Where does the Bible say...

[ReChoired]

Your saying that Scripture is interpreted by the Holy Spirit thru you

Again. Leai (No.) This is no word game. I am not attempting in any way for you to believe me. I am asking you to believe what is already written. God interprets God in scripture. You don't need me at all. May your eyes be opened soon.

Malo (Samoan). Basically, "Hey, hi." (and a few other things).

 

[Marymog]

Quote ...backlit.... Do you know the meaning of the word Antichrist?

Then you would understand the Jesus stands in three distinct ministerial roles, and they are spoken of in a discussion between Jesus and the Pharisees. We can read of this exchange in Matthew 12 and 13.
Matthew 12:4 Have ye not read what David did, when he was an hungred, and they that were with him; How he entered into the house of God, and did eat the shewbread, which was not lawful for him to eat, neither for them which were with him, but only for the priests?
5 Or have ye not read in the law, how that on the sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless?
6 But I say unto you, That in this place is one greater than the temple.
The temple to the Jews was the centerpiece of their worship. Everything they believed in revolved around the temple, the festivals and holy days, its rituals and services, its priesthood. (Sound familiar?) But Jesus claimed to be even greater than the temple, which would have included everything within the temple, eg the law and the very High Priest who would no doubt have heard a report on these words, if he wasn't there in person. Jesus the true High Priest Who is now serving before the Father in the true heavenly temple/sanctuary in the company of angels. There is where our faith is to be focused on. There, in heaven, is where all plans are laid, and are carried out through the ministry of angels here on earth. There, and no where else, is where all authority finds its source and center. There is only one who can be greater than the law of God...the Lawgiver.
Matt. 13:39 But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:
40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale’s belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
41 The men of Nineveh shall rise in judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: because they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here.

Here the Jews are seeking a sign. They want miracles and proofs of Jesus claims. They don't want the truth, all they want is to trap Jesus into failure. To destroy His reputation. To relegate Jesus into someone undesirable, unworthy, untruthful, and below their own sense of self righteous dignity. They were simply wanting to protect their own exalted positions of power. (Sound familiar?) But Jesus claimed a stature greater than Jonah, who everyone must admit had a very successful evangelism campaign. Thus Jesus was a greater Prophet than Jonah.

42 The queen of the south shall rise up in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for she came from the uttermost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and, behold, a greater than Solomon is here.

People came from all the known world to hear Solomon. Ambassadors, Kings and Queens, Presidents, Prime Ministers and leaders of world churches are lining up at the door of the Vatican to seek the favour of the Pope. Even you and others on this forum admit that salvation is impossible without Papal approval. Yet Jesus is here claiming greater Kingship even than the greatest of old testament kings. I would suggest that Jesus is greater than even the Pope, but sadly, Catholics are content to trust a man's institution for their salvation. Jesus is the true High Priest, the true Prophet, the true King of Kings. The Papal system has placed the Pope on that exalted throne, which makes that system the Antichrist...that which replaces Christ with a counterfeit.

Bible study Backlit.

I will not waste my time addressing the flat out lies in your last paragraph. I know you will never apologize for them since you truly believe them.

As for the rest of your post you sprinkled in some truth but twisted other words to fit what you believe instead of what Scripture teaches: 2 Peter 3:16

Please run from whomever taught you that.

Mary

 

[Marymog]

Again. Leai (No.) This is no word game. I am not attempting in any way for you to believe me. I am asking you to believe what is already written. God interprets God in scripture. You don't need me at all. May your eyes be opened soon.

Malo (Samoan). Basically, "Hey, hi." (and a few other things).

Thanks for the translation.

My eyes have been opened and your right....I don't.

Mary

 

[Brakelite]

I will not waste my time addressing the flat out lies in your last paragraph. I know you will never apologize for them since you truly believe them.

As for the rest of your post you sprinkled in some truth but twisted other words to fit what you believe instead of what Scripture teaches: 2 Peter 3:16

Please run from whomever taught you that.

Mary

Every reformer taught the same and the Roman church sought to destroy every one of them, because so many people realised they were teaching the truth and this truth turned Europe upside down. Your rejection of that truth is sad, but not surprising.
Apologise? By your own testimony you declare your church as your master. Not Jesus... Your church. Thus in your mind, by your own testimony declared just a few pages previously in this thread, the church has displaced Jesus from His rightful throne. This is Antichrist.
Instead of...a replacement for... Christ. See Strongs concordance number 473.

 

[Marymog]

Every reformer taught the same and the Roman church sought to destroy every one of them, because so many people realised they were teaching the truth and this truth turned Europe upside down. Your rejection of that truth is sad, but not surprising.
Apologise? By your own testimony you declare your church as your master. Not Jesus... Your church. Thus in your mind, by your own testimony declared just a few pages previously in this thread, the church has displaced Jesus from His rightful throne. This is Antichrist.
Instead of...a replacement for... Christ. See Strongs concordance number 473.

Good morning backlit,

Every original Reformer had a man who reformed him and then another man reformed him etc. etc. to the point that their is no truth...just every mans opinion. sooooo which reformer do you choose as having the truth? You choose you as having the truth. You are your own master.

I choose what Scripture says: the church is the pillar and foundation of truth.

Mary

 

[theefaith]

That's blasphemy. And a lie.
No priest ever died for my sins. No priest is entitled to be deemed a mediator between me and my Lord. God saves through his grace and we are saved through our faith in Christ. Who took the sins of the world upon himself on the cross, that whosoever believeth in him shall be saved and have eternal life.

Come the day of accountability there shall be many Catholics standing before the throne of God to account of their lives and deeds. However, they shall be preceded in that line by their leaders who through a man made construct set up an idol in the place of God. Surrounded it with a wall, and anointed it as that vehicle which has all power on earth to speak for God and edit what he had to say to the world through his word, the scriptures.
You dear soul when arrived in that line shall have a very long wait till your turn.
But it is coming.
And you have my deepest sympathy if you are there standing behind those former leaders. For when they discover God saves, not man, you will then and far too late discover you lived a lie and died within it. Eternally.

May God have mercy and show you the path of righteousness for his namesake. In Jesus name I ask this for all RCC members here and in the world, Amen.

but Jesus is a priest!

and he saves thru grace made available to us thru faith and the sacraments

 

[Brakelite]

Every original Reformer had a man who reformed him and then another man reformed him etc. etc

That's not correct. They're were reformers in different parts of the world who had no contact with one another yet arrived at the same answers. Why? Because they read and studied their Bibles. Go back and read what @ReChoired was teaching you regarding interpretation and how we arrive at Truth. God's word interprets itself. As Peter said, scripture is of no private interpretation. That God Himself teaches His people isn't a new concept.

 

[WaterSong]

but Jesus is a priest!

and he saves thru grace made available to us thru faith and the sacraments

Jesus IS GOD! He's not a priest!
Tell me, where in the scripture did Jesus himself say, go forth into all the world and spread the Gospel. And teach that those who hear it must come to a priest in order to receive the FREE GIFT of God's grace Salvation?

One verse!
Just one.

John 3:16-17
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him."

Notice? It does not say, might be saved through the office of the priests.

 

[BarneyFife]

but Jesus is a priest!

and he saves thru grace made available to us thru faith and the sacraments

Isn't The Lord's Supper a memorial, and not a vehicle of grace? Isn't this very clear in Scripture?

 

[BarneyFife]

Jesus IS GOD! He's not a priest!

Isn't Christ depicted all throughout the book of Hebrews as our true High Priest?

 

[WaterSong]

Isn't Christ depicted all throughout the book of Hebrews as our true High Priest?

Where did Jesus refer to himself as a high priest?
What scripture please.

All through the OT the office of High Priest was an office of mortals appointed by God. Even in Paul's epistle to the Hebrews this is so.
Hebrews 5:1 NKJV) For every high priest taken from among men is appointed for men in things pertaining to God, that he may offer both gifts and sacrifices for sins.

Jesus as did Paul, taught the truth of God through the subjective imagery particular to Judaism. That the Hebrews, the first converts to "Christianity", would understand. This is why many of Jesus' parables derived from the OT. Those parables his people would then recognize as he, their Messiah come, related them as having meaning now in the fulfillment of his arrival.

This does not mean that Jesus holds a mortal office, per the scriptures, appointed by....Jesus, who was God.
God is Jesus, Jesus is God. Jesus sits at the right of the throne because in Judaism, filled with symbolism even in their number system, is the hand of power.
Jesus saves! And even in scripture, the priests, the high priests, weren't God. They were the mediators! As they presume to be now in the RCC.
However, being we are of God, as is all creation and created, we need no mediator, no sinful mortal man holding an office appointed by other mortals, to lead us to Salvation.

Whosoever believeth in him, not a priest, God, whosoever believeth in Jesus, who is God, shall not perish but have everlasting life.
Believe! Priests do not save!
If someone believes that, God help them.
For they'd also have to prove God said that.
And they cannot.

 

[BarneyFife]

Where did Jesus refer to himself as a high priest?

Who said He did?

Even in Paul's epistle to the Hebrews this is so.

No, it is not so.

Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens; (Hebrews 8:1)​

Jesus sits at the right of the throne

So He can't multitask?

 

[WaterSong]

Who said He did?

Your prior post is then moot. Thanks.

 

[BarneyFife]

Your prior post is then moot. Thanks.

No, This is moot:

Where did Jesus refer to himself as a high priest?

 

[WaterSong]

No, This is moot:

Avoidance. I see. Let me assist your understanding.
When you say Jesus was our High Priest, per Paul in Hebrews, Jesus must have identified as that in order to sustain the context of your statement as pertained to Salvation by priests. Being "Jesus was a high priest", per Hebrews.
In other words? Jesus would have had to state he was the High Priest first! Before Paul could attribute that status to him and then, by allusion, as you and your church have done, impart that in order to be saved one must have a priest.

See also the example by theefaith.
theefaith said: ↑
You may repent but you cannot be saved without a priest

 

[Illuminator]

Isn't The Lord's Supper a memorial, and not a vehicle of grace? Isn't this very clear in Scripture?

The Lord's Supper is not a sentimental recall.
Luke 22:19; 1 Cor. 11:24-25 – the translation of Jesus’ words of consecration is “touto poieite tan eman anamnasin.” Jesus literally said “offer this as my memorial sacrifice.” The word “poiein” (do) refers to offering a sacrifice (see, e.g., Exodus 29:38-39, where God uses the same word – poieseis – regarding the sacrifice of the lambs on the altar). The word “anamnesis” (remembrance) also refers to a sacrifice which is really or actually made present in time by the power of God, as it reminds God of the actual event (see, e.g., Heb. 10:3; Num. 10:10). It is not just a memorial of a past event, but a past event made present in time.

In other words, the “sacrifice” is the “memorial” or “reminder.” If the Eucharist weren’t a sacrifice, Luke would have used the word “mnemosunon” (which is the word used to describe a nonsacrificial memorial. See, for example, Matt. 26:13; Mark 14:9; and especially Acts 10:4). So there are two memorials, one sacrificial (which Jesus instituted), and one non-sacrificial.

Lev. 24:7 – the word “memorial” in Hebrew in the sacrificial sense is “azkarah” which means to actually make present (see Lev. 2:2,9,16;5:12;6:5; Num.5:26 where “azkarah” refers to sacrifices that are currently offered and thus present in time). Jesus’ instruction to offer the bread and wine (which He changed into His body and blood) as a “memorial offering” demonstrates that the offering of His body and blood is made present in time over and over again.

Num. 10:10 – in this verse, “remembrance” refers to a sacrifice, not just a symbolic memorial. So Jesus’ command to offer the memorial “in remembrance” of Him demonstrates that the memorial offering is indeed a sacrifice currently offered. It is a re-presentation of the actual sacrifice made present in time. It is as if the curtain of history is drawn and Calvary is made present to us.

Mal. 1:10-11 – Jesus’ command to his apostles to offer His memorial sacrifice of bread and wine which becomes His body and blood fulfills the prophecy that God would reject the Jewish sacrifices and receive a pure sacrifice offered in every place. This pure sacrifice of Christ is sacramentally re-presented from the rising of the sun to its setting in every place, as Malachi prophesied.

 

[BarneyFife]

Avoidance. I see. Let me assist your understanding.
When you say Jesus was our High Priest, per Paul in Hebrews, Jesus must have identified as that in order to sustain the context of your statement as pertained to Salvation by priests. Being "Jesus was a high priest", per Hebrews.
In other words? Jesus would have had to state he was the High Priest first! Before Paul could attribute that status to him and then, by allusion, as you and your church have done, impart that in order to be saved one must have a priest.

See also the example by theefaith.
theefaith said: ↑
You may repent but you cannot be saved without a priest

Avoiding nonsense, yeah.

 

[WaterSong]

Avoiding nonsense, yeah.

Unable to respond on the merits? That's fine.

God Bless.

 

[BarneyFife]

The Lord's Supper is not a sentimental recall.
Luke 22:19; 1 Cor. 11:24-25 – the translation of Jesus’ words of consecration is “touto poieite tan eman anamnasin.” Jesus literally said “offer this as my memorial sacrifice.” The word “poiein” (do) refers to offering a sacrifice (see, e.g., Exodus 29:38-39, where God uses the same word – poieseis – regarding the sacrifice of the lambs on the altar). The word “anamnesis” (remembrance) also refers to a sacrifice which is really or actually made present in time by the power of God, as it reminds God of the actual event (see, e.g., Heb. 10:3; Num. 10:10). It is not just a memorial of a past event, but a past event made present in time.

In other words, the “sacrifice” is the “memorial” or “reminder.” If the Eucharist weren’t a sacrifice, Luke would have used the word “mnemosunon” (which is the word used to describe a nonsacrificial memorial. See, for example, Matt. 26:13; Mark 14:9; and especially Acts 10:4). So there are two memorials, one sacrificial (which Jesus instituted), and one non-sacrificial.

Lev. 24:7 – the word “memorial” in Hebrew in the sacrificial sense is “azkarah” which means to actually make present (see Lev. 2:2,9,16;5:12;6:5; Num.5:26 where “azkarah” refers to sacrifices that are currently offered and thus present in time). Jesus’ instruction to offer the bread and wine (which He changed into His body and blood) as a “memorial offering” demonstrates that the offering of His body and blood is made present in time over and over again.

Num. 10:10 – in this verse, “remembrance” refers to a sacrifice, not just a symbolic memorial. So Jesus’ command to offer the memorial “in remembrance” of Him demonstrates that the memorial offering is indeed a sacrifice currently offered. It is a re-presentation of the actual sacrifice made present in time. It is as if the curtain of history is drawn and Calvary is made present to us.

Mal. 1:10-11 – Jesus’ command to his apostles to offer His memorial sacrifice of bread and wine which becomes His body and blood fulfills the prophecy that God would reject the Jewish sacrifices and receive a pure sacrifice offered in every place. This pure sacrifice of Christ is sacramentally re-presented from the rising of the sun to its setting in every place, as Malachi prophesied.

Sorry, but I've heard this interpretation before and I remain unconvinced. Mental gymnastics is not my thing. I prefer simple, plain reading to sophistry.

 

[Illuminator]

Isn't Christ depicted all throughout the book of Hebrews as our true High Priest?

Heb. 9:23 – in this verse, the author writes that the Old Testament sacrifices were only copies of the heavenly things, but now heaven has better “sacrifices” than these. Why is the heavenly sacrifice called “sacrifices,” in the plural? Jesus died once. This is because, while Christ’s sacrifice is transcendent in heaven, it touches down on earth and is sacramentally re-presented over and over again from the rising of the sun to its setting around the world by the priests of Christ’s Church. This is because all moments to God are present in their immediacy, and when we offer the memorial sacrifice to God, we ask God to make the sacrifice that is eternally present to Him also present to us. Jesus’ sacrifice also transcends time and space because it was the sacrifice of God Himself.

Heb. 9:23 – the Eucharistic sacrifice also fulfills Jer. 33:18 that His kingdom will consist of a sacrificial priesthood forever, and fulfills Zech. 9:15 that the sons of Zion shall drink blood like wine and be saved.

Heb. 13:15 – this “sacrifice of praise” refers to the actual sacrifice or “toda” offering of Christ who, like the Old Testament toda offerings, now must be consumed. See, for example, Lev. 7:12-15; 22:29-30 which also refer to the “sacrifice of praise” in connection with animals who had to be eaten after they were sacrificed.

Heb. 2:17; 3:1; 4:14; 8:1; 9:11,25; 10:19,22 – Jesus is repeatedly described as “High Priest.” But in order to be a priest, “it is necessary for [Jesus] to have something to offer.” Heb. 8:3. This is the offering of the eternal sacrifice of His body and blood to the Father.

Heb. 5:6,10; 6:20; 7:15,17 – these verses show that Jesus restores the father-son priesthood after Melchizedek. Jesus is the new priest and King of Jerusalem and feeds the new children of Abraham with His body and blood. This means that His eternal sacrifice is offered in the same manner as the bread and wine offered by Melchizedek in Gen. 14:18. But the bread and wine that Jesus offers is different, just as the Passover Lamb of the New Covenant is different. The bread and wine become His body and blood by the overshadowing of the Holy Spirit.

Heb. 4:3 – God’s works were finished from the foundation of the world. This means that God’s works, including Christ’s sacrifice (the single act that secured the redemption of our souls and bodies), are forever present in eternity. Jesus’ suffering is over and done with (because suffering was earthly and temporal), but His sacrifice is eternal, because His priesthood is eternal (His victimized state was only temporal).