Who goes back with Jesus in the pre-tribulation rapture?

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rebuilder 454

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No, Rev. 7:14 says they have been washed by His blood.

? Martrys throughout history have gone directly to be with the Lord at the moment of their death.

REV. 7:9 are not an instanteous multitude who are killed simultaneously, this is the Raptured Church.

We are not conquered at any time by Satan, he is already defeated. He conquers reprobates, those with his mark. Any people during his reign who refuse the mark are certainly persecuted and may be martyred - but Dan. 12 says some make it to see day 1335.

True, but physical control does not mean he takes their souls.

Correct, all who are not in the book (not elect), are reprobates.

No, Daniel 12 says blessed are those who make it to day 1335. The GT ( all of it, including His wrath) is over at this time.
And if there was no one left behind, who would repopulate the earth (since all the raptured have received new bodies that DO NOT procreate) during the Millennial Kingdom? Isaiah 11 says infants are born and children die at 100 years old. After the MK there is 2nd resurrection for all those saints who missed the 1st and all mortals who lived during g rhe MK.


Many events happen at the 7th trumpet, Rev. 11:15 ( which would be Mid- Trib./ Pre-wrath).
1. The mystery of God is accomplished and revealed (Rev. 10:7). Do you know what the mystery of God is?
a.) We will see Him face to face.
b.) We will know what we will be like.
2. The kingdoms of the world become the Kingdoms of the Lord, so technically he begins His reign and the AC/ Satan' reign is over, ( that's 1260 days
3. the dead are judged,
4. rewards are given.
5. Temple in Heaven is opened (meaning since on earth the Church was the Temple and when they were raptured, the temple is now in heaven instead.
6. The 7 Bowls of wrath are released. This happens at day 1260 and so from that time to day 1335 is the wrath period within the GT.
"From the time that the daily sacrifice is abolished and the abomination that causes desolation is set up, there will be 1,290 days. 12 Blessed is the one who waits for and reaches the end of the 1,335 days". Dan. 12:11-12


That message was deliver to Philadelphia, the faithful church. "The seven churches of Revelation existed in the 1st century but were also symbolic representations of the choice types throughout the Church Age".John MacArthur.
Hence, others who were not faithful (virgins who did not have oil in their lamps) had to further go through the fire, more testing.

The oil represented the Holy Spirit. So many people claim to be Christians are not born again and will be shocked when they miss the rapture; but will be saved, just have to go through it.

>>> Don't be so sure of your view. The "last Trump" (that we all know from 1 Thes. 4:16-17 & 1 Cor. 15:52) may be #7 in Rev. 11:15. If it wasn't and came before the series of seven trumpets, it wouldn't be the last. If it came after the 7th, it would be the 8th.

rebuilder 454 said:
"Those in the innumerable number had dirty robes.
They are the 5 foolish virgins of mat 25.
They were left behind."

Your reply;
"No, Rev. 7:14 says they have been washed by His blood."

Hello...their dirty robes got washed by the blood.
They needed to be washed
They were secular carnal believers that got left behind and martyred.
 

rebuilder 454

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No, Rev. 7:14 says they have been washed by His blood.

? Martrys throughout history have gone directly to be with the Lord at the moment of their death.

REV. 7:9 are not an instanteous multitude who are killed simultaneously, this is the Raptured Church.

We are not conquered at any time by Satan, he is already defeated. He conquers reprobates, those with his mark. Any people during his reign who refuse the mark are certainly persecuted and may be martyred - but Dan. 12 says some make it to see day 1335.

True, but physical control does not mean he takes their souls.

Correct, all who are not in the book (not elect), are reprobates.

No, Daniel 12 says blessed are those who make it to day 1335. The GT ( all of it, including His wrath) is over at this time.
And if there was no one left behind, who would repopulate the earth (since all the raptured have received new bodies that DO NOT procreate) during the Millennial Kingdom? Isaiah 11 says infants are born and children die at 100 years old. After the MK there is 2nd resurrection for all those saints who missed the 1st and all mortals who lived during g rhe MK.


Many events happen at the 7th trumpet, Rev. 11:15 ( which would be Mid- Trib./ Pre-wrath).
1. The mystery of God is accomplished and revealed (Rev. 10:7). Do you know what the mystery of God is?
a.) We will see Him face to face.
b.) We will know what we will be like.
2. The kingdoms of the world become the Kingdoms of the Lord, so technically he begins His reign and the AC/ Satan' reign is over, ( that's 1260 days
3. the dead are judged,
4. rewards are given.
5. Temple in Heaven is opened (meaning since on earth the Church was the Temple and when they were raptured, the temple is now in heaven instead.
6. The 7 Bowls of wrath are released. This happens at day 1260 and so from that time to day 1335 is the wrath period within the GT.
"From the time that the daily sacrifice is abolished and the abomination that causes desolation is set up, there will be 1,290 days. 12 Blessed is the one who waits for and reaches the end of the 1,335 days". Dan. 12:11-12


That message was deliver to Philadelphia, the faithful church. "The seven churches of Revelation existed in the 1st century but were also symbolic representations of the choice types throughout the Church Age".John MacArthur.
Hence, others who were not faithful (virgins who did not have oil in their lamps) had to further go through the fire, more testing.

The oil represented the Holy Spirit. So many people claim to be Christians are not born again and will be shocked when they miss the rapture; but will be saved, just have to go through it.

>>> Don't be so sure of your view. The "last Trump" (that we all know from 1 Thes. 4:16-17 & 1 Cor. 15:52) may be #7 in Rev. 11:15. If it wasn't and came before the series of seven trumpets, it wouldn't be the last. If it came after the 7th, it would be the 8th.
QUOTE
"No, Daniel 12 says blessed are those who make it to day 1335. The GT ( all of it, including His wrath) is over at this time.
And if there was no one left behind, who would repopulate the earth (since all the raptured have received new bodies that DO NOT procreate) during the Millennial Kingdom? Isaiah 11 says infants are born and children die at 100 years old. After the MK there is 2nd resurrection for all those saints who missed the 1st and all mortals who lived during g rhe MK."

Ok, you do not understand the purpose of the 7yr tribulation.
It is JACOBS SORROW...Israel's sorrow.
The church age ends at the pretrib rapture.

That verse you quote is depicting THE JEWS and they are raptured in Rev 14:14.
Mid 7yr trib.
 

CrowCross

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QUOTE
"The oil represented the Holy Spirit. So many people claim to be Christians are not born again and will be shocked when they miss the rapture; but will be saved, just have to go through it."

You did get the oil part correct.
However you are trying to say the 5 foolish were unredeemed heathens.
Lets re-examine the scripture factually.
The foolish had;
Light
Oil
Lamps
Were waiting for Jesus
Sleeping with the wise
AND WERE VIRGINS.
Virgins = pure, set apart, undefined.
Plus the asked for the Holy Spirit from the wise.
(We see this in Acts many times, where the Holy Spirit is given to a believer, via the laying on of Hands....imparted from one believer to another)

So you actually think those believers were heathens???????

There is no way the foolish were not born again.

So, what was the difference???

It was the fact of the AMOUNT of oil.
The wise TOOK EXTRA OIL.
That is the only difference.
Oil, as you say, is the Holy Spirit.
There are many pew warmers in the Church today.