Who is the Whore of babylon

[mjrhealth]

No - CHRIST established a hierarchy - as I schooled you in post #333 . . .

Luke 22:31-32
“Simon, Simon, behold Satan has demanded to sift all of you like wheat, but I have prayed that YOUR own faith may not fail; and once YOU have turned back, YOU must strengthen YOUR brothers.”

Did Jesus ask the CROWDS to feed His lambs and tend His sheep after His ascension?
NO - He asked PETER to do that:
John 21:15, 16, 17
He said to him, “Feed my lambs.”
He said to him, “Tend my sheep.”
Jesus said to him, “Feed my sheep.

2 Thess 2:15
"Stand firm and hold fast to the Traditions you were taught, whether by an ORAL STATEMENT or by a letter from US."

You can DENY it until the cows come home and you'e STILL be wrong

What are you afraid of BOL, that the people will discover the idolatry and hypocrisy of your religion and all mens religions,the great whore and all her idolatrous daughters. She should be proud of how she has deceived the millions into worshiping her,

Rev_2:20 Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.

the only thing you school people in is idolatry, you who have kept Gods people from God, for you religion need the propel to bow down and worship her the great harlot, and they do in their millions, you are without excuse, you claim to see yet you are blind, you are joined to the harlot and you have her diseases, harlotry, idolatry even murder in your heart, just as she is so you have become.

1Co_6:16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.

you have no idea of what you have done,

Joh 9:39 And Jesus said, For judgment I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.
Joh 9:40 And some of the Pharisees which were with him heard these words, and said unto him, Are we blind also?
Joh 9:41 Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

the people long for Christ, but the religions of this world will not let them go to Him..

Mat 19:13 Then were there brought unto him little children, that he should put his hands on them, and pray: and the disciples rebuked them.
Mat 19:14 But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.

so little has changed still the saints and prophets are being murdered by the churches

Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

 

[gadar perets]

As for Jesus being God - Scripture tells us He is . . .

Jesus is God

Isaiah 7:14
All right then, the Lord himself will give you the sign. Look! The virgin will conceive a child! She will give birth to a son and will call him Immanuel (which means 'GOD is with us').

Isaiah 9:6
For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty GOD, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

John 1:1
In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the word was God.

John 1:3
ALL things were made by HIM (Jesus); and without him was not ANY thing made that was made.

John 8:58
Jesus said unto them, “Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I AM.”

John 10:30
“I and the Father are ONE."

John 15:9
Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'?

John 20:28
And Thomas answered and said unto him [Jesus], “My Lord and my GOD!”

2 Corinthians 4:4
...lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of GOD, should shine unto them.

Philippians 2:6
...Who [Jesus], being in the form of GOD, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

Colossians 2:9
...For in him [Jesus] dwelleth all the fullness of the Godhead bodily.

1 Timothy 3:16
And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: GOD was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Hebrews 1:8
But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O GOD, is forever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

Titus 2:13
Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great GOD and Saviour Jesus Christ

No, Scripture does NOT tell us he is "God". English translations done by trinitarian translators tell us that. Scripture tells us he is an "elohim" or a "theos". Both words are used of men and cannot be translated "God" or "GOD" unless they are referring to the Only True God Yeshua spoke of in John 17:3.

 

[BreadOfLife]

What are you afraid of BOL, that the people will discover the idolatry and hypocrisy of your religion and all mens religions,the great whore and all her idolatrous daughters. She should be proud of how she has deceived the millions into worshiping her,

Rev_2:20 Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.

the only thing you school people in is idolatry, you who have kept Gods people from God, for you religion need the propel to bow down and worship her the great harlot, and they do in their millions, you are without excuse, you claim to see yet you are blind, you are joined to the harlot and you have her diseases, harlotry, idolatry even murder in your heart, just as she is so you have become.

1Co_6:16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.

you have no idea of what you have done,

Joh 9:39 And Jesus said, For judgment I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.
Joh 9:40 And some of the Pharisees which were with him heard these words, and said unto him, Are we blind also?
Joh 9:41 Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

the people long for Christ, but the religions of this world will not let them go to Him..

Mat 19:13 Then were there brought unto him little children, that he should put his hands on them, and pray: and the disciples rebuked them.
Mat 19:14 But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.

so little has changed still the saints and prophets are being murdered by the churches

Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

And NONE of what you posted refutes the fact that Christ Himself instituted a hierarchy within His Church.
Pretty much what I expected from you . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

No, Scripture does NOT tell us he is "God". English translations done by trinitarian translators tell us that. Scripture tells us he is an "elohim" or a "theos". Both words are used of men and cannot be translated "God" or "GOD" unless they are referring to the Only True God Yeshua spoke of in John 17:3.

No - they say Jesus is God.
Jesus spoke wisely of people like YOU when He said:

Matt. 10:33
But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

Good luck with that . . .

 

[mjrhealth]

And NONE of what you posted refutes the fact that Christ Himself instituted a hierarchy within His Church.
Pretty much what I expected from you . . .

He never did, that was the OT, we are now under the Spirit, and He by the way should I repeat said it shouldnt be that way.

Mar 10:42 But Jesus called them to him, and saith unto them, Ye know that they which are accounted to rule over the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and their great ones exercise authority upon them.
Mar 10:43 But so shall it not be among you: but whosoever will be great among you, shall be your minister: just so you noticed

and again

1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

and again

Gal 1:11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.
Gal 1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

so BOL we dont and He doesnt need your religion, you do, it is your God that is where your heart is, that is your idol.

 

[gadar perets]

No - they say Jesus is God.
Jesus spoke wisely of people like YOU when He said:

Matt. 10:33
But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

Good luck with that . . .

I knew you would not address post#342, but I didn't expect you to reply with a verse that has nothing to do with what I wrote. And then to read your own thoughts into the text? Matthew 10:33 does NOT say, "Whosoever will deny that I am the one true God ...". It refers to the opposite of verse 32; "Whosoever will confess me before men ...". I confess Yeshua as my Master and Savior and as the Messiah and Son of YHWH as it is written. I refuse to confess that I worship two "Gods".

Also, I don't need "luck" as you seem to because I have YHWH and Yeshua.

 

[epostle]

You continue to associate me with Protestants. My "sect" does not rape children as do the Roman Catholic clergy.

More raw hate speech. More sadistic flaming zingers. For the 100th time, the Catholic Church currently has the LOWEST number of sex abuse allegations compared to ANY institution. Posting study after study gets tiresome because bigots are too blind to accept the facts.

Israel: Messianic congregation reports abuse from Orthodox Jews

Child sexual abuse in community rampant, audience told

Chabad-Lubavitch Molestation and Child Abuse

I can see it now. gadar says: "I am a messianic Hebrew, I'm not one of those." Yea right. Your sect is so small it doesn't show up in a google search. Or your hiding under an obscure sect title to avoid something.

A sadist is a person who derives pleasure from inflicting pain on others.
A forum sadist makes every effort to inflict the maximum amount of discomfort on others and truth is not important. TROLL is another word for it, but sadism is a sexual disorder.

 

[gadar perets]

More raw hate speech. More sadistic flaming zingers. For the 100th time, the Catholic Church currently has the LOWEST number of sex abuse allegations compared to ANY institution. Posting study after study gets tiresome because bigots are too blind to accept the facts.

What does it matter if Catholics stats are lower than other groups? IF true, that just makes Catholics a little less perverted than Protestants. Are you proud of that???

Israel: Messianic congregation reports abuse from Orthodox Jews

There is nothing in this article about sexual abuse.

Child sexual abuse in community rampant, audience told

This link doesn't work.

Chabad-Lubavitch Molestation and Child Abuse

This is about Jews, not followers of Messiah. It is to be expected that unbelievers would be less moral than believers.

I can see it now. gadar says: "I am a messianic Hebrew, I'm not one of those." Yea right. Your sect is so small it doesn't show up in a google search. Or your hiding under an obscure sect title to avoid something.

My "sect" is the Body of Messiah. "Messianic Hebrew" is simply a label I am forced to use so that I am not associated with the false doctrines of most Christian groups.

A sadist is a person who derives pleasure from inflicting pain on others.
A forum sadist makes every effort to inflict the maximum amount of discomfort on others and truth is not important. TROLL is another word for it, but sadism is a sexual disorder.

I have no desire to inflict pain on anyone. If you find my words painful, it is because you know they are true and are ashamed because you are part of that organization. I wrote nothing but truth. Your problem is that you think the truths I stated are MORE true of other institutions than they are of Catholics. Maybe so, but the fact remains they are true of Catholics as well.

 

[CoreIssue]

I wonder if the Catholic Church offers classes on how to sound arrogant and superior when talking to non-Catholics.

 

[BreadOfLife]

He never did, that was the OT, we are now under the Spirit, and He by the way should I repeat said it shouldnt be that way.

Mar 10:42 But Jesus called them to him, and saith unto them, Ye know that they which are accounted to rule over the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and their great ones exercise authority upon them.
Mar 10:43 But so shall it not be among you: but whosoever will be great among you, shall be your minister: just so you noticed

and again

1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

and again

Gal 1:11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.
Gal 1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

so BOL we dont and He doesnt need your religion, you do, it is your God that is where your heart is, that is your idol.

You ignorance of Scripture - although pretty severe - doe not surprise me.
Your posts read like the desperate reaches in the dark that they are.

Mark 10:43 is NOT a condemnation of the Church hierarchy that Christ Himself instituted. It is a condemnation of wanting to be greater than the rest - and about humbling oneself.

NO church is without leadership - and it would be a ridiculous prospect to expect any church to BE without leadership.
As I schooled you earlier - Paul speaks about the chain-of-command that the Church MUST have:

1 Cor. 12:28
Some people God has designated in the church to be, FIRST, apostles; SECOND, prophets; THIRD, teachers; then, mighty deeds; then, gifts of healing, assistance, administration, and varieties of tongues.

Do your homework, sparky . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

I don't need "luck" as you seem to because I have YHWH and Yeshua.

Actually - you don't have EITHER one.
When you reject Christ's Church - you reject HIM - and when you reject HIM, you reject the ONE Who sent Him (Luke 10:16).

HIS words - NOT mine . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

I wonder if the Catholic Church offers classes on how to sound arrogant and superior when talking to non-Catholics.

No - you'd probably have to go to YOUR failed forum to get lessons on arrogance . . .

 

[brakelite]

What does it matter if Catholics stats are lower than other groups? IF true, that just makes Catholics a little less perverted than Protestants. Are you proud of that???


There is nothing in this article about sexual abuse.


This link doesn't work.


This is about Jews, not followers of Messiah. It is to be expected that unbelievers would be less moral than believers.


My "sect" is the Body of Messiah. "Messianic Hebrew" is simply a label I am forced to use so that I am not associated with the false doctrines of most Christian groups.


I have no desire to inflict pain on anyone. If you find my words painful, it is because you know they are true and are ashamed because you are part of that organization. I wrote nothing but truth. Your problem is that you think the truths I stated are MORE true of other institutions than they are of Catholics. Maybe so, but the fact remains they are true of Catholics as well.

It is a wonder, if epostle and BOL and Marymog are typical examples, the fact there are so many Catholics in positions of influence such as in the Supreme court, media, the press etc, that we hear of any child sex abuse at all. If one wants to look for it, he will find it anywhere, including my own denomination, but with Catholicism, despite strenuous efforts over the centuries to cover it up, it is in your face whether looking for it or not.

I wonder if the Catholic Church offers classes on how to sound arrogant and superior when talking to non-Catholics.

They are called "Spiritual Exercises"...developed by Loyola ...ask BOL fpr lessons.

 

[brakelite]

When you reject Christ's Church - you reject HIM - and when you reject HIM, you reject the ONE Who sent Him (Luke 10:16).

Pure Jesuitism. No Christians outside of Catholicism. Just as we knew they believed all along which proves ecumenism as the farce we all know it to be.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Pure Jesuitism. No Christians outside of Catholicism. Just as we knew they believed all along which proves ecumenism as the farce we all know it to be.

Not true at all.

Protestants are, by definition, "Christian".
They simply reject the fullness of the Gospel for a partial version of it.

 

[mjrhealth]

NO church is without leadership - and it would be a ridiculous prospect to expect any church to BE without leadership.
As I schooled you earlier - Paul speaks about the chain-of-command that the Church MUST have:

It is ridiculous to have a church without Christ, yet what has God got to do with mens religions,

1Co_6:15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.

but that is what men have done, joined them selves to a harlot, and called here Christ church.

it is not us you are opposing but God...

 

[brakelite]

Not true at all.

Protestants are, by definition, "Christian".
They simply reject the fullness of the Gospel for a partial version of it.

Mmmmm. I will let Cardinal Ratzinger give the official Vatican version...
On Tuesday, September 5th, 2000, the Vatican made public a strongly worded document titled "Dominus Iesus" which reaffirmed the long held Catholic doctrine the only the Roman Catholic Church is the true Church of Christ. Excerpt from "Dominus Iesus":

17. ... the ecclesial communities which have not preserved the valid Episcopate and the genuine and integral substance of the Eucharistic mystery [Protestants], are not [sister] Churches in the proper sense; however, those who are baptized in these communities are, by Baptism, incorporated in Christ and thus are in a certain communion, albeit imperfect, with the [one true Catholic] Church.
Note that non-Catholics, i.e. Protestants, are not referred to as churches, but "ecclesial communities", and that baptism is viewed as a first step towards Catholicity. The Vatican is making quite clear to all those outside of the Roman Catholic Church, that ecumenism is not a process of recognizing Protestantism as an equal "sister" to Romanism. Rome is not interested in legitimizing Protestantism.

Ecumenism and talk of Christian Unity, in Rome's eyes, is a process of the lost sheep of Protestantism repenting of their grave defects and errors, and returning to the true fold of Christ, that of the Roman Papacy. In short, ecumenism and unity leads only to Rome. Historically, Protestantism has not viewed ecumenism favorably. Note this quote from a Protestant in 1914:

"... while many wishy-washy Protestants are very gracious and tender toward Romanism, Romanism has no more use for Protestantism than a rattlesnake has for a stone on its head. Now and then, a prominent priest, bishop, or cardinal administers Protestantism a soothing pellet in the form of a blessing upon the spirit of Christian union that is abroad in the world. But Protestantism and Romanism can no more unite than can powder and fire."

 

[gadar perets]

Actually - you don't have EITHER one.
When you reject Christ's Church - you reject HIM - and when you reject HIM, you reject the ONE Who sent Him (Luke 10:16).

HIS words - NOT mine . . .

First, I just want to acknowledge that I have noticed you have toned down your posts. Congratulations.

Luke 10:16 He that heareth you heareth me; and he that rejecteth you rejecteth me; and he that rejecteth me rejecteth him that sent me.
​

IN CONTEXT, these words refer to Yeshua's words to the seventy disciples he sent out before him (Luke 10:1). They would go to a city in Israel that Yeshua planned on visiting and preach the Gospel of the Kingdom before Yeshua arrived. Yeshua also sent out the twelve in the previous chapter (Luke 9:1-6). So Luke 10:16 applies to the twelve as well. Who was among those twelve? Judas Iscariot who was a devil himself (John 6:70). There came a point in time when Judas' words should have been rejected because he was no longer serving Yeshua, but the corrupt leaders of Israel embraced his words. In other words, Luke 10:16 ONLY applies when the person/persons we are hearing speak the words of Yeshua. When his words are NOT being spoken, then they are to be rejected.

 

[BreadOfLife]

It is ridiculous to have a church without Christ, yet what has God got to do with mens religions,
1Co_6:15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.
but that is what men have done, joined them selves to a harlot, and called here Christ church.
it is not us you are opposing but God...

No - what's "ridiculous" is YOUR complete failure to understand Christ OR His Church.
It's ridiculous to listen to a Scripturally-ignorant person like yourself who condemns Catholic Church hierarchy - yet embraces the leadership of his own sect.

Remember - the "Generals" who run your little online cult over at "aggressivechristianity.net" are YOUR hierarchy - whether YOU want to admit it or not . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

First, I just want to acknowledge that I have noticed you have toned down your posts. Congratulations.

Luke 10:16 He that heareth you heareth me; and he that rejecteth you rejecteth me; and he that rejecteth me rejecteth him that sent me.
​

IN CONTEXT, these words refer to Yeshua's words to the seventy disciples he sent out before him (Luke 10:1). They would go to a city in Israel that Yeshua planned on visiting and preach the Gospel of the Kingdom before Yeshua arrived. Yeshua also sent out the twelve in the previous chapter (Luke 9:1-6). So Luke 10:16 applies to the twelve as well. Who was among those twelve? Judas Iscariot who was a devil himself (John 6:70). There came a point in time when Judas' words should have been rejected because he was no longer serving Yeshua, but the corrupt leaders of Israel embraced his words. In other words, Luke 10:16 ONLY applies when the person/persons we are hearing speak the words of Yeshua. When his words are NOT being spoken, then they are to be rejected.

WRONG.

What YOU need to understand about the Gospels is the following hermerneutical rule:
When Jesus instructed the CROWDS - He was teaching ALL people
When He instructed his inner circle only - He was instructing the LEADERS of His Church.

Those "seventy" disciples in Luke 10 were the first BISHOPS of the Church as we read in the writings of the 2nd century theologian and historian Hippolytus.
Among them were Matthias, who replaced Judas, Annanias, who baptized Paul and Mark the Evangelist.