Why Christians Disagree

[FatalMoves]

The bible is clear that the believer's and followers of Jesus are to be of one accord, be of one mind, be of one judgment. But when you see that the opposite is true, that believer's are not all of one accord or of one mind then we can only speculate that something is very wrong.

 

[Vince]

The bible is clear that the believer's and followers of Jesus are to be of one accord, be of one mind, be of one judgment. But when you see that the opposite is true, that believer's are not all of one accord or of one mind then we can only speculate that something is very wrong.

I agree, and especially on the most important doctrine of salvation. Just look at the forums we cannot post in. They all claim to be Christians but have very different ideas on core doctrine. When I was a christian this always bothered me until I realized the reason for it. They have no clear evidence for their beliefs.

 

[Vince]

Conversation arc starts in post #42.

Ok.

 

[FatalMoves]

I agree, and especially on the most important doctrine of salvation. Just look at the forums we cannot post in. They all claim to be Christians but have very different ideas on core doctrine. When I was a christian this always bothered me until I realized the reason for it. They have no clear evidence for their beliefs.

Without grounded facts, faith can become anything it wants. Faith can feed your enemy or fly a plane into their buildings.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

I agree, and especially on the most important doctrine of salvation. Just look at the forums we cannot post in. They all claim to be Christians but have very different ideas on core doctrine. When I was a christian this always bothered me until I realized the reason for it. They have no clear evidence for their beliefs.

With all due respect, this response shows a lack of study and listening.

 

[FatalMoves]

 

[Vince]

Without grounded facts, faith can become anything it wants. Faith can feed your enemy or fly a plane into their buildings.

Amen!

 

[Vince]

With all due respect, this response shows a lack of study and listening.

Ok. I guess we just don't agree.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Ok. I guess we just don't agree.

Did you ever serious study of epistemology within your branch of Christianity? And then go are seriously study epistemology within another branch? And then a third?

And are you willing to do so now?

 

[amadeus]

Atheists make no claim on what a god would be like. We are not even saying gods don’t exist. We just want evidence.

Sounds more like an agnostic than a true atheist!

 

[FatalMoves]

Did you ever serious study of epistemology within your branch of Christianity? And then go are seriously study epistemology within another branch? And then a third?

And are you willing to do so now?

What does all this added doctrine and theology have to do with "Love the Lord your God, and your neighbour second"

Or

Love the life you have, and treat others the way they want to be treated.

 

[FatalMoves]

Sounds more like an agnostic than a true atheist!

Atheism is only a position (A stance) it is not a belief system. Richard Dawkins said this

 

[amadeus]

1 Corinthians 1:10 ESV
I appeal to you, brothers, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment.

This is the direction but alone how can anyone take it? how can anyone stay on the road to the end?

"O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem 10:23

 

[Episkopos]

It is hard, to begin with even, to understand the length, width, and height of His great love. I believe it of course because of how He has rewarded my faith and trust in Him. And, how perfectly and precisely He times His answer to prayer! I am shocked every time then I'm like "why am I so shocked? This is how He ALWAYS works"
The fire and brimstone preachers are simply trying to scare people into their "buildings"...like @Episkopos said, to get your money. That is so wrong on so many levels. Besides the obvious one of getting your money, it will lead people to believe in works as a way to salvation...HA! Jesus is the ONLY way. As far as Hell, Sheol Tartarus, Hades..."hell" was created for Satan and the third of the angels that fell with him. Those who will "perish", to me simply means to be destroyed and become nothing. JMHO ♥
If I'm wrong, I guess I will find out, huh? But, knowing God as I do now, I cannot add the horrible characteristic of "monster" to our GOOD God.

Can you say "Christian terrorist!"

 

[Episkopos]

Then god must not love me because I don't believe he exists.

God loves you....but you are simply unknown to your true self and identity...created by God.

 

[amadeus]

This is untrue. The Catholic Church in the Council of Trent and Vatican II deny salvation by grace alone and requires works. Seventh day Adventists require works as well if you look at how they define faith. These people call themselves Christians.

I would really pay not attention in many cases what people call themselves or what they say. Look rather to their hearts. That is what God does.
Can we see the hearts of others?

"Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." Matt 7:22-23

 

[Episkopos]

This is a good question. We can start with Solipsism. The idea that we can only know that our own minds exist. The mind in a jar idea. I cannot know for sure that there are other minds, neither can you. I could just be making everything up. There has not been a solution to this problem. So at this point you and I have to make a decision. I have made a decision to believe there are other minds and that I am interacting with real people, reality is as it seems. That seems to me to be the best answer.

Of course our minds are made of matter and chemicals. Take away the brain and the mind no longer exists. No mind has ever existed without a brain. My mind can learn and describe nature around me. Other minds have come up with ways to efficiently gain and interpret data through science so we can know things with as much certainty as we can. We cannot know 100% that gravity will always act as we have described it our equations, but we do have a high confidence level that it will based on past experience. This is how we gain knowledge, we also gain knowledge through experience. I would not know what love feels like if I did not love another.

You have a problem because you claim to have knowledge you have insufficient evidence for. I don't. I want to believe things are true because there are sufficient reasons to do so. Believing a god exists does not meet that criteria in my opinion.

You are looking on the wrong level. God does not reveal Himself to the outer natural man. God isn't like us. (THANKFULLY)

When you look in a person's eyes...are you studying the other from a scientific or robotic perspective?

God is MORE intimate than people are. Infinitely so. God does not bear to be treated as a thing to be studied and measured. He seeks relationship.

 

[Vince]

Sounds more like an agnostic than a true atheist!

I am a true atheist. Atheism is defined as lack of belief in a god.

 

[Vince]

You are looking on the wrong level. God does not reveal Himself to the outer natural man. God isn't like us. (THANKFULLY)

When you look in a person's eyes...are you studying the other from a scientific or robotic perspective?

God is MORE intimate than people are. Infinitely so. God does not bear to be treated as a thing to be studied and measured. He seeks relationship.

A relationship needs two parties Where is the evidence of god in the relationship?

 

[amadeus]

The reason I left my faith is because of study. My final two years I studied a lot to understand the bible, god salvation. Many atheists came to a position of non belief because they performed an in-depth and long study of the bible. If you can give sufficient evidence for a belief in god go ahead.

"And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh." Ecc 12:12