Ronald David Bruno
Well-Known Member
WPM is a non-Trinitarian/ Amillennialist ... should have informed you way back. There is no harmonious resolve with this camp - which is why I ignor them.
Who goes back with Jesus in the pre-tribulation rapture?
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Even the wicked, recieve their resurrected bodies back, at the GWTJ.
The resurrected firstfruits from paradise make up resurrected saints already in heaven.
We KNOW the dead in Christ are resurrected.
Since postribs can not, and never have been able, to accurately prove a postrib rapture, and we outnumber their verses 6 to 1, I would think the postrib rapture doctrine would have retired years ago.
Example:
Ask a postribber who was taken preflood (pretrib) in matt 24 ( the one left behind,and one taken, that Jesus taught)
I think as we are rising up in the pretrib rapture they will still be mocking like the Pharisees at the cross.
They will be gazing up, watching the bottom of our feet,saying, " ha ha ha that is not the rapture!!!!!"
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
When you, or anyone, reverses the Order of Scripture, in effect you are doing what Satan did in the Garden = twist the Truth
That is NOT Scripture
THIS is Scripture TRUTH = 1 Thess 4:13-18
"the dead in Christ Rise FIRST" - After that(Resurrection) we who are alive & remain are caught UP
Only when the dead in Christ RISE do they receive their Resurrected Glorified Body
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""Foolishness says Christians should only use parts of God's written Word""
What sort of fool would teach that ANIMAL SACRIFICES are part of the forgiving process today ?
I'm glad you're not that type of FOOL who would use that part of the Bible for today
I don't know of any born again, blood bought Christian that believes the Old Covenant still binds New Covenant believers! That does not mean the Old Covenant is of no value to New Covenant saints of Christ. These things are written to be an example for His body (church). As the Bible tells us ALL Scripture is profitable, and those who want to learn in whole instead of in part will search the whole, and study the whole to show themselves approved unto God. Telling people that since Christians are no longer bound by the Laws of Old, therefore they should use only parts (NT?) of God's written Word, is plain and simply ignorance.
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
IF we will listen and submit to the Commandment of the LORD, then Satan/Deception/Error will be Defeated by MY Words which are SPIRIT and they are LIFE.
@Ronald David Bruno, you can SEE this in Action in Matthew 4:1-11
Ronald David Bruno
Well-Known Member
No, Rev. 7:14 says they have been washed by His blood.
? Martrys throughout history have gone directly to be with the Lord at the moment of their death.
REV. 7:9 are not an instanteous multitude of multitude who were are killed simultaneously, this is the Rapture Church.
We are not conquered at any time by Satan, he is already defeated. He conquers reprobate, those with his mark. Any people during his reign who refuse the mark are certainly persecuted and may be martyred - but Dan. 12 says some make it to see day 1335.
True, but physical control does not mean he takes their souls.
Correct all who are not in the book, not elect are reprobates.
No, Daniel 12 says blessed are thise who make it to day 1335. The GT is over at this time.
And if there was no one left behind, who would repopulate the earth (since all the raptured have received new bodies that Do Not procreate) during the Millennial Kingdom? Isaiah 11 says infants are born. After the MK there is 2nd resurrection for all those saints who missed the 1st and all mortals who lived during g rhe MK.
Many events happen at the 7th trumpet, Rev. 11:15 ( which would be Mid- Trib./ Pre-wrath).
1. The mystery of God is accomplished and revealed (Rev. 10:7)
2. The kingdoms of the world become the Kingdoms of the Lord, so technically he begins His reign and the AC/ Satan' reign is over, ( that's 1260 days
3. the dead are judged,
4. rewards are given.
5. Temple in Heaven is opened (meaning since on earth the Church was the Temple and when they were raptured, the temple is now in heaven instead.
6. The 7 Bowls of wrath are released. This happens at day 1260 and so from that time to day 1335 is the wrath period within the GT.
"From the time that the daily sacrifice is abolished and the abomination that causes desolation is set up, there will be 1,290 days. 12 Blessed is the one who waits for and reaches the end of the 1,335 days". Dan. 12:11-12
That message was deliver to Philadelphia, the faithful church. "The seven churches of Revelation existed in the 1st century but were also symbolic representations of the choice types throughout the Church Age".John MacArthur.
Hence, others who were not faithful (virgins who did not have oil in their lamps) had to further go through the fire, more testing.
The oil represented the Holy Spirit. So many people claim to be Christians are not born again and will be shocked when they miss the rapture; but will be saved, just have to go through it.
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
the question was WHO goes back with JESUS at the pre trib rapture .
The answer is NONE . THERE IS NO pre trib rapture , ONLY a PRE WATH OF GOD rapture .
WHICH ITS ALL A ONE TIME EVENT . FOR JESUS will surely come for his church
WHEN HE COMETH TO ALSO LAY DOWN the WRATH OF ALL MIGHTY GOD
upon all who followed the beast , all who loved a lie , all who denied HIM , his gopsel and or his words .
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