Michiah-Imla
Well-Known Member
Never let anyone tell you Jesus was not God.
Why?
Scriptures you cited didn’t say Jesus was God.
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Never let anyone tell you Jesus was not God.
Is the King James version of the Bible altered sir?
Both of those verses are altered BH, check an interlinear sir. Best worship the God of Jesus, because He was in heaven while Jesus was on earth, even speaking from heaven at Jesus' baptism.
the jw , mormon , CC and scores of others have been decieved . The truth is in that bible and i suggest we STICK TO IT .
Now this is excellent. A very good insight how Jesus was indeed God in the flesh, but not God on the throne in the flesh.
Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men.
Having no reputation would be having no preknowledge of all things? But although He did not have all omniscience as He did the Word in the beginning, He still knew He was that Word and equal with God His Father on the throne is the eternal Spirit and Life:
For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us.
As a child He grew in grace and knowledge of the Lord: HE was just as much a baby as anyone else. He was not conscious of Himself in the womb nor before knowing it like any other child. He also learned however quickly the wisdom and truth of Scripture.
And the child grew, and waxed strong in spirit, filled with wisdom: and the grace of God was upon him.
Butter and honey shall he eat, that he may know to refuse the evil, and choose the good.
This also agrees with the truth that Jesus was not as God on the throne in His glory, where He cannot be tempted at all, but was tempted in all points of all men with renewed but not perfected minds, where no tempting thoughts could appear at all.
Very good, thanks.
the jw , mormon , CC and scores of others have been decieved . The truth is in that bible and i suggest we STICK TO IT .
Doesn't matter, neither Jehovah nor Jesus lie sir. As I pointed out, if Jesus were God, then he lied in those two passages, and our hope would be in vain.
The Bible identifies God's people beyond any doubt, would you care to discuss that or identify God's people?
It looks like you're misunderstanding me a bit. I agree with you we should minister to all Christians alike, but there are those sects and groups that think they are the only right churches or organizations and so they act like missionaries to other Christians to convert them to their own proper faith. That is why Mormons ride around on Christian streets and JWs are knocking on doors. It's not to convert the atheists and unbelieving Muslims and Buddhist, but also to missionize other confessing Christians.
It's like the Pharisees did in Jesus' day. Their name literally meant separators or separatists.
“Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you travel land and sea to win one proselyte, and when he is won, you make him twice as much a son of hell as yourselves. (Matthew 23.15)
They did among the Jews what Christians also began to do in Paul's day and still do today.
For it has been declared to me concerning you, my brethren, by those of Chloe's household, that there are contentions among you. Now I say this, that each of you says, "I am of Paul," or "I am of Apollos," or "I am of Cephas," or "I am of Christ." Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul? (1 Cor 1.11-13)
When the Corinthians were saying I am of Paul, they were not just expressing more honor and appreciation for his ministry, but were taking a stand against Apollos and Cephas. Plenty of Christians identify as Baptists, Methodists, etc... but the separatists like Mormons and Catholics, and some holiness Pentecost groups, are not just standing for Christ, but are also standing against the Baptists and Methodists they think need to be converted and saved to their own true faith. That's the difference between preaching to all Christians and proselytizing other Christians.
I totally acknowledge your right to believe as you do and not wanting to debate. Totally acknowledged and respected. However, when your posts include mischaractures of what others believe then that becomes a problem. If you don’t want to talk about what others beleive, I recommend not including that.There are just some religious groups and or types of beliefs I strive to not debate with. No offense, but maybe others are more inclined to debate with you in showing how Mormonism and JW’s are a spoof on Christianity itself. At this time in my life: It is not my calling to debate with Mormons and JW’s to show them that their religion falls into the realm of absolute ridiculousness. I am not even interested remotely in doing that because there is no standard we can agree upon (i.e. like the Bible alone). I cannot show you the silliness of spiritual underwear and or how your organization used to think blacks were inferior (Among many other problems and obvious flaws in your organization). Only God can open your eyes to the truth with His Word (if you will be open to the truth someday).
I totally acknowledge your right to believe as you do and not wanting to debate. Totally acknowledged and respected. However, when your posts include mischaractures of what others believe then that becomes a problem. If you don’t want to talk about what others beleive, I recommend not including that.
And you’re not biased at all…There are different factions of Mormonism. Are you truly aware of them all and their differing beliefs? Also, Mormonism has not always stayed the same in their beliefs over the years. One article states how they changed 100 things over the years. So I don’t really believe you are not unbiased on the matter. You are only speaking from your limited viewpoint or worldview. There are testimonies of ex Mormons of whom I trust more than what you say. Why? Because you are knee deep in your religion and you will bend over backwards to make it look good despite it’s problems (When I know your religion isn’t good).
That is interesting. Not out in public. There is a difference between riotous living and drinking to excess in our own homes and there is also a difference between cursing and being foul in anger and hate. I can laugh along with another when they use words to describe something funny. I believe it is the spirit behind things that is most important and not the manner of expressing it with the present company in mind. I drink in public but don't get drunk but as you say at home I drink and don't worry so much about how much as long as I'm not making a mess of things.
Preaching to all Christians the gospel of Jesus Christ is preaching to the churches but preaching to convert other Christians to your sect is proselytization and you are preaching as wrong Christians, which is the same as preaching to unbelievers in your own mind.
Therefore God exalted him to the highest place and gave him the name that is above every name, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. (Phil 2.9-11)
Moreover, the Father judges no one, but has entrusted all judgment to the Son, that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. Whoever does not honor the Son does not honor the Father, who sent him. (John 5.23)
Anyone who thinks they are bowing to the Father as God and not to the Son also, is not honoring the Son as the Father, and is fooling themselves. If your God is not the Lamb and the Father, then your God is not my God. You can claim it, but that is like those who claim Jesus with some minor honor of their lips but deny Him His rightful Godly power above all powers:
lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God—having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with such people. (2 Tim 3.4-5)
You only have a form of worship to God when you reject the Son as God and do not honor Him as the Father is God. In the site rules I read how we are not to doubt someone is a Christian if they claim to be one, which is fine by me because the only name in heaven and earth that I respect most is Jesus, and is also respecting the Father who gave His Son the name and declared that name to be above His own name. But that does not mean I have to fellowship with idolaters as brothers and sisters in the Lord Jesus. You are one of them that try to proselytize Christians to your own form of worship.
Every knee will bow to Jesus the Lamb as to God, and will finally honor Him as to the Father, but some too late. When we honor the Son we honor the Father, and when we honor the Father we honor the Son. Unbelievers can try to separate Them from One another in their hearts and minds, but God doesn't and never will. Lucifer was the first one to dishonor the Word and the Father and the Spirit.
Jesus' God is the Father's God and the Holy Spirit's God with Him. They are all three one God together and they all respect One another equally and their divine unity and oneness together. Like a faithful husband and wife respect each other equally and their marriage together, which they hold to as the most important thing in their life.
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. (John 1.1-3)
For it is the God who commanded light to shine out of darkness, who has shone in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. (2 Cor 4:6)
The earth was without form, and void; and darkness was on the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters. (Gen 1.2)
God the Father and the Word and the Holy Spirit create all things when the Father commands the Word to speak and the Spirit does the work of the words spoken. It is the Spirit who made the body for the Son in Mary's womb when the Father commanded Him to become a man, and He obeyed and became flesh on earth, so that while a man He made Himself nothing like He was on the throne, because He became physical like all men and women. And now He is the only resurrected man in heaven back on the throne where He came from but now in an even more honored seat with Jesus the Lamb sitting on the right hand and the Father sits on the left hand. Jesus is given the place of higher honor than the Father, because of what He has done for all men on earth and died on a cross. If either of them are to be honored above the other, then is it the Son who sits in the highest place of honor forever, which is the right hand seat on the throne given to Him without remorse by the Father. And in the new heaven and earth it will only be God and the Lamb sitting on their throne.
That power is the same as the mighty strength he exerted when he raised Christ from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms, far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every name that is invoked, not only in the present age but also in the one to come. (Eph 1.19-21)
Also the Lamb now has the honor of more power than the Spirit and the Father, because they gave it to Him to honor Him, and they did not begrudge it, because the Father loves the Son and the Son loves the Father. But His power is not more than God Himself who is altogether the Spirit and the Father and the Son. Only pagan idolators think in terms of a King God who is separate from and better than the other lesser gods.
There were also two Lords in the OT, Christ the Lord and the LORD Father and they had many names such as the Almighty to Abraham and Jehovah to Moses and now it is only the one name Jesus forever the Lamb of God and is above every name of God ever named by Him in the OT, the NT, and the new heaven and earth to come.
So stick that in your pipe and smoke it until you repent of rejecting Jesus Christ as Lord and God or at least stop trying to proselytize people like you tried with me in your sneaky manner. I would have respected you more if you just come out and say what you have to say and let the chips fall where they may. Don't bother trying it with me anymore because I don't argue about the Bible just for the sake of arguing. We will never agree on anything in the Bible in this matter. There are other things we can hash out but not this one and it is the first and most important one of all. All the rest are like sideshows to me.
I believe God’s Word was purified seven times just as it says in Psalms 12:6-7. I believe that starting with the 1611 KJB, there were seven KJB editions (with the KJB Cambridge Edition 1900) being the final purification. The King James Bible is the first major Bible that went out to the hands of the common man in English (that was almost stop by the opposition by the Catholics). It was the dominant bible in English for hundreds of years. This makes sense because that is the goal of God’s Word is to reach lost souls. If one’s religion is so small and cultish to the point that it can truly have no impact in providing men in being without excuse then that religion fails. JW’s and Mormons are small cultish religions, and their influence is small and not great like the Holy Bible itself alone. That’s why your religion fails and is silliness. Even in the 1500’s the Bible’s leading up to the King James Bible had a great influence. But what of your religion at this time? Didn’t exist. Even in 1611 when the King James Bible came out… your religion did not exist. Then when it did exist… it came about by one man here in America. Like America has always been great when it comes to spiritual things? The Bible ends with us looking to the return of Jesus and there are no hints or fulfilled prophecies of some upcoming JW guy coming on to the scene, or some Mormon dude to be given the way for us to be guided. That’s why these religions again fail and are just plain stupid. They defy all logic where you just have to shut your brain off multiple times.
Most interlinears favor the corrupt Alexandrian texts (Which is the origin of Arianism) which are the texts that most of all your Modern Bibles are primarily based upon. That’s why if you go to Biblehub Interlinear’s page, you will not see the word God mentioned in 1 Timothy 3:16 (When it talks about how God was manifest in the flesh). They are using the corrupt Alexandrian texts that Westcott and Hort used. This should be no surprise because Westcott and Hort were threatening to quit the Translation team if they could not have one of their Arian friends on their translation committee. Their attempt was to dethrone the KJB. Westcott and Hort were into Catholicism and other false beliefs.
One has to look to a different line of manuscripts (Like the Textus Receptus manuscripts) that has not been corrupted (Which is where we get the KJB from). Here are the verses in the Textus Receptus line of bibles. The words are intact in these bibles even dating way back before 1611.
Interlinear Bible: John 1:1 - Textus Receptus Bibles
Interlinear Bible: John 1:14 - Textus Receptus Bibles
Interlinear Bible: 1 Timothy 3:16 - Textus Receptus Bibles
The Modern Bibles based upon the false Alexandrian manuscripts add the devil’s name in the Bible where they do not belong, they attack holy living in certain places, they falsely remove fasting along with praying to cast out persistent demons from those who are demon possessed. Then there are the changes that favor the Catholic Church in Modern Bibles, as well.
I just explained to you that those two verses in no way shows that Jesus lied.
An easy verse to see a deliberate manipulation is found at Ps 110:1 in the King James version of the Bible. Do you see the alteration, and do you understand why the translators manipulated the verse?
I don't get into weird arguments of any kind. When I go to church, I go to be preached to by a Christian minister. That's why we go to church.Why would Christians preach to each other sir? We were sent to teach those who are yet to be Christians, those rightly disposed to life. We are in fact commanded to make disciples, do you think Jesus was wrong in giving that assignment Mat 28:19,20? Why do you suppose you feel that way?
I also don't keep saying what I've already said. Reread what I wrote and you tell me. If you can't figure it out from all the words I wrote to you, then that's your problem.You said:Therefore God exalted him to the highest place and gave him the name that is above every name
You are quite correct, now once again who is that God who exalted him?
I don't say the devil nor anything makes me to do anything but only because I choose to and I do not enjoy sinning while doing it, and I don't seek to sin and try to enjoy it as I used to. I do not believe I will return to my old life with gusto as you say, because I practice believing Jesus is the Christ and I am saved from that life of trying to sin as much as possible. And so I don't believe I am sinning with the devil anymore trying to be an enemy of God.Now this is certainly very interesting, and I've never quite heard it put this way. I do agree with the principle difference between loving to sin and hating to sin, but I always counted that as after the fact, because the pleasure of sinning is only for a sinning, and then comes the morning after.
Are you saying that while you are sinning, you are not enjoying it? What sinning are you talking about? Getting drunk? Fornicating? Stealing? I can believe it with the stealing, because Scripture speaks of how thieves can be almost excused for needing to eat. They don't like the stealing part, but do need to eat.
Do you have any Scripture that says enjoying sinning or not makes any difference to Jesus? Otherwise, you are adding your own interpretation of wilfilly sinning, rather than the simple one of doing something willingly, whether we like it or not, we are willing to do it. Not ignorantly.
However, there is this:
Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind.
Here we see willingly vs being forced into it, something we must do, but not really want to do, so in that case you could be correct, if you want to say the devil made me do it. You're doing it, but your heart and mind are not really in it.
I believe at least in part you may be right, in that Christians that sin can be doing so without gusto, although they can be the same for any sinner one earth.
It can also mean a Christian who has returned to the vomit like a dog all onboard for sinning again with abandonment of any pretense of the cross of Christ.
However, since sinning once with the devil is against God and has no forgiveness nor salvation, while willingly sinning, then the sacrifice of Christ to forgive sins is not present with that sinning soul that is, at that time, dead and separated from Christ.
I do agree you are correct at least about returning to our old life of all-out sinning, of liking it, loving it, and wanting more of it, without any regard to the will of the Lord.