Once Saved, Always Saved?

[BloodBought 1953]

The objective of the Law is being like the Messiah.


Think again, Blind Guide.....
The “ Objective of the Law” is to bring you to the END of yourself ....something that CLEARLY has not happened in YOUR life....It is supposed to show you that you are a hopeless and helpless Sinner that MUST have a Savior in order to get to Heaven.....Paul referred to the Law as a Burden That neither “ HE” nor “ His Fathers” could keep—— yet, you think that YOU can.....


Newbies out their? Let the Law perform its intended purpose in your Life.....swallow your Pride and admit that you CANT and DON’T “ keep it”, and do just like the wicked Tax Collector did ...the guy that Jesus said, “ Returned Home JUSTIFIED!” .....get on your knees and cry out, “ Lord , have Mercy on me, a Sinner!” That’s the evidence of a “Contrite Heart” ..... Its what God is looking for....it’s the Starting Point Of Christianity .....some here have not arrived at “ The Starting Gate “ Of Christianity....they are Blind yet purport to teach others.....don’t fall for their Spiritual Hog Wash....

Pray for that “ Contrite Heart” .....ask God for His Mercy if you haven’t before—- “ All those that ASK for Mercy shall Receive it!” .....You pray the prayer——- watch God do the rest .........” TURN TO ME and * I* will TURN to You!” ......That “ Turning?” .....That is the Repentance that God wants to see....Its a Repentance That will get you Saved.....God Bless....


( btw.....as far as “ Being like Jesus?” ......THAT is the job of the Holy Spirit....The Job Of the Law is to show you the “ NEED” for that Holy Spirit)

 

[Titus]

Some christians will fall away,
Acts 20:28,
-Therefore take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which he purchased with His own blood.

1Timothy 4:1,
-Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons.

Christians are told to restore the fallen,
Galatians 6:1,
-Brethren, if a man is overtaken in any trespass, you who are spiritual restore such a one in a spirit of gentleness, consider yourself lest you also be tempted.

James 5:19-20,
-Brethren, if anyone among you wonders from the truth and someone turns him back.
-let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

God does not break His promises with man.
Ephesians 1:13,
In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise.

But that has nothing to do with our promise.

The gospel of Jesus Christ is a covenant with God.
Covenant is an agreement, contract between two ir more.

God will not break His seal to keep us saved.

But we can break our contract and therefore the seal is broken.
Nothing can seperate us from the love of God.

But we can seperate ourselves from Gods grace.
Only under the new covenant is Gods grace.

Once we break our contract, we are no longer under Gods grace.

Seals can be broken,
Revelation 6:1-12

If one initializes the Contract by Believing the Gospel Of 1Cor15:1-5 , He is in the Grip of God at that very instant.....God’s Word says that “ NOTHING in the FUTURE” can affect that Grip....” YOU” being in that Grip and then later, IN THE FUTURE , deciding to remove yourself from that Grip wont affect a thing.....unless God is a Liar....not likely....

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yep, stop right there. The doctrine of "OSAS," properly understood, does not trample on in any way the fact that sin cannot is not to be justified (as if that were even possible) sin in any way. And yes, the heart-regenerate Christian will certainly struggle against, battle, and fight to overcome all kinds of sin. It is God Who justifies, so no one can bring any charge against His elect (Romans 8:33).

Romans 8:33 is in context to believers who love God (Romans 8:28).
To love God is to keep His commandments according to Jesus (John 14:15).
If a charge is being laid against the Elect it is a past sin that is forgiven and not one that they are currently committing or a wrong mindset that says that they must sin this side of Heaven according to a false interpretation on 1 John 1:8, and Isaiah 64:6.

And this is not meant to say that God somehow "justifies sin," but rather He justifies people even while they are yet dead in sin ~ this is His mercy and compassion ~ based on His will and Christ's work of redemption on the cross.

Colossians 2:13
“And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;”

This is referring to when we first come to the Lord Jesus and His grace.
This is referring to how you are forgiven of all your past sins and not future sins.
Christ’s redemption upon the cross is a Provisional Atonement, and it only applies to a person if they apply the proper right kind of faith.

Pffft. Not the right "OSAS Christians"! But seriously. Again, what so many are labeling "OSAS" is really antinomianism, and they don't even realize it.

I used to buy into this excuse but I am not so convinced of that anymore because the Scriptures teach Conditional Salvation and how sin can separate you from God unless you confess and forsake sin. Your disagreement with that process means that if you abide in sin for a time before you confess of your sin, you are still saved.

But 1 John 1:9 says if we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. See... you don't even believe that. None of it. You don't believe confessing sin leads to forgiveness of sins. How can you? Do you not believe all future sin is forgiven by Jesus? If so... then why confess of sins if they are already forgiven?

Also, why would Jesus warn us about how the Father would not forgive us if we don't forgive?
This cannot be written to the unbeliever because if an unbeliever forgives everyone on the planet and they reject Jesus, they are still going to hell. So Matthew 6:15 is written to believers. You need to forgive in order to be forgiven. But if OSAS is true, then why is Jesus warning us? It makes no sense. That's why your belief is far out there in left field somewhere.

And that's why they "think" along the same lines you are "thinking" along here.

If you tell a child that they are saved by God's grace and it is nothing that they do and you never see them again... they can grow up to be the next George Sodini (Whether you wanted that to happen or not). That's the problem with OSAS. If you don't clarify yourself... it's easy to think it is a license to sin. That's why OSAS is bogus.

To learn about George Sodini, check out this article here:

O.S.A.S. – THE WATCHMAN'S CRY

My goodness. Okay, yet again, "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

So you think that you will always sin this side of Heaven based on 1 John 1:8? This is a justification to sin that is a false misinterpretation. It's not saying you will always sin in this life. That's what I am talking about. There is no holiness in OSAS. You also probably misread Isaiah 64:6 to think that this is talking any form of righteous actions. But it's not. 1 John 3:7 says he that does righteousness is righteous.

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness." This is 1 John 1:8-9, and is true yesterday, today, and forever... well, until Jesus comes back, because then there will be no more sin, so then nothing to confess, and nothing to be forgiven of.

John says to “sin not” (1 John 2:1). Jesus says to “sin no more” (John 5:14) (John 8:11). In other words, to deny these statements in Scripture is the justification of sin I am talking about (Which we see in all forms of OSAS). You guys believe you cannot stop sinning this side of Heaven. Yet, you are still saved. Justification of sin and evil.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yep, stop right there. The doctrine of "OSAS," properly understood, does not trample on in any way the fact that sin cannot is not to be justified (as if that were even possible) sin in any way. And yes, the heart-regenerate Christian will certainly struggle against, battle, and fight to overcome all kinds of sin. It is God Who justifies, so no one can bring any charge against His elect (Romans 8:33). And this is not meant to say that God somehow "justifies sin," but rather He justifies people even while they are yet dead in sin ~ this is His mercy and compassion ~ based on His will and Christ's work of redemption on the cross.


Pffft. Not the right "OSAS Christians"! But seriously. Again, what so many are labeling "OSAS" is really antinomianism, and they don't even realize it. And that's why they "think" along the same lines you are "thinking" along here.


My goodness. Okay, yet again, "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness." This is 1 John 1:8-9, and is true yesterday, today, and forever... well, until Jesus comes back, because then there will be no more sin, so then nothing to confess, and nothing to be forgiven of.

Okay, that's enough. Grace and peace to you.

Pop quiz:

If a believer generally lived a holy life and yet he one day looked upon a woman in lust, and he got hit by a bus and died immediately is he saved?

I don't believe he is saved because he did not have a chance to confess of his sin to be forgiven of it (i.e. 1 John 1:9).

If you are Once Saved Always Saved and you want to be consistent with that thinking... then nothing should in theory ever make you unsaved, right? So how you live should not matter if you are Once Saved Always Saved. But you oddly believe a Christian will not live that way. Again... why the many warnings to us believers if that is so?

Matthew 5:28-30 says that if you look upon a woman in lust, your whole body can be cast bodily into hellfire.
This is said to believers because if an unbeliever never looked upon a woman in lust and yet they rejected Jesus as their Savior, they are going to hell. So this is written to the believer. It's a warning to the believer.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yep, stop right there. The doctrine of "OSAS," properly understood, does not trample on in any way the fact that sin cannot is not to be justified (as if that were even possible) sin in any way. And yes, the heart-regenerate Christian will certainly struggle against, battle, and fight to overcome all kinds of sin. It is God Who justifies, so no one can bring any charge against His elect (Romans 8:33). And this is not meant to say that God somehow "justifies sin," but rather He justifies people even while they are yet dead in sin ~ this is His mercy and compassion ~ based on His will and Christ's work of redemption on the cross.


Pffft. Not the right "OSAS Christians"! But seriously. Again, what so many are labeling "OSAS" is really antinomianism, and they don't even realize it. And that's why they "think" along the same lines you are "thinking" along here.


My goodness. Okay, yet again, "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness." This is 1 John 1:8-9, and is true yesterday, today, and forever... well, until Jesus comes back, because then there will be no more sin, so then nothing to confess, and nothing to be forgiven of.

Okay, that's enough. Grace and peace to you.

Pop quiz: Was King David saved while he committed his sins of adultery and murder?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

One day, the Lord spoke to me (I heard His voice), "I will never leave you nor forsake you." I believe Him. If anyone has a conniption fit over that, then that's their business.

You have to read the Bible in context.

In Deuteronomy we read something similar.

Deuteronomy 31:6
“Be strong and of a good courage, fear not, nor be afraid of them: for the LORD thy God, he it is that doth go with thee; he will not fail thee, nor forsake thee.”

Deuteronomy 31:16-17
16 And the LORD said unto Moses, Behold, thou shalt sleep with thy fathers; and this people will rise up, and go a whoring after the gods of the strangers of the land, whither they go to be among them, and will forsake me, and break my covenant which I have made with them.
17 Then my anger shall be kindled against them in that day, and I will forsake them, and I will hide my face from them, and they shall be devoured, and many evils and troubles shall befall them;...”

So if one keeps God's covenant He will not forsake you or fail you. But if you break His covenant... God will forsake you. It's that simple. We can break God's covenant by committing grievous sin with no remorse or repentance.

But many OSAS folk falsely teach that Christians who backslide are still saved while they are in their backslidden lifestyle of sin.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

If one initializes the Contract by Believing the Gospel Of 1Cor15:1-5 , He is in the Grip of God at that very instant.....God’s Word says that “ NOTHING in the FUTURE” can affect that Grip....” YOU” being in that Grip and then later, IN THE FUTURE , deciding to remove yourself from that Grip wont affect a thing.....unless God is a Liar....not likely....

What about those who seek to later be justified by the Law? Are they not fallen from grace?

Galatians 5:4
“Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.”

 

[Titus]

YOU” being in that Grip and then later, IN THE FUTURE , deciding to remove yourself from that Grip wont affect a thing.....unless God is a Liar....not likely....

God keeps His promises.
Gods grace is in the covenant of Jesus Christ.
The saved are in His new covenant.

What happens when we break His covenant?
We are no longer under His grace.

God did not break His promise.
We broke our promise to remain faithfull to Him.

Deuteronomy 31:16-17,
-And the Lord said to Moses; Behold, you will rest with your fathers; and this people will rise and play the harlot with the gods of the foreigners of the land, where they go to be among them, and they will forsake Me and break My covenant which I have made with them.

-17 Then My anger shall be aroused against them in that day and I will forsake them and I will hide My face from them and they shall be devoured. And many evil troubles shall befall them, so they will say in that day, Have not these evils come upon us because our God is not among us?

 

[JunChosen]

If a charge is being laid against the Elect it is a past sin that is forgiven and not one that they are currently committing or a wrong

Seeing that the wages of sin [singular] is death, :"How many sins did Jesus redeem when He went to the cross for you,10, a 100, a 1,000, 1,000,000, or, ALL OF YOUR SINS. If Christ did NOT pay one sin of yours, YOU WILL SURELY END UP IN HELL. For the wages of sin [one sin] is death!

To God Be The Glory

 

[Titus]

Seeing that the wages of sin [singular] is death, :"How many sins did Jesus redeem when He went to the cross for you,10, a 100, a 1,000, 1,000,000, or, ALL OF YOUR SINS. If Christ did NOT pay one sin of yours, YOU WILL SURELY END UP IN HELL. For the wages of sin [one sin] is death!

To God Be The Glory

Jesus shed blood washes the sins from the past till the present. Once the christian,
Begins to fall away, Jesus' blood no longer washes the sins away, unless,
1John 1:9.
Read Hebrews 10:26

 

[Truman]

I believe what He said.
I died, He lives, and dwells inside of me
I am finally assured of eternity
He never left my side, not even when I died
He was with me in the dark...right by my side
Faithful is His name tc

When He said that He would never leave me, He meant that...He would never leave me.
I trust Him. Not me. Not you. Not some doctrine...how many are there? Not the fruit of someone's natural mind's "correct" doctrine.
Yeshua said that He would not lose one that the Father had given Him. I will never again make the mistake of knuckling under to anyone's doctrine. I trust Him. Not me, not you, not religion, not copies of copies of copies of lost manuscripts, helpful as they are.

 

[Titus]

I believe what He said.
I died, He lives, and dwells inside of me
I am finally assured of eternity
He never left my side, not even when I died
He was with me in the dark...right by my side
Faithful is His name tc

When He said that He would never leave me, He meant that...He would never leave me.
I trust Him. Not me. Not you. Not some doctrine...how many are there? Not the fruit of someone's natural mind's "correct" doctrine.
Yeshua said that He would not lose one that the Father had given Him. I will never again make the mistake of knuckling under to anyone's doctrine. I trust Him. Not me, not you, not religion, not copies of copies of copies of lost manuscripts, helpful as they are.

Salvation is conditioned on remaining faithful, Revelation 2:10
God forsakes those who forsake Him.

]Deuteronomy 31:16-17,
-And the Lord said to Moses; Behold, you will rest with your fathers; and this people will rise and play the harlot with the gods of the foreigners of the land, where they go to be among them, and they will forsake Me and break My covenant which I have made with them.

-17 Then My anger shall be aroused against them in that day and I will forsake them and I will hide My face from them and they shall be devoured. And many evil troubles shall befall them, so they will say in that day, Have not these evils come upon us because our God is not among us?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Seeing that the wages of sin [singular] is death, :"How many sins did Jesus redeem when He went to the cross for you,10, a 100, a 1,000, 1,000,000, or, ALL OF YOUR SINS. If Christ did NOT pay one sin of yours, YOU WILL SURELY END UP IN HELL. For the wages of sin [one sin] is death!

To God Be The Glory

So you believe in Universalism? That everyone will be saved because Jesus died for the sins of the whole world?
Obviously you need the proper kind of faith to access God's grace.
Faith starts off as a belief alone in being saved by His grace and mercy, but it does not remain that way.

1 John 1:7 says if you walk in the light as he is in the light, we fellowship with one another and the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us from all sin.

Walking in the light is loving your brother according to the indirect wording in 1 John 2:9-11.
So you have to love your brother in order for the blood to continue to cleanse you of all your sin. For it's a part of the faith. For faith comes by hearing, and hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The thing is that there are many verses that refute OSAS. You cannot deny that there are verses that do appear to look like they refute OSAS. So what if you are wrong? I would not want to be overly confident in a belief that could make me to play games with my soul.

In fact, OSAS justifies sin and evil. You get to sin on some level, and yet be saved. Those deny this simply are being double minded and not paying attention at the moment at their false OSAS justify sin interpretations on 1 John 1:8, and Isaiah 64:6, etcetera. They also seem to ignore or downplay when they say that they will always sin this side of Heaven (When they admit they don't justify sin). But the Bible does not say one will always sin this side of Heaven. Also, God would have to agree with your sin in order to let you into His Kingdom (if you thought you could sin and still be saved). But God cannot agree with sin because He is holy and righteous.

You can keep clinging to all the verses of what you believe is OSAS all you like. It's not gonna help you come judgment day because God is holy, just, and good.

 

[Truman]

Salvation is conditioned on remaining faithful, Revelation 2:10
God forsakes those who forsake Him.

]Deuteronomy 31:16-17,
-And the Lord said to Moses; Behold, you will rest with your fathers; and this people will rise and play the harlot with the gods of the foreigners of the land, where they go to be among them, and they will forsake Me and break My covenant which I have made with them.

-17 Then My anger shall be aroused against them in that day and I will forsake them and I will hide My face from them and they shall be devoured. And many evil troubles shall befall them, so they will say in that day, Have not these evils come upon us because our God is not among us?

He said that He would never leave me. Everyone else did and they will all give you sound doctrinal reasons for doing it. It took me many years to realize that not only were they all wrong, they didn't want to spend time on someone who was chronically ill.
I died in the hospital, but when the nurse was filling out my time of death, my heart started beating again. As I came out of the coma 4 days later, I had a clear mental image of looking down into the lobby of a travel agency. I knew that I'd gone somewhere, though I didn't know where.
17 years later, I had a flash in my head and I finally remembered where. I was on a street in a city park that had a golden mist on the ground. I turned to my front and Yeshua was standing a few feet in front of me, and He was looking into my eyes. He loves me (and obviously others) so much. Even in death, He was with me. I trust Him, and I love Him. I'm His...period.
"…37No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us. 38For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor principalities, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, 39neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.…"
- Romans 8:37-39. To this I say, "Yes, and amen!"

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I think the issue is... do people want a Holy Bible (a divine book), or a holey bible (a book full of holes)?
I say this because folks tend to focus a laser beam on what appears to be OSAS verses and yet they seem to twist, dodge, duck, ignore any verses that would refute OSAS. For when we present verses that refute OSAS, it's like they are not hearing the Bible as a whole. They have a holey bible that is full of holes and they keep only the parts that they like in it.

 

[farouk]

He said that He would never leave me. Everyone else did and they will all give you sound doctrinal reasons for doing it. It took me many years to realize that not only were they all wrong, they didn't want to spend time on someone who was chronically ill.
I died in the hospital, but when the nurse was filling out my time of death, my heart started beating again. As I came out of the coma 4 days later, I had a clear mental image of looking down into the lobby of a travel agency. I knew that I'd gone somewhere, though I didn't know where.
17 years later, I had a flash in my head and I finally remembered where. I was on a street in a city park that had a golden mist on the ground. I turned to my front and Yeshua was standing a few feet in front of me, and He was looking into my eyes. He loves me (and obviously others) so much. Even in death, He was with me. I trust Him, and I love Him. I'm His...period.
"…37No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us. 38For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor principalities, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, 39neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.…"
- Romans 8:37-39. To this I say, "Yes, and amen!"

Great Romans 8 passage there, @Truman...

 

[JunChosen]

So you believe in Universalism? That everyone will be saved because Jesus died for the sins of the whole world?

Prove that I said that. Your kind loves to add and subtract to the written Scripture or what others have written.

FYI, Jesus died only for those whom the Father gave to Him in eternity past before the foundation of the world. [John 6:37].

So you have to love your brother in order for the blood to continue to cleanse you of all your sin. For it's a part of the faith. For faith comes by hearing, and hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17).

To love my brother yes. Romans 10 is another issue. It seems you have no knowledge of what it means. So sad! Hosea 4:6.

To God Be The Glory

 

[farouk]

I think the issue is... do people want a Holy Bible (a divine book), or a holey bible (a book full of holes)?
I say this because folks tend to focus a laser beam on what appears to be OSAS verses and yet they seem to twist, dodge, duck, ignore any verses that would refute OSAS. For when we present verses that refute OSAS, it's like they are not hearing the Bible as a whole. They have a holey bible that is full of holes and they keep only the parts that they like in it.

Is your salvation supposedly so holey that the perfect work of Christ at the Cross is supposedly never good enough and sufficient for you?