What is the state of the dead in the afterlife?

[Aunty Jane]

We'll never be good enough or measure up.
I thought that was the point of grace and mercy.

Sin is in all of us but not forever.....”grace and mercy” have limits as the Scriptures rightly point out.....God’s patience can run out...as it did many times with Israel. He gave them time to repent and when they did he blessed them...when they stuck to their unrighteousness conduct, he punished them, often severely.

What does “grace and mercy” mean then? What is it’s purpose? Is it a blanket cover for deliberate sin?
That’s not what the Bible tells us. Choosing to obey God in spite of our sinful tendencies is what grace and mercy are for....a reward for “standing firm against the machinations of the devil”.

Luke 18:13 NIV
“But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven,
but beat his breast and said, ‘God, have mercy on me, a sinner.’

Why was the tax collector more righteous than the Pharisee? He was humble....humility is what God looks for in his servants because those with responsibilities in his service can get an exalted view of themselves as Paul warned about. Whatever “thorn” he had was to keep him humble.
That’s why there was no hierarchy among those first Christians...they operated as a cohesive body because no one man was allowed to dictate to anyone. The consensus of the body was always appealed to when serious issues arose....and prayer and the operation of God’s spirit was always sought in their decisions.

 

[Aunty Jane]

'Death' NEVER means 'cease to exist' in the Bible. NEVER!

Humans never cease to exist with God because he remembers every last one of them.....even those who did bad things .....all are raised from the same place...Sheol/hades/the grave. (John 5:28-29)

Revelation 20:12-15
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books.
13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works.14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.

What a shame you overlooked what else that passage of Scripture states...this is what is called “cherry picking”.....that is reading over some parts whilst ignoring everything else that is said...

First of all, the Revelation is a vision of the future, so what John was given was to be fulfilled at a future time....when it was time for the judgment. Has that happened yet Jack?

Do you see that “the dead” are being judged “according to their works”....what works does a dead person do?....and also where they were resurrected from...?
The “sea and death and hades” all “delivered up their dead”......it’s called resurrection, Jack.
All these people were dead and are brought back to life.

For those who fail to be found in the “Book of life”....it’s because they were basically so ignorant that you couldn’t teach them anything.....it’s not that they can’t know, but that don’t want to....leading to dead works...of no value to God at all.

The “lake of fire”.....is not a literal lake, but the symbol of eternal death...which is why it’s called “the second death”.....it’s a death from which no one returns.

It would be a really good thing if at any time you actually knew what you were talking about.

 

[Jay Ross]

What is their state in the After Life? My opinion is that they are still lost, just like they were on this side before the toes started curling.

 

[Jack]

2 PETER 3:8
KJ21
But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing: that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Why does the Bible even have these words? "you shall surely die" "dust you shall return" "The dead no nothing" Ecc. 9:5 "Those who sleep in the earth will rise up" Isaiah 26:19 "Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake" Daniel 12:2-3 "And I will raise them up at the last day" NIV John 6:44 "And you, Daniel, go rest to the end, and you shall rise in your time at the end of days." Daniel 12:13 Peshitta Holy Bible

Should these words be included in our understanding of what is true?

When Aunty agrees with you that means your WRONG!

 

[Jack]

Humans never cease to exist with God because he remembers every last one of them.....even those who did bad things .....all are raised from the same place...Sheol/hades/the grave. (John 5:28-29)

And BILLIONS of humans will burn FOREVER in torment.

What a shame you overlooked what else that passage of Scripture states...this is what is called “cherry picking”.....that is reading over some parts whilst ignoring everything else that is said...

First of all, the Revelation is a vision of the future, so what John was given was to be fulfilled at a future time....when it was time for the judgment. Has that happened yet Jack?

Do you see that “the dead” are being judged “according to their works”....what works does a dead person do?....

The works they did before death! You clearly were educated at Kingdom Hall!

and also where they were resurrected from...?
The “sea and death and hades” all “delivered up their dead”......it’s called resurrection, Jack.
All these people were dead and are brought back to life.

For those who fail to be found in the “Book of life”....it’s because they were basically so ignorant that you couldn’t teach them anything.....it’s not that they can’t know, but that don’t want to....leading to dead works...of no value to God at all.

Sounds just like Kingdom Hall puppets!

The “lake of fire”.....is not a literal lake, but the symbol of eternal death...which is why it’s called “the second death”.....it’s a death from which no one returns.

JW's LOVE "symbolical" whent the don't like what God said!

It would be a really good thing if at any time you actually knew what you were talking about.

I know JW's twist the Hell out of nearly every verse in the Bible to change the perfectly clear meaning. Just like Satan.

 

[walter]

When Aunty agrees with you that means your WRONG!

Please, should't the scripture context be important to our understanding? Not my words.

Only scriptures should support our fundamental beliefs, do you agree?

 

[Jack]

Please, should't the scripture context be important to our understanding? Not my words.

Only scriptures should support our fundamental beliefs, do you agree?

Exactly, that's why I said "When Aunty agrees with you that means your most likely WRONG!"

 

[walter]

Exactly, that's why I said "When Aunty agrees with you that means your most likely WRONG!"

Aunty Jane and I belong to the same faith, but we both support our fundamental beliefs by scripture context alone!

But we both may have a different way to explain it?

 

[Jack]

Aunty Jane and I belong to same faith,

You have my DEEP sympathy!

but we both support our fundamental beliefs by scripture context alone!

But we both may have a different way to explain it?

And the way JW's explain it is almost always attacks on the Christian Bible. Just like the Devil.

 

[walter]

And the way you explain it is almost always attacks on the Christian Bible. Just like the Devil.

I use the Bibles on Biblehub.com most of the time, aren't these the same Bibles that you use?

Jesus said let the dead bury the dead.

The word dead here is used in two different ways, does that make me just like the devil if I choose a perspective that agrees with the majority of the scriptures?

 

[Jack]

I use the Bibles on Biblehub.com most of the time, aren't these the same Bibles that you use?

Jesus said let the dead bury the dead.

The word dead here is used in two different ways, does that make me just like the devil if I choose a perspective that agrees with the majority of the scriptures?

The Bible means what it says, not what JW's say it means. Do you have a clue what Jesus said about THE FIRE? Several times!

 

[walter]

The Bible means what it says, not what JW's say it means. Do you have a clue what Jesus said about THE FIRE? Several times!

You're exactly right just read the scripture the words themselves explain the meaning.

 

[Jack]

You're exactly right just read the scripture the words themselves explain the meaning.

Amen! Jesus is God and Hell Fire is "FOREVER"!

 

[walter]

Amen! Jesus is God and Hell Fire is "FOREVER"!

Jesus also says they perish at John 3:16 and at John 3:36 Jesus says they will not see life.

Why do you have to pick a perspective that does not agree with majority scriptures from Genesis to Revelation

Why ignore the majority?

 

[Jack]

Jesus also says they perish at John 3:16 and at John 3:36 Jesus says they will not see life.

Doesn't the GB allow you to quote Scripture?

 

[walter]

Doesn't the GB allow you to quote Scripture?

thanks for the conversation.

 

[Jack]

thanks for the conversation.

Jesus is God and Hell Fire is FOREVER. Come back when you can quote some Scripture for us.

 

[walter]

Starting with Genesis 3:19 "until you return to the ground, since you were taken from it. For you are dust, and you will return to dust.”

Daniel 12:2
And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, Some to everlasting life, Some to shame and everlasting contempt.
New King James Version

Brenton Septuagint Translation The Septuagint Lxx Bible is the scriptures in Greek which dates before the first century.
Psalms 37:29 "But the righteous shall inherit the earth, and dwell upon it for ever".
Psalms 37:11 "But the meek shall inherit the earth; and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace."

John 12:48
The one who rejects Me and does not accept My teachings has one who judges him: the word which I spoke. That will judge him on the last day. New American Standard Bible

John 6:44
No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. King James Bible

.........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

Luke12:32
Fear not, little flock; for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom. King James Bible

1 Corinthians 15:51-53
51 Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed— 52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. New King James Bible

Jesus also says: And so, dear brothers and sisters who belong to God and are partners with those called to heaven, think carefully about this Jesus whom we declare to be God’s messenger and High Priest. Hebrews 3:1 New living Translation

Lu 22:28-30
28 You are those who have stood by me in my trials. 29 And I confer on you a kingdom, just as my Father conferred one on me, 30 so that you may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom and sit on thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. NIV

Rev 20:5-6
The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were over. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over these; they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for [the] thousand years. New American Bible

Summary for those who sleep: "those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake" "the righteous shall inherit the earth, and dwell upon it for ever" "I will raise him up at the last day"

Summary for the little flock who goes to Heaven: "Fear not, little flock; for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom"
"We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed" "so, dear brothers and sisters who belong to God and are partners with those called to heaven" "And I confer on you a kingdom, just as my Father conferred one on me, 30 so that you may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom and sit on thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel." "Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over these; they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for [the] thousand years."

Scripture "context" alone for our understanding.

 

[walter]

Why would Jesus offer Everlasting life, if people already go on living after death in heaven or hell? John 3:36

 

[St. SteVen]

Why would Jesus offer Everlasting life, if people already go on living after death in heaven or hell? John 3:36

In my view, the afterlife is not the same as "eternal life".
When does life begin, and when does it end?

If one has eternal life (in the here and now) will they ever die?

But to address your question:
The eternal life that Jesus offers begins in the here and now and carries over into the afterlife.
That's why Jesus offers it. There are eternal blessing on this earth before we pass away physically.

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