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GISMYS_7

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Really??? ""we couldn't stomach the endless "Faith" chatter"" ====== without faith we cannot please God!! Are you pleasing God???

Your Power is in Your Saying and Believing | Jesse Duplantis

Aug 15, 2017
 
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Waiting on him

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He's just projecting, brother. When those who disagree with you begin to accuse you of things that aren't true, or even infer it, then it's an indication they themselves are provoked and wish to retaliate.

Their hope is to provoke you so they can say, "See, you're angry. You're not a Christian, and nobody should listen to you."

But they would be the source of the provocation, right? So who should listen to them?

The point is, we have sin, we live in an imperfect world, and we must share the world with imperfect people. We are all going to die, and we all, as Christians, must be disciplined.

Further, we must all, if we are godly, suffer persecution from a world that hates Christian righteousness. What then is the value of "claim it" theology?

Do these people really think they're going to "take over the world" in Jesus' name, and live perfect lives? God only knows what is in their hearts!

We share a gospel of *grace,* and not a gospel of perfection, and certainly not a gospel that exhibits rebellion against God's word. If God says we must suffer persecution and deprivation of various kinds, it is rebellion to establish a doctrine that attempts to override it.
Very true.
 

Waiting on him

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You are *so* uninspired brother! If you're addressing me, you shouldn't even remotely suggest I'm unable to watch Jess D. I began by telling you I watched him many years ago. And I'm very familiar with his teaching. My wife used to enjoy his great humor, although ultimately we couldn't stomach the endless "Faith" chatter. It sounded so very worldly--give me this, give me that. Give that to God, and God will give you that.

I was into this kind of Faith Teaching before Jesse D. began his ministry. But over time it didn't work out for me, and I gave up supporting them. I used to support Oral Roberts, and that was before Copeland broke off and began his own TV ministry AFAIK. Ultimately, Roberts was found having proclaimed false prophecies--he said God would enable his Medical Center to cure cancer. It didn't happen! I suppose we can just keep waiting until it actually happens?

I read Kenneth Hagin's biography many years ago, and was intrigued by it. I thought he was a real prophet. Maybe he was? But Hagin declared that nobody in his church died--perhaps somebody misrepresented him?

Regardless, people can know God, legitimately be a prophet or preach the Gospel, and still have errant doctrine. This was true of Hagin, Roberts, Copeland, Du Plantis, Dollar, and a whole drum of them. They teach false doctrine, or perhaps I should say, "unbalanced doctrine?"

No I'm not afraid of listening to them. For years about the only thing I watched on TV was TBN! I've heard them all! But a number of leaders have come forward in recent times to try to put "Faith" back into proper focus, and they are critical of Faith Doctrine, as I am. Fools are beyond correction. I hope better for you.
You may enjoy @charity thread Isaiah 45:7
 

GISMYS_7

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Very true.

Yes!==""Do these people really think they're going to "take over the world" in Jesus' name, and live perfect lives? God only knows what is in their hearts!"" ========= I have watched and supported Jesse's Bible teaching for years and never heard anything like you say he teaches!! Wonder why??
 

Waiting on him

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Yes!==""Do these people really think they're going to "take over the world" in Jesus' name, and live perfect lives? God only knows what is in their hearts!"" ========= I have watched and supported Jesse's Bible teaching for years and never heard anything like you say he teaches!! Wonder why??
I'm not certain if you meant to address me or Randy, but my answer would simply be, your blind, but not hopeless!
 

Waiting on him

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Yes!==""Do these people really think they're going to "take over the world" in Jesus' name, and live perfect lives? God only knows what is in their hearts!"" ========= I have watched and supported Jesse's Bible teaching for years and never heard anything like you say he teaches!! Wonder why??
I've also noticed that on this forum you only come here to further the acceptance of men you seem to be fond of, it's weird almost as if your their personal prophet? I never see you engage in any of the discussion about Christ
 

Waiting on him

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Surley you can see what I'm proposing, all you posts are Jessie said, Kenneth said, Jack said,etx,,,,, what's Jesus said to you, is what I'm interested in?
 
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Randy Kluth

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Yes!==""Do these people really think they're going to "take over the world" in Jesus' name, and live perfect lives? God only knows what is in their hearts!"" ========= I have watched and supported Jesse's Bible teaching for years and never heard anything like you say he teaches!! Wonder why??

I was extending, logically, what the end of "claim it" theology is. If you can claim anything you want that seems godly to you, then why not just claim the Kingdom of God now, and cast Satan out of the world now? Do you see? If there are no logical restraints on Faith Doctrine who is to know what its limitations are?

Instead of just responding in knee-jerk fashion, why don't you actually try to engage in the conversation? You know as well as I do that "back and forth" conversations accomplish virtually nothing.

What I'd like to ask you to do, if you are willing, is tell me what you think the biblical restraints are on asking for things? I mean, apart from asking for things that are obviously wrong, where do we draw the line on "claiming" things?
 

Randy Kluth

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Beware of being used by satan as his tool and fool!!

Do all things to edify. We can walk and chew gum at the same time. While we're busy avoiding "being used by Satan" we can also engage in building one another up, by our most holy faith.

2 Cor 2.11 For we are not unaware of his schemes.
 

justbyfaith

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In @GISMYS_7's defense, he does at times start good threads that are highly evangelistic and that have the capability of brining people to salvation.

But I would say very clearly that his gift is evangelism rather than teaching.
 

Randy Kluth

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In @GISMYS_7's defense, he does at times start good threads that are highly evangelistic and that have the capability of brining people to salvation.

But I would say very clearly that his gift is evangelism rather than teaching.

Yes, I find that often to be the case, that those with certain gifts refuse to submit to considering others who have different gifts. They seem to want to "have it all."
The fact is, we need each other. It's not that we need to be taught who Christ is or what salvation is--"you have no need that anyone teach you, as his anointing teaches you all things." (1 John).

But the fact is, some are more gifted in evangelism, and are less inclined to become scholars, whereas scholars tend to focus on teaching, and perhaps excessively criticize those who are "less careful" with their teaching.

My wife and have a good balance. She sometimes "goes to sleep" when I share the Bible with her. But she is always the one to have love and concern for the lost, for reaching out to people with the love of God. That keeps me on track, and I suppose I keep her on track, as well.

Even though my brother and I are both more into scholasticism and teaching the Bible, we still benefit immensely from meeting weekly--though with the coronavirus that has stopped. He is much more learned than me in the various schools of thought, with Christian theologians, and with the biblical languages. He also founded and pastored a church.

However, as he fully admits he is more about translation than exposition. I offer him creative theological ideas, whereas he would test them against the actual language. Good learning experience for both of us.
 

GISMYS_7

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I was extending, logically, what the end of "claim it" theology is. If you can claim anything you want that seems godly to you, then why not just claim the Kingdom of God now, and cast Satan out of the world now? Do you see? If there are no logical restraints on Faith Doctrine who is to know what its limitations are?

Instead of just responding in knee-jerk fashion, why don't you actually try to engage in the conversation? You know as well as I do that "back and forth" conversations accomplish virtually nothing.

What I'd like to ask you to do, if you are willing, is tell me what you think the biblical restraints are on asking for things? I mean, apart from asking for things that are obviously wrong, where do we draw the line on "claiming" things?

Philippians 4:18-20==I have all I need and more, now that I have received your gifts from Epaphroditus. They are a sweet smelling aroma, an acceptable sacrifice, well-pleasing to God. 19And my God will supply ""all"" your needs according to His glorious riches in Christ Jesus. 20To our God and Father be glory forever and ever. Amen.…
Psalm 37:1-40
Fret not yourself because of evildoers; be not envious of wrongdoers! For they will soon fade like the grass and wither like the green herb. Trust in the Lord, and do good; dwell in the land and befriend faithfulness. Delight yourself in the Lord, and he will give you the desires of your heart. Commit your way to the Lord; trust in him.
Psalm 23:1
A Psalm of David. The Lord is my shepherd; I shall not want.
Psalm 34:10
Those who seek the Lord lack no good thing.