Johann
Well-Known Member
Did I say there is sin in Christ?
Correct you are, there is rampant confusion on this forum and I am not the confused one brother.
If we are sinless then we are god, yes?
J.
Heresy or error?
- Thread starter Episkopos
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Correct you are, there is rampant confusion on this forum and I am not the confused one brother.
If we are sinless then we are god, yes?
J.
For me... and I believe it should be for all of us.... growing is the thing:
| He must increase, but I must decrease." John 3:30 |
How long must this increasing and decreasing continue? How much time do we have?
How high up must we or should we increase? How high is God? How much like Him can we or should we become? The limit is Not in God but in us?
Johann
Well-Known Member
I fully concur, growing in Christ is the thing, have we reached absolute sinless perfection?
We BECOME more and more like/relative Christ, progressive sanctification, but we are NOT Christ nor little gods running around on this Forum, yes?
J.
Johann
Well-Known Member
The entire object of John's ministry is summarized in this verse. He labored ceaselessly to point men and women to the Lord, and to make them realize His true worth. In doing this, John realized that he must keep himself in the background. For a servant of Christ to seek to attract attention to himself is really a form of disloyalty.
Note the three “musts” in this chapter: for the Sinner (Joh_3:7); for the Savior (Joh_3:14); and for the Saint (3:30).
I am not here blowing my own trumpet brother, some here have "arrived" but I am still running this race, alone.
J.
Our goal should be to become more like Him as we continue to grow. Too many people reach a plateau and believe they can stop now on that plateau proceeding no further... just waiting for God to provide their final reward. This is I believe wrong if there is a place God higher than we are and there is time left to us.
If we were equal to God in all ways now, the stopping might be appropriate. For anyone not equal to God now, to stop, I believe, is to die if we are not dead already. Who is now equal to God?
Johann
Well-Known Member
...but you have it "altogether" no need for the Scriptures to teach you, nor the Holy Spirit, nor your sanctification walk, the progressive part, since you have attained what not even Paul dared to say.
Nicely done, you will go straight to heaven and no need to stand before the Judge.
J.
Johann
Well-Known Member
Noticed you don't answer my questions but you have a lot to say about the Puritans and Reformers.
You are out of your depth listening to your podcasts.
J.
Johann
Well-Known Member
Hope you will give this a listen since we have so much time and are commanded to redeem the little time given us.
Shalom
J.
If we may accept Paul's written words as truth he reach the end of his race before he wrote it down. Was that being equal to God was simply as high as he was going to go for the time allotted to him?
I have fought a good fight, I have finished my course, I have kept the faith
I have my belief on this things, but I do not insist. God knows the answers, but to whom and when does He reveal those answers? |
Johann
Well-Known Member
I do believe that the negative faith held by many bearing the label of Christian is their problem.
Had Paul attained that sinless perfection himself when he wrote those words I Time 4:7-8 I quote above? I do not know that answer, but not knowing I will not respond with a negative faith so as to say that God could not do it that way for Paul or for you or for me...!
| And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible." Mark 10:27 |
Is God in us, or is He not? If He is, what could stop from doing anything except you or me choosing to allow Him or not? Can a man stop or prevent or hinder God?
I am not, and I know of no one who is. In the ultimate sense no one, I believe, can be, which is why there is always room to grow close to Him. At the end of our race, how close to Him or how much like Him will we be? Of course, not knowing all of God's answers, how much is missing or incorrect in my this response of me to you?
Johann
Well-Known Member
Are you seeking to have a dialogue, with me, of all people?
Just want to make sure.
Johann
Well-Known Member
To begin with, Paul encouraged the Corinthians by his
personal prayers on their behalf (2 Cor. 13:9). The
word translated “wish” in the King James Version carries the meaning of “pray.”
Paul prayed for their
perfection, which does not mean absolute sinless perfection, but “spiritual maturity.” The word is part of a
word family in the Greek that means “to be fitted out,
to be equipped.” As a medical term, it means “to set a
broken bone, to adjust a twisted limb.” It also means
“to outfit a ship for a voyage” and “to equip an army for
battle.” In Matthew 4:21, it is translated “mending
nets.”
One of the ministries of our risen Lord is that of
perfecting His people (Heb. 13:20–21). He uses the
Word of God (2 Tim. 3:16–17) in the fellowship of the
local church (Eph. 4:11–16) to equip His people for
life and service. He also uses suffering as a tool to equip
us (1 Peter 5:10). As Christians pray for one another (1
Thess. 3:10) and personally assist one another (Gal.
6:1, where “restore” is this same word perfect), the
exalted Lord ministers to His church and makes them
fit for ministry.
2 Corinthians 13
542
Balanced Christian growth and ministry is impossible in isolation. Someone has said that you can no
more raise one Christian than you can raise one bee.
Christians belong to each other and need each other. A
baby must grow up in a loving family if it is to be balanced and normal. The emphasis today on the
individual Christian, as apart from his place in a local
assembly, is wrong and very dangerous. We are sheep,
and we must flock together. We are members of the
same body, and we must minister to one another.
In 2 Corinthians 13:10, Paul gave the Corinthians
a second encouragement—the Word of God. Paul
wrote this letter to meet the immediate needs of a local
congregation, but we today benefit from it because it is
a part of the inspired Word of God. This letter carries
the same authority as the presence of the apostle himself. Paul’s great desire was that the congregation’s
obedience to the letter solve their problems, so that he
would not have to exercise authority when he visited
them.
Sometimes the minister of the Word must tear
down before he can build up (see Jer. 1:7–10).
The
farmer must pull up the weeds before he can plant the
seeds and get a good crop. Paul had to tear down the
wrong thinking in the minds of the Corinthians (2
Cor. 10:4–6) before he could build up the truth in
their hearts and minds. The negative attitude of the
Corinthians made it necessary for Paul to destroy, but
his great desire was to build.
In my own ministry, I have been through two
building programs and two remodeling programs and,
in spite of all their demands, building programs to me
are much easier. It is much simpler and less expensive
to build a new structure on unimproved land than to
tear down walls and try to remodel an old building.
Likewise, it is much easier to take a new believer and
teach him the Word than it is to try to change the
wrong thinking of an older saint. Wrong ideas can hold
out against the truth for a long time, until the Spirit of
God demolishes the walls in the mind.
Paul encouraged the saints to cultivate grace, love,
and peace (2 Cor. 13:11–12). The word translated
“farewell” means “grace,” a common form of greeting
in that day. It can also be translated “rejoice.” The command be perfect relates to Paul’s prayer in 2 Corinthians
13:9 and carries the idea “be mature, be restored and
fitted for life.” Be of good comfort means “be encouraged.” In spite of all their sins and problems, they had
every right to be encouraged.
Live in peace was a needed admonition, for there
were divisions and dissensions in the church (see 2 Cor.
12:20). If they practiced love and sought to be of one
mind, the wars would cease and they would enjoy
peace in their fellowship. To be of one mind does not
mean that we all agree on everything, but that we agree
to disagree over matters that are not essential.
Our God is the “God of love and peace” (2 Cor.
13:11). Can the outside world tell that from the way
we live and the way we conduct the business of the
church? “Behold how they love one another!” was what
the lost world said about the early church, but it has
been a long time since the church has earned that kind
of commendation.
Since ancient times, the kiss has been a form of
greeting and a gesture of love and fellowship. However,
it was usually exchanged between members of the same
sex. The early church used the kiss of peace and kiss of
love as evidences of their affection and concern for one
another. It was a “holy kiss,” sanctified because of their
devotion to Jesus Christ. Members of the early church
often kissed new believers after their baptism and thus
welcomed them into the fellowship.
The everyday fellowship of God’s people is important to the church. We must greet each other in other
places as well as the fellowship of the assembly, and we
must show concern for each other. In giving this admonition in 2 Corinthians 13:12, Paul was certainly
hitting hard at one of the most serious problems in the
church: their division and lack of concern for one
another.
The closing benediction in 2 Corinthians 13:14 is
one of the most beloved used in the church. It emphasizes the Trinity (see Matt. 28:19) and the blessings we
can receive because we belong to God. The grace of our
Lord Jesus Christ reminds us of His birth, when He
became poor in order to make us rich (see 2 Cor. 8:9).
The love of God takes us to Calvary, where God gave
His Son as the sacrifice for our sins (John 3:16). The
communion of the Holy Ghost reminds us of Pentecost,
when the Spirit of God came and formed the church
(Acts 2).
The Corinthian believers then, and all believers
now, desperately needed the blessings of grace, love,
and communion. The Judaizers then, and the cultists
today, emphasized law instead of grace, exclusiveness
instead of love, and independence rather than communion (fellowship). The competition in the
Corinthian church, resulting in divisions, would have
been solved if the people had only lived by God’s grace
and love.
The church is a miracle, and it can be sustained
only by the miracle ministry of God. No amount of
human skill, talents, or programs can make the church
what it ought to be. Only God can do that. If each
believer is depending on the grace of God, walking in
the love of God, and participating in the fellowship of
the Spirit, not walking in the flesh, then he will be a
part of the answer and not a part of the problem. He
will be living this benediction—and being a benediction to others!
Ask God to make you that kind of Christian.
Be encouraged—and then encourage others.
Warren Wiersbe
Think he answered it well
You still have not answered my question re sanctification.
J.
Johann
Well-Known Member
I am edified by listening to RC as he talks about growth and sanctification and that we are not holy as we ought to be.
But then again, you don't have to listen as most here have a "negative faith" toward anything Reformed, but boy, the testimonies.
What I love about these boys is that they may disagree on some points but still have a deep love toward one another and play a "sanctified game of golf together"
You ask a lot of questions but the answers is in the video clips from God's word, but you refuse to listen.
Man, I love RC and these Irish boys.
J.
Johann
Well-Known Member
Our Lord’s own words in Luke 9:27 indicate that
the event was a demonstration (or illustration) of the
promised kingdom of God. This seems logical, for the
disciples were confused about the kingdom because of
Jesus’ words about the cross. (We must not be too hard
on them, because the prophets were also confused—1
Peter 1:10–12.) Jesus was reassuring them that the Old
Testament prophecies would be fulfilled, but first He
had to suffer before He could enter into His glory (note
especially 2 Peter 1:12–21).
But there is also a practical lesson here, for we can
have a spiritual “transfiguration” experience each day as
we walk with the Lord. Romans 12:1–2 and 2
Corinthians 3:18 tell us how. As we surrender body,
mind, and will, the Lord transforms us from within so
that we are not conformed to the world. As we behold
Him in the Word (the mirror), we are “transfigured” by
the Spirit “from glory to glory.”
The theological name
for this experience is sanctification, the process by
which we become more like the Lord Jesus Christ,
which is the Father’s goal for each of His children
(Rom. 8:19; 1 John 3:2). Note that our Lord was once
again praying, which suggests that prayer is one of the
keys to a transformed life.
Peter, James, and John had accompanied Jesus
when He raised Jairus’s daughter from the dead (Luke
8:51ff.), and they would accompany Him when He
prayed in the garden (Matt. 26:36–46). These three
occasions remind me of Philippians 3:10: “That I may
Luke 9
167
know him [the Transfiguration], and the power of his
resurrection [raising the girl], and the fellowship of his
sufferings [in the garden].”
This may well have been the greatest “Bible conference” ever held on earth! Even apart from the great
glory that was involved, here you certainly had the
greatest speakers: Moses, the law; Elijah, the prophets;
and Jesus, who came to fulfill the law and the prophets.
You had the greatest topic: Jesus’ “decease” (the Greek
is exodus) that He would accomplish at Jerusalem.
Moses had led Israel out of bondage to Egypt, and
Elijah had delivered them from bondage to false gods,
but Jesus would die to set a sinful world free from
bondage to sin and death (Gal. 1:4; Col. 1:13; Heb.
2:14–15).
WB
Note the progressive part of sanctification, this is "cut out" by these sinless perfectionists.
Yes?
Anymore questions?
J.
Similar threads
