New Covenant only for Jews?

[Adventageous]

Matt Slick (CARM) commits the same error repeatedly.

He has his own cult following, and is a non-sequitur. I debated him, on his own forum, in his own chat area, and he had to kick me and ban me permanently (we were discussing the state of the dead, which he agrees with Romanism on). I also sent him and Diane, several pages of materials on several of their incorrect positions (which, is also still currently held by Catholicism).

 

[Truth7t7]

As far back as mid 19th century, the bloke who shot Abraham Lincoln was smuggled out through Canada to Europe, and was discovered as one of those candy cane guards.

The standard story of Booth's demise is below, what source have you used to show otherwise?

How did Booth stay in hiding for so long?

Booth was able to escape Ford’s Theater alive, and he was on the run for 12 days, accompanied by another conspirator, David Herold. The pair went to the Surratt Tavern in Maryland, gathered supplies, went to see Dr. Mudd to have Booth’s broken leg set, and then headed through forest lands and swamps to Virginia. They were also aided by a former Confederate spy operative and by other Confederate sympathizers. Military forces were hot on their trail, and they found a person who directed them to a Virginia farm. At the Garrett Farm, Booth was fatally wounded, and Herold surrendered.

 

[Truth7t7]

And then more recently, there were warrants of arrest from all over Europe and America for the head of the Vatican bank back in the day. He was wanted for fraud, embezzlement, illegal international transactions, money laundering for the Mafia, falsifying documents etc. He was a bishop from memory, and never left as far as I know so was never indicted or faced a court.

Yep, and a 100 more accounts could be made of the 110 acre country at Vatican City, being a place of criminal refuge for the catholic church

 

[Adventageous]

For the SECOND time, paragraph 970 explains 969.
970 "Mary's function as mother of men in no way obscures or diminishes this unique mediation of Christ, but rather shows its power. But the Blessed Virgin's salutary influence on men . . . flows forth from the superabundance of the merits of Christ, rests on his mediation, depends entirely on it, and draws all its power from it."513 "No creature could ever be counted along with the Incarnate Word and Redeemer; but just as the priesthood of Christ is shared in various ways both by his ministers and the faithful, and as the one goodness of God is radiated in different ways among his creatures, so also the unique mediation of the Redeemer does not exclude but rather gives rise to a manifold cooperation which is but a sharing in this one source."514

I don't see how you can call this heresy and claim to be a Christian. How old are you? 9?

Heresy #1

"Mary's function as mother of men ..."​

​

The scripturual Mary was the mother of Jesus (Matthew 1:18; John 2:1,3, 19:25; Acts 1:14), not the "mother of men".​

​

Jesus, at Calvary, entrusted the care of Mary into the hands of a believer, John, and likewise he, to her (John 19:26-27); , knowing that James (John's older brother) was going to be martyred in a few years (Acts 12:2).​

​

Jesus actually stated that his "mother" and "brethren" were those who did His Father's will. Mary, and his step brothers (sons of Joseph by a previous wife) were outside (at the time), not inside learning, and were attempting to get Jesus to stop teaching, because of the claims of the religious 'leaders', the Pharisees (previous verses).​

​

Mat 12:46 While he yet talked to the people, behold, his mother and his brethren stood without, desiring to speak with him.​

Mat 12:47 Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee.​

Mat 12:48 But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren?​

Mat 12:49 And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren!​

Mat 12:50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.​

​

Mar 3:31 There came then his brethren and his mother, and, standing without, sent unto him, calling him.​

Mar 3:32 And the multitude sat about him, and they said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren without seek for thee.​

Mar 3:33 And he answered them, saying, Who is my mother, or my brethren?​

Mar 3:34 And he looked round about on them which sat about him, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren!​

Mar 3:35 For whosoever shall do the will of God, the same is my brother, and my sister, and mother.​

​

Mary was quite misled by the elder sons of Joseph and the Pharisees at the time.​

Heresy #2

"... the Blessed Virgin ..."​

​

Mary was once a "virgin" (Genesis 3:15; Isaiah 7:14; Matthew 1:23; Luke 1:27, also a reference to the city, even people of God (2 Kings 19:21; Isaiah 37:22, 62:5; Jeremiah 14:17, 18:13; 2 Corinthians 11:2; Revelation 12:1-6, &c), not merely the single woman), but after giving birth to Jesus, she continued her marriage (bed; Hebrews 13:4) relationship with Joseph (Matthew 1:23-25), as is the right, love and duty of the married (1 Corinthians 7:4-5; Ephesians 5:22-33). When the Romanist says, "Blesssed Virgin", they do not merely mean Mary's original state (of sexual purity), but include their ideology of 'perpetual virginity' of their 'Mary'. This is not only unscriptural, heretical, and paganistic (goddess theology), but also, dangerous.​

Heresy #3

"... salutary influence ..."​

​

"salutary (adj.)​

​

"wholesome, healthful, healing," late 15c. (Caxton), from Old French salutaire "beneficial," or directly from Latin salutaris "healthful," from salus (genitive salutis) "good health" (from PIE root *sol- "whole, well-kept"). By 19c. also in a general sense, "contributing to some beneficial purpose." Earlier as a noun, salutari, "a remedy," (early 15c.), from Latin salutaris (n.)." - salutary | Etymology, origin and meaning of salutary by etymonline​

​

The real Mary is dead, and buried somewhere around Jerusalem (probably in some area of John's family), and remains there (not in Heaven), until her resurrection at the second Advent of Jesus (Job 14:10-21; John 14:1-4; 1 Thessalonians 4:15-16). She can have no influence upon anyone, except as an example in certain areas as written in scripture, just like anyone else written therein, as impressed by the Holy Ghost/Spirit.​

​

Therefore, who is the 'angel (messenger) of light' of Rome that is called an 'apparition'? Well scripture tells us:​

​

2Co_11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.​

​

Rev_16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.​

So, what did Lucia (of 'Fatima') originally see? She claimed to have seen a glowing angel ("He told them, “Do not be afraid. I am the angel of peace. Pray with me.” - "Do not be afraid. I am the angel of peace. Pray with me." - Google Search). After the first deception, came the next, another 'familiar spirit' masquerading as in the days of King Saul.​

 

[Adventageous]

For the SECOND time, paragraph 970 explains 969.
970 "Mary's function as mother of men in no way obscures or diminishes this unique mediation of Christ, but rather shows its power. But the Blessed Virgin's salutary influence on men . . . flows forth from the superabundance of the merits of Christ, rests on his mediation, depends entirely on it, and draws all its power from it."513 "No creature could ever be counted along with the Incarnate Word and Redeemer; but just as the priesthood of Christ is shared in various ways both by his ministers and the faithful, and as the one goodness of God is radiated in different ways among his creatures, so also the unique mediation of the Redeemer does not exclude but rather gives rise to a manifold cooperation which is but a sharing in this one source."514

I don't see how you can call this heresy and claim to be a Christian. How old are you? 9?

Fashioning weapons from the catechism to attack the Church the way do is a form of witchcraft, IMO. Matt Slick (CARM) commits the same error repeatedly. Next time you quote the catechism, provide a link to the page, like this:

Catechism of the Catholic Church - PART 1 SECTION 2 CHAPTER 3 ARTICLE 9 PARAGRAPH 6

www.scborromeo.org

That way you can avoid taking ONE paragraph out of context, a bad habit committed by uncharitable anti-Catholics.

Heresy #4

Mary as Mediatrix, or Redemptrix, the "Virgo Sacerdos":

"O Mary, Mother of Mercy,
Mother and Daughter of Him who is the Father of mercies
and the God of all consolation (1),
Dispensatrix of all the treasures of thy Son (2),
Minister of God (3),
Mother of Christ, our High Priest,
thou who art both Offerer and Altar together, (4),
Immaculate Temple of the Word of God (5),
Teacher of the Apostles and Disciples of Christ (6),
protect the Supreme Pontiff,
intercede for us and for our priests,
that Jesus Christ the Eternal High Priest
may purify our consciences,
and that we may worthily, and with loving devotion,
approach His sacred banquet.
O Immaculate Virgin,
who not only hast given us Christ the heavenly bread
for the forgiveness of sins (7),
but who art thyself a most acceptable sacrifice offered unto God” (8),
and the glory of priests (9),
and who, as thy most blessed servant Saint Antoninius declares,
“without receiving the Sacrament of Order,
wert full of whatsoever in dignity and grace is given by it”,
thou art therefore rightly acclaimed as “Sacerdotal Virgin” (10).
Look upon us and upon the priests of thy Son,
save us, purify us, and sanctify us,
that we may receive the ineffable treasures of the Sacraments
in a holy manner
and so deserve to obtain
the eternal salvation of our souls. Amen.
Mother of Mercy, pray for us.
Mother of Jesus Christ, the Eternal Priest, pray for us.
Queen of the Clergy, pray for us.
Mary, Sacerdotal Virgin, pray for us."



The "yoni" (female opening) surrounds her, as it does in many images, of 'Mary', and 'Jesus' in Roman Catholicism.





Roman Catholicism has their 'Mary' wearing the 12 Gemstone Breastplate of the Highpriest, with the 7 Branch Shepherd's Rod in her hand, and priestly garments. However, notice the horns of the dragon above on her head. It is where women's ordination to priesthood stems from. It is originally a Roman Catholic doctrine, borrowed from earlier paganism.

“969 "This motherhood of Mary in the order of grace continues uninterruptedly from the consent which she loyally gave at the Annunciation and which she sustained without wavering beneath the cross, until the eternal fulfillment of all the elect. Taken up to heaven she did not lay aside this saving office but by her manifold intercession continues to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation . ... Therefore the Blessed Virgin is invoked in the Church under the titles of Advocate, Helper, Benefactress, and Mediatrix."512” [The Catechism of the [Roman] Catholic Church; Online section 969] - 404 Resource at /content/dam/wss/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p123a9p6.htm not found

 

[Adventageous]

For the SECOND time, paragraph 970 explains 969.
...

““... If We have spent so large a share of our activities, in promoting the Rosary devotion, We can easily see with what benevolence the Queen of Heaven has come to Our aid when We prayed to her; and We express the confident conviction that she will continue to stand at Our side to lighten the burdens and the afflictions which the days to come will bring. …

... She was, in very truth, the Mother of the Church, the Teacher and Queen of the Apostles …

... 8. The power thus put into her hands is all but unlimited. How unerringly right, then, are Christian souls when they turn to Mary for help as though impelled by an instinct of nature, confidently sharing with her their future hopes and past achievements, their sorrows and joys, commending themselves like children to the care of a bountiful mother. How rightly, too, has every nation and every liturgy without exception acclaimed her great renown, which has grown greater with the voice of each succeeding century. Among her many other titles we find her hailed as "our Lady, our Mediatrix,"[3] "the Reparatrix of the whole world,"[4] "the Dispenser of all heavenly gifts."[5] …

... 9. ... "O Virgin most holy, none abounds in the knowledge of God except through thee; none, O Mother of God, attains salvation except through thee; none receives a gift from the throne of mercy except through thee."[7] …

… 10. It is no exaggeration to say that it is due chiefly to her leadership and help that the wisdom and teachings of the Gospel spread so rapidly to all the nations of the world in spite of the most obstinate difficulties and most cruel persecutions, and brought everywhere in their train a new reign of justice and peace. This it was that stirred the soul of St. Cyril of Alexandria to the following prayerful address to the Blessed Virgin: "Through you the Apostles have preached salvation to the nations. . . through you the priceless Cross is everywhere honored and venerated; through you the demons have been put to rout and mankind has been summoned back to Heaven; through you every misguided creature held in the thrall of idols is led to recognize the truth; through you have the faithful been brought to the laver of holy Baptism and churches been founded among every people."[8] …

… 13. No one will fail to remark how much the merits of the venerable Fathers and Doctors of the Church, who spent their lives in the defense and explanation of the Catholic Faith, redound to the Virgin Mother of God. For from her, the Seat of Divine Wisdom, as they themselves gratefully tell us, a strong current of the most sublime wisdom has coursed through their writings. And they were quick to acknowledge that not by themselves but by her have iniquitous errors been overcome. Finally, princes as well as Pontiffs, the guardians and defenders of the faith-the former by waging holy wars, the latter by the solemn decrees which they have issued- have not hesitated to call upon the name of the Mother of our God, and have found her answer powerful and propitious.

14. Hence it is that the Church and the Fathers have given expression to their joy in Mary in words whose beauty equals their truth: "Hail, voice of the Apostles forever eloquent, solid foundation of the faith,unshakable prop of the Church."[10] "Hail, thou through whom we have been enrolled as citizens of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church."[11]"Hail, thou fountain springing forth by God's design, whose rivers flowing over in pure and unsullied waves of orthodoxy put to flight the hosts of error."[12] "Rejoice, because thou alone hast destroyed all the heresies in the world."[13] …

… 15. The unexampled part which the Virgin most admirably played and still plays in the progress, the battles, and the triumphs of the Catholic Faith, makes it evident what God has planned for her to do. It should fill the hearts of all good people with a firm hope of obtaining those things which are now the object of our common desire. Trust Mary, implore her aid.

16. That the one self same profession of faith may unite the minds of Christian nations in peace and harmony, that the one and only bond of perfect charity may gather their hearts within its embrace-such is our prayerful hope! And may Mary, by her powerful help, bring this ardently desired gift into our possession! And remembering that her only begotten Son prayed so earnestly to His heavenly Father for the closest union among the nations whom He has called by the one Baptism to the one inheritance of salvation bought for an infinite price, will she not, for that reason, see to it that all in His marvelous light will strive as with one mind for unity? And will it not be her wish to employ her goodness and providence to console the Spouse of Christ, the Church, through her long-sustained efforts in this enterprise, as well as to bring to full perfection the boon of unity among the members of the Christian family, which is the illustrious fruit of her motherhood? …

 

[Adventageous]

For the SECOND time, paragraph 970 explains 969.
...

...
… 17. A token that the fulfillment of these hopes may soon be a reality is to be seen in the conviction and the confidence which warms the hearts of the devout. Mary will be the happy bond to draw together, with strong yet gentle constraint, all who love Christ, no matter where they may be, to form a nation of brothers yielding obedience to the Vicar of Christ on earth, the Roman Pontiff, their common Father. …

… 21. There is another special reason why Mary will be favorably disposed to grant our united prayers in behalf of the nations cut off from communion with the Church: namely, the prodigious things they have done for her honor in the past, especially in the East. To them is due much of the credit for propagating and increasing devotion to her. From them have come some of the best- remembered heralds and champions of her dignity, who have wielded a mighty influence by their authority or by their writings-eulogists famed for the ardor and the charm of their eloquence;"empresses well beloved of God,"[16] who imitated the Virgin most pure in the example of their lives, and paid honor to her with lavish generosity; temples and basilicas built to her glory with regal splendor. …

… 25. The very origin of the Rosary makes that plain. When such faith is exercised by vocally repeating the Our Father and Hail Mary of the Rosary prayers, or better still in the contemplation of the mysteries, it is evident how close we are brought to Mary. For every time we devoutly say the Rosary in supplication before her, we are once more brought face to face with the marvel of our salvation; we watch the mysteries of our Redemption as though they were unfolding before our eyes; and as one follows another, Mary stands revealed at once as God's Mother and our Mother. …

… 27. For that reason We say that the Rosary is by far the best prayer by which to plead before her the cause of our separated brethren. To grant a favorable hearing belongs properly to her office of spiritual Mother. …

… 30. On the strength of this it has been decided to begin work on a scale proportioned to the size of the undertaking, and We have granted permission for the laying of the first stone of the shrine at an early date with solemn ceremonies. The temple will stand as a monument of ever lasting thanksgiving erected in the name of the Christian people to their heavenly Helper and Mother. There she will be invoked unceasingly in the Greek and the Latin rites that, ever more propitious, she will continue to heap new favors upon the ancient blessings. ...” [ADIUTRICEM (Benefactress) (On The Rosary); ENCYCLICAL OF POPE LEO XIII ON THE ROSARY; SEPTEMBER 5, 1895] - On the Rosary or Adiutricem (September 5, 1895) | LEO XIII

“The gesture with which Christ confided his disciple to his Mother and his Mother to the disciple (16) has defined an extremely close relationship between Mary and the Church. It is the will of the Lord that a Marian note mark the physiognomy of the Church, her road, her pastoral activity; and into the spiritual life of each disciple a "Marian dimension" is infused (17).” …

… Every priest knows that Mary, because she is a mother, is the eminent formator of the priesthood, since she is the one who knows how to shape the priestly heart; the Virgin, therefore, knows and wants to protect priests from dangers, exhaustion, and discouragement: with motherly solicitude she watches over the priest so that he may grow in wisdom, age, and grace before God and before men (34). …

...Finally, Mary is the "offering Virgin." The Church has perceived in the heart of the Virgin who carried the Child to Jerusalem to present him to the Lord, a willing oblation that transcended the ordinary meaning of the rite (51). "You offer your Son, Holy Virgin, and you present to the Lord the blessed fruit of your womb. You offer the holy victim, pleasing to God, for the reconciliation of us all" (St Bernard). …

...This union of the Mother with the Son in the work of redemption reaches its culmination at Calvary, where Christ "offered himself, immaculate, to God" (52) and where Mary was beside the cross (53) suffering deeply with her Only Son and associating herself with motherly courage to his sacrifice, adhering lovingly to the immolation of the Victim engendered by her and offering herself as well to the Eternal Father. To perpetuate throughout the centuries the Sacrifice of the Cross, the Savior instituted the Eucharistic Sacrifice, memorial of his death and resurrection, and he confided it to his Spouse, the Church... who accomplishes it in union with the Saints in Heaven and, in the first place, with the blessed Virgin, whose ardent charity and unshakable faith she imitates (54).

Therefore the Church, with this same oblationary fervor and spirit lived by Mary, continually exhorts the priest to prepare himself and celebrate the Eucharist, center and summit of his interior life and apostolate. May his priestly hands elevate the consecrated bread and wine, Body and Blood of the Lord, just as Mary offered him as a child in the Temple, and having consummated the redemption at the foot of the cross, may he return it to the Father as an expiatory offering for our sins. …

...Priestly formation, finally, has an active dimension oriented to pastoral action. The figure of Mary, her operative presence in the life of the Church, is recognized as the soul of every apostolic or pastoral work. Her spirit of service inspires the priestly ministry as an expression of love and as a response to a received gift. The pastoral challenges of our times demand action inspired by Mary's life.” [Conference of Mons. Norberto Rivera, Archbishop, Primate of Mexico; THE BLESSED VIRGIN MARY IN THE LIFE AND MINISTRY OF THE PRIEST] - THE BLESSED VIRGIN MARY IN THE LIFE AND MINISTRY OF THE PRIEST

The qualifications for priesthood in the OT, and Eldership (Bishoprick, Presbyter) in the NT are clear. Male, not female.

 

[Illuminator]

Why does it say the "New Covenant" Jesus made is only for the Jews?

Hebrews 8:8 - But God found fault with the people and said: “The days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and with the people of Judah.

4. As the sacred synod searches into the mystery of the Church, it remembers the bond that spiritually ties the people of the New Covenant to Abraham's stock.

Thus the Church of Christ acknowledges that, according to God's saving design, the beginnings of her faith and her election are found already among the Patriarchs, Moses and the prophets. She professes that all who believe in Christ-Abraham's sons according to faith (6)-are included in the same Patriarch's call, and likewise that the salvation of the Church is mysteriously foreshadowed by the chosen people's exodus from the land of bondage. The Church, therefore, cannot forget that she received the revelation of the Old Testament through the people with whom God in His inexpressible mercy concluded the Ancient Covenant. Nor can she forget that she draws sustenance from the root of that well-cultivated olive tree onto which have been grafted the wild shoots, the Gentiles.(7) Indeed, the Church believes that by His cross Christ, Our Peace, reconciled Jews and Gentiles. making both one in Himself.(8)

The Church keeps ever in mind the words of the Apostle about his kinsmen: "theirs is the sonship and the glory and the covenants and the law and the worship and the promises; theirs are the fathers and from them is the Christ according to the flesh" (Rom. 9:4-5), the Son of the Virgin Mary. She also recalls that the Apostles, the Church's main-stay and pillars, as well as most of the early disciples who proclaimed Christ's Gospel to the world, sprang from the Jewish people.

As Holy Scripture testifies, Jerusalem did not recognize the time of her visitation,(9) nor did the Jews in large number, accept the Gospel; indeed not a few opposed its spreading.(10) Nevertheless, God holds the Jews most dear for the sake of their Fathers; He does not repent of the gifts He makes or of the calls He issues-such is the witness of the Apostle.(11) In company with the Prophets and the same Apostle, the Church awaits that day, known to God alone, on which all peoples will address the Lord in a single voice and "serve him shoulder to shoulder" (Soph. 3:9).(12)

Since the spiritual patrimony common to Christians and Jews is thus so great, this sacred synod wants to foster and recommend that mutual understanding and respect which is the fruit, above all, of biblical and theological studies as well as of fraternal dialogues.

True, the Jewish authorities and those who followed their lead pressed for the death of Christ;(13) still, what happened in His passion cannot be charged against all the Jews, without distinction, then alive, nor against the Jews of today. Although the Church is the new people of God, the Jews should not be presented as rejected or accursed by God, as if this followed from the Holy Scriptures. All should see to it, then, that in catechetical work or in the preaching of the word of God they do not teach anything that does not conform to the truth of the Gospel and the spirit of Christ.

Furthermore, in her rejection of every persecution against any man, the Church, mindful of the patrimony she shares with the Jews and moved not by political reasons but by the Gospel's spiritual love, decries hatred, persecutions, displays of anti-Semitism, directed against Jews at any time and by anyone.

Besides, as the Church has always held and holds now, Christ underwent His passion and death freely, because of the sins of men and out of infinite love, in order that all may reach salvation. It is, therefore, the burden of the Church's preaching to proclaim the cross of Christ as the sign of God's all-embracing love and as the fountain from which every grace flows.

footnotes:
6. Cf. Gal. 3:
7. Cf. Rom. 11:17-24
8. Cf. Eph. 2:14-16
9. Cf. Lk. 19:44
10. Cf. Rom. 11:28
11. Cf. Rom. 11:28-29; cf. dogmatic Constitution, Lumen Gentium (Light of nations) AAS, 57 (1965) pag. 20
12. Cf. Is. 66:23; Ps. 65:4; Rom. 11:11-32
13. Cf. John. 19:6

Nostra aetate

Declaration on the Relation of the Church to non-christian religions - Nostra aetate

www.vatican.va

​

 

[BreadOfLife]

Exactly. Thank you. The "pope" is "VICAR" according to the Magisterium of Rome, which, stemming from the Latin, means:

“Vicar (Latin vicarius, from vice, “instead of”) ...” [Online Catholic Encyclopedia, Vicar] - CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Vicar

"Meaning of instead of in English​

instead of​

preposition​

us​

/ɪnˈsted ˌəv/ uk​

/ɪnˈsted ˌəv/​

in place of someone or something: ..." - instead of​

“... anti ... (in the place of…” [Roman Catholic Online Encyclopedia; "S"; "Sacrifice"] - CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Sacrifice

Therefore "VICAR ... of Christ" (aka Vicarius Christi), as you (BoL) put it succinctly, actually means "anti christ".

“Vicar of Christ (Latin Vicarius Christi). ... thus, Innocent III appeals for his power to remove bishops to the fact that he is Vicar of Christ (cap. "Inter corporalia", 2, "De trans. ep."). ... and states that it is the Roman Pontiff who is "the successor of Peter and the Vicar of Jesus Christ" (cap. "Licet", 4, ibid.). The title Vicar of God used for the pope by Nicholas III (c. "Fundamenta ejus", 17, "De elect.", in 6) is employed as an equivalent for Vicar of Christ” [Online Catholic Encyclopedia, Vicar of Christ] - CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Vicar of Christ

“But since We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty, ...” [“The Great Encyclical Letters of Pope Leo XIII”, Encyclical Letter June 20, 1894; Praeclara Gratulationis Publicae - Papal Encyclicals] - Praeclara Gratulationis Publicae - Papal Encyclicals

“...It will be enough, however, to refer to the evidence contained in the epistles of St. Ignatius, Bishop of Antioch, himself a disciple of the Apostles. In these epistles (about A.D. 107) he again and again asserts that the supremacy of the bishop is of Divine institution and belongs to the Apostolic constitution of the Church. He goes so far as to affirm that the bishop stands in the place of Christ Himself. ...” [Roman Catholic Online Encyclopedia; "C"; "Church"] - CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: The Church

“...Supreme Pontiff, Vicar of Jesus Christ on earth...” [Roman Catholic Online Library; Church Documents; "Ad Sinarum Gentem (1954)"; Point 11.] - CATHOLIC LIBRARY: Ad Sinarum Gentem (1954)

“...We, indeed, to all men are the Vicar of Christ, the Son of God...” [Roman Catholic Online Library; Church Documents; "In Plurimis (1888)"; Point 2.] - CATHOLIC LIBRARY: In Plurimis (1888)

Cherry-picking gets you NOWHERE but confused . . .

Here is the full CONTEXT of Pope Leo XIII’s Encyclical Letter Praeclara Gratulationis Publicae., which was a call for the reunion of the Eastern and Wester Church.

"But since We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty, who will have all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth, and now that Our advanced age and the bitterness of anxious cares urge Us on towards the end common to every mortal, We feel drawn to follow the example of Our Redeemer and Master, Jesus Christ, who when about to return to Heaven, implored of God, His Father, in earnest prayer, that His disciples and followers should be of one mind and of one heart: "I pray...that they all may be one, as thou Father in Me, and I in Thee: that they also may be one in Us."

IF the Pope identifies himself as GOD, then WHY did he refer to the Lord Jesus as "Our Redeemer and Master?" God doesn’t have a master, Einstein.
A representative HOLDS the place of his superior - he doesn't USURP it - he doesn't

Merriam Webster’s Collegiate Dictionary
Vicar
noun
vic·ar ˈvi-kər
one serving as a substitute or agent
specifically : an administrative deputy

The “Vicar” of Christ is His Chief representative (Chief Agent)

- As Christ’s Chief representative – Peter and Peter the Keys to the kingdom of Heaven.

- Peter and Peter ALONE was asked by Jesus to “strengthen his brothers” (Luke 22:31) and bring them back to faith.

- Peter and Peter ALONE was asked by Jesus to, “Feed my lambs”, “Tend my sheep lambs”, and “Feed my sheep”.

You;/’re a cherry-picker – not a love of TRUTH.

 

[BreadOfLife]

The topic isn't about what Catholics believe their Pope to be. It's about what the magisterium teaches their Pope to be, and what various church doctors teach the Pope to be, in this case, Cardinal Bellarmine. And @BreadOfLife , it's irrelevant where one finds the quote when the quote is accurate. What you need to show is whether the pictures of Bellarmine's book as shown in the post above, is real or not. If real, then doesn't that require an explanation? You continue to exercise your prerogative to be indignant at our right to ask questions, and complain that we misunderstand, misquote, misapply etc etc, but you fail miserably to explain what he did actually mean.

And YOU are a flat-out LIAR.
`
I DID explain what Bellarmine was saying in post #970:

"The quote AND THE CONTEXT in which it appears can be found in chapter 17, entitled Summum Pontificem absolute esse supra Concilium:

Bellarmine was positing that
1 - it follows that the Pope is over the Council, and over the Church, not the other way around. It is proved by the second reason, based in Scripture: for all the names, ascribed to Christ in Scripture, from which it is determined that he is over the Church—those same names are ascribed to the Pontiff.

2 - And first, Christ is the paterfamilias (male head of the household) in his own house, which is the Church.
The Pope is the highest steward in the same house, that is, the household head in Christ’s place, per Luke 12:
The CONTEXT of Bellarmine’s word indicate that Pope is the VICAR (Chief Stewrd) of Christ – and NOT Christ Himself."

 

[covenantee]

Bellarmine was positing that
1 - it follows that the Pope is over the Council, and over the Church, not the other way around. It is proved by the second reason, based in Scripture: for all the names, ascribed to Christ in Scripture, from which it is determined that he is over the Church—those same names are ascribed to the Pontiff.

So you now admit that this was an actual declaration, authored by Bellarmine.

Which of the following names are "ascribed to the Pontiff"?

Isaiah 9
6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

 

[Philip James]

The kings and princes were Herod, Caiaphas, and Pilate.

Heya Brakelite how ya been?

Really? Let's try that..

Why do the nations protest and the peoples grumble in vain?

(Kings on earth) Herod and Caeser rise up and (princes) Caiaphas and Pilate plot together against the LORD and his anointed:

"Let us break their shackles and cast off their chains!"

What chains and shackles are they casting off? When were any of these pledged to serve Him? What yoke on the 'nations and peoples' made them grumble against Him?

Help me out with what you're suggesting here..

Pax et Bonum

 

[BreadOfLife]

So you now admit that this was an actual declaration, authored by Bellarmine.

Which of the following names are "ascribed to the Pontiff"?

Isaiah 9
6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

NO, it was always a natter of CONTEXT - which you rejected.
You cherry-picked a statement that was completely OUT of CONTXT.
Your position is as stupid as if I were to hold YOU accountable for saying, “The ENTIRE town came to see the parade.”

Matt. 2:3 explicitly says that when he heard about the birth of Jesus from the Magi, Herod “was disturbed, and ALL JERUSALEM Jerusalem with him.

So, EVERY deaf-mute, every elderly person with dementia, every infasnt was “disturbed”? OR, is that just YOU ignoring the CONTEXT?

Another great example of your ineptitude is Rom 3:10, where it explicitly states:
Rom. 3:10
“There is no one righteous, not even one;

This verse is taken from Psalm 14, where it states the same in verse 1.
4 verses later, however, it says that “God is present in the company of the righteous.
Is this a contradictory statement – OR is it just YOUR ineptitude and failure to understand the CONTEXT?

Psalm 14:1 says:
The fool says in his heart, “There is no God.” They are corrupt, their deeds are vile; there is no one who does good. s

By YOUR idiotic cherry-picking standards – can we conclude that God DOESN’T exist?

The Lesson here is:
When you ignore CONTEXT – you magnify your ignorance . . .

 

[Philip James]

"O Mary, Mother of Mercy,
Mother and Daughter of Him who is the Father of mercies
and the God of all consolation (1),
Dispensatrix of all the treasures of thy Son (2),
Minister of God (3),
Mother of Christ, our High Priest,
thou who art both Offerer and Altar together, (4),
Immaculate Temple of the Word of God (5),
Teacher of the Apostles and Disciples of Christ (6),
protect the Supreme Pontiff,
intercede for us and for our priests,
that Jesus Christ the Eternal High Priest
may purify our consciences,
and that we may worthily, and with loving devotion,
approach His sacred banquet.
O Immaculate Virgin,
who not only hast given us Christ the heavenly bread
for the forgiveness of sins (7),
but who art thyself a most acceptable sacrifice offered unto God” (8),
and the glory of priests (9),
and who, as thy most blessed servant Saint Antoninius declares,
“without receiving the Sacrament of Order,
wert full of whatsoever in dignity and grace is given by it”,
thou art therefore rightly acclaimed as “Sacerdotal Virgin” (10).
Look upon us and upon the priests of thy Son,
save us, purify us, and sanctify us,
that we may receive the ineffable treasures of the Sacraments
in a holy manner
and so deserve to obtain
the eternal salvation of our souls. Amen.
Mother of Mercy, pray for us.
Mother of Jesus Christ, the Eternal Priest, pray for us.
Queen of the Clergy, pray for us.
Mary, Sacerdotal Virgin, pray for us."

Amen!

 

[covenantee]

NO, it was always a natter of CONTEXT - which you rejected.
You cherry-picked a statement that was completely OUT of CONTXT.
Your position is as stupid as if I were to hold YOU accountable for saying, “The ENTIRE town came to see the parade.”

Matt. 2:3 explicitly says that when he heard about the birth of Jesus from the Magi, Herod “was disturbed, and ALL JERUSALEM Jerusalem with him.

So, EVERY deaf-mute, every elderly person with dementia, every infasnt was “disturbed”? OR, is that just YOU ignoring the CONTEXT?

Another great example of your ineptitude is Rom 3:10, where it explicitly states:
Rom. 3:10
“There is no one righteous, not even one;

This verse is taken from Psalm 14, where it states the same in verse 1.
4 verses later, however, it says that “God is present in the company of the righteous.
Is this a contradictory statement – OR is it just YOUR ineptitude and failure to understand the CONTEXT?

Psalm 14:1 says:
The fool says in his heart, “There is no God.” They are corrupt, their deeds are vile; there is no one who does good. s

By YOUR idiotic cherry-picking standards – can we conclude that God DOESN’T exist?

The Lesson here is:
When you ignore CONTEXT – you magnify your ignorance . . .

Why are you afraid to answer the question?


Which of the following names are "ascribed to the Pontiff"?

Isaiah 9
6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.


I'll tell why you're afraid to answer the question.

It's called spiritual stupor and craven cowardice.

I defy you to prove me wrong.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Why are you afraid to answer the question?

Which of the following names are "ascribed to the Pontiff"?

Isaiah 9
6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

Because it's an idiotic question based ib a FALSE premise.
I've already explained to you in FOUR posts, that this quote was taken OUT of context.

At this point - I just have to assume that you don't have a CLUE as to what "Context" means . . .

I'll tell why you're afraid to answer the question.
It's called spiritual stupor and craven cowardice.
I defy you to prove me wrong.

I already HAVE - to anyone reading this who has HALF a brain , , ,

 

[covenantee]

Because it's an idiotic question based ib a FALSE premise.
I've already explained to you in FOUR posts, that this quote was taken OUT of context.

At this point - I just have to assume that you don't have a CLUE as to what "Context" means . . .

I already HAVE - to anyone reading this who has HALF a brain , , ,

You can context all you want. No amount of context can evade what Bellarmine declared.

Ascribing the names of Christ to anyone else, pontiff or otherwise, is the epitome of the abomination of desecration.

Spiritual stupor and craven cowardice are the quintessence of what you are purveying.

 

[Illuminator]

You can context all you want. No amount of context can evade what Bellarmine declared.

Context disproves what you want to think what Bellarmine declared. Made-in-America cults, radical fundamentalist, and Calvinoid cult leader Matt Slick uses the same tactics. and it's because you have an axe to grind in the first place.

Ascribing the names of Christ to anyone else, pontiff or otherwise, is the epitome of the abomination of desecration.

I agree, but Bellarmine is using the names of Christ in the representative sense, not in the literal sense, which you refuse to understand.

Spiritual stupor and craven cowardice are the quintessence of what you are purveying.

No Pope has ever declared himself to be God Almighty, a blasphemous lie you are purveying, in a spiritual stupor and craven cowardice, afraid of the evidence presented by BofL.

​

 

[Adventageous]

Cherry-picking gets you NOWHERE but confused . . .

Here is the full CONTEXT of Pope Leo XIII’s Encyclical Letter Praeclara Gratulationis Publicae., which was a call for the reunion of the Eastern and Wester Church.

"But since We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty, who will have all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth, and now that Our advanced age and the bitterness of anxious cares urge Us on towards the end common to every mortal, We feel drawn to follow the example of Our Redeemer and Master, Jesus Christ, who when about to return to Heaven, implored of God, His Father, in earnest prayer, that His disciples and followers should be of one mind and of one heart: "I pray...that they all may be one, as thou Father in Me, and I in Thee: that they also may be one in Us."

IF the Pope identifies himself as GOD, then WHY did he refer to the Lord Jesus as "Our Redeemer and Master?" God doesn’t have a master, Einstein.
A representative HOLDS the place of his superior - he doesn't USURP it - he doesn't

Merriam Webster’s Collegiate Dictionary
Vicar
noun
vic·ar ˈvi-kər
one serving as a substitute or agent
specifically : an administrative deputy

The “Vicar” of Christ is His Chief representative (Chief Agent)

- As Christ’s Chief representative – Peter and Peter the Keys to the kingdom of Heaven.

- Peter and Peter ALONE was asked by Jesus to “strengthen his brothers” (Luke 22:31) and bring them back to faith.

- Peter and Peter ALONE was asked by Jesus to, “Feed my lambs”, “Tend my sheep lambs”, and “Feed my sheep”.

You;/’re a cherry-picker – not a love of TRUTH.

No, I cherry picked nothing. I agreed with you, and cited the sources, showing that the pope is, as you said, the "VICAR" of Christ (which, in Latin, is Vicarius Christi, or in koine Greek, Anti-Christos). The actual substitute, that Jesus sent in His stead, was the Person/Being of the Holy Ghost/Spirit, not any man.

All you did was simply cite, something to this effect - Pope claimed to be God?

I have read the original Encyclicals, Bulls, etc, in their fullness.

However, their (and also yours) argument, that a person cannot claim to be God and have a Redeemer and Master is simply not true. Jesus Himself, referred to such, when upon the Cross, cited Psalms 31:5 in part, even as He had for Psalms 22, etc. Jesus claimed to be God (Deity, not the Person/Being of the Father), manifest in the flesh (of mankind, fallen sinful), and yet also said that He had a "God" and "Father", which is also a Master over Himself (see John 20:17). There are other OT references that show the Son calling upon the Father as His "redeemer". Why? The Son was "made ... to be sin for us" (2 Corinthians 5:21) and bore all the sins of mankind upon Himself. See also texts that refer to Jesus' resurrection (redemption) from the grave (such as Psalms 49:15).

So, can a pope claim to be God, and still say that they have a Redeemer and Master? Sure. It has been done. I had helped to find this quote some time back and shared it with brother Michael Scheifler - Mysterious Quote Regarding Pope Found!

The argumentation of Catholic apologists are generally seriously flawed and usually self-serving (but you do not have to agree with me here, yet).

 

[Truth7t7]

Context disproves what you want to think what Bellarmine declared. Made-in-America cults, radical fundamentalist, and Calvinoid cult leader Matt Slick uses the same tactics. and it's because you have an axe to grind in the first place.

I agree, but Bellarmine is using the names of Christ in the representative sense, not in the literal sense, which you refuse to understand.

No Pope has ever declared himself to be God Almighty, a blasphemous lie you are purveying, in a spiritual stupor and craven cowardice, afraid of the evidence presented by BofL.

View attachment 28625​

Roman Catholicis is a false religion, Mary doesn't bring salvation, nor is she Mediatric as the Catechism teaches

Pope Francis condones and supports same setx unions, Pope John Paul sheltered Cardinal "Beranard Francis Law" from extradition to the US, after his involvement in 400+ sexual abuse molestation case in Boston

Who in the world would want to be a part of your religious organization and leadership "No Body"!