Who are the “other sheep” of John 10:16? (For Jehovah's Witnesses)

[RR144]

They are the only other ones who will be saved-they have to be the other sheep not of that fold.

The Bible speaks of the church as Jehovah’s flock (Acts 20:29; 1 Pet 5:2). Up until the conversion of Cornelius, the Gospel invitation had NOT been made available to the gentiles. But that changed suddenly about AD 36. Of the conversion of Cornelius’ household, we read in Acts 10:45, “And the faithful ones that had come with Peter who were of those circumcised were amazed, because the free gift of the holy spirit was being poured out also upon people of the nations.” NWT.

The gentile Christians could not be invited until after the 70 weeks (Dan 9:24) for Israel were completed (AD 36). Of that final week [a day = a year], we read “And he must keep the covenant in force for the many for one week” Dan 9:27 NWT). That covenant was Jehovah’s 70 weeks agreement with Israel. It was in the last half of the 70th week, three and a half years after the cross, that the great work was done amongst the Jews.

Applying the “other sheep” to the new gentile converts is the evident meaning and it would take strong additional scriptural evidence to convince the honest student otherwise. There is no direct indication in the Bible that these “other sheep” are referring only to the “Great Crowd” (true Christians who will not be part of the Little Flock.” Another reasonable application would be to apply this to the billions of mankind that will be awakened from the dead in Paradise earth and there have an opportunity to follow Jehovah in obedience forever. Without further compelling evidence, applying the “Other Sheep” to the “Great Crowd” is building a doctrine from a scripture taken out of context. This reminds us of the Catholic Church misapplication of Matt 16:18 which says, “You are Peter, and on this rock-mass I will build my congregation, and the gates of Ha’des will not overpower it.” (NWT) Based on an unsupportable misapplication of this text, the Catholic Church believes that the papacy represents an “unbroken” line of apostolic succession from Peter to the present day.

 

[Keiw]

The Bible speaks of the church as Jehovah’s flock (Acts 20:29; 1 Pet 5:2). Up until the conversion of Cornelius, the Gospel invitation had NOT been made available to the gentiles. But that changed suddenly about AD 36. Of the conversion of Cornelius’ household, we read in Acts 10:45, “And the faithful ones that had come with Peter who were of those circumcised were amazed, because the free gift of the holy spirit was being poured out also upon people of the nations.” NWT.

The gentile Christians could not be invited until after the 70 weeks (Dan 9:24) for Israel were completed (AD 36). Of that final week [a day = a year], we read “And he must keep the covenant in force for the many for one week” Dan 9:27 NWT). That covenant was Jehovah’s 70 weeks agreement with Israel. It was in the last half of the 70th week, three and a half years after the cross, that the great work was done amongst the Jews.

Applying the “other sheep” to the new gentile converts is the evident meaning and it would take strong additional scriptural evidence to convince the honest student otherwise. There is no direct indication in the Bible that these “other sheep” are referring only to the “Great Crowd” (true Christians who will not be part of the Little Flock.” Another reasonable application would be to apply this to the billions of mankind that will be awakened from the dead in Paradise earth and there have an opportunity to follow Jehovah in obedience forever. Without further compelling evidence, applying the “Other Sheep” to the “Great Crowd” is building a doctrine from a scripture taken out of context. This reminds us of the Catholic Church misapplication of Matt 16:18 which says, “You are Peter, and on this rock-mass I will build my congregation, and the gates of Ha’des will not overpower it.” (NWT) Based on an unsupportable misapplication of this text, the Catholic Church believes that the papacy represents an “unbroken” line of apostolic succession from Peter to the present day.

Rev 14:3 is clear-144,000 are bought from the earth=the little flock-The great crowd is not promised heaven anywhere.= the other sheep who are not of that fold.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Rev 14:3 is clear-144,000 are bought from the earth=the little flock-The great crowd is not promised heaven anywhere.= the other sheep who are not of that fold.

In his foretelling the separating work that was to continue throughout these last days, ‘the preaching of the good news of the Kingdom’ was to take place right up till “the end” of this present world system under the influence of satan and his minions. (Matt 24:14; Matt 28:19-20)

@RR144......What was the criteria for the separation of “the sheep and the goats”? (Matthew 25:31-35: 41, 46)
The “sheep” supported Christ’s “brothers” in their commission to preach the good news and in any ways that gave aid and comfort to them as they were hated and persecuted (John 15:18-21)......the “goats” OTOH did nothing to support Christ’s brothers, ignorant of the fact that it was a requirement for life.

So who are Christ’s “brothers” as opposed to who are the “sheep” who support them?
They were to be “one flock with one shepherd”.....since there was to be no distinction between the races in Christianity, how can the “other sheep” be Gentile Christians? The “sheep” come in all ethnicities.

“The little flock” are those anointed for a heavenly role, (Jews and Gentiles) but “the other sheep” made up of all nations on earth, support them as their numbers diminish in the work assigned to them. This close to the end of the current system of things, most of the anointed are already in their positions ready for the Kingdom to take over control of the whole world of redeemed mankind. (Dan 2:44)

All Christians have the role of an evangelist, but the anointed have a weightier responsibility to teach and to set a fine example in conduct. Just as the apostles received help from the brotherhood at times, so the anointed do too.

There are only two groups of Christians who are saved....those who will rule with Christ in heaven, and those who will be their subjects on earth....all have the same shepherd.

In John’s Revelation the 144,000 are seen with the Lamb on a heavenly Mt Zion, and his anointed ones, chosen from the earth for a role in the kingdom as “kings and priests” (Rev 20:6) are with him.....but “the great crowd” were “from all nations, tribes, peoples and tongues.” (Rev 7:4, 9-10, 13-14)
Here is the correlation.....a ‘little flock’ are seen in heaven with Christ, while the ‘other sheep’ on earth are seen as survivors of “the great tribulation”. The majority of the anointed do not have to endure the great tribulation...only the few that remain alive at the end.

It is prophesied that Gog (satan’s forces) will attack God’s people while the remaining anointed ones are still on earth. (Ezekiel 38:16) How will God’s people react? They will obey the following instructions: “You will not need to fight this battle. Take your position, stand still, and see the salvation of Jehovah in your behalf. . . . Do not be afraid or be terrified.” (2 Chronicles 20:17) Sometime after the attack of Gog begins, all the remaining anointed ones on earth will be taken to heaven. (transformed in the twinkling of an eye.)

Then Revelation 17:14 tells us about the reaction in heaven to Gog’s attack. The enemies of God’s people “will battle with the Lamb, but because he is Lord of lords and King of kings, the Lamb will conquer them. Also, those with him who are called and chosen and faithful will do so.” Thus, Jesus, together with his 144,000 anointed kings in heaven, will rescue God’s people here on earth.

This is what we expect to see happen.

 

[RR144]

@RR144......What was the criteria for the separation of “the sheep and the goats”? (Matthew 25:31-35: 41, 46)

Okay Jane, let's look at these verses one at a time.

"When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory" - Matt. 25:31

Now, the setting of this parable is when The Christ (head and body, Jesus and his Church, the 144,000) is complete and glorified and the Kingdom has been inaugurated. Now keep in mind that the Parable of the Sheep and the Goats is still a continuation of “Our Lord’s Great Prophecy,” which embraces Matthew 24 and 25.

“All the holy angels” are the risen saints, the 144,000, the glorified Church class. Similar Scriptures are:

1. “When the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels.” - 2 Thessalonians 1:7
2. "When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory." - Col. 3:4
3. “Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, To execute judgment upon all.” - Jude 14,15
4. “Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.” - Mark 8:38

Verse 31 implies the reign will begin at that time. “Then [at that time] shall he sit upon the throne of his glory” and exercise his office.

"And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats" - Matt. 25:32

A gathering work is being described. “And before him shall be gathered all nations [peoples].” The separating work is to be accomplished gradually. A shepherd separates the sheep from the goats when he is ready to move to another place.

"And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left." - Matt. 25:33

The sheep are separated to the right hand of favor. The goats are separated to the left hand of disfavor.

"Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world." - Matt. 25:34

The titles “King” and “Son of man” both refer to Jesus, and the term “King” suggests his reign. The chief lesson of this parable is that in the Kingdom Age there will be a dividing work between those who inherit life and those who go into Second Death.

This verse will be fulfilled after the final testing of the Little Season at the end of the Kingdom. It harmonizes with Revelation 21:7, “He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.” Only those of the world of mankind who pass that final test will be considered sons of God. They will enter into the age beyond the Millennium, in which there will be no death.

The Kingdom has been prepared for the sheep “from the foundation of the world.” Ephesians 1:4 is proof that this parable refers to the world and not to the Little Flock: “According as he [God] hath chosen us in him [Jesus] before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love.” The inheritance of the Little Flock was set up long before the inheritance for mankind. The term “foundation of the world” refers to Adam’s creation. God designed Adam to be a king, but Adam lost that privilege when he sinned. The privilege will be restored to the sheep class at the end of the Millennium. Psalm 8 shows that God’s purpose is to bring man into harmony with Him.

 

[RR144]

The “sheep” supported Christ’s “brothers” in their commission to preach the good news and in any ways that gave aid and comfort to them as they were hated and persecuted (John 15:18-21)......the “goats” OTOH did nothing to support Christ’s brothers, ignorant of the fact that it was a requirement for life.

So who are Christ’s “brothers” as opposed to who are the “sheep” who support them?

"Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these My brethren, ye have done it unto Me." – Matt. 25:40.

Now this Scripture is a generally misunderstood and misused one. If you haven't studied it in its connections, you'd likely think that the Lord is referring to those who have lived during the Gospel Age. But the context shows that He refers to those living in the Millennial Age. The principle, then, is helpful to us now. Whoever does a kindness for anyone belonging to the Lord is counted by Him as doing it unto Him.

In the past God made a covenant with the nation of Israel alone. All other nations and peoples were outsiders. During this Gospel Age the Lord has made a covenant with the Church, through Christ, a special Covenant of Sacrifice into which you and I, (if you avail yourself of it) are privileged to enter. The opportunity to make this Covenant of Sacrifice has been open throughout the Gospel Age; and all who come to God through that covenant are said to be Israelites indeed. – Gal. 3:8,16,29.

Now verse 40 refers, not to Christians, (only the True Church are considered "Christian") but to Gentiles – the world in general, (remember the Church is no part of this world.) So, before Messiah's Throne shall be gathered all peoples, all nations. "And He shall separate them the one from the other, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats." It's not a class separation, but an individual one. As I stated above, whoever, after trial, demonstrates that he is a goat will go over to the left hand. Whoever proves himself to be a sheep will go to the right. The whole picture refers to the thousand years of the Messianic Reign, the world's judgment, the world's trial. The sole object of that Reign is to prove who will desire to be God's sheep, to come into His fold and have His Son as their Shepherd, and who will not come into harmony with Him, but will have a goat-like nature. Then Christ will deal with them accordingly.

So, the Messiah will be dealing with the world of mankind, the majority of whom are now in the great prison-house of death. The Apostle Paul, in speaking of the resurrection, says that the dead shall come forth "every man in his own order," or company or class. They will not all come forth at once. The Church class will come forth first; then the Great Company class; and early in the new order of things will come forth the Ancient Worthies, who will be the earthly representatives of God's Kingdom. – 1 Cor. 15:21-23.

As Jesus said to some in His day, "Ye shall see Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and all the Prophets in the Kingdom of God." (Luke 13:28.) They will be the human representatives of the Heavenly Kingdom, which will be invisible. Jesus said nothing about their seeing Himself. Neither did He say, "Ye shall see these My disciples in the Kingdom." He did say, however, "Yet a little while, and the world seeth Me no more." John tells us that the Church shall be like her Lord. (1 John 3:2.) If the world will not see Him, they will not see the Church; for the Church will be spirit beings, that cannot be seen.

So, we have these orders: the Little Flock, the Great Company, the Ancient Worthies, and the world of mankind – "every man in his own order." Jesus said, "The hour is coming when all that are in the graves shall hear the voice of the Son of God; and they that hear shall live." (John 5:25-29.) As the world returns from the tomb, the thought is that they will come back in answer to prayer, very much the same as did Lazarus. Remember, Jesus asked, "Where have you laid him?" Then He lifted up His eyes and prayed to the Father, after which He said, "Lazarus, come forth." – John 11:41-44.

The "sheep" class of that Age will be those who will have the Lord's spirit; and as the Lord's purpose will be to bring people back from death, to teach them and to prepare them for eternal life, all the sheep will feel the same way. They'll gladly do this, because they have a love for this work. They'll be feeding, clothing and helping those whom they have gotten out of the prison-house of death. Their prayers will go out continually after those in prison. This explains the whole work of the Millennial Age, and shows how all the people will come into harmony with God.

As oppose to the goat class, who will say, "I don't care about this matter or care for these people." The sheep class will be busy working, working right along; but the goat class will be showing their selfish disposition. God doesn't purpose that any who are selfish shall have everlasting life. Selfishness came in as a result of sin. You and I were born selfish and couldn't help it; but we have better knowledge now. We're beginning to see God's way. All then in true sympathy with God and righteousness will be cultivating love in their hearts.

At the close of the Age the Lord will say to the sheep class, "I was an hungered, and ye gave Me meat; I was thirsty, and ye gave Me drink; I was a stranger, and ye took Me; naked, and ye clothed Me; sick and in prison, and ye visited Me"; for "inasmuch as ye did it unto one of the least of these, ye did it unto Me." You did not know it, but I was watching you. You are on My right hand – in My favor. The Father wishes you to have the Kingdom originally given to Adam but lost through disobedience.

No other class will be given the kingdom. God's not selfish but is always considering what He can do for somebody else. All of His people must have His spirit. All mankind must eventually have the same spirit, or they can't inherit the earthly kingdom. The Heavenly Kingdom is for those of the Church who prove worthy. They will get it because they have the spirit of love; and those of the world who cultivate the Lord's spirit will receive the kingdom prepared for them from the foundation of the world. (Gen. 1:26-28.) Christ's Kingdom was prepared from before the foundation of the world. Mankind's will be an earthly kingdom a Paradise world-wide.

 

[Aunty Jane]

All the holy angels” are the risen saints, the 144,000, the glorified Church class. Similar Scriptures are:

1. “When the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels.” - 2 Thessalonians 1:7
2. "When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory." - Col. 3:4
3. “Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, To execute judgment upon all.” - Jude 14,15
4. “Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.” - Mark 8:38

Just a few points here.....
In what scripture are the “saints” (holy ones) ever called angels?

1 Cor 6:1-3...
“Does any one of you who has a dispute with another dare to go to court before unrighteous men, and not before the holy ones? 2 Or do you not know that the holy ones will judge the world? And if the world is to be judged by you, are you not competent to try very trivial matters? 3 Do you not know that we will judge angels? Then why not matters of this life?”
Those chosen from the earth to rule with Christ in heaven will judge the world, and the angels. There is no reference to them AS “angels”.

The term “foundation of the world” refers to Adam’s creation. God designed Adam to be a king, but Adam lost that privilege when he sinned. The privilege will be restored to the sheep class at the end of the Millennium. Psalm 8 shows that God’s purpose is to bring man into harmony with Him.

Whoa...again, where is this written? Adam was designed to be a servant of the King, like the angels before them. No human was ever designed by God to be a king.
When Israel demanded an earthly King to be like the nations, God warned them that it would mean nothing but trouble for them, but they refused to listen....because humans are designed to BE ruled by God.
Humans having power over other humans, simply corrupts them.....the one who was meant to be their only King exclusively, was incorruptible.

Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these My brethren, ye have done it unto Me." – Matt. 25:40.

Now this Scripture is a generally misunderstood and misused one.

Who says?

If you haven't studied it in its connections, you'd likely think that the Lord is referring to those who have lived during the Gospel Age. But the context shows that He refers to those living in the Millennial Age.

If you mean the time when humans were to hear the word as taught by Jesus Christ, and respond to the preaching of the “good news” heralded by his disciples, then yes, because only whilst his elect are on earth are these sheep doing good to Christ’s brothers. So who are Christ’s “brothers”? They are his joint heirs on earth who are persecuted by satan and his minions before they get to their heavenly reward. Once in heaven these anointed ones are immortal and incorruptible.
These “Brothers” all have the same “Father”.....they are adopted “sons of God” because they experience a new birth in a new body so as to enter heaven and become part of God’s arrangement for redeeming mankind and bringing them back to paradise.

Whoever proves himself to be a sheep will go to the right. The whole picture refers to the thousand years of the Messianic Reign, the world's judgment, the world's trial. The sole object of that Reign is to prove who will desire to be God's sheep, to come into His fold and have His Son as their Shepherd, and who will not come into harmony with Him, but will have a goat-like nature. Then Christ will deal with them accordingly.

Sorry, I cannot see that happening in the millennium. There will be no trials and tribulations during the thousand years because it is ruled by “the Prince of Peace.” The millennium is for education and setting things straight, ready for the final test....anyone who misses the mark during the thousand years when satan and his demons are locked away, even though he is a hundred years old...he will lose his life as an unworthy person. There will be no influence for evil, except from within that person themselves.

 

[RR144]

Just a few points here.....
In what scripture are the “saints” (holy ones) ever called angels?

Well Jane, we are, afterall dealing with a book of symbols. You know the saints are known by many terms and descriptions. For example; Church, Holy Ones, Kingdom of God, Temple of God, Bride of Christ, the body of Christ and the Lamb's Wife. Why not "angels"? What is an angel? Is it not a messenger. In Revelation 1:20 it speaks of "the angels of the seven congregations." Even your "slave class" claims they are humans, the elders in the congregation. Another thing Jane, Jesus rules with his Church, NOT with the angels. Now, the angels no doubt will be doing their bidding during the Kingdom reign. So, let me ask you Jane, where are the saints in this parable? If they are to rule with Christ? Return with Him?

Whoa...again, where is this written? Adam was designed to be a servant of the King, like the angels before them. No human was ever designed by God to be a king.

Don't get hung up on the term "king." Was not Adam told to have dominion over the earth? Genesis 1:27, 28 tells us:

"So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. Then God blessed them, and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth.”"​

What is a domain? It's defined as "Possession; estate; as a portion of the kings domains."

Who says?

Well, just because you believe you understand something doesn't mean you do and if you did understand it, doesn't mean everybody else does. Look at the churches, some of the simplest verses go over their heads.

If you mean the time when humans were to hear the word as taught by Jesus Christ, and respond to the preaching of the “good news” heralded by his disciples, then yes, because only whilst his elect are on earth are these sheep doing good to Christ’s brothers. So who are Christ’s “brothers”? They are his joint heirs on earth who are persecuted by satan and his minions before they get to their heavenly reward. Once in heaven these anointed ones are immortal and incorruptible.
These “Brothers” all have the same “Father”.....they are adopted “sons of God” because they experience a new birth in a new body so as to enter heaven and become part of God’s arrangement for redeeming mankind and bringing them back to paradise.

What you fail to understand is that the preaching work is for a particular purpose, it isn't to save as many as possible before the end of this "system of things." It's to gather his "jewels", the "saints", the "anointed", the "144,000". When the Church class is complete, then the Kingdom will be in full operation. And what is that Kingdom for? Is it not an age of teaching? When everyone will be taught of Jehovah. They shall be enlightened, free from the wiles of the devil. Then and ONLY then, at the end of the Kingdom rule, after they have been taught the permission of evil, and what Jehovah has done for them through His Son, Jesus will they have come to full knowledge and be tested during the short time that Satan is let loose from his prison cell. Those who fail will going into second death where there is no resurrection, and those who pass will inherit the Kingdom, or as you call it "paradise earth." Of course there will be those who will perish during the Kingdom reign for not conforming to the rules. and have shown they don't plan to cooperate. Wee believe that mankind will be given at least 100 years to conform: "For the child shall die one hundred years old, But the sinner being one hundred years old shall be accursed." (Isaiah 65:20)

Sorry, I cannot see that happening in the millennium. There will be no trials and tribulations during the thousand years because it is ruled by “the Prince of Peace.” The millennium is for education and setting things straight, ready for the final test....anyone who misses the mark during the thousand years when satan and his demons are locked away, even though he is a hundred years old...he will lose his life as an unworthy person. There will be no influence for evil, except from within that person themselves.

How many judgments are there Jane? God judges people now? Under ignorance? And destroys them at Armageddon? Those who weren't ignorant enter into the Kingdom reign, only to be judged again during the "little season" when Satan is let loose? No, sorry, there is only ONE JUDGMENT period and that's during the end. You have all the right scriptures, you just apply them at the wrong time.