Who are the chosen people of God ?

[BibleScribe]

To All,

Please allow me to clarify my previous post (being it is past the Edit timeline) per the following circumstance:


Topic: Recognizing the antichrist ..., Post #16
http://www.christianityboard.com/topic/14893-recognizing-the-antichrist-and-the-subtle-methods-of-the-adversary/

Edward Palamar, on 07 November 2011 - 04:54 PM, said:
...
I baptized Jesus Christ in the river Jordan under His command to do so, and you are going to introduce me to Him after He has raised me from the dead?

BibleScribe

 

[Edward Palamar]

Not Bible.

Not your bible, duckybill, nor the bible of killjoy.

 

[Duckybill]

Not your bible, duckybill, nor the bible of killjoy.

What? No Scripture? I have plenty.

Mark 9:43 (NKJV)
43 If your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter into life maimed, rather than having two hands, to go to hell, into the fire that shall never be quenched--

 

[Edward Palamar]

What? No Scripture? I have plenty.

Even if the topic were "The Terrorism of Hell Fire", I couldn't laud your interjections against Christ's accomplishment.

I write that all God's children (sons and daughters of Adam and Eve) are saved by Christ, and you raise the devil's envy judged, quite a contrast.

 

[Prentis]

Hmmm....

Romans 9:8
That is, those who are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God; but the children of the promise are counted as the seed.

Notice, it doesn't say ALL are the children of God, but rather some are, some aren't. In the end, the sons of God will be revealed.

Of course, we can take this as a pride. Only we must realize we are still running a race, and if we are obedient, we are only doing what we must.

Sorry William, the promises are not to Adam and his seed, but to Christ and his seed.

 

[Edward Palamar]

Sorry William, the promises are . . .

Even in Genesis before any form of consummation prophecy announces that Christ will save all of the children of Adam, which is why He used the name "Son of Man".

 

[Prentis]

Where would that be, William?

The scriptures are clear enough. The promises are to Christ and his seed. The obedient go to eternal life, the disobedient go to... the second death! We will be judged by our works. Not all find the way, for it is narrow...

But hey, all the above is meaningless when you have an agenda to promote!

 

[Edward Palamar]

Where would that be?

Genesis 3:15

"And he will crush your head" - and judging from your snide remark, He's done quite well.

 

[Prentis]

Genesis 3:15

"And he will crush your head" - and judging from your snide remark, He's done quite well.

Oh, in other words 'serpent seed'. Those who are literally born of the devil are evil, and those who are literally born of Adam are good. Is that what you're saying?

 

[Edward Palamar]

Oh, in other words 'serpent seed'. Those who are literally born of the devil are evil, and those who are literally born of Adam are good. Is that what you're saying?

No. Adam is originally a son of God. Prophecy is for the good of Christ's Church any time.

 

[Prentis]

Prophecy is FOR it's good. But it isn't always 'happy, thou are my favorite'!

Sometimes it goes something like 'if you don't repent, I will spew you out of my mouth'.

Just doesn't sounds like everyone is all safe and sound, does it?

 

[Duckybill]

Even if the topic were "The Terrorism of Hell Fire", I couldn't laud your interjections against Christ's accomplishment.

I write that all God's children (sons and daughters of Adam and Eve) are saved by Christ, and you raise the devil's envy judged, quite a contrast.

If you want to ignore the MANY Scriptures that's up to you. But they are still there.

Revelation 20:10 (NKJV)
10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

Know what 'forever' means? Same as 'everlasting' and 'unquenchable'.

 

[Vengle]

The conclusion of the matter, all things having been considered, is this:

Romans 9:15-16 "For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy."

Ephesians 1:4 "According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love."

2 Thessalonians 2:13 "But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth."

James 2:5 "Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?"

1 Peter 2:1 [ASV] "Putting away therefore all wickedness, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, and all evil speakings,
2 as newborn babes, long for the spiritual milk which is without guile, that ye may grow thereby unto salvation;
3 if ye have tasted that the Lord is gracious:
4 ¶unto whom coming, a living stone, rejected indeed of men, but with God elect, precious,
5 ye also, as living stones, are built up a spiritual house, to be a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.
6 Because it is contained in scripture, Behold, I lay in Zion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: And he that believeth on him shall not be put to shame.
7 For you therefore that believe is the preciousness: but for such as disbelieve, The stone which the builders rejected, The same was made the head of the corner;
8 and, A stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence; for they stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.
9 But ye are a elect race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for God's own possession, that ye may show forth the excellencies of him who called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
10 who in time past were no people, but now are the people of God: who had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy."

1 Corinthians 1:27-28 "But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are."

Romans 9:22 "What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
25 ¶As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.
26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.
27 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:
28 For he will finish the work, and cut it short in righteousness: because a short work will the Lord make upon the earth.
29 And as Esaias said before, Except the Lord of Sabaoth had left us a seed, we had been as Sodoma, and been made like unto Gomorrha.
30 ¶What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed."


Just listen. That is all it takes to know.

Your own wisdom only prevents you from knowing.

 

[WISDOM CALLED]

The chosen can be found in every nation, they are the spiritually elect that were called from one end of heaven to the other by the angels in 2003 when the sign of the son of man appeared in the heavens. The elect celebrated globally.

 

[veteran]

The sign of the Son of Man has still yet... to appear in the heavens, for that's about Christ's second literal coming back to this earth.

Once again, you take the Scriptures and spread dung upon them.

 

[logabe]

Even if the topic were "The Terrorism of Hell Fire", I couldn't laud your interjections against Christ's accomplishment.

I write that all God's children (sons and daughters of Adam and Eve)

are saved by Christ,

and you raise the devil's envy judged, quite a contrast.

In past ages God has been training judges for the age to come, that they might
partake of the Elijah ministry to "restore all things," as Jesus said. Paul himself
was in training as a judge, and we get a glimpse of his concept of judgment in 2
Cor. 5:14 and 15,

14 For the love of Christ constrains us, because WE THUS
JUDGE, that if One died for all, then are all dead;
15 and that He died for all, that they which live should not
henceforth live unto themselves, but unto Him which died
for them and rose again."

What kind of judgment is that? He is saying that Christ died for all, or on behalf of
all. Therefore, all are dead (because all are identified with Christ in His death). The
result of this is that they will live no more for themselves (selfishly) but rather will
live for Christ who died for them and rose again.

This is an incredible statement that not many have fully grasped--simply because it
seems too good to be true. Yet Paul enlarges upon this in the next verses, telling us
the message that we are to give to the world as ambassadors of Christ and His
Kingdom:

18 And all things are of God, who has reconciled US to himself by
Jesus Christ and has given to US the ministry of reconciliation;
19 to wit, that God was in Christ reconciling THE WORLD unto
Himself, not imputing THEIR trespasses unto THEM; and has
committed unto US the word of reconciliation.
20 Now then, we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God
did beseech you by us; we pray you in Christ's stead, be YE
reconciled to God."

Take note especially how Paul speaks of "us" and "them." We who have become
believers are "us." We are ambassadors giving a message to "them," that is, to
"the world" of unbelievers. What is our message? It is "the word of reconciliation."
We are to tell the world that God is "not imputing their trespasses unto them."
This statement is so foreign to Christians today that their minds often cannot grasp what
Paul is saying. Because Christians have been taught so thoroughly about the Angry God
who judges sinners, they have a difficult time taking Paul at his word. They make excuses
for Paul saying, "Well, he could not possibly mean this, because of all the other verses
dealing with divine judgment upon sinners. So we have to be careful not to take this out
of context with all of those other verses about divine judgment."

I agree that we should always take things in context, as long as we do not make the
"context" contradict the present passage.

Paul says we are ambassadors. An ambassador represents his government and is its
spokesman. As ambassadors we represent Jesus Christ to the world. Our message
boils down to this: "that God was in Christ reconciling THE WORLD unto Himself, not
imputing THEIR trespasses unto THEM."

Secondly, our message is an appeal for THEM to be reconciled to God (vs. 20). It is
apparent that they are not currently reconciled to God, otherwise there would be
no need for such a message to be given. How, then, can God not impute their
trespasses unto them, seeing that they are not yet reconciled to God? Does it not
require belief in Christ and the Cross to avoid the judgment for one's trespasses?

Logabe

 

[Vengle]

Logabe said: We are to tell the world that God is "not imputing their trespasses unto them." End Quote

The idea that the world is forgiven apart from confession I do not find in the Bible. For that would disagree with what Paul said, Colossians 2:13 “And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;”

That being dead in our sins and our trespasses applies to the whole world until they confess.
Romans 3:19 “Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.”

John 8:24 “I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.”

So what we need to tell the world is that they will die in their sins if they do not confess them to Christ.

I see that first part of 1 John 1:8-10, “If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us”, as simply telling us that we need to be honest to begin with about ourselves so that we are willing to make confession. That is why it continues, “If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.”

This part, “If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word has no place in our lives”, is simply telling us that if we are not honest enough to do that first part (acknowledge our sin and confess it) we make him out to be a liar and his word has no place in our lives.

We are however told at 2 Peter 1:9 that the ransom applies to past sins, but is that with regard to not needing confession? No. This refers to those who have confessed but have then forgotten all about why they confessed. They have returned to their old ways after confession.

 

[WISDOM CALLED]

The sign of the Son of Man has still yet... to appear in the heavens, for that's about Christ's second literal coming back to this earth.

Once again, you take the Scriptures and spread dung upon them.

The Angels are the harvesters at the end of the age, not the Christian orthodox or the orthodox from any religion.

The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels. Matthew 13:39

The healing angels are his family and mine.

 

[logabe]

Logabe said:

We are to tell the world that God is "not imputing their trespasses unto them."

End Quote

The idea that the world is forgiven apart from confession I do not find in the Bible. For that would disagree with what Paul said, Colossians 2:13 “And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;”

That being dead in our sins and our trespasses applies to the whole world until they confess.
Romans 3:19 “Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.”

John 8:24 “I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.”

So what we need to tell the world is that they will die in their sins if they do not confess them to Christ.

I see that first part of 1 John 1:8-10, “If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us”, as simply telling us that we need to be honest to begin with about ourselves so that we are willing to make confession. That is why it continues, “If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.”

This part, “If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word has no place in our lives”, is simply telling us that if we are not honest enough to do that first part (acknowledge our sin and confess it) we make him out to be a liar and his word has no place in our lives.

We are however told at 2 Peter 1:9 that the ransom applies to past sins, but is that with regard to not needing confession? No. This refers to those who have confessed but have then forgotten all about why they confessed. They have returned to their old ways after confession.

Paul says, "where there is no law, neither is there violation"
(Rom. 4:15). In order for something to be a sin there must
be a law that makes that act a sin. Putting away the law is
man's way of legalizing or decriminalizing sin. God's way is
to recognize the law and then pay its full penalty, as Jesus
did on the cross.

With this in mind, let us go back to Paul's statement in 2 Cor.
5 and the ministry of reconciliation. Paul says in verse 19 that
our message is that God is not imputing the world's trespasses
unto them. The Universalist view, as developed some centuries
ago, is that the law was put away at the cross; therefore, there
is no more sin to impute to the world.

Yet Paul says no such thing. It is one thing to say that the world
has no sin at all; it is quite another to say that God is not imputing
their sin to them. The first statement says that sin no longer exists;
the second recognizes the existence of sin, but that Jesus has paid
for it on the cross. The first destroys the law; the second honors
the law enough to pay its full demand.

Universalism seeks to save all mankind by destroying the law,
which would then make its violation impossible, regardless of
what a man might do to his neighbor. The events of 9-11-01?
That was not murder, they would say.

My belief is the belief that all of creation will be restored and
reconciled to Him, not by putting away the law, but by paying
its full penalty.

Secondly, while Jesus obtained the FACT of salvation for all
men, the TIMING of salvation differs and depends upon which
"squadron" (Greek: tagma) one is in (1 Cor. 15:23).
There is more than one resurrection coming. The
first "squadron" will be those who are called to rule
and reign with Him (Rev. 20:4-6).

The second group will be those believers who are
raised along with all the unbelievers (John 5:28, 29;
Luke 12:46) at the Great White Throne (Rev. 20:11-13).

The third group will be the unbelievers, after their time
of judgment has been completed, for there will be a
Jubilee at the end of time according to the law, wherein
all of creation will be set free in the glorious liberty of the
children of God (Rom. 8:21).

The judgments of God are established in the law itself. In the
law, there is no sin worthy of torture in a literal fire. The fire
is the "fiery law" itself (Deut. 33:2). His Word is like a fire (Jer.
23:29), for its purpose is to cleanse, purify, and burn out the
dross in order to bring forth a perfect, finished product. Thus,
when the "fire" has done its work, sin will have been fully
purged and creation restored. God's purpose for creation will
then be fulfilled, and God will be a success, not a failure.

The Jubilee is the law of grace, where every man's debt is
cancelled whether or not they have paid their full debt.
And yet the time preceeding this Jubilee is the time of
judgment and discipline for the sinner, during which time
he learns righteousness (Isaiah 26:9).

For this reason the New Testament often speaks of eonian
judgment--that is, age-abiding judgment, or judgment
during the eon (age). Though eonian is usually mistranslated
to mean "eternal" or "everlasting," this is not the true
meaning of the word. Young's Literal Translation translates
Matt. 25:46, "And these shall go away to punishment age-
during, but the righteous to life age-during."


Logabe

 

[WISDOM CALLED]

Logabe you quote Matthew 25 and as we know it is about the last days of the end times. The chapter also mentions the "faithful servant' that was mentioned by King David and Prophet Hosea. Prophet Hosea predicted that the LORD would plant HER himself in Jezreel. He did that in May 2006 for the holy gathering. King David called her the 'Harp of Faithfulness' that comes at night time. Prophet Jeremiah also spoke of her when he mentioned the 4 covenants. As did Prophet Micah when he spoke of the LORD's plan for the last days. In the NT, Christ called her the Queen of the South and told his followers that she would come to judge this generation. He told the Jewish priests that the only sign that they would be given would be the sign of Jonah.

The word 'age-during' is interesting.

[sup]46[/sup] “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.” NIV

I have checked out translations and the word 'age-enduring' is not found there.

In the Greek lexicon for ETERNAL it is a word that means 'without beginning or end'.

Aionios

And the word comes form Aion.

http://www.studylight.org/isb/bible.cgi?query=mt+25:46&it=nas&ot=bhs&nt=na&sr=1&l=en