Is Lordship salvation Biblical?

[Johann]

^ ^ ^ ^

Pros and cons

What is the Bible saying?

I myself am not sure re this "teaching" so I put it out there on this forum and please don't "attack" any members.
Shalom
J.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

Is Lordship salvation Biblical?

Yes.

“For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,” (1 Thessalonians 5:9)

 

[Johann]

Lordship salvation, much like calvinism is Biblical. Its amazing how you pick who you listen to. If you really want to learn what Lordship salvation is, listen to john macarthur, who is by the way, a calvinist.

Like I have said, don't attack, explain.
J.

 

[GEN2REV]

john macarthur, who is by the way, a calvinist.

... and a PreMillennialist and an OSAS-ist and a heretic-ist, etc.

@Johann

I'm here to learn what Lordship Salvation is as well.

I'll follow the thread to find out.

(MacArthur's not a member here so I hope it's ok that I'm attacking him. :))

 

[GEN2REV]

Pros and cons

What is the Bible saying?

I myself am not sure re this "teaching" so I put it out there on this forum and please don't "attack" any members.
Shalom
J.

Based on the GotQuestions teaching of Lordship Salvation, I would say it's 100% Biblical and it's what I have been supporting for many years now.

I think this paragraph from the GotQuestions website best sums up Lordship Salvation as the opposite of Easy Believism.

"In the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus says that eternal life is a narrow path found by “only a few” (Matthew 7:14); in contrast, easy-believism seeks to broaden the path so that anyone who has a profession of faith can enter. Jesus says that “every good tree bears good fruit” (verse 17); in contrast, easy-believism says that a tree can still be good and bear nothing but bad fruit. Jesus says that many who say “Lord, Lord” will not enter the kingdom (verses 21–23); in contrast, easy-believism teaches that saying “Lord, Lord” is good enough."
What is lordship salvation? | GotQuestions.org

What say you?

 

[GEN2REV]

Lordship salvation, much like calvinism is Biblical. Its amazing how you pick who you listen to. If you really want to learn what Lordship salvation is, listen to john macarthur, who is by the way, a calvinist.

It seems to me like Lordship Salvation is nothing like Calvinism; on the contrary.

LS does not align with OSAS at all.

LS says that we must fully let go of the 'old man' and walk in Christ; observing the Commandments, etc.

LS says that we must endure to the end, not that we have received full salvation just by professing our belief, etc.

Calvinism opposes these views and others of Lordship Salvation.

 

[GodsGrace]

i disagree. John macarthur has made it clear that he is a calvinist. The issue has now become is Lordship salvation just another name for calvinism. I would say yes. As much as i listen to macarthur, this is basically him trying to rename calvinism yet keep the 5 pts in an attempt to get people to see that it is Biblical.

Why is Mac trying to rename calvinism?
Is it like the Trojan horse idea?

Calvinism is not biblical.
Lordship salvation is biblical.

I like to listen to Jesus, not men.

 

[GEN2REV]

i disagree. John macarthur has made it clear that he is a calvinist. The issue has now become is Lordship salvation just another name for calvinism. I would say yes. As much as i listen to macarthur, this is basically him trying to rename calvinism yet keep the 5 pts in an attempt to get people to see that it is Biblical.

Wow. I'm not sure how you see them as so similar.

I totally get how annoying it is when somebody asks you to watch a vid or read something, but if it's not too much trouble, just take a quick look at this summary of Lordship Salvation and compare it to your understanding of Calvinism and see if you don't see the differences.

What is lordship salvation? | GotQuestions.org

 

[Johann]

It seems to me like Lordship Salvation is nothing like Calvinism; on the contrary.

LS does not align with OSAS at all.

LS says that we must fully let go of the 'old man' and walk in Christ; observing the Commandments, etc.

LS says that we must endure to the end, not that we have received full salvation just by professing our belief, etc.

Calvinism opposes these views and others of Lordship Salvation.

This is interesting G2R
I have to admit, know nothing re Lordship salvation but to me it is entrusting myself in Christ Jesus as my Savior and my Lord.
J.

 

[Johann]

... and a PreMillennialist and an OSAS-ist and a heretic-ist, etc.

@Johann

I'm here to learn what Lordship Salvation is as well.

I'll follow the thread to find out.

(MacArthur's not a member here so I hope it's ok that I'm attacking him. :))

I am also keen to learn @GEN2REV
J.

 

[Johann]

Also, you DO realize that the folks who run Gotquestions.org are calvinist right??

Very interesting to know
J.

 

[GEN2REV]

Also, you DO realize that the folks who run Gotquestions.org are calvinist right??

Not particularly, but I've known for a long time that I don't agree with all that they teach.

 

[GEN2REV]

your view on this is interesting, but for now, yes it is Biblical. And at the heart of the matter, there is one thing we seem to agree on; that easy believism is a false assurance and that the majority fall into that category.

When you consider Easy-believism, you do understand that it is referring to those who TRULY DO believe, don't you?

The point is that it's not enough to simply believe.

The paragraph I posted from the GotQuestions website referenced Matthew 7:21-23 about those who say "Lord, Lord." Those individuals TRULY DO believe. They are believers - the point is that their belief, in itself, was not enough.

Are we on the same page in that regard?

 

[Johann]

you dont understand either calvinism or the Bible.

Correct, I don't understand Calvin-ism, but I am know by my Lord and Savior Christ Jesus and a pity the infallible scriptures are "reasoned" away by the isms and schisms...


1Co 12:24 For our comely parts have no need: but God hath tempered the body together, having given more abundant honour to that part which lacked:
1Co 12:25 That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another.
1Co 12:26 And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it; or one member be honoured, all the members rejoice with it.
1Co 12:27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.
1Co 12:28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues.
1Co 12:29 Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles?
1Co 12:30 Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?
1Co 12:31 But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way.
J,

 

[Johann]

When you consider Easy-believism, you do understand that it is referring to those who TRULY DO believe, don't you?

The point is that it's not enough to simply believe.

The paragraph I posted from the GotQuestions website referenced Matthew 7:21-23 about those who say "Lord, Lord." Those individuals TRULY DO believe. They are believers - the point is that their belief, in itself, was not enough.

Are we on the same page in that regard?

Here's a thing...


Jas 2:19 So you're impressed with yourselves that with your emunah you can recite the kri'at Shema, nu? O you do so well...why, even the shedim have your da'as and emunah! But they shudder! [DEVARIM 6:4]
Jas 2:20 Are you willing to have da'as, O hollow man, that Emunah unharnessed to Ma'asim, stands idle?
OJB


Jas 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
Jas 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
J.

 

[GEN2REV]

Here's a thing...


Jas 2:19 So you're impressed with yourselves that with your emunah you can recite the kri'at Shema, nu? O you do so well...why, even the shedim have your da'as and emunah! But they shudder! [DEVARIM 6:4]
Jas 2:20 Are you willing to have da'as, O hollow man, that Emunah unharnessed to Ma'asim, stands idle?
OJB


Jas 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
Jas 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
J.

Exactly.

Belief is not enough.

 

[GodsGrace]

This is interesting G2R
I have to admit, know nothing re Lordship salvation but to me it is entrusting myself in Christ Jesus as my Savior and my Lord.
J.

Trusting Jesus as Savior and Lord is right.

Problem is, some want Him to be their Savior, bit not their Lord.

 

[GodsGrace]

you dont understand either calvinism or the Bible.

Funny.
How do you know that?

 

[Johann]

Exactly.

Belief is not enough.

Problematic


Rom 10:8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Rom 10:11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.


Rom 10:10 For with the "heart" one has emunah unto being YITZDAK IM HASHEM and with the "mouth" hoda'ah is made unto Yeshu'at Eloheinu.
Rom 10:11 For the Kitvei Hakodesh says, "Everyone who has emunah in Him shall not be put to shame" [YESHAYAH 28:16].
...When a man is drowning and a hand is there to help..it must be simple, nothing complicated.
J.

 

[GodsGrace]

Problematic


Rom 10:8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Rom 10:11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.


Rom 10:10 For with the "heart" one has emunah unto being YITZDAK IM HASHEM and with the "mouth" hoda'ah is made unto Yeshu'at Eloheinu.
Rom 10:11 For the Kitvei Hakodesh says, "Everyone who has emunah in Him shall not be put to shame" [YESHAYAH 28:16].
...When a man is drowning and a hand is there to help..it must be simple, nothing complicated.
J.

@GEN2REV said belief is not enough.

I know what that poster means,
But your reply is correct...

Solution to problematic....

We're speaking here about belief as used by the Greeks...one believes with the heart - not just with the mind.

Believing with the heart brings to action.