I'm a non-Christian, where can I post?

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Angelina

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So, usually, as soon as I talk about my faith, I'm kicked out of any Christian forum I join. After paying money to join one recently, I was kicked out without any notice at all except to say that I had violated some rule--and I have no idea what that rule was--but they got my money!

I would like to not get kicked out of this forum. I am a Veridican. I follow ONLY Jesus Christ, which means I am not a Christian when the word is used to mean the accepted forms of the Christian Church throughout the world. I have registered, this time, as a non-Christian or "other faith."

So, where am I allowed to post and discuss things? I'm not rude to people. I don't cause trouble. I just want to discuss theology in a rational way.

Hi @Edward Gordon. You have come to the right forum so let's start as we mean to go on....welcome to CyB. :)

If members here wish to discuss something other than the O/P please start a conversation in another forum ie: Fellowship or other Christian forum. Thank you.
 
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Wrangler

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OK, I'm interested in discussing that if you don't mind. God told me I am to become as an Angel. So where do I fit into that heaven? Are Mormons saying there will be none of that? Or will they be above that? And why do you need to be a joint heir? What will that give you?

Probably worth a separate thread so as not to derail this one.
 

dev553344

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God also told you that you’re going to be a joint-heir with Christ .

And that’s very different than literally becoming Christ.

Please don’t mix those up.
Nope, Mormons told me I would be a joint-heir with Christ. God visited me in the Holy Spirit for a few months and taught me much. But threw out it all, I was to be as an Angel. And that is what God told me. I also received the Body and Blood of Christ thru the Holy Spirit which until then I had just had the bread and wine (and Mormon water).

It's always been blasphemy to me to think I would be like Jesus. He is my God and I am a child of God. But God can heal people truly, he can create Galaxies. He can part the red sea. He can wound and heal, kill and make alive miraculously. I can do none of those things with any of the abilities I have.

And he was clear that He is the Only True Prophet. He can see into the future and none can. But we can be receivers of his prophecies and healing and such. You can make petition to God for others to be healed, but the power is not ours. It is God's power and always will be in my opinion.

Deuteronomy 32:39-41

King James Version

39 See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand.

40 For I lift up my hand to heaven, and say, I live for ever.

41 If I whet my glittering sword, and mine hand take hold on judgment; I will render vengeance to mine enemies, and will reward them that hate me.
 
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dev553344

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You are correst. This thread is being derailed. Please stick to the O/P. Thank you.
I was addressing a similar belief to Edwards. To be a christ or joint heir seems to be the same thing. I was covering it with scripture. I thought you would like that? I'll back out.
 

APAK

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Thank you. I appreciate that summary. Since I am a monist, I am not passionate about the Trinity one way or the other.



Here's what I seem particularly good at: the interpretation of symbols (astrology, tarot, dreams, apocalyptic prophecy). That said, I have renounced tarot. I personally feel it is a kind of witchcraft, and while I don't have strong emotions about it, I have renounced witchcraft and repented from it, and tarot just is too much like it. I feel uneasy about it now, and in truth, there's nothing in the Gospel to support it. Besides, with dreams, Revelation, and astrology, I have plenty of symbology to focus on. And they all have Gospel support.

I can communicate with astral entities. Sometimes with people who have crossed over, but I'll be honest with you about that. I'm not sure they are really the "people" because they sound a lot like demons, and when you channel astral entities, you get a lot of demons. I mean, it's a fact. And they are some lying spirits, I tell you. And so, I now find mediumship to be unreliable at best. And it's not like you have to use mediumship to talk to God or Christ or the Holy Spirit anyway; that's telepathy--or prayer if you will. So, now, unless I have to talk to a demon, and there are times for that, especially in exorcism, I don't channel any longer. And I suppose channeling is just telepathy anyway. Besides, they usually strike up the conversations with me. They're around me all the time trying to sabotage and get me to stop.

That said, I no longer astral project to find people who have crossed over. I no longer think it is necessary. I no longer think it's reliable, and there is no Gospel support for it, anyway.

As for the practice of witchcraft. It works. It does. Spells work. But the thing with witchcraft is that it's void of Christ. Miracle working, which is like witchcraft but done in the name of Jesus Christ, is more powerful. Witchcraft is of and for the world. The path leads to nothing, and it leads to no Eternal life. It leaves one alone in the world because ultimately even God becomes a kind of unknown spiritual entity. He stops being the Father and becomes a force. And then, of course, the demons. Most witches derive their power from demonic forces. And demons destroy you in the end. They lead you to death. A witch dies, and that's it. A witch only has the world. I repent of that, and I feel sorry for witches at the same time. Witchcraft is any religion without Christ. That's it. And Jesus Christ is the Way, the Truth, and the Life. You really learn that hard when you go walking down dark paths, my friend. I can tell you!

I'm sorry to go on like this. I don't expect you to read all of this or comment. I just wanted to put it out there, to say it. And to tell people what I've repented of. I hate the time I spent away from Christ, even if in the end it was necessary for my mission now. And maybe like the scribe Jesus refers to in Matthew 13, I have brought out the old and the new.

Then He told them, “For this reason, every scribe who has been discipled in the kingdom of heaven is like a homeowner who brings out of his storeroom new treasures as well as old." (Matthew 13:52)
Thank you Edward for your partial personal testimony regarding how you came to see Christ as the end all in and for your life. He is everything to me as well.

Let me briefly or longer, share a part of my past and a part of my testimony to Christ. I have ran into the other realms of real angels of God, witchery and charms in my past, so I will highlight just a few of them here.

I grew up in a rigid formal setting concerning the patriarchal religion, of the RCC. I was taught until High school by missionary nuns in New Zealand, and the Priests who has their home on the school grounds as well. I had the fear of God, and my Dad and the nuns well instilled in me by the time I was a teenager. I excelled in the subject of religion. I became an altar boy, and would occasionally help the priest gather and display all the articles essential for the Mass.

I was always an analyst in everything it seemed, more than most. I would quietly question in my mind why are we serving God this way etc. What are these people getting out of the Mass? Their lives did not reflect joy, hope, and many times they exhibited sternness, and no love at times. Why the statues, why this long list of sacraments, and many Hail Mary's etc. And then my mother was part of the Church of England and very rarely seen in a RCC building. And only when coerced by my Dad. And then I used to listen to the fights before and afterwards, like we had evil or demons in the house...

I wondered about Jesus a lot, as a baby, a man and now in heaven, as my 12 year old mind was so intrigued. I never felt a close connection with the Savior at that point in time.

Well before that age, before school age, my mother would get on occasion, knocks, on the front door of our government subsidized about 700 sq, ft. 2-story brick, 1910-built, bug infested rowhouse (we were very poor) in Nottingham England. It was common to see female witches knock on doors and tell their owners their future tidings and fortune, and requested any donation if it could be afforded. My mother told me on the eve of us all emigrating to New Zealand, that I would be a scholar in another land. So the idea of witches were not just in story books for me, they were part of the community in the 50s and early 60s.

I remember still today when I was sick in bed and only a few years old, actually seeing a being in white hover to the side of me and smiling as 'it' seemed to then float out of the room.

Zooming forward in time, back to New Zealand again. My mother would use tarot cards quite frequently. I used to watch her dabble in it. So this was not new to me at all.

One the eve of leaving NZ for the States, whilst I was with my mother over at a friend's place; I believe she was an actual witch, I used a Ouija/we gee board with one her children. I requested information about my future. I ask if I would be married, and when, and if I would have children in that marriage. The answers became spot on in time. More that just a coincidence to me.

You know years later I've always wondered whether my mother was a practicing witch. I never really got that close into her affairs to know. I know as an adult child of hers she really never showed love to me, and my wife. In fact the very few times we would visit her house, it was like kryptonite to her. She was always unsettled. She firmly, cruelty and coldly would say to me, since I was a teenager and after marriage, privately in my face, 'I never wanted kids.' Great Mom aye?!

On the eve of knowing my true love and marriage partner I found myself drawing with pencils and then with India black ink, of medieval drawings, from scratch. I drew dozens of them. I was so proud of them I showed them to another person. He said to me, they were great and then asked me if I was into the black arts. I was stunned! I really did not see the harm in drawing witches, demons and other symbols in this art work. He shook me up, indeed. I became so upset inside because of his reaction that I later just stopped this art work completely.

So I got married to a lovely US born woman. And someone like I've always prayed for. My prayers were answered. And unbeknownst to me then, she was a true lover of Jesus, from knee-high.

Now one day an acquaintance of mine asked me if I wanted to know about Christ is a personal way, in my life. Flags were going up and then down for awhile, I was wrestling inside with something bigger than me; it seemed like an eternity. I took a chance and quickly said, yes, and what is it all about. Now before that time, I was also good at higher math, and I tried to place God in these parameters, as a curve to infinity on a graph. I was suddenly very much interested in God. Maybe my marriage sparked something within me. I could not get God off my mind. I tried to define him in terms of symbols, mathematics and astrophysics. I was enjoying myself..

So when I gave my life to Christ one midweek evening in April 1974, in our mobile home, my life changed forever. Within an hour I was racing around the house trying to find a bible. I could not get enough of the word of God. I eventually became immersed in water at a local Baptist church, with my wife. I was on fire for Christ. For the first time in my life I felt an internal bond with Jesus, my personal friend and Lord. Where have you been all my life?! It was me that needed to answer my Jesus, not he.

Just one more area concerning the 'dark side.' In my mid-life my spiritual walk declined noticeably for the first time. Without revealing the surrounding settings in the interest of time, I once was enchanted away by another woman. I actually felt uncontrollably drawn to her, and not really for the sexual attraction. She tried to use some device like a pendulum to conjure up a friendly' spirit for me. She placed it in front of me and caused it to swing, however it always stopped when it tried to swing toward me. She was surprised and said it does not want/work for me. I really never knew what that meant and I did not care.

Anyway, I'm today still on fire for Christ with the love and passion I had with him when I first received the Spirit of truth and life from the Father.

I'm a work-in progress. I hope and look forward to continuing my journey with him in the next life; as you do I would imagine.

APAK
 
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lforrest

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That's fine then, we'll leave it there. But I wonder why it's okay for you to be taught by the Spirit of God, but when I'm taught by the Holy Spirit, I'm deluded? I mean, you'd have no problem if I just let you tell me what to think--right?

You would be a first to ask me what I think. We were not taught by the same spirit, as I was lead to believe the orthodox Christian beliefs are true. That the full canon of scripture are truly God's inspired words. My negative opinions towards people, even of other religions, were softened.

The differences appear to be that you had a grounding in the occult, where I did not and maintained a fear of those things.
 

Edward Gordon

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Your Eucharist is not transubstantiation then?

I'm pretty sure it is:

----------
tran·sub·stan·ti·a·tion
/ˌtran(t)səbˌstan(t)SHēˈāSH(ə)n/

noun
CHRISTIAN THEOLOGY


(especially in the Roman Catholic Church) the conversion of the substance of the Eucharistic elements into the body and blood of Christ at consecration, only the appearances of bread and wine still remaining.
------------

I was raised LDS, and baptized at 10 (didn't know what they believed) when I was older, I found about the marriage for time and eternity. After I asked if they were saying God had a wife, and they sad "Where do you think all those spirit babies come from" I kicked them out.

Blasphemy, and pride. Why would you ever want to become a god?

Because I think it would be better to live in Christ's Kingdom than to simply perish after death. And unless one becomes Christ, one does not see the Kingdom of God. It's that simple.

From post 351
Edward Gordon said

I think this is one of the saddest things I ever read. He called Jesus an elitist too.
This Christ he worships is not the Christ the Bible speaks of.

Christ is an elitist. The only ones who matter to Jesus Christ are the chosen. Y'all need to read the Gospels a little more closely.
 

Edward Gordon

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Edward, I'm reading up on the Verdican church.

1. You believe you will be transformed into Christ. The question I have is that you believe you will be transformed into gods then since Jesus is a God. How do you hold to your idea without Godly powers? And don't you feel that might be blasphemous?

God is the monistic entity. Christ is God conscious of Himself within His creation. When we are transformed into Christ we are babies in Christ, so we have growing to do in Christ. I personally believe that most of our maturation takes place in the Kingdom of God. Here on Earth, as far as God-powers go, we might perfect prophecy, some of the healing miracles, that sort of thing, but we don't have much faith, and we have not been raised to have much faith. So, miracles are very difficult for us now. BUT...that's just from my perspective. Who knows? Some child could be born and raised as a Veridican and display great powers of faith. If the world has that much time left, that is.

And no, I don't think it's blasphemous. I got my ideas from the life and teachings of Jesus Christ.

2. You believe as the Catholics do that the bread and wine are transformed into the Body and Blood of Jesus. I see that as a job of the Holy Spirit. That we consume the bread and wine and the Holy Spirit clenses our souls of sin and grants us longer lives and healings thru the body and blood of Christ. As @Cassandra pointed out Jesus gave that bread and wine to the disciples before he made the atonement. How do you reason that out?

We are what we eat. Your physical body is a product of the food you have eaten and the fluids you have drank. Same goes with the Spirit of Christ. If we consume Him, we become Him.

3. Your church statement of faith says:

Satan
"We believe in a spiritual entity that exists to draw human beings away from any development into Christ. We hold that Satan is a creation of God intended to purify the elect and to prune those from the Church who are not truly committed to it by faith. Anyone not in a league with Christ necessarily remains in a league with Satan."

So you think Satan holds an important purpose in the purification of the elect. I see that as a dangerous doctrine and I don't think Satan has the potential to do anything Good and it would be best if he was gone. People would be better off. He was kicked out of heaven with the Blood of Christ as the bible points out. He has no place there now and soon will have no place on earth. I think without Satan God could save us easier such that he makes God's job more difficult. He is an enemy to God and serves only evil. So then your purification of the elect is done by evil?

4. Your church statement of faith says:

Hell
"We believe hell is a place of spiritual agony where souls are kept for the pleasure of God. We believe anyone not transforming into Christ at the time of death will go to hell."

So you're church believes that God gets pleasure from sending people to hell? I kinda see that as anti-God and anti-Love of God. Perhaps your god is more evil than good. How do you work that out?

No, you must have searched the internet and found some information on an old version of the religion. The official Articles of Faith are at In fact, I think at this point it's safe to post the link. I mean, people have been going there and posting stuff in here, so I think I can post the link to the Articles of Faith for discussion purposes.
Veridican Articles of Faith (veridicans.org)

BUT... I don't mind talking about those points. They are not, however, part of the finalized Articles of Faith. That said:


Satan
"We believe in a spiritual entity that exists to draw human beings away from any development into Christ. We hold that Satan is a creation of God intended to purify the elect and to prune those from the Church who are not truly committed to it by faith. Anyone not in a league with Christ necessarily remains in a league with Satan."

So you think Satan holds an important purpose in the purification of the elect. I see that as a dangerous doctrine and I don't think Satan has the potential to do anything Good and it would be best if he was gone. People would be better off. He was kicked out of heaven with the Blood of Christ as the bible points out. He has no place there now and soon will have no place on earth. I think without Satan God could save us easier such that he makes God's job more difficult. He is an enemy to God and serves only evil. So then your purification of the elect is done by evil?

Well, Satan is a creation of God and could be destroyed by God at any time. But he is not destroyed by God. And I do see his work as trying keep the elect from germinating into Christ, and to tempt the elect to keep them from developing. He is the king of this world right now, and he means to keep it. But I do see him as the enemy. He is definitely the enemy of Christ. A literal interpretation of Revelation says that he will be thrown into the lake of fire forever. But I'm reserving comment on that for now.


4. Your church statement of faith says:

Hell
"We believe hell is a place of spiritual agony where souls are kept for the pleasure of God. We believe anyone not transforming into Christ at the time of death will go to hell."

So you're church believes that God gets pleasure from sending people to hell? I kinda see that as anti-God and anti-Love of God. Perhaps your god is more evil than good. How do you work that out?

Yes. God gets pleasure from watching those in hell suffer. Absolutely. However, I no longer believe those who are not born again go to hell. Jesus says they perish, so that's what happens. There are other types that go to hell, not just because they are unsaved.

God (not "my" God but THE God) is good. He is good because he is God. If He does it, it's good. That's it.
 
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Edward Gordon

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I'm not surprised you have no comment on my 'babbling'. You are a fraud and not a true brother in Christ. We don't have spiritual unity as do true Christians who recognise the Holy spirit in each other.

You're right: You and I are not the same.
nono.gif
 

Edward Gordon

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@Edward Gordon I'm noticing similarities in the Veridican Church as with the Mormon Church. Both believe they'll be gods or like gods or something along those lines. It's my opinion that both the Veridican Church and the Mormon Church were created by people that were delusional. Both their teachings seem to reflect that. At least I see some delusions in their teachings. Some of it may be correct, but one shouldn't overlook the delusional portions.

I find the bible to be accurate and Paul's writings and the Apostles to be inspired by God and the Holy Spirit. Something to think about. And while yes, Jesus is always correct in his teachings, we as Christians find ways to accept all of the teachings without throwing out portions. Something the Veridican Church shares with the Mormon Church, they both toss out parts of the Bible to create their new doctrines. Dangerous teachings to say the least.

I think the Latter Day Saints honor the whole Bible as the word of God. They also have the Book of Mormon and I think "A Perl of Great Price" as part of their canon as well. I could be wrong.

Perhaps the moderators should read the articles of faith of Edwards church:

Veridicanism

I'm pretty sure they have. And this is a non-Christian board. So...deal with it.

That link goes to an outdated post about Veridicanism from a long time ago. I've marked it, and I'm going to try to contact Wikibin to see if I can get them to exchange it for the current Articles of Faith. Outdated articles notwithstanding, I stand by a lot of what's written there, but not all of it.
 

dev553344

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God is the monistic entity. Christ is God conscious of Himself within His creation. When we are transformed into Christ we are babies in Christ, so we have growing to do in Christ. I personally believe that most of our maturation takes place in the Kingdom of God. Here on Earth, as far as God-powers go, we might perfect prophecy, some of the healing miracles, that sort of thing, but we don't have much faith, and we have not been raised to have much faith. So, miracles are very difficult for us now. BUT...that's just from my perspective. Who knows? Some child could be born and raised as a Veridican and display great powers of faith. If the world has that much time left, that is.

And no, I don't think it's blasphemous. I got my ideas from the life and teachings of Jesus Christ.



We are what we eat. Your physical body is a product of the food you have eaten and the fluids you have drank. Same goes with the Spirit of Christ. If we consume Him, we become Him.



No, you must have searched the internet and found some information on an old version of the religion. The official Articles of Faith are at In fact, I think at this point it's safe to post the link. I mean, people have been going there and posting stuff in here, so I think I can post the link to the Articles of Faith for discussion purposes.
Veridican Articles of Faith (veridicans.org)

BUT... I don't mind talking about those points. They are not, however, part of the finalized Articles of Faith. That said:




Well, Satan is a creation of God and could be destroyed by God at any time. But he is not destroyed by God. And I do see his work as trying keep the elect from germinating into Christ, and to tempt the elect to keep them from developing. He is the king of this world right now, and he means to keep it. But I do see him as the enemy. He is definitely the enemy of Christ. A literal interpretation of Revelation says that he will be thrown into the lake of fire forever. But I'm reserving comment on that for now.




Yes. God gets pleasure from watching those in hell suffer. Absolutely. However, I no longer believe those who are not born again go to hell. Jesus says they perish, so that's what happens. There are other types that go to hell, not just because they are unsaved.

God (not "my" God but THE God) is good. He is good because he is God. If He does it, it's good. That's it.
Thanks for discussing. I will read the other articles of faith for more clarification. I like the fact that you now believe that the born again will not perish.
 

GTW27

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So why have you formed a belief system based upon the Gospels when you believe the Gospels to be fiction?
 

stunnedbygrace

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I don't really care. I'm not angry and hurt, as you claim that I am, as if that were the only reason God put Veridicanism on the Earth. I am not errant. I am not outcast from the World Church. I am a sword cutting it in half. You don't appreciate the times you are living in. You don't see the handwriting on the wall (read Daniel). You think there is some way to save this world in this age, and there isn't. All your "peacemaking" at this point is just polishing brass on the Titanic. You need to wake up. In my ever so humble opinion.

I most certainly do not think there is some way to save this world in this age. It will be destroyed in fire and there will be a new heaven and new earth.

As for peacemaking and seeking peace with men and seeking not to cause them harm, your own book of Mathew has Jesus saying, blessed are the peacemakers for they shall be called sons of God.
 
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