Why are there so many versions of the Bible?

[michaelvpardo]

Did the pope really say this?

 

[bbyrd009]

apparently
https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS718US718&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=i%20believe%20in%20god%20not%20in%20a%20catholic%20god

but then he is quite a departure anyway.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Thanks for the advice, I'll remember that the next time the Lord gives me the unction to proclaim truth. He's not that big into providing evidence in the areas of faith, but He has always confirmed the word of His prophets. Are you asking for some personal sign? That's about all the evidence the Lord gives on my behalf, but perhaps He'll accommodate you, though I don't imagine that it will be pleasant.

Ummmmm, wrong. Truth requires evidence.
YOU made some pretty bold claims about a Catholic translation of Scripture and now, you're backing down from them.

If you don't have evidence for the claims you made - then they didn't come from God.

 

[mjrhealth]

This moronic statement is coming from a person who is completely ignorant of what Christ's Church is.
Allow me to educate to:

Soory God educates His children not men.

As for this

[SIZE=12pt]Jesus established ONE Church (Matt. 16:16-19). He prayed fervently that this Church remain ONE - as He and the Father are ONE (John 17:20-23).
There is NO other.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=12pt]Jesus is Truth itself (John 14:6).[/SIZE]

[SIZE=12pt]Jesus promised His Church that the Holy Spirit would guide her to ALL Truth (John 16:12-15).[/SIZE]

[SIZE=12pt]The Church is the Pillar and Foundation of Truth (1 Tim. 3:15).[/SIZE]

[SIZE=12pt]The Church is the Body of Christ and He is the Head (1 Cor. 12:12-31, Eph. 4:3-6, Col. 1:8).[/SIZE]

[SIZE=12pt]The Church is the FULLNESS of Christ (Eph. 1:22-23).[/SIZE]

[SIZE=12pt]Jesus identifies His very SELF with His Church (Acts 9:4-5).[/SIZE]

[SIZE=12pt]Jesus gave the Church supreme Authority on earth and whatever it ordains on earth is also ordained in heaven (Matt. 16:18-19, 18:15-18, Luke 10:16, John 20:21-23).[/SIZE]

All true just has nothing to do with your church, or teh potestants, evangellical, SDA, Jw's etc etc

Jesus came so we could have a walk with God, your religion has put a league om men betwen you and God, you miss the whole point of what was achieved at teh cross. God is not religious, its a man thing.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Soory God educates His children not men.

As for this
All true just has nothing to do with your church, or teh potestants, evangellical, SDA, Jw's etc etc

Jesus came so we could have a walk with God, your religion has put a league om men betwen you and God, you miss the whole point of what was achieved at teh cross. God is not religious, its a man thing.

WRONG.

God uses men to teach His children:
1 Cor. 12:28
And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets, third TEACHERS, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping, of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues.

As for your total failure to understand what Christ's Church is all about, it is evidenced by your vain attempts to pit Christ and His Church against each other.
Christ and His Church are inseparable, as I showed you in my last post.

 

[brokentuningfork]

 

[mjrhealth]

As for your total failure to understand what Christ's Church is all about, it is evidenced by your vain attempts to pit Christ and His Church against each other.
Christ and His Church are inseparable, as I showed you in my last post.

Are you not tre one declaring "your" cghurch to be "better" than everyone elses. Yes Christ and "His" church is inseperable good thing its not yours.

God uses men to teach His children:

Doesnt need to but as I said, men are carnal

1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

go all to do with this

Act 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
Act 10:45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

God soent need men, its men who have no faith in God..

Exo_8:1 And the LORD spake unto Moses, Go unto Pharaoh, and say unto him, Thus saith the LORD, Let my people go, that they may serve me.

But still today pharaoh wont let Gods people go and still today they are in bondage and serve men and not God.

As i said all you do is promote your Church, would you have us all rather believe a lie than the truth that is in Jesus

 

[epostle1]

Did the pope really say this?

Yes, it's covered in numerous news outlets. It's a succinct expression, but when unpacked it's not anything new.

 

[epostle1]

but you are going to finish with a meme from the pope?

in your opinion, perhaps

You equated the papacy with the king in Samuel 8 rather subtlety. The Israelites sinned by demanding a king. This is explicit in verse 19. Nobody made demands to God for a papacy. There is absolutely no parallel and no foreshadow. You dismiss what I said as opinion, which suggests you are unable to support your contention. Are you running from Isa. 22?

so, we could split hairs now over "disagree" and "rebel" if you like...but Catholics are perfectly free to rebel, lots of former Catholics have rebelled; they are some of my fave authors right now lol.

Yea, I could probably name some. They are like the guy who breaks up with his girlfriend and spends the rest of his life bad mouthing her.

I am of the Body of Christ, and i am counseled to seek my own salvation, with fear and trembling. It is my works that will be tested with fire. I must reap what i sow. I already provided some preliminary Witnesses for my authority, and i notice you aren't addressing them. My authority is Christ, and i need no intercessor; would you like to see those verses too?

30. The lack of a definitive teaching authority in Protestant (as with the Catholic magisterium) makes many individual Protestants think that they have a direct line to God, notwithstanding all of Christian Tradition and the history of biblical exegesis (a "Bible, Holy Spirit and me" mentality). Such people are generally under-educated theologically, unteachable, lack humility, and have no business making presumed "infallible" statements about the nature of Christianity. 150 Reasons Why I Am a Catholic

i beg your pardon? is unsupported put-downs all you got? then have a nice day

You are the one who made unsupported put-downs of Catholic sacraments. I can offer copious scriptural support for all 7 of them but I am not sure the page is long enough. You won't know until you want to know. But what do you care? You have a direct line to God. Have a nice day.

 

[mjrhealth]

150 Reasons Why I Am a Catholic

I can give you one reason why we are Christians "CHRIST". Is this not a "christian" forum are we not supposed to be promoting Christ, it is no wonder so many stay away from religion.

 

[bbyrd009]

Nobody made demands to God for a papacy.

how do you know? If i showed you proof of where the RCC wrested control of the fledgling Church administration from the Congregation, what would you say then? I'm not sure how you imagine men would have done anything else? Men make kings. God wants men to have Christ as King. And you cannot serve two masters. So the only reason there is a dichotomy here in most peoples' minds is because they want a human king, not because there is any argument at "God wants men to recognize Christ as King." There is a difference, iow, at obeying just laws and praying for your rulers, and kissing the ring. You cannot divide your fealty, between some guy and God, whether you think you can or not. You can try, and you can then pretend, and you will spend those days misinterpreting Scripture--the part you even acknowledge--or ignoring other passages entirely, because they will not resolve for you.

You will not be able to functionally put yourself in the Sinai, as a Wanderer, and you will evince all of the signs of one in the Promised Land, worshipping Nehushtan. That is why these passages are given--and why you will never hear a sermon on them; and why you likely never even heard of Nehushtan until you started reading me--so that one might see, or not see.

So it becomes pointless, imo, to condemn the papacy, or uplift it, either one, when it is seen that it is just a manifestation of men, an inevitable thing, a reflection of the war that is within each of us. Some physical manifestation of the church must exist, obviously, and must both do human good, and be corrupt, according to the hearts that manifest it. And it cannot define the Church, which is a Spiritual entity, the Body of Christ.

 

[bbyrd009]

30. The lack of a definitive teaching authority in Protestant (as with the Catholic magisterium) makes many individual Protestants think that they have a direct line to God, notwithstanding all of Christian Tradition and the history of biblical exegesis (a "Bible, Holy Spirit and me" mentality).

Yet i have quoted Scripture that tells you as much, and the Book even goes further, to say that one who is physically uncircumcised and does not even have the Book, the letter, will judge those who are circumcised and have the Book. Sure doesn't sound like the Catholic religion, or any other that comes to mind, either. If you don't have a direct line to God, then you are doomed, as Job teaches us.

Such people are generally under-educated theologically, unteachable, lack humility, and have no business making presumed "infallible" statements about the nature of Christianity.

Hmm, in my experience they are generally the ones with several years of study, as newbies pretty much rely on their pastors or priests for their doctrine, but i guess they prolly range along a bell-curve like everyone else does. I see very little (no) difference in a Catholic and someone who unquestioningly accepts whatever death-centered dogma their guy in a tie who claims "Protestant" is telling them tbh. If you are waiting for Jesus to come save you, or waiting for death to go somewhere and be with Jesus, or even just waiting, for what you do not know, then it seems to me you have to question whether you are of the Body of Christ, and filled with His Spirit. This imo is a frank statement from God to you that you are not getting it.

And i don't mean that to be a put down, or any kind of slur, it takes years to establish one's root, and church is a great place for that. The only way to grasp humility is to experience pride, i guess. How are you going to know what a wolf in sheep's clothing looks like, if you don't experience a wolf in sheep's clothing. How are you going to find your first love, if you don't forget your first love. No one hits the mark consistently, without first missing the mark; there is no shame in this. We all find what we seek. Everyone reaps what they sow. Catholic, Protestant, or Wiccan. God judges the heart.

 

[bbyrd009]

You are the one who made unsupported put-downs of Catholic sacraments. I can offer copious scriptural support for all 7 of them

well, you say i am putting Catholic ones down, when i meant to point out the currently ritual nature of both Catholic and Protestant--or any--"sacraments," performed as rituals, religiously, iow, rather than recognizing them as life events. I can offer copious Scriptural support for all of them, too, that actually apply to someone's walk. I know that you surely hold to transubstantiation, but of course no one actually took a bite from Jesus' arm or anything when they had the chance, did they. But we pretend after the fact that Christ's Body is really consumed now. And i'm pretty sure some wars were fought over this, this silly idea, that men made up, and Christ has nothing to do with, as the lesson makes clear to anyone who can hear.

So at least now you can claim alliance against me with Protestant pastors, if you like. And here, i'll put it plainly, just so there is no misunderstanding; if you take communion in a church at some point, because it has meaning for you and brings you closer to Christ in some way, then amen; but if you do not, if you never do this, but you grasp the point of "consuming" Christ as a metaphor for dying yourself, and replacing yourself with Christ, and manifesting Christ more as a way to salvation, then you will judge those who are circumcised and have the Bible, the ones quoting Scripture at you with slitted eyes. This is a promise from the Bible.

 

[bbyrd009]

I can give you one reason why we are Christians "CHRIST". Is this not a "christian" forum are we not supposed to be promoting Christ, it is no wonder so many stay away from religion.

well, let's be honest, our churches are in meltdown, Cath or Prot. 65 million people have bailed from Western Christianity, i guess in the US alone. And these people have not stopped seeking God, most of them. I think they have just had enough of the lie, the death-centered models that encourage us to believe that Paul was suicidal or whatever, looked forward to death so he could be with Jesus in the Sky. What tripe.

 

[BreadOfLife]

well, you say i am putting Catholic ones down, when i meant to point out the currently ritual nature of both Catholic and Protestant--or any--"sacraments," performed as rituals, religiously, iow, rather than recognizing them as life events. I can offer copious Scriptural support for all of them, too, that actually apply to someone's walk. I know that you surely hold to transubstantiation, but of course no one actually took a bite from Jesus' arm or anything when they had the chance, did they. But we pretend after the fact that Christ's Body is really consumed now. And i'm pretty sure some wars were fought over this, this silly idea, that men made up, and Christ has nothing to do with, as the lesson makes clear to anyone who can hear.

So at least now you can claim alliance against me with Protestant pastors, if you like. And here, i'll put it plainly, just so there is no misunderstanding; if you take communion in a church at some point, because it has meaning for you and brings you closer to Christ in some way, then amen; but if you do not, if you never do this, but you grasp the point of "consuming" Christ as a metaphor for dying yourself, and replacing yourself with Christ, and manifesting Christ more as a way to salvation, then you will judge those who are circumcised and have the Bible, the ones quoting Scripture at you with slitted eyes. This is a promise from the Bible.

Time for a Bible lesson . . .

In 1 Corinthians 11:27-30, Paul speaks to the reality of the Eucharist and the severity of the consequences to those who take this lightly: “Therefore whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will have to answer for the body and blood of the Lord. A person should examine himself, and so eat the bread and drink the cup. For anyone who eats and drinks without discerning the body, eats and drinks judgment on himself. That is why many among you are ill and infirm, and a considerable number are dying.”This is pretty harsh language for something that Protestants claim is only a symbol.

This directly correlates to the Bread of Life discourse in John 6, where Jesus stated in no uncertain terms: “Amen, amen, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.
Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him on the last day. For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him.”

The usual Greek word used for human eating is “phagon”, however, this is NOT the word used in these passages. St. John uses the word, “trogon”, which means, to rip apart one's food - like an animal. Jesus was again using hyperbole as he often did to drive his point across so that the crowd would understand that he was NOT speaking metaphorically. He meant what he said.

Just as the Paschal Lamb was to be eaten, it is also true for the Lamb of God.

In verse 60, his disciples said, "This saying is hard; who can accept it?"
Did Jesus explain what he "really" meant? No, he said: "Does this shock you?" He knew that some would not believe because they didn't have true faith from the Father.

READ the verses immediately following verse 63 (64-65): “But there are some of you who do not believe.” Jesus knew from the beginning the ones who would not believe and the one who would betray him. And he said, “For this reason I have told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by my Father.”

Here, Jesus is telling them that unless we are drawn to him by the Father, we cannot possibly understand him. This is why his followers abandoned him and returned to their former way of life in verse 66. This verse says, “As a result of this, many of his disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him.”

This marks the only time in Scripture where Jesus' disciples left him for doctrinal reasons. They simply couldn't handle what Jesus was telling them.
It is also important to note what happened after this. Did Jesus plead with them or explain that he was speaking “metaphorically” or “symbolically”? NO. He turned to the Apostles and said, "Do you also want to leave?"

It is completely evident - except to people like YOU who refuse to see - that Jesus meant what he said.

At the Last Supper, Jesus gave the MEANS of how to consume His body and Blood SACRAMENTALLY.

 

[BreadOfLife]

well, let's be honest, our churches are in meltdown, Cath or Prot. 65 million people have bailed from Western Christianity, i guess in the US alone. And these people have not stopped seeking God, most of them. I think they have just had enough of the lie, the death-centered models that encourage us to believe that Paul was suicidal or whatever, looked forward to death so he could be with Jesus in the Sky. What tripe.

Matt. 16:18
And so I say to you, you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it.

Christ's Church will be here to the end.
The ONLY thing that is in "meltdown" is YOUR faith.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Are you not tre one declaring "your" cghurch to be "better" than everyone elses. Yes Christ and "His" church is inseperable good thing its not yours.

Doesnt need to but as I said, men are carnal

1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

go all to do with this

Act 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
Act 10:45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

God soent need men, its men who have no faith in God..

Exo_8:1 And the LORD spake unto Moses, Go unto Pharaoh, and say unto him, Thus saith the LORD, Let my people go, that they may serve me.

But still today pharaoh wont let Gods people go and still today they are in bondage and serve men and not God.

As i said all you do is promote your Church, would you have us all rather believe a lie than the truth that is in Jesus

The Catholic Church isn't "Better" than everybody else's.
It's the ONLY Church established by Christ.

The problem is not His Church - it is the 50,000 or so disjointed, perpetually-splintering sects that ALL teach different doctrines and were founded by MEN in the 16th century:

Some Protestant denominations believe in baptismal regeneration, while others do not.
Some believe in soul-sleep, while others do not.
Some believe in the total depravity of man, while others do not.
Some believe in the Holy Trinity, while others do not.
Some believe in doctrine of “once saved, always saved”, while others do not.
Some believe in a pre-tribulation “Rapture”, while others do not.
Some believe that only those who were predestined will make it to heaven, while others do not.
Some believe that some were predestined for hell, while others do not.
Some believe in a woman’s right to choose abortion, while others do not.
Some believe that practicing homosexuality is a sin, while others do not.
Most believe in contraception, while others do not – and the list goes on.

And YOU have the nerve to talk about the teachings of "mere men".
What hypocrisy . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

I can give you one reason why we are Christians "CHRIST". Is this not a "christian" forum are we not supposed to be promoting Christ, it is no wonder so many stay away from religion.

Comparing "Catholic" to "Christian" is an exercise in ignorance.
It is an oxymoron (look up that word).

Not only are Catholics Christian - we were the very FIRST Christians.

 

[mjrhealth]

The Catholic Church isn't "Better" than everybody else's.
It's the ONLY Church established by Christ.

Still want us to believe a lie, thats teh work of teh devil not christ.

Comparing "Catholic" to "Christian" is an exercise in ignorance.
It is an oxymoron (look up that word).

Not only are Catholics Christian - we were the very FIRST Christians.

As isaid, you never come here to glorfy Jesus nor God its all about your church, havre you not read,

Mat 6:24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

So which is it??

No you where not teh first Christians, just another lie,

Act 4:4 Howbeit many of them which heard the word believed; and the number of the men was about five thousand.

They where teh first Christians all those who heard and believed well before "your Church" was establisehd. As I said shes like a spolied child, a jealous sister crying "look at me look at me". a bit like the story of snow white with te hugly step sisters hating her because she was so beautfull, Your church, doent even compare to teh "bride of Christ". His Church.

For you to justify your church you have to lie, isnt the devil teh father of lies???

 

[BreadOfLife]

Still want us to believe a lie, thats teh work of teh devil not christ.

As isaid, you never come here to glorfy Jesus nor God its all about your church, havre you not read,

Mat 6:24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

So which is it??

No you where not teh first Christians, just another lie,

Act 4:4 Howbeit many of them which heard the word believed; and the number of the men was about five thousand.

They where teh first Christians all those who heard and believed well before "your Church" was establisehd. As I said shes like a spolied child, a jealous sister crying "look at me look at me". a bit like the story of snow white with te hugly step sisters hating her because she was so beautfull, Your church, doent even compare to teh "bride of Christ". His Church.

For you to justify your church you have to lie, isnt the devil teh father of lies???

Don't you EVER tire of being proven wrong??

As i have repeatedly shown you - preaching about Christ's Church is preaching about CHRIST Himself.
Looks like another Bible lesson is in order . . .

Christ’s Church isn’t a gaggle of 50,000 or so disjointed sects of “believers”.

- Jesus established ONE Church (Matt. 16:16-19)- not 50,000 competing sects 2000 years later.

- He prayed fervently that this Church remain ONE - as He and the Father are ONE (John 17:20-23).
There is NO other.

- Jesus is Truth itself (John 14:6).

- Jesus promised His Church that the Holy Spirit would guide her to ALL Truth (John 16:12-15).

- The Church is the Pillar and Foundation of Truth (1 Tim. 3:15).

- The Church is the Body of Christ and He is the Head (1 Cor. 12:12-31, Eph. 4:3-6, Col. 1:8).

- The Church is the FULLNESS of Christ (Eph. 1:22-23).

- Jesus identifies His very SELF with His Church (Acts 9:4-5).

- Jesus gave the Church supreme Authority on earth and WHATEVER it ordains on earth is also ordained in heaven (Matt. 16:18-19, 18:15-18, Luke 10:16, John 20:21-23).

In other words, my Scripturally-bankrupt friend – Christ’s Church is HIM in His fullness.

And, until you can show me WHEN you think the Catholic church was created - you have NO case because I have already shown that the Church established by Christ was already being called "The Catholic Church" by the end of the FIRST century. Oh, and i'll need historical documentation from you to prove your point.

Happy hunting . . .