Why many Christians will be deceived by Satan

[PS95]

Need to look at Christ and what He says...
Matthew 19:17
And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

1Now accept the one who is weak in faith, but not to have quarrels over opinions. 2One person has faith that he may eat all things, but the one who is weak eats only vegetables. 3The one who eats is not to regard with contempt the one who does not eat, and the one who does not eat is not to judge the one who eats, for God has accepted him. 4Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.

5One person values one day over another, another values every day the same. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind. 6The one who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and the one who eats, does so with regard to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and the one who does not eat, it is for the Lord that he does not eat, and he gives thanks to God. 7For not one of us lives for himself, and not one dies for himself; 8for if we live, we live for the Lord, or if we die, we die for the Lord; therefore whether we live or die, we are the Lord’s. 9For to this end Christ died and lived again, that He might be Lord both of the dead and of the living.

10But as for you, why do you judge your brother or sister? Or you as well, why do you regard your brother or sister with contempt? For we will all appear before the judgment seat of God. 11For it is written:

“AS I LIVE, SAYS THE LORD, TO ME EVERY KNEE WILL BOW,

AND EVERY TONGUE WILL GIVE PRAISE TO GOD.” 12So then each one of us will give an account of himself to God.

13Therefore let’s not judge one another anymore, but rather determine this: not to put an obstacle or a stumbling block in a brother’s or sister’s way. 14I know and am convinced ]in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself; but to the one who thinks something is unclean, to that person it is unclean. 15For if because of food your brother or sister is hurt, you are no longer walking in accordance with love. Do not destroy with your choice of food that person for whom Christ died. 16Therefore do not let what is for you a good thing be spoken of as evil; 17for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit. 18For the one who serves Christ in this way is acceptable to God and approved by other people. 19So then we pursue the things which make for peace and the building up of one another. 20Do not tear down the work of God for the sake of food. All things indeed are clean, but they are evil for the person who eats and causes offense. 21It is good not to eat meat or to drink wine, or to do anything by which your brother or sister stumbles. 22The faith which you have, have as your own conviction before God. Happy is the one who does not condemn himself in what he approves. 23But the one who doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating is not from faith; and whatever is not from faith is sin.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Your understanding is not supported by the scriptures I posted. The only people who "overcome" are the Elect and they "overcome" only because Christ causes it to happen. Christ causes it to happen when He returns. If a believer dies before Christ comes a second time to them, then they are not one of the Elect.

What brings you to this conclusion? Are you saying that the elect are only those alive when Christ returns?

1Thess 4:13-17….NASB…
”But we do not want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, so that you will not grieve as do the rest who have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus. For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord.”

“Those who are asleep” are those of the elect who died faithful. They are “sleeping” in their graves until the time of Christ’s return, just as Jesus said his friend Lazarus was “sleeping” in death. (John 11:11-14)
These will be resurrected before the ones living when Christ returns. They will NOT precede them. (Rev 20:6)

Christ’s “coming” is misrepresented in the Scriptures as an event that all will witness, and yet the angels who appeared to the apostles when Jesus ascended into heaven, said he would return in the “same manner”…so what was the manner of his departure? He was caught away in the clouds, meaning that his actual ascension was concealed even from them…..the clouds here are synonymous with invisibility because clouds can hide even the sun. There is not a single scripture that suggests that the clouds are angels.

Another important aspect of Christ’s return is the word used in Matthew 24:3…
”As He was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things happen, and what will be the sign of Your coming,and of the end of the age?”

The word rendered “coming” is an error in translation. The word used is not “erchomai” (coming )but “parousia” (presence). The difference is important because one can be “present” without discerning when they arrived. A “presence“ is not the same as one’s arrival.

Since Jesus was to come back in the ”same manner” that he left, the world at large was not aware of his ascension and neither were all of his disciples who were not present like the apostles, when he ascended and then disappeared from their view. The apostles took that news to the faithful.

So examining Matt 24:3-14, we see Jesus describe a “sign” in world events that would identify the time of his “presence” as King. If it was a visual event seen by all, then what was the purpose of the “sign of his presence” and “the end of the age”? It was to begin with unprecedented warfare……the First World War was such an event….and what has followed since has fulfilled the ”sign” in every way……so Christ has been here, invisibly “present” for over 100 years already. We are staring down the barrel of “the end” of satan’s entire world system.

If Christ came invisibly (in the midst of his enemies) to oversee the work he had assigned to his disciples (that of preaching the good news of the Kingdom in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations” before “the end” came…Matt 24:14; Matt 28:19-20) then in saying that he would be “with” his disciples in this work, we would expect to see a global preaching campaign the likes of which the world at large had never seen before…..international in its scope and undertaken in the midst of Christ’s enemies.
Jesus‘ words would prepare them for a hostile audience.

John 15:18-21…
”If the world hates you, you know that it has hated Me before you. If you were of the world, the world would love its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, because of this the world hates you. Remember the word that I said to you, ‘A slave is not greater than his master.’ If they persecuted Me, they will also persecute you; if they kept My word, they will keep yours also. But all these things they will do to you for My name’s sake, because they do not know the One who sent Me.”

Who were the most hostile to Jesus and his disciples? Was it not those who claimed to worship the same God? Should we expect any difference today since the devil has no new tricks…..the old ones still work for him. The deceived majority would be persecuting the hated minority.

Being “no part of the world” shows Christendom up for ignoring Christ‘s teachings on this matter….the churches are up to their necks in politics and they support the corrupt governments of this world. They fully support the bloodshed and the use of heinous weapons that indiscriminately take the lives of the innocent victims of their wars and conflicts…..largely political, and often religious or racial.
Genuine Christians have their citizenship in God’s Kingdom, not man’s.…..God’s people today are not based on race, but on their dedication to God through faith and obedience to his son. (Acts 10:34-35) We cannot take up arms against anyone, let alone those who may be on the other side of a conflict who also identify as “Christians”….(1John 4:20-21)

“By their fruits” Jesus said we would identify his true disciples from those who merely claim to be footstep followers of Christ. There are no excuses for disobedience in any of these areas…..they are the true testing ground for Christians to BE “NO PART OF THE WORLD”…..when patriotic sentiments overshadow Christ’s teachings, individuals show where their loyalty truly lies. We cannot serve two masters.

Your understanding of the New Covenant teachings is carnally based (physical and outward) when they should be spiritually based (eyes that can see). Spiritually based understanding is only given to a believer upon Christ's second coming when He brings salvation to them (Mark 8:15-25, Heb 9:28). If you are waiting for a visible and outward second coming to this world, you will be waiting in vain. Christ does not come that way.

Luke 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: 21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is WITHIN YOU.

Christ is the Kingdom of God.

Luke 17:20-21 is another mistranslated passage…. it actually says…
“For behold, the kingdom of God is in your midst.”

As Luke relays Jesus response to the Pharisees, The Kingdom does not “come” with visual observation, Jesus said…”the kingdom of God is“ (not “within you”) but “in your midst.”
Since Jesus was speaking to the Pharisees, whom he had condemned to “Gehenna” and said that “their hearts were far removed from him”….how could Jesus be saying that the kingdom was “within” them?
The correct rendering shows that the Kingdom of God was “in their midst”…..as its King was right there in front of their eyes, but in their wickedness, they failed to acknowledge him, instead denying him and plotting how to silence him.

These words seem insignificant until you discern their true meaning…..this is why Bible reading has to be backed up by Bible study…..translations can be incorrect and unless you do your homework, you will be deceived like the majority who are travelling the wrong road. Reading the Bible will never replace studying it. Like the people of Noah’s day, they will not believe until the world around them completely falls apart. (Matt 7:13-14; 21-23; Matt 24:37-39) Then it may be too late…..

 

[FaithWillDo]

What brings you to this conclusion? Are you saying that the elect are only those alive when Christ returns?

Dear Aunty Jane,
The New Covenant teachings are spiritual and the spirit words that Christ uses carry meaning that are different than what mankind wisdom teaches.

1Cor 2:13 These things we also speak, not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

To understand the meanings of Christ's spirit words (John 6:63), Paul says to compare those words with how they are used elsewhere in scripture. You should not look for their meanings out in this world as most believers do.

Then, to further conceal the truth of the New Covenant teachings, Christ uses His spirit words in parables, types, analogies and prophecies. Because the truth of Christ's teachings are concealed, Christ is able to decide when and to whom He will reveal it. Mark 8:15:25 is a "type" which teaches that only after Christ "comes again" to a believer and pours out the Latter Rain, will the believer be given "eyes that can see".
The second coming of Christ is a reoccurring spiritual event (Rev 1:4 & 8, 4:8 and 11:7) which only the Elect will experience in this age. When Christ returns to them, He does so for the purpose of pouring out the Latter Rain of the Spirit, followed by the Day of the Lord (judgment).

The apostles experienced Christ's return on the Day of Pentecost. That was their day of salvation and conversion. That is also when Christ healed their spiritual blindness so that the truth of His New Covenant teachings would open up to their understanding. Before that time, the apostles had only received the Early Rain of the Spirit which gave them their faith - but it left them carnally minded and spiritually blind. This is what a portion of Mark 8:15-25 teaches.

Believers (the "many") who only have the Early Rain of the Spirit can only understand "Christ and Him crucified" because Christ physically performed this work. The spiritual work that Christ is presently doing is mostly concealed from them (likened to be near-sighted and not totally blind). The bread that they consumed has leaven hidden in it until the whole loaf was leavened (Mat 13:33). Christ does it this way so that new believers will "fall backward, and be broken, and snared and taken:

Isa 28:9 Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them (the converted Elect) that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts. 10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little: 11 For with stammering lips and another language will he speak to this people. 12 But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; THAT THEY MIGHT GO, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken.

Babes in Christ remain spiritually blind and because of such, they cannot receive the truth of Christ's spiritual teachings. Christ repeats the truth that Isa 28:9-12 teaches in the verses below:

Mat 12:43 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none. 44 Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished. 45 Then goeth he, and taketh with himself SEVEN other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation.

The spiritual symbol of an unclean spirit represents a spirit which teaches Satan's false truth through lies and deceptions.

Since a new believer remains spiritually blind (Mark 8:21-25) after receiving the Early Rain of the Spirit, they cannot replace their worldly false beliefs with the truth of Christ. ONE unclean spirit leaves but comes back with SEVEN more. The number "seven" represents perfection. In this case, the number seven represents the perfection of Satan's lies/deceptions which come to a believer by the indwelling of the spirit of anti-Christ. Now, instead of ONE unclean spirit within the believer, they now have EIGHT. The number eight is a spiritual symbol which represents a new spiritual condition. In this case, the new spiritual condition is worse than the first.

This "worse than the first" spiritual condition causes the believer to become a False Prophet, a Man of Sin, a Minister of Satan and a Seven Headed Beast with Ten Horns & Crowns.

You quoted 1Thes 4:13-17. This scripture is teaching about the bodily resurrection from the grave. It is not a teaching on the second coming of Christ when He brings salvation to the Elect. The resurrection from the grave is the only event that happens at the literal end of this age. All the other "end-time" teachings apply to when Christ "comes again" to convert each of His Elect before they die. In the way, Christ comes quickly to them.

Heb 9:28 So Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.

As for "clouds", it is a spirit word. To find its true meaning, you must compared it with where it is used in other scriptures. The verses below teach the most common spiritual meaning for the spirit word "clouds":

Job 22:14 Thick clouds are a covering to him, that he seeth not; and he walketh in the circuit of heaven.

Job 37:21 With clouds he covereth the light (truth/Christ is truth); and commandeth it not to shine by the cloud that cometh betwixt.

Lam 3:44 Thou hast covered thyself with a cloud, that our prayer should not pass through.

The spirit word "clouds" represents Christ's veil which keeps Him concealed from all who are carnally minded (includes babes in Christ who suck from the breasts). The only ones who can see Christ are the converted Elect who are drawn from the breasts:

Mat 18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.

When the second coming occurs to an Elect individual, Christ comes out of the clouds (His concealment) because the Latter Rain of the Spirit gives the believer "eyes that can see" spiritually.

Clouds can also represent the angels and the Elect:

Heb 12:1 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,

Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds (His witnesses); and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven (His witnesses) with power and great glory. 31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

CONTINUED ON THE NEXT POST...

 

[FaithWillDo]

What brings you to this conclusion? Are you saying that the elect are only those alive when Christ returns?

CONTINUED FROM THE PREVIOUS POST...

As for this verse that you quoted:

Mat 24:3 As He was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things happen, and what will be the sign of Your coming,and of the end of the age?”

The events being described by Christ in Matthew chapter 24 represent the spiritual events that happens within the Elect after they have received the Early Rain of the Spirit up until Christ returns to convert them with the Latter Rain and judgment.

Paul says this about the end of the age:

1Cor 10:11 Now all these things happened to them as types, and have been written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the ages are come.

As I said, the ends of the ages come upon the Elect when Christ returns to convert them. This is the same event that the Apostles experienced on the Day of Pentecost and is what Paul experienced in Damascus after being blind (represents his spiritual blindness) and unable to eat or drink (represents Paul not being able to consume Christ's bread and New Wine) for three days. Paul's conversion "types" the pathway to salvation the Elect will travel. Mat 24 teaches the same truths also (here a little and there a little).

Also, all the parables that begin with the phrase "the Kingdom of Heaven is like" are also teaching on the pathway to salvation.

You said:
If Christ came invisibly (in the midst of his enemies) to oversee the work he had assigned to his disciples (that of preaching the good news of the Kingdom in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations” before “the end” came…Matt 24:14; Matt 28:19-20) then in saying that he would be “with” his disciples in this work, we would expect to see a global preaching campaign the likes of which the world at large had never seen before…..international in its scope and undertaken in the midst of Christ’s enemies.
Jesus‘ words would prepare them for a hostile audience.

Mat 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

Your understanding of this verse is carnal and not spiritual. The phrase "this gospel of the kingdom" is referring to the "another gospel" which is taught to a believer when the spirit of anti-Christ indwells them. After that false gospel is fully accepted into the beliefs (nations) of the believer, the "end" (conversion) will come. When Christ comes, He will pour out the Latter Rain and heals the believer's spiritual blindness. With their blindness healed, they will "see" the Abomination of Desolation that previously occurred within themselves when the spirit of anti-Christ indwelt them.

Mat 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) 16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:

The Abomination of Desolation occurred when the believer (God's temple) was made "worse than the first" (Mat 12:43-45). Immediately following this knowledge of their apostate condition, judgment will fall on the believer to remove the spirit of anti-Christ and the Great Harlot (carnal nature of the believer). This judgment is shown in Mat 24:40-41.

If I didn't respond to all your main points, please specify and I will try to do so.

Joe

 

[Aunty Jane]

I have to say, @FaithWillDo that was probably the most convoluted interpretation of scripture I have ever heard....
Can I ask if this is your personal interpretation of the Bible’s narrative....or whether you have a brotherhood who believe what you believe? Who are your brethren?

 

[FaithWillDo]

I have to say, @FaithWillDo that was probably the most convoluted interpretation of scripture I have ever heard....
Can I ask if this is your personal interpretation of the Bible’s narrative....or whether you have a brotherhood who believe what you believe? Who are your brethren?

Dear Aunty Jane,
I used to have a similar understanding of God's Word as most of the people on this forum have. I even taught end-time prophecy in the last church I attended. My understanding of end-time prophecy back then was in-line with the mainstream church teachings (like yours).

But on Oct 8, 2005, everything changed for me. That is the day that the Lord spiritually returned to me and poured out the Latter Rain of the Spirit. It happened at my home on a Saturday morning. I didn't speak in tongues or anything like what others in the apostate church are said to experience. Those types of gifts are given with the Early Rain of the Spirit and not with the Latter Rain of the Spirit.

Christ made these statements below about His second coming when He pours out the Latter Rain of the Spirit:

John 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the SPIRIT OF TRUTH, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the SPIRIT OF TRUTH, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

The true gifts that come from the Latter Rain of the Spirit (Spirit of Truth) are:

1). The Spirit increases the believer's faith and causes them to repent of their own works which they have been mixing with faith as an apostate believer.
2). Heals a believer's spiritual blindness so that the truth of Christ's spiritual teachings will open up to their understanding.
3). Gives the believer the full measure of the Holy Spirit so that the believer is "born again" and can walk by the Spirit.

The second coming of Christ with the Latter Rain to an Elect believer also comes with spiritual thunder (God's voice) and spiritual earthquakes (the believer's world paradigm is changing). The powers of the heavens are also shaken (stars/unclean spirits). Even the natural sun (Satan) and moon (worsened carnality of the believer) are darkened because the light (false truth) that they give off is no longer being received by the believer.

Here is Peter's description of Christ's return to Himself and the other Jewish Elect on the Day of Pentecost:

Acts 2:14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: 15 For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day. 16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; 17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams: 18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy: 19 And I will show wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapor of smoke: 20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, BEFORE the great and notable Day of the Lord come: 21 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

The conversion event that Peter describes above is the same event that Christ describes in Mat 24:29-31 when He returns to convert an Elect believer. This is when the "ends of the ages" come upon the Elect.

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven (the believer's spiritual blindness has been healed to reveal Christ): and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn (the child of the devil will mourn because the carnal and false beliefs of the believer have died), and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Can you see that these two events described in Acts 2:14-21 & Mat 24:29-31 are speaking of the same event?

After I was converted on Oct. 8th, 2005, I left the apostate church system and never returned because light has no fellowship with darkness. Since that time, I have met a "few" other converted believers on-line but none locally. Nearly all the truth that I have learned since my conversion has come directly from Christ and His Word. I no longer have a need for a "teacher" but am myself a teacher.

My wife was converted on the same day as I was converted. Just before that time, she was given the gift of prophecy which lasted for a couple of more years after our conversion.

Below is a prophecy that my wife received a short time prior to our conversion:

"I am. I know your heart. Seek Me and I will be found. Look deep into My Word. The truth is not to be given by man but only revealed by Me. It is for those whose hearts desire it above the treasures of this world. You must give up all and treasure you will receive. I am the truth and the only way. I am the Lord."

A short time after our conversion, she received this prophecy:

"I am with you. I hear your prayers. You will know my Word when you are able to receive it. I am preparing you for my work. You have much to learn about yourself. You will show others my way. I will prepare you for the work I give you. I am doing my work in you. I am the Lord".

Over the years since our conversion, the Lord has shown us the great treasures of God as recorded in scripture.

This scripture applies:

Prov 2:1 My son (a converted Elect believer), if you receive my words and treasure up my commandments with you, 2 making your ear attentive to wisdom and inclining your heart to understanding; 3 yes, if you call out for insight and raise your voice for understanding, 4 if you seek it like silver and search for it as for hidden treasures, 5 then you will understand the fear of the Lord and find the knowledge of God.

The work that Christ gave to me is to teach others the hidden truth of God. I have spent the last several years teaching on many different forums and have written many papers which I present on the website that Christ inspired me to create. My conversion testimony is there, too.

There is a link to my website just under my member name.

Joe

 

[Ronald Nolette]

If you dont turn to Christ, it doesnt matter the '%'.... When you truly turn to Christ, His Truth from His Word you will internalize in your heart and mind, as the Holy Spirit guides you..

Oh, I agree totally. but all believers are deceived in a measure for the simple fact we are finite, mortal beings trapped for now in a body of sin and death. so many Christians will be surprised at things they believed that will be found to be false because of the subtle schemes of Satan and man.

 

[Aunty Jane]

I used to have a similar understanding of God's Word as most of the people on this forum have. I even taught end-time prophecy in the last church I attended. My understanding of end-time prophecy back then was in-line with the mainstream church teachings (like yours).

I used to believe my mainstream church’s beliefs too, until it dawned on me that most of what they had as their foundational beliefs, did not originate from Scripture, but from the Roman Catholic church.....a corrupt counterfeit created by the devil......nothing taught by them is truth, yet the whole of Christendom bases their beliefs on their faulty foundation. The Reformation cleaned out a lot of obvious rubbish, but did nothing to unite Christianity in truth and love....in fact it just fractured it into thousands of bickering fragments, all claiming to be correct. In that environment, I would be wary of ever being singled out with some spiritual experience, because the deceiver loves to direct people onto the wrong road, for what appears to be the right reason....

But on Oct 8, 2005, everything changed for me. That is the day that the Lord spiritually returned to me and poured out the Latter Rain of the Spirit. It happened at my home on a Saturday morning. I didn't speak in tongues or anything like what others in the apostate church are said to experience. Those types of gifts are given with the Early Rain of the Spirit and not with the Latter Rain of the Spirit.

I believe that Paul confirmed that the gifts of the spirit were for a time and a reason, (a foregleam of the miracles that were to be experienced in the new world to come) so that when Christianity was firmly established, there was no longer a need for miracles. These gifts would cease and be replaced by the more important qualities needed by Christ’s followers to get them through the hard times ahead....”faith, hope and love”. (1 Cor 13:8-13) They would be hated and persecuted especially by those who claimed to worship the same god. (John 15:18-21)
We are to walk by faith in the things unseen, because in a world ruled by the devil, nothing is as it appears. (1 John 5:19)

Christ made these statements below about His second coming when He pours out the Latter Rain of the Spirit:

John 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the SPIRIT OF TRUTH, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the SPIRIT OF TRUTH, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

I see those scriptures in a completely different way.....the “spirit of the truth” is not a “he” but the very power of God himself. The holy spirit can be imparted to humans as it was in the first century, to demonstrate the power of God, but it can also be used in ways that do not involve the supernatural......if the gifts were to cease as Paul indicated, and the Bible indicates another source of power that can mimic the actions of God’s spirit...there is need for caution. If God withdrew his miracles back in apostolic times, then it would be obvious as to the source of any such supernatural experiences in our day.
Jesus told us that these powerful works are not from God.
Matt 7:21-23....
“Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens, but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will. 22 Many will say to me in that day: ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!’”

These ”Christians” are convinced that their “prophesying”, “expelling demons”, and “powerful works” are from God, but Jesus shows that this is not the case.....he rejects them utterly, saying that he “NEVER knew” these ones. It has to give us pause to see who is behind these things.....God.......or the “angel of light” pretender.

After I was converted on Oct. 8th, 2005, I left the apostate church system and never returned because light has no fellowship with darkness. Since that time, I have met a "few" other converted believers on-line but none locally. Nearly all the truth that I have learned since my conversion has come directly from Christ and His Word. I no longer have a need for a "teacher" but am myself a teacher.

You see, that gives me reasons to doubt the source of your revelations.....we cannot be “Christians” in isolation from one another....we must have a global brotherhood who believe as we do.....because the work Jesus commissioned was to be undertaken in “all the inhabited earth as a witness to all the nations”.....we cannot be just a local body with a few dotted here and there with similar beliefs.....the entire body have to be united and to meet regularly for encouragement. (Matt 24:14; 1 Cor 1:10; Heb 10:24-25) Paul said that our meeting together was “to incite to love and fine works”.....and was to be done “all the more so as we beheld the day drawing near”. Jehovah’s day is at hand....and a local church, with few members is not going to get the job done.....First century Christianity is the model.....the Christians met together and were taught one truth.....it was the devil who sowed the counterfeit “weeds”.

 

[Fred J]

We see Christ laying down what will happen at the Second Coming and the signs and events to watch for...

Matthew 24 King James Version (KJV)
1 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.
2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?
4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.
9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.
10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand.
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
25 Behold, I have told you before.
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Take a close look at one verse especially..
“For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect."
Matthew 24:24

Christ repeatedly gave warnings against deception. From what He says in this chapter, these warnings seem to constitute a greater sign of the climax of the ages than any other sign given, with the exception of the worldwide preaching of the gospel. His disciples questioned Him, "When shall these things be?" In reply Christ opened His discourse on the destruction of Jerusalem and the end of the world with a strong warning against deception. His first remark was " Take heed that no man deceive you." in verse 4. Christ connected His warning against deception, not just with the events we would see, but with the spiritual realm.

Satan has set about to plan the last great deception of man. "Jesus is going to come so he must find a way to deceive the world. He is planning a great, masterful delusion to falsify the coming of Christ. Satan wants every man, woman, and child to be duped by the persuasive powers is his plan. And the Bible says it will succeed with everyone, that is, except those who have built a firm foundation upon the Scriptures. The devil is planning one last massive attack against man. The Bible speaks of it.
"Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves" (Matt. 7:15). "And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light" 2 Cor. 11:14.

In Revelation is a description of one last great deception where all the world will be deceived except one small group, the very elect, those who seek put the truth from Christ in their hearts and minds and will go into Gods kingdom.

Revelation 14:12
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Revelation 22:14
Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

Let's not also forget GOD sending a strong delusion on the ones who loved darkness rather than the Light.

And the context of 2 Cor 11:14, is also verse 15, where likewise satan's human servants disguise themselves as servants of righteousness to deceive.

 

[Hobie]

What brings you to this conclusion? Are you saying that the elect are only those alive when Christ returns?

1Thess 4:13-17….NASB…
”But we do not want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, so that you will not grieve as do the rest who have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus. For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord.”

“Those who are asleep” are those of the elect who died faithful. They are “sleeping” in their graves until the time of Christ’s return, just as Jesus said his friend Lazarus was “sleeping” in death. (John 11:11-14)
These will be resurrected before the ones living when Christ returns. They will NOT precede them. (Rev 20:6)

Christ’s “coming” is misrepresented in the Scriptures as an event that all will witness, and yet the angels who appeared to the apostles when Jesus ascended into heaven, said he would return in the “same manner”…so what was the manner of his departure? He was caught away in the clouds, meaning that his actual ascension was concealed even from them…..the clouds here are synonymous with invisibility because clouds can hide even the sun. There is not a single scripture that suggests that the clouds are angels.

Another important aspect of Christ’s return is the word used in Matthew 24:3…
”As He was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things happen, and what will be the sign of Your coming,and of the end of the age?”

The word rendered “coming” is an error in translation. The word used is not “erchomai” (coming )but “parousia” (presence). The difference is important because one can be “present” without discerning when they arrived. A “presence“ is not the same as one’s arrival.

Since Jesus was to come back in the ”same manner” that he left, the world at large was not aware of his ascension and neither were all of his disciples who were not present like the apostles, when he ascended and then disappeared from their view. The apostles took that news to the faithful.

So examining Matt 24:3-14, we see Jesus describe a “sign” in world events that would identify the time of his “presence” as King. If it was a visual event seen by all, then what was the purpose of the “sign of his presence” and “the end of the age”? It was to begin with unprecedented warfare……the First World War was such an event….and what has followed since has fulfilled the ”sign” in every way……so Christ has been here, invisibly “present” for over 100 years already. We are staring down the barrel of “the end” of satan’s entire world system.

If Christ came invisibly (in the midst of his enemies) to oversee the work he had assigned to his disciples (that of preaching the good news of the Kingdom in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations” before “the end” came…Matt 24:14; Matt 28:19-20) then in saying that he would be “with” his disciples in this work, we would expect to see a global preaching campaign the likes of which the world at large had never seen before…..international in its scope and undertaken in the midst of Christ’s enemies.
Jesus‘ words would prepare them for a hostile audience.

John 15:18-21…
”If the world hates you, you know that it has hated Me before you. If you were of the world, the world would love its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, because of this the world hates you. Remember the word that I said to you, ‘A slave is not greater than his master.’ If they persecuted Me, they will also persecute you; if they kept My word, they will keep yours also. But all these things they will do to you for My name’s sake, because they do not know the One who sent Me.”

Who were the most hostile to Jesus and his disciples? Was it not those who claimed to worship the same God? Should we expect any difference today since the devil has no new tricks…..the old ones still work for him. The deceived majority would be persecuting the hated minority.

Being “no part of the world” shows Christendom up for ignoring Christ‘s teachings on this matter….the churches are up to their necks in politics and they support the corrupt governments of this world. They fully support the bloodshed and the use of heinous weapons that indiscriminately take the lives of the innocent victims of their wars and conflicts…..largely political, and often religious or racial.
Genuine Christians have their citizenship in God’s Kingdom, not man’s.…..God’s people today are not based on race, but on their dedication to God through faith and obedience to his son. (Acts 10:34-35) We cannot take up arms against anyone, let alone those who may be on the other side of a conflict who also identify as “Christians”….(1John 4:20-21)

“By their fruits” Jesus said we would identify his true disciples from those who merely claim to be footstep followers of Christ. There are no excuses for disobedience in any of these areas…..they are the true testing ground for Christians to BE “NO PART OF THE WORLD”…..when patriotic sentiments overshadow Christ’s teachings, individuals show where their loyalty truly lies. We cannot serve two masters.


Luke 17:20-21 is another mistranslated passage…. it actually says…
“For behold, the kingdom of God is in your midst.”

As Luke relays Jesus response to the Pharisees, The Kingdom does not “come” with visual observation, Jesus said…”the kingdom of God is“ (not “within you”) but “in your midst.”
Since Jesus was speaking to the Pharisees, whom he had condemned to “Gehenna” and said that “their hearts were far removed from him”….how could Jesus be saying that the kingdom was “within” them?
The correct rendering shows that the Kingdom of God was “in their midst”…..as its King was right there in front of their eyes, but in their wickedness, they failed to acknowledge him, instead denying him and plotting how to silence him.

These words seem insignificant until you discern their true meaning…..this is why Bible reading has to be backed up by Bible study…..translations can be incorrect and unless you do your homework, you will be deceived like the majority who are travelling the wrong road. Reading the Bible will never replace studying it. Like the people of Noah’s day, they will not believe until the world around them completely falls apart. (Matt 7:13-14; 21-23; Matt 24:37-39) Then it may be too late…..

Some people just dont want to see what is right before them in Gods Word...

 

[Hobie]

Oh, I agree totally. but all believers are deceived in a measure for the simple fact we are finite, mortal beings trapped for now in a body of sin and death. so many Christians will be surprised at things they believed that will be found to be false because of the subtle schemes of Satan and man.

Not if you look at the truth given, and the disciples heard clearly what Christ said as its repeated in Mark..

Mark 13:1-27
1 And as he went out of the temple, one of his disciples saith unto him, Master, see what manner of stones and what buildings are here!
2 And Jesus answering said unto him, Seest thou these great buildings? there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives over against the temple, Peter and James and John and Andrew asked him privately,
4 Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when all these things shall be fulfilled?
5 And Jesus answering them began to say, Take heed lest any man deceive you:
6 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
7 And when ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars, be ye not troubled: for such things must needs be; but the end shall not be yet.
8 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be earthquakes in divers places, and there shall be famines and troubles: these are the beginnings of sorrows.
9 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.
10 And the gospel must first be published among all nations.
11 But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.
12 Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.
13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
14 But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:
15 And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house:
16 And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment.
17 But woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
18 And pray ye that your flight be not in the winter.
19 For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.
20 And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.
21 And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here is Christ; or, lo, he is there; believe him not:
22 For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.
23 But take ye heed: behold, I have foretold you all things.
24 But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,
25 And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.
26 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.
27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

And in Luke, so it was very clear what Jesus said.

Luke 21:5-28 King James Version (KJV)
5 And as some spake of the temple, how it was adorned with goodly stones and gifts, he said,
6 As for these things which ye behold, the days will come, in the which there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
7 And they asked him, saying, Master, but when shall these things be? and what sign will there be when these things shall come to pass?
8 And he said, Take heed that ye be not deceived: for many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and the time draweth near: go ye not therefore after them.
9 But when ye shall hear of wars and commotions, be not terrified: for these things must first come to pass; but the end is not by and by.
10 Then said he unto them, Nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom:
11 And great earthquakes shall be in divers places, and famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.
12 But before all these, they shall lay their hands on you, and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues, and into prisons, being brought before kings and rulers for my name's sake.

 

[Hobie]

Let's not also forget GOD sending a strong delusion on the ones who loved darkness rather than the Light.

And the context of 2 Cor 11:14, is also verse 15, where likewise satan's human servants disguise themselves as servants of righteousness to deceive.

Well, we have the strong delusion being spread now with this idea of a secret rapture which proposes that the people of God will be secretly taken to heaven while the unconverted remain on the earth to receive what is tantamount to a second chance. The second chance doctrine is a doctrine of false hope which does not encourage people to change their lives and make right with God.

Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts; and let him return unto the Lord, and He will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for He will abundantly pardon. Isaiah 55:7

But if a wicked man turns from all his sins which he has committed, keeps all My statues, and does what is lawful and right, he shall surely live; he shall not die. None of the transgressions which he has committed shall be remembered against him; because of the righteousness which he has done, he shall live. 'Do I have any pleasure at all that the wicked should die?' says the Lord, 'and not that he should turn from his ways and live?' Ezekial 18:21-23 NKJV

Again there is an "if" in these verses. Salvation is conditional to obedience. We will be held accountable for our deeds.

For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father, with his angels, and then he shall reward every man according to his works. Matthew 16:27

And then we have the many who say sin cannot be overcome..

Revelation 3:5
He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

Revelation 3:21
To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

 

[Hobie]

CONTINUED FROM THE PREVIOUS POST...

As for this verse that you quoted:

Mat 24:3 As He was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things happen, and what will be the sign of Your coming,and of the end of the age?”

The events being described by Christ in Matthew chapter 24 represent the spiritual events that happens within the Elect after they have received the Early Rain of the Spirit up until Christ returns to convert them with the Latter Rain and judgment.

Paul says this about the end of the age:

1Cor 10:11 Now all these things happened to them as types, and have been written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the ages are come.

As I said, the ends of the ages come upon the Elect when Christ returns to convert them. This is the same event that the Apostles experienced on the Day of Pentecost and is what Paul experienced in Damascus after being blind (represents his spiritual blindness) and unable to eat or drink (represents Paul not being able to consume Christ's bread and New Wine) for three days. Paul's conversion "types" the pathway to salvation the Elect will travel. Mat 24 teaches the same truths also (here a little and there a little).

Also, all the parables that begin with the phrase "the Kingdom of Heaven is like" are also teaching on the pathway to salvation.

You said:
If Christ came invisibly (in the midst of his enemies) to oversee the work he had assigned to his disciples (that of preaching the good news of the Kingdom in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations” before “the end” came…Matt 24:14; Matt 28:19-20) then in saying that he would be “with” his disciples in this work, we would expect to see a global preaching campaign the likes of which the world at large had never seen before…..international in its scope and undertaken in the midst of Christ’s enemies.
Jesus‘ words would prepare them for a hostile audience.

Mat 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

Your understanding of this verse is carnal and not spiritual. The phrase "this gospel of the kingdom" is referring to the "another gospel" which is taught to a believer when the spirit of anti-Christ indwells them. After that false gospel is fully accepted into the beliefs (nations) of the believer, the "end" (conversion) will come. When Christ comes, He will pour out the Latter Rain and heals the believer's spiritual blindness. With their blindness healed, they will "see" the Abomination of Desolation that previously occurred within themselves when the spirit of anti-Christ indwelt them.

Mat 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) 16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:

The Abomination of Desolation occurred when the believer (God's temple) was made "worse than the first" (Mat 12:43-45). Immediately following this knowledge of their apostate condition, judgment will fall on the believer to remove the spirit of anti-Christ and the Great Harlot (carnal nature of the believer). This judgment is shown in Mat 24:40-41.

If I didn't respond to all your main points, please specify and I will try to do so.

Joe

If one looks, the Bible clearly explains the reason and manner of Christ Second Coming...

John 14:1-3 King James Version (KJV)
1 Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

Acts 1:9-11 King James Version (KJV)
9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.
10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

1 Corinthians 15:51-54 King James Version (KJV)
51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 King James Version (KJV)
13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

Titus 2:13 King James Version (KJV)
13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;

Hebrews 9:28 King James Version (KJV)
28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

The coming of Christ will be seen by every eye and will be very literal, visible, audible, and universal. It cannot be counterfeited by Satan.

 

[FaithWillDo]

I used to believe my mainstream church’s beliefs too,

Dear AuntyJane,
You said:
I used to believe my mainstream church’s beliefs too, until it dawned on me that most of what they had as their foundational beliefs, did not originate from Scripture, but from the Roman Catholic church.....a corrupt counterfeit created by the devil......nothing taught by them is truth, yet the whole of Christendom bases their beliefs on their faulty foundation. The Reformation cleaned out a lot of obvious rubbish, but did nothing to unite Christianity in truth and love....in fact it just fractured it into thousands of bickering fragments, all claiming to be correct. In that environment, I would be wary of ever being singled out with some spiritual experience, because the deceiver loves to direct people onto the wrong road, for what appears to be the right reason....

The Tower of Babel and the confusion of languages is a "type" that is fulfilled in the apostate churches of the world (approx. 2,000 different denominations/sects). The disunity is caused by the spiritual blindness of apostate believers. The only beliefs that they all have in common is that they mixed "works" with faith. This is the one and only sin that leads to a believer's spiritual death.

You said:
I believe that Paul confirmed that the gifts of the spirit were for a time and a reason, (a foregleam of the miracles that were to be experienced in the new world to come) so that when Christianity was firmly established, there was no longer a need for miracles. These gifts would cease and be replaced by the more important qualities needed by Christ’s followers to get them through the hard times ahead....”faith, hope and love”. (1 Cor 13:8-13) They would be hated and persecuted especially by those who claimed to worship the same god. (John 15:18-21)
We are to walk by faith in the things unseen, because in a world ruled by the devil, nothing is as it appears. (1 John 5:19)

Yes, that might be true but since the churches are now apostate, the Spirit is not working through the believers any longer. All that happens in the apostate churches are the lying signs and wonders of Satan.

You said:
“Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens, but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will. 22 Many will say to me in that day: ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!’”

These ”Christians” are convinced that their “prophesying”, “expelling demons”, and “powerful works” are from God, but Jesus shows that this is not the case.....he rejects them utterly, saying that he “NEVER knew” these ones. It has to give us pause to see who is behind these things.....God.......or the “angel of light” pretender.

The last portion of the verse tells us the real reason why these apostate believers are rejected. It is because they work "lawlessness". This means that they are still under the Law and are mixing their own works with faith. And as the earlier portion of the scripture indicates, they believe those works made them worthy of salvation.

You said:
You see, that gives me reasons to doubt the source of your revelations.....we cannot be “Christians” in isolation from one another....we must have a global brotherhood who believe as we do.....because the work Jesus commissioned was to be undertaken in “all the inhabited earth as a witness to all the nations”.....we cannot be just a local body with a few dotted here and there with similar beliefs.....the entire body have to be united and to meet regularly for encouragement. (Matt 24:14; 1 Cor 1:10; Heb 10:24-25) Paul said that our meeting together was “to incite to love and fine works”.....and was to be done “all the more so as we beheld the day drawing near”. Jehovah’s day is at hand....and a local church, with few members is not going to get the job done.....First century Christianity is the model.....the Christians met together and were taught one truth.....it was the devil who sowed the counterfeit “weeds”.

I do have fellowship with other converted believers on-line but none live locally. You must understand that ALL (100%) the churches in the world who claim to be Christian are actually apostate and they have been since the end of the 1st century. Paul was quite serious when He said that none of the flock would be spared. A converted believer has no business fellowshipping with apostate believers. The only interaction with them should be for the purpose of teaching them truth as James says:

James 5:17 Elias was a man subject to like passions as we are, and he prayed earnestly that it might not rain: and it rained not on the earth by the space of three years and six months. 18 And he prayed again, and the heaven gave rain (the Latter Rain/Spirit of Truth), and the earth produced its fruit (conversion occurs). 19 Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, 20 let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins.

The time of drought is a "type" for the time a believer spends between the Early and Latter Rains. This is the time period that a believer will fall away and become apostate. It is their "Day of Evil" when the child of God within the believer will experience "great tribulation".

As for Paul's comments in the verse you quoted, those comments were directed to the true churches of His day. The true church now only exists in the "few" converted believers who have come out from the wilderness where the apostate church dwells with Satan. Until you can see that the apostasy happens 100% of the time to all new believers shortly after Christ calls them to be saints (Early Rain of the Spirit), you are not going to understand the pathway to salvation. Only after a believer is given the Latter Rain of the Spirit and has their spiritual blindness healed will they see the Abomination of Desolation and have the man of sin revealed (themselves). God is not a respecter of persons, all the Elect will travel the same pathway to salvation and that pathway goes through the apostate church. Everyone will experience Satan's "Day of Evil".

All of Christ's teachings that deal with the pathway to salvation teach this truth. However, that truth is concealed by His spiritual language. Only the "few" can accept this truth and they can only do so after they are given the Spirit of Truth. Until that time, they will continue to be deceived and will practice "lawlessness".

Joe

 

[Taken]

Why many Christians will be deceived by Satan



Inanutshell…the F words…perpetuated BY God and imulated by the anti-godly…

FEAR…
FREEBIES…

Anti-godly FEAR…afraid
Anti-godly FREEBIES…tangible items

Godly FEAR…honorable respect
Godly FREEBIES…spiritual gifts

Knowledge to Know the KEY F words, but
Ignorance to NOT Know the difference.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[FaithWillDo]

If one looks, the Bible clearly explains the reason and manner of Christ Second Coming...

John 14:1-3 King James Version (KJV)
1 Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

Acts 1:9-11 King James Version (KJV)
9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.
10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

1 Corinthians 15:51-54 King James Version (KJV)
51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 King James Version (KJV)
13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

Titus 2:13 King James Version (KJV)
13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;

Hebrews 9:28 King James Version (KJV)
28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

The coming of Christ will be seen by every eye and will be very literal, visible, audible, and universal. It cannot be counterfeited by Satan.

Dear Hobie,
The 1Cor 15:51-54 and 1Thes 4:13-18 scriptures are not teaching about the second coming of Christ when He spiritually converts an Elect believer. Those verses are teaching about the bodily resurrection from the grave which happens at the literal end of this age.

The other scriptures you presented are teaching about the second coming of Christ when He returns to His Elect to convert them. But even then, Christ does not physically appear where human eyes can see Him. His coming is spiritual.

Luke 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: 21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

Christ's second coming is "spiritual" and happens within a person.

The second coming is when Christ (Christ is the Kingdom of Heaven) enters a believer as the Spirit of Truth/Latter Rain of the Spirit. This begin the conversion event and is what Paul experienced in Damascus after being there for three days. It is also what the 120 Jewish Elect experienced on the Day of Pentecost.

In my post to AuntyJane, I scripturally proved that the second coming event shown in Mat 24:29-31 is the same event that the 120 Jewish Elect experienced on the Day of Pentecost. Compare what Peter says in Acts 2:14-21 with Mat 24:29-31. They are the same event.

Also, take a closer look at Tit 2:13, but this time, include verse 14:

Tit 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; 14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

I know that you believe that you are saved now, but yet Paul says that salvation comes with Christ's glorious appearing. If Christ return is a future event, then you are NOT SAVED at this time. Also, notice the TWO things that verse 14 says will happen upon Christ's return:

1) He redeems us from all iniquity (sin).

This is what happens when Christ pours out the Latter Rain of the Spirit.

2). He purifies us.

This happens by Christ's judgment (Day of the Lord) which immediately follows the Latter Rain of the Spirit.

It is these two parts that make up the conversion event.

Now look at what John the Baptist said:

Mat 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the HOLY SPIRIT, and with FIRE: 12 Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

Notice the TWO baptisms mentioned in the above scripture. They match up exactly with the two parts that Tit 2:14 teaches will happen when Christ returns.

The Baptism of the Holy Spirit (Latter Rain of the Spirit) is what "redeems us from all iniquity" and the Baptism of Fire (judgment) is what purify us.

In Mat 24:40-41, it shows more details on how Christ purifies His Elect after He pours out the Latter Rain of the Spirit and appears to them.

Mat 24:40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

When Christ returns to an unconverted Elect believer, they will have both the Holy Spirit and the spirit of anti-Christ within themselves. One spiritually produces the child of God within the believer and one produces the man of sin within the believer. When Christ's judgment falls on the believer, Christ will "take" and destroy the spirit of anti-Christ/man of sin.

In verse 41, it repeats this judgment but shows a "woman" this time. The spirit word "woman" represents the spiritual nature of a person. When the spirt of anti-Christ indwells a believer, the woman becomes the Great Harlot (described in Rev 18). When the Holy Spirit indwells a person, it gives them the spiritual nature of God. When Christ's judgment falls on the believer, Christ will "take" and destroy the Great Harlot from within the believer.

After the judgment process is complete, all that is left within the believer is the Holy Spirit and new child of God. The believer is then "converted".

Also, consider what the book of Revelation says about Christ's second coming:

Rev 1:3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for THE TIME IS AT HAND.

Rev 1:8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

Rev 4:8 And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come.

Rev 22:7 Behold, I come quickly: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book.

Rev 22:10 And he saith unto me, SEAL NOT the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for THE TIME IS AT HAND.

At the time John received the vision, the time for Christ's return was already at hand. For something to be "at hand", it means it is already happening. Because Christ's return must occur in the lifetime of each of the Elect before they die, John says that Christ's second coming is a reoccurring event (is, was and will be coming) and that Christ comes "quickly". Neither of those two things are true if Christ's second coming is a one-time event that only happens at the literal end of the age.

Also, all end-time prophecy is teaching about the spiritual events that happen within each of the Elect before they die. Those events (signs of the times) lead up to the return of Christ when He converts them - just as Paul wrote to Titus in Tit:2:13-14.

For the converted Elect, the "ends of the ages" have come upon them.

1Cor 10:11 Now all these things happened to them as types, and have been written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the ages are come.

Joe

 

[Dan Clarkston]

I think you've gone a bit off .... Christ is coming to save those who believe and turn to Him..

You forgot to add He is only saving the saturday peoples

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Not if you look at the truth given, and the disciples heard clearly what Christ said as its repeated in Mark..

Mark 13:1-27
1 And as he went out of the temple, one of his disciples saith unto him, Master, see what manner of stones and what buildings are here!
2 And Jesus answering said unto him, Seest thou these great buildings? there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives over against the temple, Peter and James and John and Andrew asked him privately,
4 Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when all these things shall be fulfilled?
5 And Jesus answering them began to say, take heed lest any man deceive you:
6 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
7 And when ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars, be ye not troubled: for such things must needs be; but the end shall not be yet.
8 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be earthquakes in divers places, and there shall be famines and troubles: these are the beginnings of sorrows.
9 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.
10 And the gospel must first be published among all nations.
11 But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.
12 Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.
13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
14 But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:
15 And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house:
16 And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment.
17 But woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
18 And pray ye that your flight be not in the winter.
19 For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.
20 And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.
21 And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here is Christ; or, lo, he is there; believe him not:
22 For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.
23 But take ye heed: behold, I have foretold you all things.
24 But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,
25 And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.
26 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.
27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

And in Luke, so it was very clear what Jesus said.

Luke 21:5-28 King James Version (KJV)
5 And as some spake of the temple, how it was adorned with goodly stones and gifts, he said,
6 As for these things which ye behold, the days will come, in the which there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
7 And they asked him, saying, Master, but when shall these things be? and what sign will there be when these things shall come to pass?
8 And he said, Take heed that ye be not deceived: for many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and the time draweth near: go ye not therefore after them.
9 But when ye shall hear of wars and commotions, be not terrified: for these things must first come to pass; but the end is not by and by.
10 Then said he unto them, Nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom:
11 And great earthquakes shall be in divers places, and famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.
12 But before all these, they shall lay their hands on you, and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues, and into prisons, being brought before kings and rulers for my name's sake.

You need to realize this is a specific and unique deception. Look at what jesus said we need to be careful about:

5 And Jesus answering them began to say, take heed lest any man deceive you:
6 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

The deception is falling prey to people claiming to be teh return of Jesus.

Jim Jones
David Koresh
Sung Yun Moon
Father Divine

to name but a few.

 

[Hobie]

I used to believe my mainstream church’s beliefs too, until it dawned on me that most of what they had as their foundational beliefs, did not originate from Scripture, but from the Roman Catholic church.....a corrupt counterfeit created by the devil......nothing taught by them is truth, yet the whole of Christendom bases their beliefs on their faulty foundation. The Reformation cleaned out a lot of obvious rubbish, but did nothing to unite Christianity in truth and love....in fact it just fractured it into thousands of bickering fragments, all claiming to be correct. In that environment, I would be wary of ever being singled out with some spiritual experience, because the deceiver loves to direct people onto the wrong road, for what appears to be the right reason....

I believe that Paul confirmed that the gifts of the spirit were for a time and a reason, (a foregleam of the miracles that were to be experienced in the new world to come) so that when Christianity was firmly established, there was no longer a need for miracles. These gifts would cease and be replaced by the more important qualities needed by Christ’s followers to get them through the hard times ahead....”faith, hope and love”. (1 Cor 13:8-13) They would be hated and persecuted especially by those who claimed to worship the same god. (John 15:18-21)
We are to walk by faith in the things unseen, because in a world ruled by the devil, nothing is as it appears. (1 John 5:19)

I see those scriptures in a completely different way.....the “spirit of the truth” is not a “he” but the very power of God himself. The holy spirit can be imparted to humans as it was in the first century, to demonstrate the power of God, but it can also be used in ways that do not involve the supernatural......if the gifts were to cease as Paul indicated, and the Bible indicates another source of power that can mimic the actions of God’s spirit...there is need for caution. If God withdrew his miracles back in apostolic times, then it would be obvious as to the source of any such supernatural experiences in our day.
Jesus told us that these powerful works are not from God.
Matt 7:21-23....
“Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens, but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will. 22 Many will say to me in that day: ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!’”

These ”Christians” are convinced that their “prophesying”, “expelling demons”, and “powerful works” are from God, but Jesus shows that this is not the case.....he rejects them utterly, saying that he “NEVER knew” these ones. It has to give us pause to see who is behind these things.....God.......or the “angel of light” pretender.


You see, that gives me reasons to doubt the source of your revelations.....we cannot be “Christians” in isolation from one another....we must have a global brotherhood who believe as we do.....because the work Jesus commissioned was to be undertaken in “all the inhabited earth as a witness to all the nations”.....we cannot be just a local body with a few dotted here and there with similar beliefs.....the entire body have to be united and to meet regularly for encouragement. (Matt 24:14; 1 Cor 1:10; Heb 10:24-25) Paul said that our meeting together was “to incite to love and fine works”.....and was to be done “all the more so as we beheld the day drawing near”. Jehovah’s day is at hand....and a local church, with few members is not going to get the job done.....First century Christianity is the model.....the Christians met together and were taught one truth.....it was the devil who sowed the counterfeit “weeds”.

Amen, we must take the truth of Gods Word, not mans traditions or theories they come up with...

 

[Hobie]

You need to realize this is a specific and unique deception. Look at what jesus said we need to be careful about:

5 And Jesus answering them began to say, take heed lest any man deceive you:
6 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

The deception is falling prey to people claiming to be teh return of Jesus.

Jim Jones
David Koresh
Sung Yun Moon
Father Divine

to name but a few.

People can fake miracles or claim to see a false christ, but no one can counterfeit the Second Coming. It will be unmistakable, as the heavens open to reveal innumerable angels lift their voices in glory and Christ appears through the clouds, no one will wonder who has come. Jesus Himself described the event, “For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.....Matthew 24:27