What is the sign of the Son of Man?

[David H.]

The Question in the title was asked of Me By @marks, And i thought it would be worth a post here to get some other thoughts.

Here was my response to this Question to Him:

"We do not know exactly what that sign is but it is the sixth seal. I can surmise that it is the sky rolling up like a scroll, which is the one thing that differs from the Matthew 24:29-30 account and the Revelation 6:12-14. Read the two passages as parallel accounts to see this, Below.

And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. (Revelation 6:12-14)

Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. (Matthew 24:29-30)"

My Question to all of You is what is this sign? Some other verses to consider are Acts of the Apostles 1:11, Which is the ascension verse.

 

[Marty fox]

The Question in the title was asked of Me By @marks, And i thought it would be worth a post here to get some other thoughts.

Here was my response to this Question to Him:

"We do not know exactly what that sign is but it is the sixth seal. I can surmise that it is the sky rolling up like a scroll, which is the one thing that differs from the Matthew 24:29-30 account and the Revelation 6:12-14. Read the two passages as parallel accounts to see this, Below.

And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. (Revelation 6:12-14)

Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. (Matthew 24:29-30)"

My Question to all of You is what is this sign? Some other verses to consider are Acts of the Apostles 1:11, Which is the ascension verse.

The sign was that Jesus is in heaven.

Jesus wasn’t killed because He claimed to be the messiah He was killed because He claimed to be God.

Matthew 26:64-66
62 Then the high priest stood up and said to Jesus, “Are you not going to answer? What is this testimony that these men are bringing against you?” 63 But Jesus remained silent.

The high priest said to him, “I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Messiah, the Son of God.”

64 “You have said so,” Jesus replied. “But I say to all of you: From now on you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”

65 Then the high priest tore his clothes and said, “He has spoken blasphemy! Why do we need any more witnesses? Look, now you have heard the blasphemy. 66 What do you think?”

“He is worthy of death,” they answered.

Jesus actually claimed that He would be sitting at the right hand of the Farther which was not to be the son of God but to be equal with God Himself. Jesus claimed to be the one in Daniel chapter 7

Daniel 7:13-14
13 “In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. 14 He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all nations and peoples of every language worshiped him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.

It’s the sign of the son of man in heaven that you are looking for and that sign is that Jesus was in heaven because Jerusalem was destroyed within that generation which is what Jesus predicted in Matthew chapter 24.

Matthew 24:1-2 & 34
Jesus left the temple and was walking away when his disciples came up to him to call his attention to its buildings.2 “Do you see all these things?” he asked. “Truly I tell you, not one stone here will be left on another; every one will be thrown down.”

34 Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

Jesus gave a prediction with a date on it and when it happened when He said that it would happen (within that generation)then they all would of realized that Jesus was God and in heaven sitting at the right hand of the Father.

The timely destruction of Jerusalem was that sign of the son of man that the son of man was in heaven

 

[David H.]

64 “You have said so,” Jesus replied. “But I say to all of you: From now on you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”

Great verse, and answer, Thanks.

 

[Marty fox]

Great verse, and answer, Thanks.

Your very welcome

 

[quietthinker]

I don’t think it’s necessary to make it a mystery or complicated.
The context tells us it’s Jesus coming in the clouds of heaven.

The language used is how the Hebrews thought, eg; the shepherds on Bethlehem’s hill were told the sign for them will be a baby in a donkey’s feed box etc.
... there was nothing preceding their discovery but wonder and joy and probably amazement.

When Jesus returns it’ll be a sign for those who have longed for his appearing as their deliverance and for those who have mocked, scoffed or twisted his words it’ll be a sign of abject terror.

 

[Curtis]

The Question in the title was asked of Me By @marks, And i thought it would be worth a post here to get some other thoughts.

Here was my response to this Question to Him:

"We do not know exactly what that sign is but it is the sixth seal. I can surmise that it is the sky rolling up like a scroll, which is the one thing that differs from the Matthew 24:29-30 account and the Revelation 6:12-14. Read the two passages as parallel accounts to see this, Below.

And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. (Revelation 6:12-14)

Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. (Matthew 24:29-30)"

My Question to all of You is what is this sign? Some other verses to consider are Acts of the Apostles 1:11, Which is the ascension verse.

The sign is His appearing in the air on a cloud, for every eye to see, per Revelation 1:7, where it repeats that the tribes of the earth will mourn when they see Him.

The parallel accounts of His coming in Luke 21 and Mark 13 omit the part about a sign appearing at His coming, BTW.

 

[Truth7t7]

The sign was that Jesus is in heaven.

Jesus wasn’t killed because He claimed to be the messiah He was killed because He claimed to be God.

Matthew 26:64-66
62 Then the high priest stood up and said to Jesus, “Are you not going to answer? What is this testimony that these men are bringing against you?” 63 But Jesus remained silent.

The high priest said to him, “I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Messiah, the Son of God.”

64 “You have said so,” Jesus replied. “But I say to all of you: From now on you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”

65 Then the high priest tore his clothes and said, “He has spoken blasphemy! Why do we need any more witnesses? Look, now you have heard the blasphemy. 66 What do you think?”

“He is worthy of death,” they answered.

Jesus actually claimed that He would be sitting at the right hand of the Farther which was not to be the son of God but to be equal with God Himself. Jesus claimed to be the one in Daniel chapter 7

Daniel 7:13-14
13 “In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. 14 He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all nations and peoples of every language worshiped him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.

It’s the sign of the son of man in heaven that you are looking for and that sign is that Jesus was in heaven because Jerusalem was destroyed within that generation which is what Jesus predicted in Matthew chapter 24.

Matthew 24:1-2 & 34
Jesus left the temple and was walking away when his disciples came up to him to call his attention to its buildings.2 “Do you see all these things?” he asked. “Truly I tell you, not one stone here will be left on another; every one will be thrown down.”

34 Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

Jesus gave a prediction with a date on it and when it happened when He said that it would happen (within that generation)then they all would of realized that Jesus was God and in heaven sitting at the right hand of the Father.

The timely destruction of Jerusalem was that sign of the son of man that the son of man was in heaven

Matthew 24:29-31 represents the second coming and last day resurrection, who you kidding Marty

Gotta get rid of the literal second coming seen with symbolism and allegory to keep the 70AD Preterist teaching alive

No greater example in the Holy bible of the second coming, than that seen below, and you want to remove it through symbolic allegory

Matthew 24:29-31KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

 

[Truth7t7]

Jesus gave a prediction with a date on it and when it happened when He said that it would happen (within that generation)then they all would of realized that Jesus was God and in heaven sitting at the right hand of the Father.

The timely destruction of Jerusalem was that sign of the son of man that the son of man was in heaven

Marty Jesus spoke of the "Future" generation that would be eyewitnesses of the events that precede (The Second Coming) Future

Verse 33, when you see all these things, know that it is near (The Second Coming) Future

Verse 36, of that day and hour knoweth no man, (The Second Coming) Future

Matthew 24:32-36KJV
32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

 

[David H.]

Matthew 24:29-31 represents the second coming and last day resurrection, who you kidding Marty

Gotta get rid of the literal second coming seen with symbolism and allegory to keep the 70AD Preterist teaching alive

"truth", This is not about right or wrong, I just want to hear what you think is the sign. Whatever perspective that you come from. @Marty fox is a preterist, But I appreciate his answer because i have never heard this explanation before. Do I agree with Him? Probably not, but his view is unique and one I had never considered before.

Matthew 24:32-36KJV
32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

I Like you believe the sign and its timing is determined by the fig tree (Israel) Generation, which began in 1948 when Israel became a nation in one day. A generation is said to be 70-80 years and we are living in that window right now. (Psalm 90:10)

 

[marks]

I don’t think it’s necessary to make it a mystery or complicated.
The context tells us it’s Jesus coming in the clouds of heaven.

The language used is how the Hebrews thought, eg; the shepherds on Bethlehem’s hill were told the sign for them will be a baby in a donkey’s feed box etc.
... there was nothing preceding their discovery but wonder and joy and probably amazement.

When Jesus returns it’ll be a sign for those who have longed for his appearing as their deliverance and for those who have mocked, scoffed or twisted his words it’ll be a sign of abject terror.

Not just the context, but the syntax also.



Clauses are connected by the same syntax (grammatical form). "The sign" is followed by information about the sign. Here we are told this is the sign "of the Son of Man". We know these words are joined into the clause by their syntax.

It's been proposed that this the sign is "the Son of Man in Heaven", that the people are seeing a sign that tells them the Son of Man is in heaven.

If that were so, we should see that same Genetive case extended to "in the heaven", but it's not. "The heaven" is Dative, giving information, and in this instance, locative, and therefore is telling us where the sign is seen.

A sign will be seen. It will be seen in heaven, that is, the sky. It is the sign of the Son of Man. That would be the proper reading of the passage, according to the grammar.

Matthew 24:27 KJV
For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Much love!

 

[Truth7t7]

"truth", This is not about right or wrong, I just want to hear what you think is the sign. Whatever perspective that you come from. @Marty fox is a preterist, But I appreciate his answer because i have never heard this explanation before. Do I agree with Him? Probably not, but his view is unique and one I had never considered before.



I Like you believe the sign and its timing is determined by the fig tree (Israel) Generation, which began in 1948 when Israel became a nation in one day. A generation is said to be 70-80 years and we are living in that window right now. (Psalm 90:10)

Sorry for deviation in your thread, just answering claims made

I dont believe Israel being a nation was a sign, that's Calvary Chapel and Chuck Smith doctrine

It's the future generation that will witness the signs in the heavens and distress of the world's nations

The fig blooming shows that a season is coming, nothing more

P.S. Ole Chuck had a generation at 40 years, now it's 70-80?

Jesus Is The Lord

 

[Zao is life]

The Question in the title was asked of Me By @marks, And i thought it would be worth a post here to get some other thoughts.

Here was my response to this Question to Him:

"We do not know exactly what that sign is but it is the sixth seal. I can surmise that it is the sky rolling up like a scroll, which is the one thing that differs from the Matthew 24:29-30 account and the Revelation 6:12-14. Read the two passages as parallel accounts to see this, Below.

And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. (Revelation 6:12-14)

Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. (Matthew 24:29-30)"

My Question to all of You is what is this sign? Some other verses to consider are Acts of the Apostles 1:11, Which is the ascension verse.

I'll tell you when Jesus comes back.

Because the surrounding context of Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke 21 is what was going to occur during the time of the generation who would be alive during the destruction of the temple (.A.D 70). But Matthew 24:31 and 1 Corinthians 15:52 bear such close resemblance as to make one wonder what period Matthew 24:9, 14 and 29-31 are talking about:

1 Corinthians 15
51 Behold, I speak a mystery to you; we shall not all fall asleep, but we shall all be changed;
52 in a moment, in a glance of an eye, at the last trumpet. For a trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall all be changed.

Matthew 24
30 And then the sign of the Son of man shall appear in the heavens. And then all the tribes of the earth shall mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of the heaven with power and great glory.
31 And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.

BUT the Lord had told His disciples that when they see the AoD then those in Judea should flee to the mountains etc. So the elect would have been scattered and would be gathered following the destruction of Jerusalem?

One thing I don't believe is that the beast that is going to be destroyed by Christ when He returns, is not the same as the horn that rose up after the ten horns of the 4th beast in Daniel 7. Also, the thing that placing the fulfillment of all these prophecies in the 1st century ignores, is the fact that when Jesus comes back, He's riding on a white horse and wearing MANY crowns, as He returns as the King of (all) kings and Lord of (all) lords to take the beast and throw it into the LoF.

Preterists place all these prophecies in Daniel and Revelation in the 1st century, almost as though we will never see Jesus again, and as though the resurrection of the dead will never happen.

 

[Zao is life]

The sign was that Jesus is in heaven.

Jesus wasn’t killed because He claimed to be the messiah He was killed because He claimed to be God.

Matthew 26:64-66
62 Then the high priest stood up and said to Jesus, “Are you not going to answer? What is this testimony that these men are bringing against you?” 63 But Jesus remained silent.

The high priest said to him, “I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Messiah, the Son of God.”

64 “You have said so,” Jesus replied. “But I say to all of you: From now on you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”

65 Then the high priest tore his clothes and said, “He has spoken blasphemy! Why do we need any more witnesses? Look, now you have heard the blasphemy. 66 What do you think?”

“He is worthy of death,” they answered.

Jesus actually claimed that He would be sitting at the right hand of the Farther which was not to be the son of God but to be equal with God Himself. Jesus claimed to be the one in Daniel chapter 7

Daniel 7:13-14
13 “In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. 14 He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all nations and peoples of every language worshiped him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.

It’s the sign of the son of man in heaven that you are looking for and that sign is that Jesus was in heaven because Jerusalem was destroyed within that generation which is what Jesus predicted in Matthew chapter 24.

Matthew 24:1-2 & 34
Jesus left the temple and was walking away when his disciples came up to him to call his attention to its buildings.2 “Do you see all these things?” he asked. “Truly I tell you, not one stone here will be left on another; every one will be thrown down.”

34 Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

Jesus gave a prediction with a date on it and when it happened when He said that it would happen (within that generation)then they all would of realized that Jesus was God and in heaven sitting at the right hand of the Father.

The timely destruction of Jerusalem was that sign of the son of man that the son of man was in heaven

No. He said the sign of the son of Man would appear in the heavens (not the same as "heaven"). Very subtle change from "the sign of the son of man appearing in the heavens" to "the sign that the son of Man was in heaven in order to make it comply with Preterist theology and eschatology.

Nevertheless the most subtle changes to the Word of God is taking huge liberty.

 

[marks]

Nevertheless the most subtle changes to the Word of God is taking huge liberty.

What I seem to consistently find is so many who have different ideas about these things likewise have a high tolerance for that kind of interpretation. Which isn't interpretation at all. I can't make someone else care that certain words are used, or that certain grammar is used, but I for one care very much!

Jesus proved the continuation of human life after physical death by the tense of a verb.

Much love!

 

[Truth7t7]

Because the surrounding context of Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke 21 is what was going to occur during the time of the generation who would be alive during the destruction of the temple (.A.D 70). But Matthew 24:31 and 1 Corinthians 15:52 bear such close resemblance as to make one wonder what period Matthew 24:9, 14 and 29-31 are talking about:

1 Corinthians 15
51 Behold, I speak a mystery to you; we shall not all fall asleep, but we shall all be changed;
52 in a moment, in a glance of an eye, at the last trumpet. For a trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall all be changed.

Matthew 24
30 And then the sign of the Son of man shall appear in the heavens. And then all the tribes of the earth shall mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of the heaven with power and great glory.
31 And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.

BUT the Lord had told His disciples that when they see the AoD then those in Judea should flee to the mountains etc. So the elect would have been scattered and would be gathered following the destruction of Jerusalem?

One thing I don't believe is that the beast that is going to be destroyed by Christ when He returns, is not the same as the horn that rose up after the ten horns of the 4th beast in Daniel 7. Also, the thing that placing the fulfillment of all these prophecies in the 1st century ignores, is the fact that when Jesus comes back, He's riding on a white horse and wearing MANY crowns, as He returns as the King of (all) kings and Lord of (all) lords to take the beast and throw it into the LoF.

Preterists place all these prophecies in Daniel and Revelation in the 1st century, almost as though we will never see Jesus again, and as though the resurrection of the dead will never happen.

Jesus spoke of the "Future" generation that would be eyewitnesses of the events that precede (The Second Coming) Future

Verse 33, when you see all these things, know that it is near (The Second Coming) Future

Verse 36, of that day and hour knoweth no man, (The Second Coming) Future

Matthew 24:32-36KJV
32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

 

[marks]

I love when this happens. . . came across this in my lunchtime reading . . .

Acts 2:31-33 KJV
31) He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.
32) This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.
33) Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

So then the sign that the Son of Man had returned to the right hand of the Father was giving the Holy Spirit in public display on Pentecost.

I just LOVE how the Bible answers Everything! And timely too!



Much love!

 

[Zao is life]

Jesus spoke of the "Future" generation that would be eyewitnesses of the events that precede (The Second Coming) Future

Verse 33, when you see all these things, know that it is near (The Second Coming) Future

Verse 36, of that day and hour knoweth no man, (The Second Coming) Future

Matthew 24:32-36KJV
32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

The question the disciples asked Him, as recorded in Matthew's gospel, was a loaded question

.. and I'm about to prove to you once again how faulty the KJV is in certain verses, because the question they asked was,

Matthew 24:3 (YLT)
And when he is sitting on the mount of the Olives, the disciples came near to him by himself, saying, `Tell us, when shall these be? and what is the sign of thy presence, and of the full end of the age?' (Greek aiṓn)

αἰών aiṓn, ahee-ohn'
from the same as 104;
properly, an age; by extension, perpetuity (also past); by implication, the world; specially (Jewish) a Messianic period (present or future):--age, course, eternal, (for) ever(-more), (n-)ever, (beginning of the , while the) world (began, without end).
Compare 5550.

"The end of the Age" and "the end of the world" are only the same thing if you're an Amillennialist.

Nevertheless the Bible should be translated accurately without any theological influence, don't you think? There are a number of other places where the KJV betrays a theological influence on the part of the translators in their choice of words which they used to translate from the Greek.

So anyway, the dsicples asked the Lord,

1. When shall the temple be destroyed?
2. What will be the sign of Your coming and the end of the Age?

They had no idea at the time they were asking the question that there would be (now coming close to) at least 2,000 years in-between the first question and the second question.

It could be (I'm not saying it is) that Jesus answered both questions, without telling them about the gap between the one event and the other.

Personally I don't have an answer to the question that naturally arises among the saints of later generations. The endless debate about this is given birth and then nourished by saints adopting either the one theory or the other, i.e from the Preterist position of the person who started this thread, to your fururist only position, to believing that the Lord was talking about both periods in time.

I used to feed the baby by adopting it into this family or that, but not anymore. Just correcting the subtle changing of wording when it's done by whoever is doing it - whether the translators of the KJV or anyone else.

 

[Truth7t7]

The question the disciples asked Him, as recorded in Matthew's gospel, was a loaded question

.. and I'm about to prove to you once again how faulty the KJV is in ceratin verses, because the question they asked was,

Matthew 24:3 (YLT)
And when he is sitting on the mount of the Olives, the disciples came near to him by himself, saying, `Tell us, when shall these be? and what is the sign of thy presence, and of the full end of the age?' (Greek aiṓn)

αἰών aiṓn, ahee-ohn'
from the same as 104;
properly, an age; by extension, perpetuity (also past); by implication, the world; specially (Jewish) a Messianic period (present or future):--age, course, eternal, (for) ever(-more), (n-)ever, (beginning of the , while the) world (began, without end).
Compare 5550.

"The end of the Age" and "the end of the world" are only the same thing if you're an Amillennialist.

Nevertheless the Bible should be translated accurately without any theological influence, don't you think? There are a number of other places where the KJV betrays a theological influence on the part of the translators in their choice of words which they used to translate from the Greek.

So anyway, the dsicples asked the Lord,

1. When shall the temple be destroyed?
2. What will be the sign of Your coming and the end of the Age?

They had no idea at the time they were asking the question that there would be (now coming close to) at least 2,000 years in-between the first question and the second question.

It could be (I'm not saying it is) that Jesus answered both questions, without telling them about the gap between the one event and the other.

Personally I don't have an answer to the question that naturally arises among the saints of later generations. The endless debate is given birth and nourished by saints adopting either the one theory or the other, i.e from the Preterist position of the person who started this thread, to your furerist only position, to believing that the Lord was talking about both periods in time).

I used to feed the baby by adopting it into this family or that, but not anymore. Just correcting the subtle changing of wording when it's done by whoever is doing it - whether the translators of the KJV or anyone else.

You give complete disregard in distraction to the claim in the post below, do you deny the "Future" (Second Coming) is the topic of the verses below?

Jesus spoke of the "Future" generation that would be eyewitnesses of the events that precede (The Second Coming) Future

Verse 33, when you see all these things, know that it is near (The Second Coming) Future

Verse 36, of that day and hour knoweth no man, (The Second Coming) Future

Matthew 24:32-36KJV
32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

 

[Zao is life]

I love when this happens. . . came across this in my lunchtime reading . . .

Acts 2:31-33 KJV
31) He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.
32) This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.
33) Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

So then the sign that the Son of Man had returned to the right hand of the Father was giving the Holy Spirit in public display on Pentecost.

I just LOVE how the Bible answers Everything! And timely too!



Much love!

Are you saying that it supports your position or the position of @David H. and @Marty fox and @Iconoclast?

 

[Zao is life]

You give complete disregard in distraction to the claim in the post below, do you deny the "Future" (Second Coming) is the topic of the verses below?

Jesus spoke of the "Future" generation that would be eyewitnesses of the events that precede (The Second Coming) Future

Verse 33, when you see all these things, know that it is near (The Second Coming) Future

Verse 36, of that day and hour knoweth no man, (The Second Coming) Future

Matthew 24:32-36KJV
32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

Why do you assume that when Jesus said "this generation" that He wasn't talking about the 1st century Jews who lived A.D30-70?

Why does @David H. assume that He did not mean the generation that will be around at the time of His return?

@David H. and @Marty fox and @Iconoclast all have some very valid points.

Jesus had told them about the destruction of the termple. When did that happen, do you think? (Because that's the context of the entire passage, unless the Lord was answering both questions without telling them about the gap in time in-between the one event and the other).

Why should we cut 'n paste? (i.e cut the destruction of the temple and the tribulation involved out of the Olivet Discourse altogether and paste the entire Olivet Discourse into thousands of years later?)