Where is hell? Where is heaven?

[Dcopymope]

Then you retract your statement that Jesus was wrong?



Peace be with you!

If its about his statement referring to you as a gentile believer, then no I do not retract a thing. The pre-trib rapture is strictly about Jacobs descendants. He makes that very clear in revelation from the start, and doesn't take place at the seventh trumpet at all. In revelation, the last trumpet ushers in the last three and a half years of the tribulation, or what Yahshuah calls the "hour of temptation". It has nothing to do with any rapture.

(Revelation 3:9-10) "Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. {10} Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth."

 

[BarneyFife]

Are you denying the literal, eternal Biblical Hell fire?

How can one deny a thing which doesn't exist? There is no literal, eternal, Biblical Hellfire, so there's nothing to deny.

 

[BarneyFife]

Speaking the truth in love requires one to be faithful to Scripture in all things the church is to keep!

And aren't you glad you are the one who decides what those "all things" are?

 

[BarneyFife]

But if we are to serve them with divine power, we must have doctrine correctly established in our souls.

How do I know if I'm serving "with divine power" and with "doctrine correctly established" in my soul?

 

[BarneyFife]

...and to think, I thought that I was slightly harsh on my last post to you, apparently not!

Apparently, I'm just a troll.

 

[DNB]

Apparently, I'm just a troll.

Is that a label?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Extra biblical books?

So you do not believe that God inspired men to write even 39 Old Testament books? What I cited to you was from the writings of Solomon. Jesus said this of Solomon:

"The queen of the south shall rise up in the judgment with the men of this generation, and condemn them: for she came from the utmost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and, behold, a greater than Solomon is here." Luke 11:31

What I have seen in the writings of Solomon are good ways for carnal men to live as they are able: Ecclesiastes, Proverbs and Song of Solomon.

But Solomon also writes of the ways that are beyond any carnal man alone, the impossible things for example:

"Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.
Be not wise in thine own eyes: fear the LORD, and depart from evil." Prov 3:5-7

"Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man." Ecc 12:13

Peter confirms that many of these things are beyond mortal/carnal man alone:

"Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?" Acts 15:10

Jesus and Paul however show that there is a way for men to do the impossible:

"And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible." Mark 10:27

"To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:" Col. 1:27



Men have always been consuming garbage starting with Adam and Eve. They still are today... including many who carry the label of Christian.

I do not believe that study alone leads to truth! Study alone by a carnally directed mind, even a mind on the order of the brain of Einstein, goes to the verse I quoted from Solomon.

"...much study is a weariness of the flesh." Ecc 12:12

Study is necessary as the verse you cited states to be approved of God, but Not to obtain truth. Study when led by the Holy Spirit may lead us to truth, but this is the verse you should be quoting here:

"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 14:26

I was referring to the "many books". Especially today Christian Booksellers have no end of books that can consume your time and keep youfrom SCripture.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I appreciate the sincerity of your words, but when I back slid in the early 1990s [don't change the subject by trying telling me now that I was not saved in the 1st place] I had been involved in very intense Bible study for years already, reading and studying for long hours to somehow attain to the place where I thought Enoch must have been to be translated [Gen 5:24, Heb 11:5]. I was wrong to believe that my brain or any man's brain could get me there by any amount of study. After 10 years God took me back to Him but only after going through a severe chastisement I won't describe at the moment.

That was in 2002. I have returned to my Bible studies, but no longer depending upon my brain which was failing me in the natural already anyway. The simple way to see what I have seen is to understand why Peter already walking on the top of the water toward Jesus began to sink and why and how he was then saved in that moment. Did Peter walk on water after that? He most certainly did! Peter's experience describes my own.

Well I am glad you are allowing the Word its place. Sounds like you did what I did. Took in the Word but not allowed it to be life. I do nto know if what we went through was chastisement, but God stopping us to let all we had learned to transfer from the head to teh heart. that can be a painful process. I know.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

And aren't you glad you are the one who decides what those "all things" are?

Well as I am not one of those who are part of the "all things" police, your answer is moot. But as a teacher, I do tell people lots about doctrine.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

How do I know if I'm serving "with divine power" and with "doctrine correctly established" in my soul?

To the first: God will inform you. His plan is different fro all of us while His will is the same for all of us! If you are failing in His plan fro you- He will let you know somehow!

As to the second: Know the NT well. Example: I had a huge discussion with a woman pastor. I told her she was not acting in accord with the Word of God. she of course disagreed. She argued from re-interpretations of the word and culture and custom and other things. But she is not acting with doctrine correctly established.

None of us will be perfect in it, but we should never be satisfied with where we are in our walk with god. Content? yes! satisfied, No!

 

[amadeus]

I was referring to the "many books". Especially today Christian Booksellers have no end of books that can consume your time and keep youfrom SCripture.

I have a whole lot of books for reference but with one exception I only read the Bible. The only exception is a devotional, "My Utmost For His Highest" by Oswald Chambers. I read one page from it each morning to close my Bible reading.

 

[BarneyFife]

Is that a label?

Sure is. But, hey, I laid it on myself. I hope a bit of trolling does not necessarily a troll make.

 

[DNB]

Sure is. But, hey, I laid it on myself. I hope a bit of trolling does not necessarily a troll make.

...'a bit', not necessarily, but time will tell...

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I have a whole lot of books for reference but with one exception I only read the Bible. The only exception is a devotional, "My Utmost For His Highest" by Oswald Chambers. I read one page from it each morning to close my Bible reading.

I love Chambers!

 

[Waiting on him]

Worms are like people. They continuously are producing offspring. In this sense the human race does not die. As we never run out of people, we also never run out of worms.

These worms, are they flesh?

 

[Waiting on him]

Yes, you're suffering from a case of hermeneutical hyper-literalism. I meant to mention that in my previous post, but, I anticipate that predominantly, your alleged plethora of support text will be out of context, or not taking into consideration the stages of death, which I have been incessantly predicating.

We die and are buried, then what? Are we raised to Judgement, so that the previous death was not final, as you so emphatically assert? Or, as some say, we are in paradise until Judgement day, ...so that no one actually died yet? I believe in soul-sleep, the body dies, but the spirit is in dormancy until Christ returns. So, your principle of death means death, how does that apply to physical death and Judgement day, where the latter you imply will be the 2nd or final death?

Until Christ returns from where?

 

[Waiting on him]

Brother Paul received many stripes.

Why?

 

[Waiting on him]

Hell is quoted in revelation as being this looking forward to of fiery indignation, and before Christ and the angels. My father passed last Monday, and for a long time I’ve been full of indignation feeling as if I was treated unfairly. I also witness others in this same wake.

When I read scripture especially in the gospels I see many whom are indignant for many reasons, even His very disciples. In the acts and epistles I see this indignant position as having no place. In the first act upon receiving the Holy Spirit Peter and John go to the temple where they are beaten and possibly stripped of their clothes, but instead of going somewhere to pout and complain they petition the Spirit for more boldness.

 

[BarneyFife]

My father passed last Monday,

I'm very sorry.

 

[Behold]

Heaven is found at the end of a Christ receiving life

Hell is found at the end of a Christ rejecting life.