Sanctification is not a Process

[Ronald David Bruno]

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As a present passive, "being sanctified" is a correct translation.

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Same syntax here. "the ones being sanctified". Present Passive, happening now, ongoing, and being done to us.

Much love!

I think sanctification is both:
1. Spiritual, when we are born again, we are washed instantly and so if we die, our spirits separate from our flesh and go to the Lord pure and spotless.
2. Concerning our fleshly behavior for our remaining life on earth, the Holy Spirit helps us gradually to get a handle on sin. We don't instantly behave holy when we are born again! We grow spiritually and become more loving people and grow to hate sin in our lives.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I repeat.

When someone says they are made perfect in the flesh in an instant.

Yet says that they can fall away or walk away

they are confused.

Its like saying that something is made perfect. Yet that perfect thing can fall apart because in reality, it is not really perfect.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

ahh, so you believe in progressive sanctification also?

Then you do NOT believe as EPI does. in fact you would appose him

No…I was trying to make a point by showing how ridiculous the thought was.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

No man can tame the tongue.

But:

“…If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.” (James 3:2)

 

[MatthewG]

But:

“…If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.” (James 3:2)

Ayyy thanks

 

[stunnedbygrace]

so are we made holy in an instant?

or are we being made holy the rest of our lives?

We are learning righteousness, growing in righteousness. If God translates you into the kingdom, yes, it’s in an instant.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

I repeat:

We are warned against becoming prideful in our Spiritual walk lest we fall thereby.

“Pride goes before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall.” (Proverbs 16:18)

But:

“The meek He will guide in judgment; and the meek He will teach His way.” (Psalms 25:9)

“…Knowledge puffs up, but love edifies.” (1 Corinthians 8:1)

Those who ignore these scriptures are the confused ones…

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Its like saying that something is made perfect. Yet that perfect thing can fall apart because in reality, it is not really perfect.

That’s actually correct,…”It,” is not perfect. “It” is walking in Gods perfectness.
What made the temple holy? It was holy because Gods presence was there.

 

[MatthewG]

So a soul can go from being in darkness to light? God dwells in the temple of the soul?

The mind/will/emotion - renew mind, allowing God to work on the darkness of the soul.

A process of change from darkness to light.

A child at first; may fight a little, might see things differently, may point fingers; grows to mature (perfect) in the process of learning about God and Christ, faith is built, trust instated, and Gods love is put on the heart of the an individual by the Holy Spirit of God.

Only good things really come from the Father of lights and the gifts are spiritual contentment in being made right with God through faith in the Lord Jesus, whom God had sent. Looking forward to a heavenly home, a free bonus is that God will reward every person according to their own lives in which they either choose to serve for God or for themselves. God will judge rightly and it’s all due to Jesus and his work that one is made right with God; though because of Jesus and his work, he now works in and through you, by the spirit in which lead to doing good things which are a creditable to the Father with praise to the son.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

We don't instantly behave holy when we are born again!

“…they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.” (Galatians 5:24)

What’s gradual is moving from pleasing the flesh to actually crucifying it and becoming born again!

This was the case with some of the Galatians who hadn’t even had Christ formed in them yet:

“My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you…” (Galatians 4:19)

 

[stunnedbygrace]

That’s actually correct,…”It,” is not perfect. “It” is walking in Gods perfectness.
What made the temple holy? It was holy because Gods presence was there.

No one rushed to give the answer I was so sure they would…
But I’m sure it’s coming. I have to go for quite a few hours though. Have a good day all.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

The meek do not puff themselves up as being perfect. The proud do.

What even more amazing, is the proud man who claims he is meek.

alot of backward thinking here

 

[stunnedbygrace]

The meek do not puff themselves up as being perfect. The proud do.

What even more amazing, is the proud man who claims he is meek.

alot of backward thinking here

Whoooooa….that’s just so freaky….

You literally just said, the meek/humble/righteous do not puff themselves up as being holy. The proud do.
Then, you literally said, it is a proud man who claims he is meek/humble/righteous.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

We are learning righteousness, growing in righteousness. If God translates you into the kingdom, yes, it’s in an instant.

ahh, so progressive sanctification is real.

Then why does EPI teach against it? and why even more confusing. are you claiming he does not?

 

[Lambano]

Could we define the terms "holiness" and "righteousness" up front, please? I don't think y'all are arguing about the same thing.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

That’s actually correct,…”It,” is not perfect. “It” is walking in Gods perfectness.
What made the temple holy? It was holy because Gods presence was there.

It was perfect unless someone walked in unclean. and made it abominable

Who is going to walk in and make you abominable? (perfect)

Your example fails. Because you again claim you are perfect..

And this "walking in Christ"???

That is part of sanctification. and part of growing, learning to walk in Christ.. It is not that the priest came in unclean and sullied the holy place. it is that you or I or someone else falling back to our flesh. BECAUSE we are not yet perfectly sanctified.

If we were. we could never fall back

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Could we define the terms "holiness" and "righteousness" up front, please? I don't think y'all are arguing about the same thing.

I believe both would be defined as perfection. walking without sin..

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Your example fails. Because you again claim you are perfect..

I most certainly have never claimed that. I’ve claimed I am holy? Of course I haven’t. I’ve said I’ve never even walked in the Spirit. Ever. I don’t even claim I am righteous, let alone holy!

 

[marks]

VG point! We have power and this power does not mean a show of ostentatious might to show the world we are believers in the Spirit. The power to cause peace and resolve disputes within a neighborhood, the power to love as God loves us. The power to cause a healing in faith. The power to say no to sin, and I have really noticed this type of power over the last decade or two....this power from God really works...

Power over our tongues.

James 3:1-2 KJV
1) My brethren, be not many masters, knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation.
2) For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.

Right here is a training manual in self control. Learn to control your tongue, and the same "spiritual muscles" by which you control your tongue, you will be able to control everything else.

James says that no man can do this, but we have the Spirit of God.

Much love!

 

[Lambano]

I believe both would be defined as perfection. walking without sin..

Okay, that'll help understand where you're coming from.

My own understanding of "holiness" as applied to God refers to His "otherness", His complete separation from His creation. When applied to persons, places, or things, it means separated out of the world for God's use.

My understanding of "righteousness" is that in the relational sense, it means meeting the obligations of the relationship, whether that relationship is husband-wife, parent-child, friend-friend, neighbor-neighbor, employer-employee, citizen-government, or human-God. The latter has some overlap with "holiness", since we have an obligation to allow God to use us as He sees fit. In a more limited forensic sense, to be declared "righteous" (i.e. "justified") means the judge has found in your favor in whatever the matter in dispute was.

Where I see some points of contact with your position is that while sin is primarily a failure to meet a relational obligation, but in a sense also a failure to separate from the world.