Why Jews were Made, not Born

[Episkopos]

“As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:” (Romans 3:10)
Are you saying this is not true?

Why is everything a polarity with you? That is religious thinking. You have your mind stuck on one idea (idee fixe) and can't see beyond it.

No one is righteous like God. In comparison EVERYTHING we do is imperfect. Like the way you are thinking...which is even more imperfect than the ones you are criticizing.

But the righteousness of God is in LOVE. A sacrificial love...which you don't yet understand. So you are operating from yourself...your own selfish understanding...placing yourself above others.

But you can learn what love is ...of Christ.

So then there is a righteousness outside of God...but it is limited. It is weak. But God still sees it as good....if we don't push it ourselves. Like the Samaritan. He did what was right towards his "neighbour".

We are called to be perfect as God is. So unless you are perfect and never sin...you cannot destroy the weakness of human righteousness...Jesus came to NOT break the weak broken reed...or quench the weak smoking flax. But you stomp all over the place thinking you are justified in destroying what is weak in the world

But this makes you an enemy of righteousness. For you are NOT walking in God's righteousness AND you condemn all righteousness.

But Jesus came to fulfill ALL righteousness. That means He came to do both a human AND a divine righteousness. Learn what that is...

 

[Dave L]

Why is everything a polarity with you? That is religious thinking. You have your mind stuck on one idea (idee fixe) and can't see beyond it.

No one is righteous like God. In comparison EVERYTHING we do is imperfect. Like the way you are thinking...which is even more imperfect than the ones you are criticizing.

But the righteousness of God is in LOVE. A sacrificial love...which you don't yet understand. So you are operating from yourself...your own selfish understanding...placing yourself above others.

But you can learn what love is ...of Christ.

So then there is a righteousness outside of God...but it is limited. It is weak. But God still sees it as good....if we don't push it ourselves. Like the Samaritan. He did what was right towards his "neighbour".

We are called to be perfect as God is. So unless you are perfect and never sin...you cannot destroy the weakness of human righteousness...Jesus came to NOT break the weak broken reed...or quench the weak smoking flax. But you stomp all over the place thinking you are justified in destroying what is weak in the world

But this makes you an enemy of righteousness. For you are NOT walking in God's righteousness AND you condemn all righteousness.

But Jesus came to fulfill ALL righteousness. That means He came to do both a human AND a divine righteousness. Learn what that is...

People either serve Christ or Satan. There is no middle ground.

“What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?” (Romans 6:15–16)

 

[Episkopos]

People either serve Christ or Satan. There is no middle ground.

Whoever is not against us is for us. Read the Sheep and goat judgment. Many people who think they are serving Christ are actually doing the devil's work....like judging everyone. But many are doing the Lord's bidding without knowing it...like the sheep in the story.

 

[Episkopos]

“What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?” (Romans 6:15–16)

Are you saying that unbelievers are not under the law?

Do you realize that the world is not the church and the church is not the world? I think we have found your root error...

 

[Dave L]

Are you saying that unbelievers are not under the law?

Do you realize that the world is not the church and the church is not the world? I think we have found your root error...

The law written in their heart condemns them even if they never heard of the Ten Commandments.

 

[Dave L]

Whoever is not against us is for us. Read the Sheep and goat judgment. Many people who think they are serving Christ are actually doing the devil's work....like judging everyone. But many are doing the Lord's bidding without knowing it...like the sheep in the story.

“Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.” (Matthew 7:22–23)

 

[Stranger]

This assumes a physical kingdom of God on earth. This will never be. Jesus says his kingdom comes without observation, is not of this world, is eternal, not merely 1000 years long. And flesh and blood cannot enter it. And unless a person is born again, they cannot see it. Even though it has been here and in heaven since the first century.

“But if I cast out demons by the finger of God, then the kingdom of God has already overtaken you.” (Luke 11:20)

This assumes a physical resurrection of Jesus Christ. Did the body that was on the cross, that laid in the grave for three days rise from the dead?

Jesus Christ came without observation also as King of the Jews. Yet He came. Just because God's Kingdom is not of the world doesn't mean it won't be physical. You have bought into Platonic Christianity.

That Christians are in the Kingdom now doesn't mean the Kingdom of God will not be physical. (Matt. 6:10) "Thy kingdom come they will be done in earth as it is in heaven."

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

I use most all the standard works found in most theological libraries.

In other words you don't want to give it. Apparently for obvious reasons.

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

Circumcision made one a physical member of Israel. When Christ abolished circumcision, nothing remained to make one a physical member of Israel.

Circumcision didn't make one an Israelite. It was a sign of the Abrahamic Covenant that they were to observe. (Gen. 17:9-14) Where did Christ abolish circumcision?

Stranger

 

[Enoch111]

Where did Christ abolish circumcision?

On the cross. The Old Covenant was made null and void at the Cross.

Hence the heavy veil in the temple separating the Holy Place from the Holy of Holiest (the Holiest Place) was supernaturally torn in two by God Himself. And all of this is clearly explained in the epistle to the Hebrews (as well as other ScriptureS). Therefore you will find that Paul says again and again that circumcision (outwardly) is meaningless for spiritual purposes.

GALATIANS 5
1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

2 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.

3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.

4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

5F or we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.

6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

 

[Dave L]

Circumcision didn't make one an Israelite. It was a sign of the Abrahamic Covenant that they were to observe. (Gen. 17:9-14) Where did Christ abolish circumcision?

Stranger

Why did Moses continue the practice under the original set of rules?

 

[Dave L]

In other words you don't want to give it. Apparently for obvious reasons.

Stranger

I use Strong's, Louw nida, BDG, BDAG, Kittle (Big and Small) for Greek, Halot, Brown Driver Briggs, Gesenius, for Hebrew and Aramaic. And some others....

 

[Dave L]

This assumes a physical resurrection of Jesus Christ. Did the body that was on the cross, that laid in the grave for three days rise from the dead?

Jesus Christ came without observation also as King of the Jews. Yet He came. Just because God's Kingdom is not of the world doesn't mean it won't be physical. You have bought into Platonic Christianity.

That Christians are in the Kingdom now doesn't mean the Kingdom of God will not be physical. (Matt. 6:10) "Thy kingdom come they will be done in earth as it is in heaven."

Stranger

If God did not raise Jesus from the dead, we are still in our sins.

 

[Dave L]

Circumcision didn't make one an Israelite. It was a sign of the Abrahamic Covenant that they were to observe. (Gen. 17:9-14) Where did Christ abolish circumcision?

Stranger

“Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.” (Galatians 5:2–4)

 

[Stranger]

On the cross. The Old Covenant was made null and void at the Cross.

Hence the heavy veil in the temple separating the Holy Place from the Holy of Holiest (the Holiest Place) was supernaturally torn in two by God Himself. And all of this is clearly explained in the epistle to the Hebrews (as well as other ScriptureS). Therefore you will find that Paul says again and again that circumcision (outwardly) is meaningless for spiritual purposes.

GALATIANS 5
1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

2 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.

3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.

4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

5F or we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.

6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

Christ never abolished circumcision. Nor did Paul abolish circumcision. Circumcision as obedience to the law, Paul did preach against as they were using circumcision as evidence that they were justified by law. (Acts 15:5)

And shortly after the council at Jerusalem Paul had Timothy circumcised so as to remove any barrier between his testimony to the Jews about Christ. (Acts 16:3)

Circumcision was given prior to the Mosaic Law to the Jews as their testimony of faith in the Abrahamic Covenant. (Gen. 17:9-14) If one is being circumcised in obedience to the Mosaic Law, to be found justified by the Law, then no. If one is circumcised in obedience to the Abarahamic covenant, then there is nothing wrong with it.

In the Church of course, it does not matter whether or not one is circumcised. But it has not been abolished. And I assure you that all those believing Jews who will constitute the believing Israel during the Millennium, will be circumcised.

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

Why did Moses continue the practice under the original set of rules?

You ask questions but want me to do all the labor. When you ask a question provide the Scripture you are addressing.

So, my response to your question and any other question formed in like manner is this, where did Moses continue the practice of circumcision?

Do I know where, yes I do. But I am tired of doing your work.

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

I use Strong's, Louw nida, BDG, BDAG, Kittle (Big and Small) for Greek, Halot, Brown Driver Briggs, Gesenius, for Hebrew and Aramaic. And some others....

Impressive.

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

If God did not raise Jesus from the dead, we are still in our sins.

True statement. Just has nothing to do with the subject.

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

“Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.” (Galatians 5:2–4)

See my post (#115).

Stranger

 

[Dave L]

See my post (#115).

Stranger

Circumcision made one a physical Jew and member of Israel. Christ abolished all the OC, animal sacrifices, circumcision, Sabbath keeping etc on the cross. This is how he removed the unbelieving from Israel (Romans 11).