israel people are still chasing after false idols. God gets his justice, in destorying them in 70Ad, in my belief, with the destruction of the temple, and the desolation of the land, which the old testament tends to speak a lot about.

And with that judgement and divorcement, now the Heavenly Kingdom is established mentioned in Revelation 21, 22. Really neat things, and while also doing a study on the wrath of God, while it ends in Revelation 18, and is never mentioned anymore, from there forward, my understand and best guess, is that because of God's anger not lasting forever, that today, God's anger has ceased with mankind, and the throne in Revelation 4, with the rainbow, and the kingdom and the elders, and the beasts, is establishing a way that the LORD GOD ALMIGHTY, is over all things, and what resides is the light and the darkness, which a person must choose upon as they go on in this life.

Ridding, away with Satan, and all those things in revelation 20 with judgement of those from within hell, and cast into the lake of fire, with death and hades, and it brings forth new revelation of newer things, at the start of 21, and continues to 22, and it is very interesting if a person sits down and goes through them in their own time and study, and think about the great things that the Lord Jesus Christ had done for all of humankind on behalf of loving his Father, and loving others, and allowing his self to go, and then continue on three days later, rising out of the grave, which now all today, will rise, and their will be a judgement, and a placement for faithlessness, and also for those who are faith it seems like to me,

Thank you for reading just desired to share these things cause they are good in my opinion.

 

[XFire]

My answer is yes. Answered with the KJV. First Jesus is the first creation of God in rev 3.15 and col 1.15. Then attested to in John 1.1..3.
Jesus received the HS at his baptism in matt 3.16.
Then as the heir of God in heb 1.2 (please read heb 1.1-5)
Then during his ministry here on earth Jesus states he only speaks what the Father tells him in John 12.49&50.
Then after Jesus overcame death at the ressurection he tells us in matt 28.18 that he now has power over heaven and earth thereby all enemies of eternal life are now under his feet..

 

[MatthewG]

My answer is yes. Answered with the KJV. First Jesus is the first creation of God in rev 3.15 and col 1.15. Then attested to in John 1.1..3.
Jesus received the HS at his baptism in matt 3.16.
Then as the heir of God in heb 1.2 (please read heb 1.1-5)
Then during his ministry here on earth Jesus states he only speaks what the Father tells him in John 12.49&50.
Then after Jesus overcame death at the ressurection he tells us in matt 28.18 that he now has power over heaven and earth thereby all enemies of eternal life are now under his feet..

Thank you for sharing xfire.

 

[Gabriel _Arch]

Learning to become? I'd say,no. Because Immanuel was the Father.
When he delivered his ministry to the Jews he spoke as one who is like a Jew. Speaking in third person of God because he would not be well received had he spoken in first person as God.

I think that is evident when his people wanted to kill him for later referring to himself as God.

 

[XFire]

Wow. Still holding on to mans traditions.
Please show me where Jesus himself said he was God.
First off the in John 10.32..36 Jesus stated he was the Son of God. And the scripture can NOT be broken.

Please read the actual words of the Bible instead of imitating the words from the pulpit. In this case I am using KJV.

 

[Gabriel _Arch]

Wow. Still holding on to mans traditions.
Please show me where Jesus himself said he was God.
First off the in John 10.32..36 Jesus stated he was the Son of God. And the scripture can NOT be broken.

Please read the actual words of the Bible instead of imitating the words from the pulpit. In this case I am using KJV.

Immanuel="God with us".

Immanuel said, "Before Abraham was, I am." And, "I and the Father are one," and, "If you've seen me, you've seen the Father."

 

[Cassandra]

Let me also add the final touch, with using Revelation 4, and let's just see what is there.

Rev 4:1 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.

John, probably going through a vision here, looked, a door was opened in heaven (this reminds me of when Jesus was baptized by John - and heaven was opened)

and the first voice which I heard was as it were a trumpet talking with me; (what a weird sound to hear, and the first voice is talking saying to John,

Come up here, and I will show thee things which must be hereafter. Who is the first voice?

Rev 4:2 And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.

And immediately John says that he was in the spirit; and behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.
Now you are seeing a vision here of a throne, and there is only one sitting on it. It was in heaven, and John is beholding this sight.

Rev 4:3 And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and there was a rainbow round about the throne, in sight like unto an emerald.

And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper, and a sardine stone; (elements that I am not sure about to consider); and there was a rainbow round the throne (symbolism for peace? When God sent the Rainbow to signify the peace that he desired with all mankind, and this has been made possible because of his Son, who chose to do his will. With the rainbow all around the throne, which there was one who was sitting there, in sight like unto an emerald.

Rev 4:4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

And round about the throne were four and twenty seats; and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of God, do not know who these elders are, all that is know is there are seats that around sitting around the one throne, with one who sits upon it, and there is no mention of any other throne on the right hand of God here. They were all dressed in white raiment, and they had on their heads crowns of God (Crown of life?)

Rev 4:5 And out of the throne proceeded lightning and thunderings and voices: and there were seven lamps of fire burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God.

And out of the throne which is in heaven, proceeded lightings, and thundering's, and voices; and there were seven lamps of fire burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God. What these seven spirits of God are? I don't know, what this could be.

Rev 4:6 And before the throne there was a sea of glass like unto crystal: and in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne, were four beasts full of eyes before and behind.

And before the throne which proceeded lightings and thunderings and voices, there was a sea of glass like unto crystal: and in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne, with the rainbow, jasper, emerald. There were four beasts full of eyes before and behind (scary scene here John sees, seems shocking.)

Rev 4:7 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.

And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the four beast was like a flying eagle, (there is a lot to digest here.)

Rev 4:8 And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come.

And the four beast had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within; and they rest not day and night, saying Holy, Holy, Holy, Lord God Almighty, which was and is and is to come.

Rev 4:9 And when those beasts give glory and honour and thanks to him that sat on the throne, who liveth for ever and ever,

And those beasts give glory and honour and thanks to him that sat on the throne, who lives forever and ever.

Rev 4:10 The four and twenty elders fall down before him that sat on the throne, and worship him that liveth for ever and ever, and cast their crowns before the throne, saying,

The four and twenty elders who were around the throne, dressed in white, and sitting in chairs, fall down before him who is sitting on the throne, and worship him that liveth for ever and ever, and cast their crowns before the throne saying,

Rev 4:11 Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

Thou are worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou has created all things, and for thy pleasure they were created.

Did the Son, who got to sit with his Father, become one again just like they were before in the beginning, of God, become the Lord God Almighty, having to learn from his Father, to do his will, and to subject himself obedient until death, holding up the law, for all people, overcoming Satan, demons, sin, all things including death. And the Son gave everything back to his Father, in order that God be all in all, and that with this Yahava, the God of Israel, has been able to reconcile the world back to what Adam had lost in the Garden of Eden, in making peace, and being able to allow people to make their choices as they go about life.

Who is the one who is on the throne?

Thank you for viewing.

I heard a lecture that in Rev 4, Christ was not there and did not return till Rev5 In 4 you see the 24 elders and the LORD , and they are praising Him as Creator--you don't see the angels--they went to bring Jesus back to Heaven . In Rev 5, John notes the angels.--the angels are praising Jesus and we see His appearance as the slain Lamb

 

[MatthewG]

I heard a lecture that in Rev 4, Christ was not there and did not return till Rev5 In 4 you see the 24 elders and the LORD , and they are praising Him as Creator--you don't see the angels--they went to bring Jesus back to Heaven . In Rev 5, John notes the angels.--the angels are praising Jesus and we see His appearance as the slain Lamb

There is definitely a lot to consider, with the main information given, and comparing to what other people may say.

 

[XFire]

Immanuel="God with us".

Immanuel said, "Before Abraham was, I am." And, "I and the Father are one," and, "If you've seen me, you've seen the Father."

Please add scripture refs for the rest of us to learn and discuss

 

[XFire]

Immanuel="God with us".

Immanuel said, "Before Abraham was, I am." And, "I and the Father are one," and, "If you've seen me, you've seen the Father."

If ref is from isa 7.14, then this is describing Jesus and not God the Father angina making Jesus subservient to the Father until after the ressurection

Ref before Abraham was i am is again proven in rev 3.14, thru John 1.1. Jesus is the beginning of God's creation.

If you've seen me you've seen the Father. John 14.9. And why is that. Look at John 12.49.50. Jesus did nothing but what his Father told him to do/say. Again an independent being with free will to choose what is right

Christians. Pkease take off your denominational glasses and read the actual words. Study the Bible with topics, study what the words say and not what your pastor has told you your whole life.

 

[Gabriel _Arch]

If ref is from isa 7.14, then this is describing Jesus and not God the Father angina making Jesus subservient to the Father until after the ressurection

Ref before Abraham was i am is again proven in rev 3.14, thru John 1.1. Jesus is the beginning of God's creation.

If you've seen me you've seen the Father. John 14.9. And why is that. Look at John 12.49.50. Jesus did nothing but what his Father told him to do/say. Again an independent being with free will to choose what is right

Christians. Pkease take off your denominational glasses and read the actual words. Study the Bible with topics, study what the words say and not what your pastor has told you your whole life.

I suggest you study the Bible. Immanuel,Jesus,was God.

Deny that and you are wrong. When God tells us he is Jesus,in both old and new revelations in his word,that is not a debate.