What is "OSAS"?

[Scott Downey]

Christ further confirms this salvation, how it works, in John 6

60 Therefore many of His disciples, when they heard this, said, “This is a [m]hard saying; who can understand it?”

61 When Jesus knew in Himself that His disciples [n]complained about this, He said to them, “Does this [o]offend you? 62 What then if you should see the Son of Man ascend where He was before? 63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life. 64 But there are some of you who do not believe.” For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were who did not believe, and who would betray Him. 65 And He said, “Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father.”

66 From that time many of His disciples went [p]back and walked with Him no more. 67 Then Jesus said to the twelve, “Do you also want to go away?”

68 But Simon Peter answered Him, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life. 69 Also we have come to believe and know that You are the [q]Christ, the Son of the living God.”

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Christ further confirms this salvation, how it works, in John 6

60 Therefore many of His disciples, when they heard this, said, “This is a [m]hard saying; who can understand it?”

61 When Jesus knew in Himself that His disciples [n]complained about this, He said to them, “Does this [o]offend you? 62 What then if you should see the Son of Man ascend where He was before? 63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life. 64 But there are some of you who do not believe.” For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were who did not believe, and who would betray Him. 65 And He said, “Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father.”

66 From that time many of His disciples went [p]back and walked with Him no more. 67 Then Jesus said to the twelve, “Do you also want to go away?”

68 But Simon Peter answered Him, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life. 69 Also we have come to believe and know that You are the [q]Christ, the Son of the living God.”

this sounds abit calvinistic. we must be careful in what we say

 

[PinSeeker]

Thanks for the clarification PinSeeker. Now that you clarified your "soteriology" thought process it helps me get the gist of your point.

I characterize it that way because it is true. Look at the big picture and you will see that Luther rejected some long-taught beliefs and offered a few new beliefs of his own. He wasn't just fighting corruption and plenary indulgences. Calvin and the other English Reformers wanted changes to the teachings (changes of doctrine) of The Church also. They weren't just fighting corruption in The Church; they wanted changes to doctrines and they disagreed with each other on what those changes should be so the result was a fissiparous Protestantism. One of the few things they could agree on was to oppose “the Pope of Rome.”

If the only thing they wanted was to expose abuse and corruption, then once they broke away from The Church and started their own church they would have kept the same doctrines and teaching. They didn't do that. They started an entire new teaching of salvific beliefs. Other men that used to follow them then broke away from their teachings and started their own church. On and on and on for 500 years Satan keeps deceiving men.

Mary

LOL! So the Catholic narrative goes... "Started an entire new teaching of salvific beliefs..." Wow.

We will agree, for sure, that the Reformers wanted to change a lot of non-Biblical teachings/understandings that were (and still are; there is nothing new under the sun) out there. But again, back to what they really are/should be, Biblically speaking. This was really the one overarching purpose of the Reformers ~ to re-form ~ bring back correct understanding and belief in God's holy, incorruptible, infallible, true Word. But the only One Who will finally do that is God Himself, through the work of His Spirit.

Yes, Satan is at work, for sure. But God is sovereign over it all, and His promises are all true; all God's promises have their 'yes' and 'amen' in Christ Jesus. Thanks be to God, "All flesh is like grass and all its glory like the flower of grass. The grass withers, and the flower falls, but the Word of the Lord remains forever."

Grace and peace to you, Mary.

 

[PinSeeker]

Saved and Quicken men ARE establish-ed ‘sons of God” and sin NO MORE.

Well, yes... and no. It depends on the context you put that statement in. If you are saying it in the same way that Paul, in Romans 7, says "it is no longer I who sin, but sin that dwells within me," then I agree.

No human IS SINLESS, until the manifestation of their glorified Body has come into fruition.... Some raised in a new glorious, sinless body, some not.

Right. It was really a rhetorical question.

Grace and peace to you.

 

[PinSeeker]

Since the old me is now dead, I can only truthfully answer what is true by God of the new me born [again] of the spirit of God: I no longer sin and am sinless (which I do not "believe" but know).

Even so, it would not be right of me not to explain as did Paul, that since I am now among the "we who are alive and remain" in the world and in the flesh in the service of God--a mystery of God; although I myself am now a new creation of the Spirit, my old man even of flesh still walks the earth as Christ also walked for His embalming--the putting forth of fruit 40 days carrying the marks of sin. But I am not Him who did so perfectly, and therefore do say, "I have sin"--but only in the flesh that remains.

Ugh. It was really a rhetorical question, Scott. See my reply to Taken above. Over-complicating things is... tiresome.

Grace and peace to you.

 

[Scott Downey]

If we can NEVER be lost then what's the point of preaching OSAS? I truly don't understand.

Eternal consolation is one example. You know people get weary, this world and all it's evil, sufferings and sorrows it brings on believers.
That God will keep you in His love.

Luke 2:25

Simeon Sees God’s Salvation​

And behold, there was a man in Jerusalem whose name was Simeon, and this man was just and devout, waiting for the Consolation of Israel, and the Holy Spirit was upon him.

1 Corinthians 1
Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timothy our brother,

To the church of God which is at Corinth, with all the saints who are in all Achaia:

2 Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Comfort in Suffering​

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and God of all comfort, 4 who comforts us in all our tribulation, that we may be able to comfort those who are in any [a]trouble, with the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God. 5 For as the sufferings of Christ abound in us, so our [b]consolation also abounds through Christ. 6 Now if we are afflicted, it is for your consolation and salvation, which is effective for enduring the same sufferings which we also suffer. Or if we are comforted, it is for your consolation and salvation. 7 And our hope for you is steadfast, because we know that as you are partakers of the sufferings, so also you will partake of the consolation.

 

[Scott Downey]

And This!

2 Thessalonians 2:15-17​

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15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold the traditions which you were taught, whether by word or our [a]epistle.
16 Now may our Lord Jesus Christ Himself, and our God and Father, who has loved us and given us everlasting consolation and good hope by grace, 17 comfort your hearts and [b]establish you in every good word and work.

 

[Scott Downey]

And this too! How excellent is His Name and Work for us.

Hebrews 6

God’s Infallible Purpose in Christ​

13 For when God made a promise to Abraham, because He could swear by no one greater, He swore by Himself, 14 saying, “Surely blessing I will bless you, and multiplying I will multiply you.” 15 And so, after he had patiently endured, he obtained the promise. 16 For men indeed swear by the greater, and an oath for confirmation is for them an end of all dispute. 17 Thus God, determining to show more abundantly to the heirs of promise the [f]immutability of His counsel, [g]confirmed it by an oath, 18 that by two [h]immutable things, in which it is impossible for God to lie, we [i]might have strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold of the hope set before us.

19 This hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and steadfast, and which enters the Presence behind the veil, 20 where the forerunner has entered for us, even Jesus, having become High Priest forever according to the order of Melchizedek.

 

[Scott Downey]

Our High Priest is the Good Shepherd.
He will not leave us to our own fates, when we falter. He goes and get us and brings us back to Himself.
Those who depart in unbelief, God did not grant that they come to Christ, so they leave and never come back to the sheepfold as they are not of His sheep.

John 6
37 All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will [f]by no means cast out. 38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. 39 This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day. 40 And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day.”

 

[Scott Downey]

7 Then Jesus said to them again, “Most assuredly, I say to you, I am the door of the sheep. 8 All who ever came [a]before Me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them. 9 I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture. 10 The thief does not come except to steal, and to kill, and to destroy. I have come that they may have life, and that they may have it more abundantly.

11 “I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep. 12 But a [b]hireling, he who is not the shepherd, one who does not own the sheep, sees the wolf coming and leaves the sheep and flees; and the wolf catches the sheep and scatters them. 13 The hireling flees because he is a hireling and does not care about the sheep. 14 I am the good shepherd; and I know My sheep, and am known by My own. 15 As the Father knows Me, even so I know the Father; and I lay down My life for the sheep. 16 And other sheep I have which are not of this fold; them also I must bring, and they will hear My voice; and there will be one flock and one shepherd.

17 “Therefore My Father loves Me, because I lay down My life that I may take it again. 18 No one takes it from Me, but I lay it down of Myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This command I have received from My Father.”

 

[Scott Downey]

19 Therefore there was a division again among the Jews because of these sayings. 20 And many of them said, “He has a demon and is [c]mad. Why do you listen to Him?”

21 Others said, “These are not the words of one who has a demon. Can a demon open the eyes of the blind?”

The Shepherd Knows His Sheep​

22 Now it was the Feast of Dedication in Jerusalem, and it was winter. 23 And Jesus walked in the temple, in Solomon’s porch. 24 Then the Jews surrounded Him and said to Him, “How long do You keep us in [d]doubt? If You are the Christ, tell us plainly.”

25 Jesus answered them, “I told you, and you do not believe. The works that I do in My Father’s name, they bear witness of Me. 26 But you do not believe, because you are not of My sheep, [e]as I said to you. 27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand. 30 I and My Father are one.”

 

[PinSeeker]

No different with God. He calls, some answer, some do not.

That's true, but listen to what the prophet Joel, whom John and Paul specifically reference/echo, who quotes God Himself:

“And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my Spirit on all flesh; your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, and your young men shall see visions. Even on the male and female servants in those days I will pour out my Spirit. And I will show wonders in the heavens and on the earth, blood and fire and columns of smoke. The sun shall be turned to darkness, and the moon to blood, before the great and awesome day of the LORD comes. And it shall come to pass that everyone who calls on the name of the LORD shall be saved. For in Mount Zion and in Jerusalem there shall be those who escape, as the LORD has said, and among the survivors shall be those whom the LORD calls." (Joel 2:28-32)​

God's calling ~ which is given to some and not to others, as is His prerogative as the Creator and sovereign Lord; He has mercy upon whom He will, compassion upon whom He will (Moses in Ezekiel 33:19, Paul in Romans 9:18) ~ makes possible our calling on the Name of the LORD... which those called will not fail to do. Those called by God ~ inwardly, by His Spirit ~ will choose... wisely. God's purposes cannot be thwarted (Job 42:2).

MEN who call on the Lord God, ARE acknowledging THEY BELIEVE IN the Lord God.

Agreed, but consider what Jesus says to the Jews gathered around Him at the Feast of Dedication:

"At that time the Feast of Dedication took place at Jerusalem. It was winter, and Jesus was walking in the temple, in the colonnade of Solomon. So the Jews gathered around Him and said to Him, 'How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Christ, tell us plainly.' Jesus answered them, 'I told you, and you do not believe. The works that I do in my Father’s name bear witness about me, but you do not believe because you are not among my sheep. My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of My hand. My Father, Who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand. I and the Father are one.'" (John 10:22-30, emphasis mine)​

To emphasize again, Jesus said they did not believe because they were not among His sheep. That order cannot be reversed; it was not that they were not among His sheep ~ given to Him by the Father ~ because they did not believe. They did not believe because they were not among His sheep ~ given to Him by the Father.

So, when you say, YOU did not choose God, He choose you….you error.

LOL! No one really says we do not choose God, but for those who do. it is because God chose them. Jesus said to His disciples, "You did not choose Me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit and that your fruit should abide..." He was telling them not that they "did not make a choice," but that it was His choice that precipitated theirs. Paul says the same thing to us in Ephesians 2, that "God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ ~ by grace you have been saved ~ and raised us up with Him and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the coming ages He might show the immeasurable riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them." (Ephesians 2:4-10)

Offered to men of the entire world.
John 6:51

The general call of the Gospel to all to repent and believe is given to all, without exception. But God issues His inward call by His Spirit only to His elect.

YOU choose…

No one says we don't make a choice. Not Moses, not Paul, not even the Lord Jesus.

YOU elect…

It is God's purpose of election. As Paul says, using Jacob and Esau as the example of, more generally speaking, those whom God calls versus those whom He does not, "though they were not yet born and had done nothing either good or bad ~ in order that God’s purpose of election might continue, not because of works but because of Him who calls..." (Romans 9:11)

YOU call on the Lord God and make your choices KNOWN to Him.

Yes, we do, but as Paul goes on to say in Romans 9, because God has mercy on whomever He wills, and He hardens whomever he wills v.18), so then it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy (v.16). He does not choose us based on our choice; we choose (and then call on) Him because He chose us (before the foundation of the world, as Paul says in Ephesians 1).

Every man has received Gods Offering.

Well, every man has known God ~ God has made Himself known in that His invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. But many have refused to honor Him as God or give thanks to Him ~ they have exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling created things... they have exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator. They have chosen... unwisely.

It is every mans own choice to choose God and accept His Offering or not.

Agreed. But... see above. We all have a choice to make regarding God's great salvation, and make it we will, and everyone will get exactly as he/she has chosen.

Glory to God.

Indeed. Grace and peace to you, Taken.

 

[GRACE ambassador]

I was just trying to understand OSAS. I guess I should have kept quiet.

Precious friend, @Jack, asking Great Biblical questions is An Excellent road to understanding, so
no need to 'keep quiet'.

If we can NEVER be lost then what's the point of preaching OSAS? I truly don't understand.

1) God Would have all His children to agree (1 Co 1:9-10), and to "speak Sound Doctrine" (Titus 2:1).

2) God's Sound Doctrine Of Eternal Salvation [ aka osas ] Is The One Doctrine That Gives His

children Eternal Assurance, And Thus:​

​

3) Causes us to "serve God out of Love," instead of "FEAR of losing" His Eternal Salvation!

Amen.

Other helpful salvation studies:

God's OPERATION On All HIS New-born babes In CHRIST
+ Update
+
God's Eternal Life Insurance

 

[Taken]

If we can NEVER be lost then what's the point of preaching OSAS? I truly don't understand.

“We” are not all the SAME in our Beliefs.

Some believe in “NO” god.
Some believe in “A” god.
Some believe in “The” LORD God.
Some believe in “Jesus” the Word of God.
Some believe in “Christ” the Power of God.
Some believe “Jesus” is a Human man.
Some believe “Jesus” is Gods Spirit, who appeared “AS” a Flesh Human man.
Some believe IN God Only.
Some believe IN God the Father, AND Christ Jesus the Son of God.
Some believe IN their MIND, but UNSURE in their HEARTS Thoughts.
Some believe IN their MIND, but Become influenced to CHANGE their MIND and NOT Believe.

** Some BEGIN to Continually Hear, Read, Study, and BEGIN to Believe IN their Heart, YET … through circumstances … are distracted… (ie. a loved one dies, loss of job, drugs, a disease, an accident, busy jugging daily tasks, sports, TV programing, Religious contentions, 24-7 political contention, 24-7 Fear of Death of the world’s population….on and on whatever it be)

** Some DO ONE Thing “DIFFERENT” than the majority.
*** THEY, Believe “IN” their Heart’s thoughts
“IN” the LORD God “AND” CHRIST the Lord JESUS “UNTIL” the day of their physical bodily Death….(to Which AT THAT TIME, they “THEN” shall be Saved”.
…….THESE are the “IF’s”… “IF” they are NOT convinced to abandon their BELIEF, until the day of their physical death.
…….Considering as Scripture WARNS…in general men are WEAK. Demons roam the earth with cunning trickery. Powerful men; (kings, governments, promote anti-Christ, anti-God, some threaten punishments for being educated in and believing in Godly knowledge.)

*** SOME men DO “TWO” specific things, DIFFERENT than ALL OTHER MEN.
*****BY these things**** IS the concept of BEING ONCE and FOREVER SAVED (OSAS).
(Because of what they choose, what they do and Gods Promise, assuredness, guarantee, by His Power to Keep them forever WITH Him*****

**** SOME men Heartfully “BELIEVE” “IN” God “AND” IN CHRIST JESUS…….”AND”……..
call on the Lord God and “CONFESS” their
Heartful Belief.
****Heartfully BELIEVE****and****CONFESS their Heartful BELIEF.
***** “THEY” are AT THAT TIME…
~ Forgiven (for having NOT beleived)
~ accomplished Gods works (heartfully believed)
~ accomplished Gods service (heartfully confessed their belief, promising their dead body unto God, ie crucified with Jesus)
~ Gods works … accomplished…
accepting their body, washing it in Jesus’ Blood. Giving a new heart (ie circumcision), restoring the soul back to very good ie.(saving the soul), Planting Gods Seed in the new heart, (spirit of man reborn), Giving man the Spirit of Truth within the mans heart, (ie Jesus/Truth Christ/Spirit, feeding that spirit Gods Truth; Covered; (Gods Spirit/Light withIN can no longer SEE the forgiven sin), Sanctification; (set apart from all others); Justification; (qualified to be raised up); Sealed: (belongs to only the Lord God);
Resurrection; (body raised up glorified, ie holy and sinless)
Temporarily; (while the man continues naturally living), man is using the Lords risen Body. (Called IN Christ)
Forever; God shall be WITH that man.
Future…
Body whole, wholly holy…ie. (Glorified body, saved soul returned to in the body, born again spirit returned to in the body)….
Fullness Complete….man CAN THEN SEE the Lord God, AS HE IS….SPIRIT.

Point Being. To your question…
Who “WE” are…has a specific meaning and “WE” spoken in general can mean different things to different people, void of specifics, or confounding specifics.

Some say…Christian…as if “Following Christ Jesus’ teaching” MEANS having Committed… it doesn’t. Many call themselves Christians, who are Learning ABOUT Christ Jesus and MADE no commitment.
Some say….Baptized….as if being dipped or sprinkled with Water MEANS Being Baptized with the Hoy Spirit….it doesn’t. The Holy Spirit is not Water, and is not a man dipping another man IN Water.
Some say….”they were SAVED”….but no longer BELIEVE. Impossible. It is implying “tHEY FOOLED” the all-knowing God.

Point being…”WE” is specific.
“US”/“WE” are believing AND committed…
Are Those Who CAN NEVER Be Lost.
(Never Lose their Salvation)
“THEM” / “THEY” are all others.
ANY of ALL others, CAN Become Lost.
(Can Lose their salvation, BY NEVER Receiving what was Given for them TO TAKE, receive and THUS HAVE).

I am by my choice, my belief, my commitment, Gods works in me, Gods Promise…Forever WITH the Lord God.
Never can I again stand (sin) AGAINST (Not believe in) God. His Power dwells in me…ie Christ IN me.
I dwell in His Power..ie me IN Christ.
My power is weak. His Power is Supreme above ALL other powers.
I am set apart from ALL others, who do not DO the SAME, as God Himself established “HIS WAY”.
It is NOT following “my way”. It IS: individuals freely choosing, deciding, to follow Gods WAY (or not).

Bottom line…many can and will lose their salvation;
Few will never lose their salvation.

 

[Taken]

LOL! No one really says we do not choose God,

I gave a response to a poster who said He chose them, they didn’t choose Him.

Thanks for your response.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[Taken]

@GRACE ambassador

God Bless you and yours.

Taken

 

[PinSeeker]

Bottom line…many can and will lose their salvation...

Because they were not called by God. So they never were saved, and eventually proved it, to themselves and to others. This is what John says in 1 John 2:19, that unbelievers "went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us."

Few will never lose their salvation.

Right, because those few were the ones God called.

• As I quoted Jesus as saying above (from John 10), "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of My hand. My Father, Who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand. I and the Father are one.'""
• Paul writes, "we are His (God's) workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them" (Ephesians 2:10) and "He (God) Who began a good work in you will ~ will, not 'might' ~ bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ" (Philippians 1:6).
• Peter writes, "According to His great mercy, He has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, kept in heaven for you, who by God’s power are being guarded through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time" (1 Peter 1:3-5).

If we are truly called by God, we are His, and, as David says in Psalm 23, goodness and mercy shall follow us all the days of our lives, and we shall dwell in the house of the LORD forever.

Grace and peace to you.

 

[Taken]

Because they were not called by God. So they never were saved, and eventually proved it, to themselves and to others. This is what John says in 1 John 2:19, that unbelievers "went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us."

If we are truly called by God, we are His, and, as David says in Psalm 23, goodness and mercy shall follow us all the days of our lives, and we shall dwell in the house of the LORD forever.

Grace and peace to you.

Amen!
Thank you.
We serve a magnificent Lord God while stuck in a corrupt world. Lean on Gods comfort as the wicked spin their snares.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[PinSeeker]

Look at the big picture and you will see that...

You say that as if I don't...

...Luther rejected some long-taught beliefs...

Yes, wrong ones...

and offered a few new beliefs of his own....

Yes, right ones...

He wasn't just fighting corruption and plenary indulgences. Calvin and the other English Reformers wanted changes to the teachings (changes of doctrine) of The Church also.

Agreed.

...they disagreed with each other on what those changes should be so the result was a fissiparous Protestantism.

Very ambiguous. Some of the specific issues that they addressed were different. If you think they disagreed on anything specific, then it would help if you identified those things, instead of making generalizations. Then a discussion could actually be possible. For the most part, though, Luther and Calvin and all those who came after ~ later Jonathan Edwards, Abraham Kuyper, and the like ~ thought very much along the same lines, and they all thought very much along the same lines as Augustine centuries before.

One of the few things they could agree on was to oppose “the Pope of Rome.”

Agreed. Although only on certain things, of course. Very important things, of course, but only on certain things.

If the only thing they wanted was to expose abuse and corruption...

It was not; it was to return Christianity to what it was in the days of the apostles, to Scripture. If you really want to talk about what Martin Luther's impetus (impetuses) was (were), he offered the five Solas ("alones") of the Reformation: Sola Scriptura (Scripture alone), Solus Christus (Christ alone), Sola Fide (faith alone), Sola Gratia (grace alone), and Sola Deo Gloria (glory to God alone).

The five Solas

That was the purpose of the Reformers and the Reformation.

They started an entire new teaching of salvific beliefs.

Not 'new' as in "never before taught"...

...Satan keeps deceiving men

That he does. But not all; the Holy Spirit is at work. But one day ~ one great, magnificent Day... ~ there will be no more deception. The schemes of Satan will all be permanently ended.

Grace and peace to you, Mary.

 

[Marymog]

It was not; it was to return Christianity to what it was in the days of the apostles, to Scripture. If you really want to talk about what Martin Luther's impetus (impetuses) was (were), he offered the five Solas ("alones") of the Reformation: Sola Scriptura (Scripture alone), Solus Christus (Christ alone), Sola Fide (faith alone), Sola Gratia (grace alone), and Sola Deo Gloria (glory to God alone).


Grace and peace to you, Mary.

Oh goodness PinSeeker.......You have a horrible theory and revision of the truth (history).

The Reformers did not return to Christianity in the days of the Apostles. They all disagreed with The Church on doctrine. They thought they could interpret Scripture better than the men of The Church. They broke away from The Church and created their own doctrines; their own salvafic truths. Some of their doctrines agreed with Church doctrine and some of it didn't. The TRUTH is they all disagreed with each other AND The Church sooooo your revision of history (that they were trying to return to the days of the Apostles) makes ZERO sense.

If your theory was true which of the Reformers came the closest to returning to the days of the Apostles?

Keeping it real....Mary