We are judged by works, not by faith

[MatthewG]

Thank you. I have not always done the first works of shutting down every thought for sin from the devil from mind, and so I was often plagued with them unnecessarily, including allow them to become lust in the heart to do them.

Now, I do my part to keep the peace of God that passes understanding, by shutting them down so soon as they cross my mind, and I am no more plagued by double heartedness in the faith.

Many sincere Christians try to fight sin with the flesh, after lust has already been allowed to lodge in the heart. It is a lost battle.

When we first begin fighting our warfare where is begins in the spirit, it does seem impossible to maintain, but soon we find the Spirit of Christ joining in, and we see ourselves winning against the devil's every thought for sin. We realize that is our promise and seal of the Spirit.

Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.

In Christ, just as Jesus did in the flesh, we don't have to take the sinful thoughts of the devil for one second. We can cast them aside handily and continue on in the grace and goodness of walking with Jesus even as He walked with the Father in the days of His flesh.

You make some great points, sometimes I just let myself go ahead and do whatever it may be.

It's all personal cause God looks at the heart, and the communing is there.

If Paul says everything is lawful, but not everything helpful.

Some things do need to be cast down right away when it leads to malice, or evil intent.

Of course I dont believe any of us can hurt God, or even hurt Jesus, we hurt ourselves and the relationship bond because of our own actions - depending on what that may be, mainly evil and malice, or even lust of the eyes, lust of the flesh, or even being prideful over others, like the one Pharisee who said thank you God im not like this piece of garbage sinner over here who doesn't tithe, and all the rest of the murderers, Heaven forbid.

Love to you, and carry on.
Matthew

 

[Ghada]

Yes ... We are judged by works, not by faith ..

True.

AND ...

AND we are justified or condemned by works, because we are judged by works.

Saying we are justified without works, is the same as saying we are condemned without works, because justification and condemnation are by the judgment of God.

If we teach we are justified without works, and any man is condemned by God, then we are saying others are condemned without works.

Do you say you are justified without works? Then how can you say others are condemned by works? Is God unjust to justify one without works, while condemning another by works? God forbid. At least not the God and righteous Judge of the Bible.

If we say we are justified by works, then we can say others are condemned by works. God is not a respecter of persons when judging every man by His works.

There are some Christians that preach a gospel of every man being judged by faith alone.

There are also some Christians preaching a gospel that says all men will be saved and justified by God in the end, regardless of their works in this life. Some even include the devil and his sinning angels.

There are many such Christian gospels being preached, and they are free to do so, and I have no personal problem with them nor their gospels. I only show how they differ from the gospel of Jesus Christ in the Bible, if they do.

I also show what they are really teaching, that they themselves often gasp at and deny.

We are saved by grace through faith, not by works.

"Not by works" are your words added to the Bible. Paul never says we are saved through faith without works, apart from works, nor not by works.

He does say we are not save by any works which we have done before Christ.

 

[Ghada]

Saying that we Christians are not judged by our works, while others are judged by their works, is hypocrisy of faith and religion.

If we are not judged by our works, then no man is judged by His works, because the God of the Bible is not a hypocritical respecter of persons,

If we are not justified by our works, then no man is condemned by their works. God is not a hypocritical judge.

If we say we are justified without works, then if any man is condemned, then it is without works.

It also opposes the Bible, that says the Father judges every man according to His work. Because His justification or condemnation is by His judgment.

Saying any man is justified without works, is saying God does not judge any man by his work.

And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear:

The faith without works gospel begins by opposing James 2, and just goes on to oppose all other verses of the Bible having anything to do with James 2. It's a never ending dominoes effect of opposing verse after verse after verse of the Bible, that has anything to do with faith, salvation, justification, and works.

 

[Rapture Bound]

True.


AND we are justified or condemned by works, because we are judged by works.

Saying we are justified without works, is the same as saying we are condemned without works, because justification and condemnation are by the judgment of God.

If we teach we are justified without works, and any man is condemned by God, then we are saying others are condemned without works.

Do you say you are justified without works? Then how can you say others are condemned by works? Is God unjust to justify one without works, while condemning another by works? God forbid. At least not the God and righteous Judge of the Bible.

If we say we are justified by works, then we can say others are condemned by works. God is not a respecter of persons when judging every man by His works.

There are some Christians that preach a gospel of every man being judged by faith alone.

There are also some Christians preaching a gospel that says all men will be saved and justified by God in the end, regardless of their works in this life. Some even include the devil and his sinning angels.

There are many such Christian gospels being preached, and they are free to do so, and I have no personal problem with them nor their gospels. I only show how they differ from the gospel of Jesus Christ in the Bible, if they do.

I also show what they are really teaching, that they themselves often gasp at and deny.


"Not by works" are your words added to the Bible. Paul never says we are saved through faith without works, apart from works, nor not by works.

He does say we are not save by any works which we have done before Christ.

So, how in the world can we ever know that we've done enough good works in order to qualify for salvation? How is the assurance of salvation even possible according to your gospel of works??

 

[Nancy]

True. All men's works are judged without respect of persons by God. No man is judged based solely upon our inward faith and stated beliefs.

We can think what we want, but doing good or evil is the judgement of God.




This confuses ministerial rewards spoken of in 1 Cor 3, with works of righteousness or works of the flesh.

For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

The Bible plainly says that those walking after the flesh reap corruption not everlasting life.

The LORD shall reward the doer of evil according to his wickedness. Only with thine eyes shalt thou behold and see the reward of the wicked.

Moreover by them is thy servant warned: and in keeping of them there is great reward. So that a man shall say, Verily there is a reward for the righteous: verily he is a God that judgeth in the earth.

All man's works are still judged righteously by God, whether unto everlasting life with Him or everlasting shame apart from Him.

The reward of the righteous for their good works, is to inherit His kingdom. The reward of the unrighteous for their evil works, is to be forever alone and separated from God.





That will be the rest of the dead after the first resurrection of the church and Jesus' thousand year reign on earth.


Believers that do His word unto the end.

Knowledge only faith by hearing alone, is not justified by Christ. We are judged by our works, not our faith alone.





True. When repenting and coming to Jesus in faith, all our past sins have been forgiven and forgotten by God, along with all our old works and past life.

If we continue in His faith by doing His word, then there will continue to be no sinful works of the flesh for Him to judge.

The Father still judges all men's works on earth as good or evil, without respect of persons.


Yes. The judgement seat of Christ is for ministry, and not for evil or good done in our bodies. If we end our days in evil, then we will not be at His judgement seat, but at the great white throne.


True. Which is shown by ministering according to the words of the Bible, or not. Especially if ministering openly against the Bible by unbelief in any of God's words.

Many of us can minster badly by either being ignorant of all God's words, or sloppy handling of them. The dangerous ministers that lead the believers astray unto destruction, are them that purposely teach against God's words in order to justify sinning among the believers.

But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.


Yes. Very huge. One is for ministry, and the other is for doing righteousness or unrighteousness in this life.

Hello @Ghada , welcome to CyB!
You have lots of very good points in your post, thank you!
"We know them by their fruits"...that produce good works, amen!

The issue for me is that, there is not a "works based salvation" offered, because then, why would we need Christ? Although, we know them BY their fruits; produced naturally from becoming born again

"If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire."
1 Corinthians 3:15

Perhaps those whose Spiritual "works" are in more abundance with one over another, the least will serve the strong in heaven...just a thought, lol.
Welcome and I do hope you will enjoy our time here. There are lot's of wonderful brothers and sisters here.
In Him,
Nancy

 

[MatthewG]

Redux.

Jesus Christ -> leads to deliverance -> from a former old lifestyle.

With now Spirit of Christ in you -> you allow God to work in your heart and mind -> that means your faith is valid cause you show love for God and love for others.

What one reaps they sow, God will not be mocked.

All through the Christian life you can reap to your flesh and very little spirit, or you could reap alot of the spirit and your flesh here is cut down a little bit more as you go along in life looking and allowing God to work in and through your mind and allow you to be useful for the works that come around which you lean into the spirit, seeking God to help you in those times, which Christ Jesus comes through by the spirit (Spirit of Christ) and works out things for GOOD.

All credit goes to God - and it is not from ourselves is the important part to remember.
Though you submit yourself to be worked on in your heart and mind, by God.

It's a two way street. God reaching down, and us reaching up for his help.

The flesh reaps destruction, where the spirit reaps eternal life.

It's not easy to submit oneself to reading, growing, learning, and maturing by the use of the Bible.

Sometime it can take years to finally come to realize, some say the sooner the better.

Strong's Greek: 4991. σωτηρία (sótéria) -- deliverance, salvation
... Bible Strong's Greek 4991 4991. sótéria Strong's Concordance sótéria: deliverance, salvation Original Word: σωτηρία, ας, ἡ Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine Transliteration: sótéria Phonetic Spelling: (so-tay-ree' ah) Definition: deliverance, ...

(My opinion may not reflect the view of any other person or persons on this board)

 

[Rapture Bound]

So, how in the world can we ever know that we've done enough good works in order to qualify for salvation? How is the assurance of salvation even possible according to your gospel of works??

The LOS [Loss of Salvation] supporters have their individual lists in which they believe to be the "standard" to 'live up to' in order to 'remain saved' ... and if they successfully live up to it, that is, if they 'check off all their boxes,' then they assume that they will make 'the final cut' that's needed to remain on "team Heaven" - lol. The major problem with this kind of mindset is they can never possibly attain the assurance that they will make it to Heaven since they all have different checklists, with none of them exactly actually knowing what God's 'checklist' looks like.

Sorry to differ, but I'll opt for the free gift of "option B" - the righteousness of Jesus Christ freely credited to my account... don't know about you, but I always fail to check all the boxes ... that's why I choose [39 years ago] to place all my trust in Christ to fill and cover ALL of those gaps [where I succumb to my fallen fleshly nature] by His precious blood that He shed for me [and all who would believe in His finished work ... as opposed to their own]. - Praise God!!

 

[MatthewG]

The LOS [Loss of Salvation] supporters have their individual lists in which they believe to be the "standard" to 'live up to' in order to 'remain saved' ... and if they successfully live up to it, that is, if they 'check off all their boxes,' then they assume that they will make 'the final cut' that's needed to remain on "team Heaven" - lol. The major problem with this kind of mindset is they can never possibly attain the assurance that they will make it to Heaven since they all have different checklists, with none of them exactly actually knowing what God's 'checklist' looks like. Sorry to differ, but I'll opt for the free gift of "option B" - the righteousness of Jesus Christ freely credited to my account... don't know about you, but I always fail to check all the boxes ... I suppose that why I trust in Christ to fill ALL of those gaps by His precious blood He shed for me - Praise God!!

Hello rapture, I tried to answer your question on

• #66

People can lose deliverance - by no longer seeking out God in faith, and no longer looking at the Lord Yeshua who is the way to the Father.

Christians who do this without turning completely from God - are liable to quench the spirit.

You are made right by Jesus in faith.

However - there is a deliverance from an old lifestyle lived -> which if you read the post youll see.

 

[Ghada]

Can a person who is born again and given eternal life as the bible says by trusting in the death and physical resurrection of Jesus alone for their salvation

The error here is skipping by repenting of sinning, and then believing the gospel and trusting in the blood of Jesus to wash newly clean with all things now being of God.

The great error of faith alone without works teachers, is they just cannot frame themselves to include works in any of their preaching of their gospel of faith without works.

I suppose that's why they never mention works worthy of repentance.

Bring forth therefore fruits worthy of repentance, and begin not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, That God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.

, lose their salvation? Please just yes or no.

Without repenting of sinning, they never were saved by Jesus Christ in the first place, so there's nothing to lose.

A faith without works salvation is the imperfect salvation of another gospel, where they teach being saved while still sinning, They never have the perfect salvation of Jesus Christ by repentance from dead works, where all their past life is washed clean, and all their new life is now pure and of God. Even as newborn babes from the womb.

, lose their salvation? Please just yes or no.

Long story short, in the context of the thread: Since we are judged by our works, then our works judge our justification with God.

In the context of being saved and made completely new by repentance and confession unto salvation.

Those newborn babes in Christ, that are now washed clean from sinning in spirit, soul, nor life, if we do sin, then we are no more new creatures in Christ, but old sinning creatures living again. The old man is revived from our cross to sinning again.

It does not mean we no more have the Advocate of the whole world available to us. We can come to Him as the whole world can, to confess our sinning with godly sorrow, and be forgiven, clean washed and renewed unto pure life by His blood.

I wouldn't call it losing salvation, because the Bible doesn't. It's called falling from grace and becoming children of the devil by doing his unrighteousness, rather than being sons of God by doing His righteousness.

But without repenting of sinning, no man is saved and made completely new and of God by Jesus Christ in the first place.

The gospel of being saved and justified without works of repentance, is another gospel of unclean and imperfect believers.

They can believe and live that way all they wish, and like all good neighborly sinners, then can have a good life in this world. But it won't resurrect them from the dead unto everlasting life with God.

All men sinning at the end of death, are resurrected unto everlasting shame separate from God. The Father judges every man by our works, not by our personal beliefs.

 

[Rapture Bound]

Hello rapture, I tried to answer your question on

• #66

People can lose deliverance - by no longer seeking out God in faith, and no longer looking at the Lord Yeshua who is the way to the Father.

Christians who do this without turning completely from God - are liable to quench the spirit.

You are made right by Jesus in faith.

However - there is a deliverance from an old lifestyle lived -> which if you read the post youll see.

You said, " there is a deliverance from an old lifestyle lived "

Yes indeed. No one here is denying that there will be a transformation that takes place after regeneration via the Holy Spirit. I'm just refuting the claim that justification comes via a person's works.

 

[MatthewG]

You said, " there is a deliverance from an old lifestyle lived "

Yes indeed. No one here is denying that there will be a transformation that takes place after regeneration via the Holy Spirit. I'm just refuting the claim that justification comes via a person's works.

Yeah no one is saying that here.

What is being said though is that what you allow yourself to go through with Yahava in your life - at the end of it will be rewarded spiritually.

It is not based on the fleshly experience of life at all,

Look at me look what I do, look what I did for you JEsus.

No, -> It's all based on thankfulness for what Yeshua has done for us -> which we love him because he loved us first, Jesus claims all through out the scripture of rewards.

Therefore the works that God has prepared are all a choice.

Do I serve God, or Do I serve my flesh, even seek for admiration from men because of it.

@Rapture Bound

Ephesians 2:10 reads “For we are God's handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.”

All credit is due to God as per post

• #66

You can not have faith without works. Or You can not have faith without love.

It's just invalid claimed faith.

 

[MatthewG]

There is also this scripture

James 2:25
And in the same way was not also Rahab the prostitute justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out by another way?

How was she justified in faith - by works of love...

So it's hard to tear apart Faith - and Works.


Jesus makes a person right before God because of his righteousness - the justification comes through the changed life...




It's like a quarter with heads and tails.

You could replace it with Faith and on the back 'works' or LOVE, because that is what Jesus calls us to do love God and love others, and only is it coming by and through God and a persons life who allows such to be - through the spirit.


God isn't gonna do everything for you. You have to make your own choice to allow him to work in and and through your life.

• #66

People can lose deliverance - by no longer seeking out God in faith, and no longer looking at the Lord Yeshua who is the way to the Father.

Christians who do this without turning completely from God - are liable to quench the spirit.

You are made right by Jesus in faith.

However - there is a deliverance from an old lifestyle lived -> which if you read the post youll see.

Yeah no one is saying that here.

What is being said though is that what you allow yourself to go through with Yahava in your life - at the end of it will be rewarded spiritually.

It is not based on the fleshly experience of life at all,

Look at me look what I do, look what I did for you JEsus.

No, -> It's all based on thankfulness for what Yeshua has done for us -> which we love him because he loved us first, Jesus claims all through out the scripture of rewards.

Therefore the works that God has prepared are all a choice.

Do I serve God, or Do I serve my flesh, even seek for admiration from men because of it.


Ephesians 2:10 reads “For we are God's handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.”

All credit is due to God as per post

• #66

You can not have faith without works. Or You can not have faith without love.

It's just invalid claimed faith.

Hope those who are seeking for truth have their eyes opened its highly important

and spiritual rewards are on the line, proclaimed by the Lord.

 

[MatthewG]

There is also this scripture

James 2:25
And in the same way was not also Rahab the prostitute justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out by another way?

How was she justified in faith - by works of love...

So it's hard to tear apart Faith - and Works.


Jesus makes a person right before God because of his righteousness - the justification comes through the changed life...




It's like a quarter with heads and tails.

You could replace it with Faith and on the back 'works' or LOVE, because that is what Jesus calls us to do love God and love others, and only is it coming by and through God and a persons life who allows such to be - through the spirit.


God isn't gonna do everything for you. You have to make your own choice to allow him to work in and and through your life.







Hope those who are seeking for truth have their eyes opened its highly important

and spiritual rewards are on the line, proclaimed by the Lord.

One more thing, I think a lot of what Paul suggests to the Gentile - about not being justified by works are works of the LAW, not works that God had created them to do.

its important to know the difference... I hate for people to be in the dark on these things, and I believe Ghada is in the same mindset.

 

[Rapture Bound]

Yeah no one is saying that here.

What is being said though is that what you allow yourself to go through with Yahava in your life - at the end of it will be rewarded spiritually.

It is not based on the fleshly experience of life at all,

Look at me look what I do, look what I did for you JEsus.

No, -> It's all based on thankfulness for what Yeshua has done for us -> which we love him because he loved us first, Jesus claims all through out the scripture of rewards.

Therefore the works that God has prepared are all a choice.

Do I serve God, or Do I serve my flesh, even seek for admiration from men because of it.

@Rapture Bound

Ephesians 2:10 reads “For we are God's handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.”

All credit is due to God as per post

• #66

You can not have faith without works. Or You can not have faith without love.

It's just invalid claimed faith.

Bottom line :
Do you believe that any, that is, even one blood-bought, Spirit indwelt, followers of Jesus Christ, will eventually forfeit or lose their salvation and consequently perish everlastingly in the Lake of Fire? ... and yes, there are only two possible options here ... yes or no.

 

[MatthewG]

Bottom line :
Do you believe that any, that is, even one blood-bought, Spirit indwelt, followers of Jesus Christ, will eventually forfeit or lose their salvation and consequently perish everlastingly in the Lake of Fire? ... and yes, there are only two possible options here ... yes or no.

Truth is the bottom line. I dont go on about once saved always saved, as the bible has plenty of evidence of people backsliding, even becoming unbelieving from once believing.

I dont know what you think about that friend, it's not up to me to judge.

Peace be unto you, and love to you, carry on,
Matthew

 

[gpresdo]

So, how in the world can we ever know that we've done enough good works in order to qualify for salvation? How is the assurance of salvation even possible according to your gospel of works??

Be not discouraged...remember...there are only three things we must do here on earth, to receive eternal salvation after death;
We must repent of our sins
We must be water baptized
We must live a righteous life according to God's law.........."until the end".

With the heart cleansed and convicted to follow Christ the Holy Spirit will guide us.

Be blessed.

 

[dad]

Nations can be judged so that they are turned to hell, for anyone living therein. People are not judged in groups, but individually. The judgement by works is individuals of each nations.

Judgment involves rewards. Not salvation when it comes to the judgment of Jesus.

It shows God has always judged out works, since He first judged Adam by his work of unrighteousness.

Then died for us so that He could be our payment for sin.

The less than perfect gospel is not the gospel of Jesus Christ.

The evil doers reject coming to the light.

The better than evil sinners are still not in the light fellowshipping with Jesus, where there is no darkness at all. (1 John 1)

Then they are not saved at least not yet saved. If we are saved then we have fellowship with Him who lives in us.

True. Current salvation is not a reward for past works. Inheriting His kingdom by resurrection of the dead, is His reward for our past works serving God at the end.

Progressive salvation while still doing dead works, is the imperfect gospel of man.

Growing in the grace of not sinning, while walking as He walked, is the pure salvation and justification of Jesus Christ.

A just man falls seven times a day and gets back up. Though we fall we are not utterly cast down. Though works are burned yet we ourselves are saved, though it involves fiery times.

No, it is a necessary means to justification. If being justified by works is not by means of works, then being saved by grace is not by means of grace.

No one is saved by works. His work saved us when we accept it.

Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight

Now, if you want to preach being saved by faith alone, before being justified by works, then I'd be glad to hear it.

We are rewarded for works not saved by them. People who are saved and right with Him also have some works. We work because He made us just, not to attain justification or salvation.

True. See above how the Bible teaches current salvation is not by reward, but inheriting eternal salvation by resurrection of the dead, is by reward of obeying Jesus in the end.

This IS the work of God, that ye believe in him whom he hath sent. The same is true of millennial believers. They will be saved by faith in Jesus alone. Those that endure till the end obviously will be saved! Many of those martyred before the very end also of course are saved!

And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

The obedience needed is to come to Him, accept His free gift. Some obey better than others. None that come to Him will He cast out!

For erroneous ministry yes, not for unrighteous works of the flesh. The unrighteous doing such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. (Gal 5) God judges every man's works and is not a respecter of persons by personal beliefs.

Our own works are as filthy menstruous rags. None of those save anyone. Those who believe in Jesus are righteous not because of works but because of Jesus! Belief in Jesus is not a personal belief it is obeying what Jesus said.

1 Cor 3 is in context of ministry. If we err in our teaching, then that will be burned as hay or stable, but we are still saved and justified by loving God and our neighbors in righteousness and true holiness.

No it is talking about what we do after we are saved.


1 Corinthians 3:12
Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble

True. And like some parents in this life, He separates Himself from the rebellious, and does not have fellowship with them, until they repent.

The scourging of Jesus with the saints, is to separate His Spirit from their hearts. The common scourging of all men for sinning, is morning after blues.



And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.

But they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage:

And whatsoever ye do, do it heartily, as to the Lord, and not unto men; Knowing that of the Lord ye shall receive the reward of the inheritance: for ye serve the Lord Christ. But he that doeth wrong shall receive for the wrong which he hath done: and there is no respect of persons.

Thou hast a few names even in Sardis which have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with me in white: for they are worthy.

No man is worthy of being forgiven and saved by Jesus due to past works, but the resurrection unto life is only for those worthy of walking with Jesus in white forever, because they walked as He walked in this life.

Salvation is not by reward for past works before Christ. The inheritance of His kingdom is by reward for past works with Christ unto death.


Faith without works is useless to be saved by. (James 2)

It doesn't say that. It says faith is dead without works. Not useless to be saved, it is talking about believers! Believers already are saved. So when some believer doesn't do anything that is usless for the world. That does not help get people saved and preach the gospel etc. So what happens to that person? If they are saved, then God chastises and corrects them so they will bear fruit. We are a work in progress. If some believer was so bad and useless and really sinning then they may need to die. To be handed over to Satan to die so that their spirit will live!

Those hiding their faith have useless faith to be saved by. It's dead, being alone.

His faith is the free gift to our hearts by hearing only.

His faith is useless to save us, if we leave it alone and don't do His word.

The gospel of being once for all saved and justified by faith alone, makes believing there is one God, the end goal.

Faith is the means of the end goal, which is to be judged righteous by works and be rewarded with eternal salvation by resurrection of the dead.

Jesus rewards/judges us based on works. Nothing to do with salvation.

Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory: Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

Believing only is not the end goal. Doing the will of God by through to the end, is the end goal.

Grace is the means of believing, believing from the heart is the means of doing God's will. Doing God's will is the means of being reward with resurrection unto life.


Try loving God without doing good.

Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.

The gospel of faith without works is the idolatrous gospel of believing we have love for God and man, without loving God and man.

Our faith alone becomes our idol for being saved and justified without works.

And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.



By sinning with the flesh. The soul is defiled and dies to God.

Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.

The Bible makes no differences between believer or unbeliever, in judgement of works and the the soul dying to God by sinning.

The sinning soul dies separated from the Spirit of life, without respect of persons.

The gospel of not being judged and condemned with the world, while doing ungodly works of the world, is one of an unjust judge having respect of persons. Only an unjust judge condemns one and excuses another based solely upon 'family ties'.

But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation; Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.

And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear



Because they don't actually do the word. Believers by hearing, that do not the word, are called hearers only.

Their alternative Christian religion to the Bible, is being justified by faith of hearing only, not by doing the word.


The Bible teaches that people who DO believe are only those that DO the word.

The rest are hearers only, that DO unrighteousness and shall not inherit the kingdom of God.



For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

His will is that we believe and come to Him. Then we are family. Not by works of our own.

 

[MatthewG]

No one is justified by doing works of the LAW, they are justified in faith in Christ -> and Good works that God creates them for is performed by and through Spirit -> The credit goes towards God, not man (saying look Lord how good I am), Faith and works will be evidence of a changed life from old to new.

Faith justifies your works - which is you working with God who works in your heart and mind, and works in and through you -> by the Spirit of Christ whom comes through you -> which produces those works of good fruit.

A person does have to subject themselves willingly to Yahava, and follow Yeshua, and once you get that down though you move on to perfection or maturity moving onwards (Hebrews 6), no one will be justified in their flesh. All are justified by Christ. However...

A person who is a follow of Christ, can have doubts come into their head and ultimately abandon their faith they once had walking away, and no longer walking in faith, or even walking in the spirit at all...

Some doubt this however it is true, I had the thought the other day - 'Is Jesus Christ really the way, the truth, and the life, and the only way to the Father' - what do you believe about that Matthew?

I still believe he is the only way. All I would have to do is entertain the idea, to become a fully believed concept in my mind that he is not the way, however I still trust that following God, and following his Son, is valid in 2023, in faith.




People wanna try to make it condensed and easy... but condensed and easy is the way to deceive yourself if you are not careful.

Faith and works go hand and hand, just as a quarter has heads and tails. Faith first - walking and learning fortifiying off of milk and on to meat -> To have works which God created you for in Christ -> Which is

Faith and Love.

Hebrews 11:16 "And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to Him must believe that He exists and that He rewards those who earnestly seek Him".

John 6:29, Jesus answered, “The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent.”

Matthew 22:
36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”

37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’[a] 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[b] 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

Eph 2: 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

What is the will of God for those in Christ?

1 Thess 5
12 And we urge you, brethren, to recognize those who labor among you, and are over you in the Lord and [d]admonish you, 13 and to esteem them very highly in love for their work’s sake. Be at peace among yourselves.

14 Now we [e]exhort you, brethren, warn those who are [f]unruly, comfort the fainthearted, uphold the weak, be patient with all. 15 See that no one renders evil for evil to anyone, but always pursue what is good both for yourselves and for all.

16 Rejoice always, 17 pray without ceasing, 18 in everything give thanks; for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus for you.

19 Do not quench the Spirit. 20 Do not despise prophecies. 21 Test all things; hold fast what is good. 22 Abstain from every form of evil.

Hebrews 3:12 Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.

To top it off, there are probably some people out there whom are Christian, and have works which is coming by the spirit, and they do not even know the name Jesus or who he truly is yet... they will rewarded fairly, and they have the spirit too, because God sees them looking towards him, rather than themselves, and they let themselves be worked and moved by the Spirit.

(It could be a person who attends LDS, Jehovah Witness, Catholic, Baptist, Holiness, or someone out there who is just bible illiterate but looks up to the Skies and recognizes someone had to have given them life)

The Spirit is primary, whereas the Bible is simply referential (to fortify what one believes).

 

[Rapture Bound]

Truth is the bottom line. I dont go on about once saved always saved, as the bible has plenty of evidence of people backsliding, even becoming unbelieving from once believing.

I dont know what you think about that friend, it's not up to me to judge.

Peace be unto you, and love to you, carry on,
Matthew

It probably would have been much easier to say that you are undecided about the matter ... is that not a fair assessment of the matter? After all, you could not provide a yes or no answer .... just saying. Blessings!

 

[MatthewG]

It probably would have been much easier to say that you are undecided about the matter ... is that not a fair assessment of the matter? After all, you could not provide a yes or no answer .... just saying. Blessings!

Yes a person who is a christian can lose faith, and have to make a trip to the lake of fire, when they come around to not trusting having faith in God, or Jesus.

Yeah, I have no problem with saying that. Though I am not the judge.

Love to ya my man,

just the other day I had a thought in my own head is Jesus Christ really the way, the truth and the life?


@Rapture Bound I suppose that is why there is so much exortation to continue to be steadfast and continue to trust in God from the Apostles to the believers by and through the epistles,

welcome to Christianityboards by the way.