Our hope for the Future

[rwb]

I know you'll probably disagree but the quotes don't say his first advent was the DoL. Acts 2:17-18 were fulfilled and are still happening. It's not mentioned until the last part of vs. 20 "after" speaking about the signs of the 6th seal which hasn't happened yet. They are the signs that the DoL is about to begin. Peter is simply quoting the whole prophecy to keep things in context, he is not saying the whole of that prophecy was fulfilled yet. The last part of Joel 2:32 won't happen until the millennial era. The remnant will be the 1/3 of Israel per Zech. 13:8-9.

You're conflating the two Day of the Lord events. The first Day of the Lord all the prophets foretell as not a single day, but TIME that came with the advent of Christ coming to earth a man. The Day of the Lord had a beginning and also has an end day, when Christ comes again one day, not as Savior, but as Judge. The thousand years equals TIME. This is the time we have been living in since the Messiah came, just as the prophets of old foretell He would. The sixth seal depicts what will happen on the last day of the Day of the Lord we are currently living in and is described as "the great day of His wrath".

Revelation 6:17 (KJV) For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

 

[jeffweeder]

The problem with that is the prophecy wasn't for us it was for national Israel. Yes, we have all that in Jesus but national Israel does not, yet, but they will. If they had kept on accepting Christ, on a national level, after the triumphant procession than vs. 24 would have been fulfilled but they didn't, hence the need for the gap. When they (national Israel) escort Jesus into Israel after Armageddon it will be the true triumphal procession and it is when "they will bring in everlasting righteousness" and the time when they will "anoint the most holy", who is Christ as King of Kings, Lord of Lords and the prophesied Messiah. They will finish the "national transgression, the end of "national sins" and make reconciliation for "national iniquity" when Zech. 12:10 and 13:8-9 are fulfilled.

Those of Israel who believe are already part of the Holy nation and the invitation is still open to them.
There cannot be any gaps in the 70 weeks as it is based on the jubilee calendar. The 6th day is always followed by the 7th and the 69th week is always followed by the 70th to complete the cycle. Impossible for there to be a gap in the calendar.

 

[quietthinker]

Our hope for the Future​

is centred in one Man!.......if it is not, there is no hope....even if one has or thinks one has all knowledge.

 

[Trekson]

You're conflating the two Day of the Lord events. The first Day of the Lord all the prophets foretell as not a single day, but TIME that came with the advent of Christ coming to earth a man. The Day of the Lord had a beginning and also has an end day, when Christ comes again one day, not as Savior, but as Judge. The thousand years equals TIME. This is the time we have been living in since the Messiah came, just as the prophets of old foretell He would. The sixth seal depicts what will happen on the last day of the Day of the Lord we are currently living in and is described as "the great day of His wrath".

Revelation 6:17 (KJV) For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Totally convoluted eschatology, imo.

 

[Trekson]

Those of Israel who believe are already part of the Holy nation and the invitation is still open to them.
There cannot be any gaps in the 70 weeks as it is based on the jubilee calendar. The 6th day is always followed by the 7th and the 69th week is always followed by the 70th to complete the cycle. Impossible for there to be a gap in the calendar.

Nothing is in impossible with God and I don't believe it is based on a jubilee calendar which is the first I've heard of that one. The 70th week was for Israel to accomplish something which they failed to do. God in his mercy is going to give them another chance and this one will be successful. No one who knows about prophecy believes the 70th week was completed "right after" the 69th and if they do then they need to go back to square one and try again.

 

[jeffweeder]

Nothing is in impossible with God and I don't believe it is based on a jubilee calendar which is the first I've heard of that one. The 70th week was for Israel to accomplish something which they failed to do. God in his mercy is going to give them another chance and this one will be successful. No one who knows about prophecy believes the 70th week was completed "right after" the 69th and if they do then they need to go back to square one and try again.

No Brother.
God created a new calendar in ex 12, based on the 7 days of creation. They were previously under the Egyptian way of looking at it.
Increments of seven with the 7 day week ending with sabbath rest. 70 years captivity exactly for the sabbath rest of the land they neglected. 70 WEEKS as the final solution that ended up with Jesus securing our eternal rest through his redemptive cross work.

 

[covenantee]

No one who knows about prophecy believes the 70th week was completed "right after" the 69th and if they do then they need to go back to square one and try again.

The historic orthodox Christian Church knew about it for 18 centuries. They were virtually unanimous in recognizing the fulfillment of the 70th week contiguous with the prior 69, with Christ and Calvary as the central themes.

The decapitation of the 70th week is a figment of modernist dispensational futurism spawned in the counterfeit counter-reformation of the historic apostate papacy.

 

[Truth7t7]

No Brother.
God created a new calendar in ex 12, based on the 7 days of creation. They were previously under the Egyptian way of looking at it.
Increments of seven with the 7 day week ending with sabbath rest. 70 years captivity exactly for the sabbath rest of the land they neglected. 70 WEEKS as the final solution that ended up with Jesus securing our eternal rest through his redemptive cross work.

Daniel 9:24-27, Seventy Literal Weeks Explained "Future"?

Daniel's 70 weeks are literal 7 day periods, or 490 literal days.

If Daniel meant 490 years he would have written

(Four Hundred Ninety Years)

Daniel had no restrictions in "Writing" exact numerology as seen below.

Daniel 6:1KJV
It pleased Darius to set over the kingdom an hundred and twenty princes, which should be over the whole kingdom;

Daniel 8:14KJV
And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

Daniel 12:11KJV
And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

Below in Daniel 10:2-3 we see just another example of Daniel's literal weeks, as Daniel mourned and fasted for 3 literal weeks or 21 days.

Daniel 10:2-3KJV
2 In those days I Daniel was mourning three full weeks.
3 I ate no pleasant bread, neither came flesh nor wine in my mouth, neither did I anoint myself at all, till three whole weeks were fulfilled.

Below in Daniel 9:24-27 we see 70 literal "Future" weeks or 490 days.

When the "Future" call/commandment goes out in Jerusalem to build unto the Jewish Meshiach/Messiah that they wait for (They Denied Jesus Christ) this will start the 7 week period in preparing to build.

62 literal weeks will be in building, and Meshiach/Messiah will be cut off by the armies surrounding Jerusalem, this stops the building.

The 70th literal week will see (The Antichrist) revealed in making a covenant, and in the middle of this literal week he proclaims to be Meshiach/Messiah God to the Jews, and Jesus returned to the apostate church, to start a Millennium on earth.

The 3.5 year tribulation starts at this time.

Daniel 9:24-27KJV
24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

 

[covenantee]

Daniel 9:24-27, Seventy Literal Weeks Explained "Future"?

Daniel's 70 weeks are literal 7 day periods, or 490 literal days.

If Daniel meant 490 years he would have written

(Four Hundred Ninety Years)

Daniel had no restrictions in "Writing" exact numerology as seen below.

Daniel 6:1KJV
It pleased Darius to set over the kingdom an hundred and twenty princes, which should be over the whole kingdom;

Daniel 8:14KJV
And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

Daniel 12:11KJV
And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

Below in Daniel 10:2-3 we see just another example of Daniel's literal weeks, as Daniel mourned and fasted for 3 literal weeks or 21 days.

Daniel 10:2-3KJV
2 In those days I Daniel was mourning three full weeks.
3 I ate no pleasant bread, neither came flesh nor wine in my mouth, neither did I anoint myself at all, till three whole weeks were fulfilled.

Below in Daniel 9:24-27 we see 70 literal "Future" weeks or 490 days.

When the "Future" call/commandment goes out in Jerusalem to build unto the Jewish Meshiach/Messiah that they wait for (They Denied Jesus Christ) this will start the 7 week period in preparing to build.

62 literal weeks will be in building, and Meshiach/Messiah will be cut off by the armies surrounding Jerusalem, this stops the building.

The 70th literal week will see (The Antichrist) revealed in making a covenant, and in the middle of this literal week he proclaims to be Meshiach/Messiah God to the Jews, and Jesus returned to the apostate church, to start a Millennium on earth.

The 3.5 year tribulation starts at this time.

Daniel 9:24-27KJV
24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Grammar.

 

[Keraz]

The decapitation of the 70th week is a figment of modernist dispensational futurism spawned in the counterfeit counter-reformation of the historic apostate papacy.

Your grammar is OK, your verbiage sucks.
That there will be a 7 year period ending with the Return of Jesus, is well proven from Daniels and Revelation Prophesies.
Disbelieve it if you must, but publicly deny it at the risk of being found in error.

 

[ewq1938]

Your grammar is OK, your verbiage sucks.
That there will be a 7 year period ending with the Return of Jesus, is well proven from Daniels and Revelation Prophesies.

Jesus said that time would be shortened so what was in Daniel is now shorter, and sure enough in Rev we see 42 months not 84 months. It's been cut in half.

 

[covenantee]

Your grammar is OK, your verbiage sucks.
That there will be a 7 year period ending with the Return of Jesus, is well proven from Daniels and Revelation Prophesies.
Disbelieve it if you must, but publicly deny it at the risk of being found in error.

Spoken like a good papist.

Francisco Ribera would be proud of you.

 

[Trekson]

No Brother.
God created a new calendar in ex 12, based on the 7 days of creation. They were previously under the Egyptian way of looking at it.
Increments of seven with the 7 day week ending with sabbath rest. 70 years captivity exactly for the sabbath rest of the land they neglected. 70 WEEKS as the final solution that ended up with Jesus securing our eternal rest through his redemptive cross work.

It's not called a jubilee calendar, it's based on a 360 day lunar cycle. The "jubilee" year was the 50th year. The number 70 has nothing to do w/ jubilee.

 

[Trekson]

The historic orthodox Christian Church knew about it for 18 centuries. They were virtually unanimous in recognizing the fulfillment of the 70th week contiguous with the prior 69, with Christ and Calvary as the central themes.

The decapitation of the 70th week is a figment of modernist dispensational futurism spawned in the counterfeit counter-reformation of the historic apostate papacy.

To your last sentence, baloney! Yes and they were unlearned for doing so. As the prophecy of Dan. 12:4 says knowledge, both spiritual and secular, will increase in the latter days. The church of today has a far greater understanding of prophecy than they did because most of it could not really be understood until it got closer to the generation it was written for. They had to make stuff up or use symbolism to try and explain what they didn't know.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Your way of thinking is carnal and earthly when it should be spiritual and heavenly. Your doctrine is sexist and completely ridiculous. It's not talking about being virgins sexually. Why would no women be included among a special large group of God's people? How ludicrous.

A commentary about the 144k in Rev. 7 by John MacArthur

"These Jewish believers and evangelists are the firstfruits of Israel, which as a nation will be redeemed before Christ returns (Zech. 12:10–13:1, 8–9; Rom. 11:26). The 144,000 are not all Jewish believers at that time, but a unique group selected to proclaim the gospel in that day (cf. 12:17; 14:1–5)​

Despite the plain and unambiguous declaration of the text that the one hundred and forty-four thousand who are to be sealed will come from every tribe of the sons of Israel, many persist in identifying them as the church. They cite several New Testament passages that allegedly identify the church as Israel to support that interpretation. But the identification of Israel with the church in those passages is tenuous and disputed. Thus, they can offer no support for such an identification in the present passage. The fact is that “no clear-cut example of the church being called ‘Israel’ exists in the NT or in ancient church writings until A.D. 160. … This fact is crippling to any attempt to identify Israel as the church in Rev. 7:4” (Robert L. Thomas, Revelation 1–7: An Exegetical Commentary [Chicago: Moody, 1992], 476). Further, “such an attempt becomes even more ridiculous because it necessitates typological interpretation that divides the church into twelve tribes to coincide with the listing of Rev. 7:5–8, even with all the irregularities in that list” (Thomas, Revelation 1–7, 476). The term Israel must be interpreted in accordance with its normal Old and New Testament usage as a reference to the physical descendants of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Nor is there any exegetical reason not to interpret the numbers 144,000 and 12,000 literally." John MacArthur​

 

[rwb]

Totally convoluted eschatology, imo.

And your opinion concerns me because?

 

[Truth7t7]

Spoken like a good papist.

Francisco Ribera would be proud of you.

Roman Catholic Jesuit Priest "Luis De Alcasar" would be proud of you

The Father Of Preterism That You Teach

 

[covenantee]

They had to make stuff up or use symbolism to try and explain what they didn't know.

Which is exactly what the father of futurism, Jesuit priest Francisco Ribera, did in an attempt to defeat the Reformation.

By God's grace and mercy, he failed.

But his deceptions found willing evangelists in modernist dispen/premil futurism.

It's time for another Reformation.

 

[covenantee]

Roman Catholic Jesuit Priest "Luis De Alcasar" would be proud of you

The Father Of Preterism That You Teach

Historicism rejects Alcazar.

But futurism embraces Ribera.

Your father.

 

[covenantee]

The term Israel must be interpreted in accordance with its normal Old and New Testament usage as a reference to the physical descendants of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

Apparently Bro. MacArthur forgot about the Gentiles who were always part of Israel.

Or was he just trying his best to ignore them?

Genesis 17:12
And he that is eight days old shall be circumcised among you, every man child in your generations, he that is born in the house, or bought with money of any stranger, which is not of thy seed.

Exodus 12:48
And when a stranger shall sojourn with thee, and will keep the passover to the Lord, let all his males be circumcised, and then let him come near and keep it; and he shall be as one that is born in the land: for no uncircumcised person shall eat thereof.

Exodus 12:49
One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you.

Leviticus 19:34
But the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.

Leviticus 24:22
Ye shall have one manner of law, as well for the stranger, as for one of your own country: for I am the Lord your God.