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Ferris Bueller

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And if they refuse to do either?
They will not be saved when Jesus comes back....

5hand this man over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved on the day of the Lord. 1 Corinthians 5:5
The whole purpose of turning the willfully unrepentant sinner over to satan is so they will be prepared to meet Jesus when he returns, because they are not ready in the unrepentant condition they are in now. And there's no guarantee they will respond to being turned over to satan.
 

marks

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The problem is everyone who may believe they are born again by saying some words may not be born again......But if they say they are born again...and they seek to find ways to get over...is anyone going to believe they are? Matter of fact, will they even believe they are...?
I'd say, keep it real . . . this isn't about some person somewhere who may think some certain thing. The pertinent question is what do you believe for yourself?

I believe that God has come to live in me, and that He well be here with me forever. I believe that this is entirely based on what Jesus did, not on what I do or don't do, and therefore all I can do is what God allows me to do, which is either receive Him, or not receive Him. That's it, all there is.

Having received Him, I'm His, owned by God. So who, including myself, is going to go against God's ownership of me? God owns me, He calls the shots, and these are the shots He's called.

That when I see Him, I'll be like Him.

We're concerned over sin in our lives. OK, of course we are! Just the same, when we see Him, we WILL be like Him, and expecting that this will be so is what leads us to purify ourselves, to not sin. Because we KNOW that we will be transformed to be fully like Jesus, this is what actually addresses sin in our lives. We can know it's been defeated, and live that way. The assurance that He will complete His work in us assures us we can work out what He is working into us.

Much love!
 
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marks

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There is definitely a difference...
Well if they have yet to be born....and you are ascribing to them that they are born and then tell them that they are always saved...lol then
You have the mess we are in now... mean "Christians" etc
Putting your confidence in Jesus for what? To complete your salvation? How confident are you?

Much love!
 

marks

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Continuing in belief in Christ covers any and all failure to be perfect.
Jesus already removed your sin and reconciled you to God, with or without your belief. He did that for you an enemy of God. Before repentance, before receiving Jesus.

"Covers" would be what the animal sacrifices in the OT did with sins. They were covered, because the bloods of bulls and goats could not remove sins. Jesus did that with the offering of His body. But removed, not covered.

"Behold the Lamb of God who bears away the sin of the world!"

Do not count the blood of Jesus as an unholy or profane thing! As if it were no better than the blood of an animal!

As if Jesus' blood did not remove sins!

Once again you've tried to redefine the New Covenant according to the terms of the first covenant, without regard to the offering of Christ.

Much love!
 
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marks

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But are your sins forgiven before you are born from above? Or are you born from above then your sins forgiven...

Romans 5:6-11 LITV
6) for we yet being without strength, in due time Christ died for ungodly ones.
7) For with difficulty one will die for a just one, (for perhaps one even dares to die for the sake of the good one),
8) but God commends His love to us in this, that we being yet sinners, Christ died for us.
9) Much more then, being justified now by His blood, we shall be saved from the wrath through Him.
10) For if while being enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by His life;
11) and not only so, but also glorying in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we now received the reconciliation.

Sins were addressed in Christ before either of us were ever born. We were reconciled to God when Jesus died. What remains is that we receive the reconciliation.

Behold, the Lamb of God, Who carries away the sin of the world!

Much love!
 

BloodBought 1953

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Jesus is the Gosple? Do you agree?

And the Kingdom is NOW made available through believing who He is with the intent to follow.


To be specific—- The Gospel is a Promise.....Jesus was God in the Flesh.....Jesus Sacrifice on the Cross made the Promise possible .....

The Kingdom is indeed NOW made available through Believing who He is......” the intent to follow” sounds good.....it IS good......it just ain’t part of the Gospel.....

The Heart of the Gospel is “ Jesus Saves”. NOT “ Jesus Saves—- BUT, your intentions must measure up! You must agree to “ Follow!” ( Whatever “that” means..... probably trying to make yourself “ Worthy” in some performance- Based manner , instead of reading we are “ MADE Worthy by the Blood Of The Lamb....it’s a Recipe for “ falling from Grace”...... and as always....it Sounds good....it tickles the ears to think that YOU did something other than simply Believe) The True Gospel is NOT what you do/did for God —— it’s what God did for you.That way, God gets ALL of the Glory and you get NONE.....just theWay He Wants it......human pride rejects God's Way....God’s Way is as simple as the song that millions of Hypocrites sing every Sunday—- “ Nothing But The Blood Of Jesus”.....NOT, “Nothing But The Blood plus your willingness and ability to follow Him.....good things for sure , but never forget that Salvation was a GIFT.....all you had to do was “ cash in” on what was already accomplished FOR you.....
 
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JunChosen

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The saved, Spirit sealed Galatians stopped believing in the sufficiency of Christ for justification and went back to observance of the old covenant Festival cycle and to a different gospel.

The letter to the Galatians was Paul's argument between the resurrection of Christ as opposed to the old covenant Festival cycle, as you put it.

It is not not about the saved, spirit sealed Galatians who stopped believing.
That's impossible since Jesus said in John 8:36; 10:26-28.

John 8:36
"If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed."

John 10:26-28
26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any [man] pluck them out of my hand.


But if you want to believe you'll never stop believing, that's fine. I'm not going to take that away from you. You may very well never stop believing. But to project your experience onto other believers would be a mistake. Not all believers are as mature as you might be.

I merely declare the truth. It is not I that continue to believe but Christ in me!

For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal? 1 Corinthians 3:1-4


Carnal means having the nature of flesh, governed by mere human nature, NOT by the Spirit of God. By this definition [Strong's Concordance], there are no such thing as carnal Christians!

To God Be The Glory
 

michaelvpardo

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Correct. If they respond to church discipline and repent.
Pretty sure that repentance is what sanctification (or living a sanctified life is about.) When you commit your soul to God's care through the gospel (become His bride) does He take responsibility for your salvation? Does a good father discipline his son in order to correct him?
Does the book of Hosea only apply to the Jews or was God teaching us important lessons regarding His bride?
I believe your sincerity and your profession of faith. It's clear to me that your heart is in the right place, but you need to be cautious in those things you reject outright. I don't believe for a second that you can loose your salvation after being delivered from the kingdom of darkness, but every testimony is tested, every son is disciplined, and our trials are always based upon our beliefs, our attitudes, and our misconceptions. As a child in the RCC I believed that I would be rewarded for doing good, but when I did good things sacrificially, something evil always happened to me afterwards, (and my mind formulated a saying, "no good deed goes unpunished " and there seemed to be a hint of truth to the Billy Joel song "only the good die young.") To my carnal mind this was very confusing and lead me to doubts. It wasn't until I received the gospel that I was able to understand what Jesus meant when He said, "So likewise you, when you have done all those things which you are commanded, say, ‘We are unprofitable servants. We have done what was our duty to do.’ ”
Back before I received the gospel, while I was investigating all things claiming to be "spiritual" I dabbled with Tarot and nearly every time I read the cards for myself, my card came up as "the fool". Without explaining the significance of the card or giving Tarot any kind of validation, let me say that one of the most encouraging verses in scripture for me was from Isaiah:
A highway shall be there, and a road, And it shall be called the Highway of Holiness. The unclean shall not pass over it, But it shall be for others. Whoever walks the road, although a fool, Shall not go astray. Isaiah 35:8
Since the bible says, "The fool has said in his heart,
“There is no God.” They are corrupt, They have done abominable works, There is none who does good.
Psalm 14:1, it would seem that God alone is both the author and finisher of our salvation and that our participation in the process is mainly just breathing.
I know for a certainty that if any part of my salvation relied on my contribution, I would fail, oh wretched man that I am, but "Blessed is the man to whom the Lord does not impute iniquity, And in whose spirit there is no deceit." Psalm 32:2
As an addendum, I'm glad that verse says "in whose spirit" rather than "in whose mind" because I'm no stranger to so called "white lies" and falsehoods to protect relationships, but the verse applies to all whose spirit has been made alive in Christ (and we had nothing to do with that beyond apprehending the truth through the ministry of the Holy Spirit.) I don't always like what the Lord does in my life, some things seem unfair from my perspective, but I love Him fiercely for all that He has done to protect and preserve me through all the foolishness I've been involved in despite my sin and self will. The long suffering of God is salvation.
14 Therefore, beloved, looking forward to these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, without spot and blameless; 15 and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures. 2 Peter 3:14-16
You see, people have been struggling with understanding these things for 2000 years, even Peter, the Apostle to the Jews, and yet, 2000 years later we're still arguing over liberty and licentiousness, and attributing God's election to our own choices. I stand, positionally, with Martin Luther on these things when he wrote the Bondage of the will. While I don't consider him authoritative (and he clearly held to some carnal thoughts), he was a far better scholar than I ever wanted to be, and made arguments entirely supported by scripture. If God works to will and to do in us, how does our will overcome omnipotence? Just saying...
 
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michaelvpardo

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The letter to the Galatians was Paul's argument between the resurrection of Christ as opposed to the old covenant Festival cycle, as you put it.

It is not not about the saved, spirit sealed Galatians who stopped believing.
That's impossible since Jesus said in John 8:36; 10:26-28.

John 8:36
"If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed."

John 10:26-28
26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any [man] pluck them out of my hand.




I merely declare the truth. It is not I that continue to believe but Christ in me!



Carnal means having the nature of flesh, governed by mere human nature, NOT by the Spirit of God. By this definition [Strong's Concordance], there are no such thing as carnal Christians!

To God Be The Glory
Your definition of carnal doesn't fit what Paul even said of himself. Christians have a dual nature to contend with until the full redemption (the redemption of our bodies.)
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. 24 O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? 25 I thank God—through Jesus Christ our Lord! Roman's 7:23-25
Paul went to great lengths to explain that Christians have to make a conscious effort to reckon themselves as dead and identify with Christ in His death and resurrection as is represented by baptism. That's on us (denying self will and following His) but it is God who works to will and to do in us for His own good pleasure, so self will results in discipline unless our will is aligned with His. I like Strong's concordance and have found it a valuable tool for bible study (I haven't the will or desire to learn dead languages), but the concordance isn't inspired, just a good bit of reference material.
 

marks

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They will not be saved when Jesus comes back....

5hand this man over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved on the day of the Lord. 1 Corinthians 5:5
The whole purpose of turning the willfully unrepentant sinner over to satan is so they will be prepared to meet Jesus when he returns, because they are not ready in the unrepentant condition they are in now. And there's no guarantee they will respond to being turned over to satan.
You don't think God's chastisement is effective? That it may not work?

You can have confidence!

Hebrews 12:10-11 LITV
10) For they truly disciplined us for a few days according to the thing seeming good to them; but He for our profit, in order for us to partake of His holiness.
11) And all discipline for the present indeed does not seem to be joyous, but grievous; but afterward it gives back peaceable fruit of righteousness to the ones having been exercised by it.

Much love!
 

marks

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I don't believe for a second that you can loose your salvation after being delivered from the kingdom of darkness, but every testimony is tested, every son is disciplined, and our trials are always based upon our beliefs, our attitudes, and our misconceptions. As a child in the RCC I believed that I would be rewarded for doing good, but when I did good things sacrificially, something evil always happened to me afterwards, (and my mind formulated a saying, "no good deed goes unpunished " and there seemed to be a hint of truth to the Billy Joel song "only the good die young.") To my carnal mind this was very confusing and lead me to doubts. It wasn't until I received the gospel that I was able to understand what Jesus meant when He said, "So likewise you, when you have done all those things which you are commanded, say, ‘We are unprofitable servants. We have done what was our duty to do.’ ”
Well stated!!

Much love!
 
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marks

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And the Kingdom is NOW made available through believing who He is with the intent to follow.
"With the intent to follow" sounds to me like your own addition. We believe in Jesus, and God gives us rebirth. After that we have intents which are derived from our flesh, which we are to deny, and intents that are derived from the Spirit of Christ in us, which are the new us.

John 1:11-13 LITV
11) He came to His own, and His own did not receive Him.
12) But as many as received Him, to them He gave authority to become children of God, to the ones believing into His name,
13) who were born not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but were born of God.

Much love!
 

Corlove13

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I'd say, keep it real . . . this isn't about some person somewhere who may think some certain thing. The pertinent question is what do you believe for yourself?

I believe that God has come to live in me, and that He well be here with me forever. I believe that this is entirely based on what Jesus did, not on what I do or don't do, and therefore all I can do is what God allows me to do, which is either receive Him, or not receive Him. That's it, all there is.

Having received Him, I'm His, owned by God. So who, including myself, is going to go against God's ownership of me? God owns me, He calls the shots, and these are the shots He's called.

That when I see Him, I'll be like Him.

We're concerned over sin in our lives. OK, of course we are! Just the same, when we see Him, we WILL be like Him, and expecting that this will be so is what leads us to purify ourselves, to not sin. Because we KNOW that we will be transformed to be fully like Jesus, this is what actually addresses sin in our lives. We can know it's been defeated, and live that way. The assurance that He will complete His work in us assures us we can work out what He is working into us.

Much love!
Mark- I'd say, keep it real . . . this isn't about some person somewhere who may think some certain thing. The pertinent question is what do you believe for yourself?

It sure is.......I have rarely met a true disciple of Christ growing up.......Christians who claim to be followers are to be the righteousnes of God in Christ....The state of our children, the homeless, the government, families, institutions, etc depends on What they see in us...We are to be world changers that bring the light to those around us by being Lit up! ....But if the Gospel we preach is not transforming the person into the likeness of Christ we need to check what we are preaching. THE GOSPEL OF THE KINGDOM IS WHAT THE DISCIPLES AND JESUS PREACHED...AND IF THAT WAS PREACHED THE OSAS DOCTRINE WOULD GO AWAY...BECAUSE PEOPLE, THEIR ASSURANCE WILL COME AS THEY KEEP RIGHT RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD.