John 3 Jesus discussion with Nicodemus

[Ritajanice]

God does open the eyes of the heart, through the Holy Spirit., but that is not the same as being "born again".

"conviction of the Holy Spirit", is Jesus saying.."If i be lifted up (0n the Cross) i will draw ALL to me."

Yes, I understand and know there is much more to being Born again than what I said...I know all about the drawing to Jesus, repentance, Godly sorrow, etc....

 

[rwb]

if we were holy, he would not need to die.

the blood was for our redemption. the forgiveness of sin.

Ephesians 1:7
In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace

Yes, the cross made atonement for our sins! His resurrection proves He has power over death, that whosoever believes in Him shall never die. Because when we are in Christ neither our sins nor our physical death can prevent us from being in the spiritual Kingdom of God.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

okay that seems to say so. What is the Greek I wonder.

I can look it up. what words are you looking for?

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

first question, what is it, and why do we need born again.

I will first answer why. why do we need born again..we will have to go to other parts of scripture to see why.

Must be born again – Why do we need born again?

Gen 2: 5 Then the Lord God took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to tend and keep it. 16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, “Of every tree of the garden you may freely eat; 17 but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you[shall surely die.”

• Dying you will die – Physical death is a result of sin. yet this happened 900 years later. Yet Jesus said on that day.
• Did Adam die (spiritually) the moment he sinned? The answer is yes, because the things of God became foolish to him. We see from his actions, that the separation tool place.. If anyone would like to discuss this, feel free. we can go deeper.
• Why are we dead? Besides original sin?

Romans 6: 23 For the wages of sin is death - The wage, or reward for our own sin, is death.. Again, this is spiritual death.. While physical death is a result of sin, The wage of sin is spiritual death or separation from God.

Eph 2: 2 And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins - We were dead in trespasses and sins, again, this is spiritual death, made alive we will discuss later

In Adam (also called original sin)

1 Cor 15: 22 - For as in Adam all die,

Spiritual death – Separation from God

for his we can go to the law. more specifically the temple. and what it represented.

If we go to the law. we see that the people were put in a group. in the middle of this group was the tabernacle. but no one could go near it, here was the presence of God. anyone going near would be killed.

We are then told of the sacrifices, the many sin sacrifices and offerings to the lord. But I want to focus on the day of atonement. God said his presence would be in the inner place or most holy place. Once a year the high priest would come in and make atonement of the sin of the people.

to go in, he would need to make sacrifice, I see 5 animals that had to be sacrificed. in order for the whole atonement process to be taken care of and completed.

the sacrifices were to atone for the sin of the high priest so he can enter and to make atonement for the sin of Israel for the previous year.

this shows how deep and desperate our situation is, our seperation from God is so deep that only one man may enter Gods presence. and only then, after blood is shed.

This is why we need to be born again, or raised to life. or as many say, regenerated..

Great intro! This is a crucial teaching. This is Christianity 101.

Why Did Nicodemus come To Jesus At Night?

Another view on why he came at night..online source.

Now there was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews. This man came to Jesus by night and said to him, ‘Rabbi, we know that you are a teacher come from God, for no one can do these signs that you do unless God is with him.’ Jesus answered him, ‘Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God.’” – John 3:1-3

Nicodemus visited Jesus in the dead of night. Why? Each sentence of this brief passage highlights one of three interrelated answers to that question. First, Nicodemus was one of about 6,000 Pharisees at the time, men who were set apart to maintain the ways of the Lord. He was respected as a teacher of Israel and served as a member of the Sanhedrin, or Jewish tribunal. He wielded significant religious, social, and political power, all of which would have kept him quite busy during the day. More importantly, a public meeting with Jesus could have jeopardized his position and his reputation.

I used to accept this OP version, that Nic was visiting him in secret to avoid conflict from his peers; but lean towards your view.
Jesus had thousands of people crowding around him during the day. Nic wanted some one on one time apart from the crowd. It wasn't as if no other Pharisees approached him during the day and asked questions many times.
Nic defended Jesus among the Pharisees during a meeting, so he wasn't hiding anything.
Nicodemus (he who came to Jesus by night, being one of them) said to them, “Does our law judge a man before it hears him and knows what he is doing?”
They answered and said to him, “Are you also from Galilee? Search and look, for no prophet has arisen out of Galilee.” John 7:50-52
But Jesus was born in Bethlehem, a little fact they overlooked.
However, the OP teaching about Nic being clandestine in his meeting with Jesus holds some weight since after Jesus died both Joseph of Arimethia and Nicodimus took the body and buried it together, in secret, avoiding the Pharisees who were at this time filled and possessed with evil. And anyone who followed Jesus in their eyes was considered deceived.
After this, Joseph of Arimathea, being a disciple of Jesus, but secretly, for fear of the Jews, asked Pilate that he might take away the body of Jesus; and Pilate gave him permission. So he came and took the body of Jesus. And Nicodemus, who at first came to Jesus by night, also came, bringing a mixture of myrrh and aloes, about a hundred pounds. Then they took the body of Jesus, and bound it in strips of linen with the spices, as the custom of the Jews is to bury.
JOHN 19:38-40

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Avoid it., and avoid people who try to correct the word of God with "greek" they can't read., or even if they can, you dont want to have as your teacher a BIBLE corrector.

Satan was one of those, in Genesis, when He said..."hath God said"..

And now, BIBLE correctors do the same, using "greek" and deception.

Trust a real bible.
Trust a bible believe to teach you Paul's Doctrine.
Join a bible believing Church that is entirely = not related to John Calvinism.

excuse me sir. what kind of rampage are you on? avoid the greek? That is nonsense

 

[Behold]

Yes, I understand and know there is much more to being Born again than what I said...I know all about the drawing to Jesus, repentance, Godly sorrow, etc....

Yes.

False repentance is...."im sorry i got caught".

Real repentance, real faith in Christ.... is when we come to God, and we are sorry for who we are.... and what we have become.

 

[marks]

I wonder if people view a second born again experience as a powerful filling of the spirit instead?

I believe this is the Biblical description. I've known spiritual "fillings" that have been so transformational someone could think it was like being born again again, but I don't believe that is right.

Sometimes God does dramatic things with us fast, and other times not.

Much love!

 

[Ritajanice]

Yes.

False repentance is...."im sorry i got caught".

Real repentance, real faith in Christ.... is when we come to God, and we are sorry for who we are....

Amen!!

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Avoid it., and avoid people who try to correct the word of God with "greek" they can't read., or even if they can, you dont want to have as your teacher a BIBLE corrector.

Satan was one of those, in Genesis, when He said..."hath God said"..

And now, BIBLE correctors do the same, using "greek" and deception.

Trust a real bible.
Trust a bible believe to teach you Paul's Doctrine.
Join a bible believing Church that is entirely = not related to John Calvinism.

excuse me sir. what kind of rampage are you on? avoid the greek? That is nonsense

 

[Behold]

excuse me sir. what kind of rampage are you on? avoid the greek? That is nonsense

Slow down and consider....

"common sense" is not a rampage.

Let me show you.

You think, you believe, that real bible study is to study greek, that 99.9 % of Christians CAN'T read?

You have not realized that the last 500 yrs, are "end time", in progression and God knew that the English Language was going to be the universal language currency on this earth, as He was getting read to send the Messiah, down again.

So....

You are trusting a Greek, whatever........ and that is not a good idea.

You are reading a Lexicon TRANSLATION, when you should be studying a REAL BIBLE that you yourself can read

Get a real bible, that you can READ, and study to show yourself approved, unto God.

If you can read the Greek then, get a real bible, and study to show yourself approved. @Eternally Grateful

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Slow down and consider....

"common sense" is not a rampage.

Let me show you.

You think, you believe, that real bible study is to study greek, that 99.9 % of Christians CAN'T read?

You have not realized that the last 500 yrs, are "end time", in progression and God knew that the English Language was going to be the universal language currency on this earth, as He was getting read to send the Messiah, down again.

So....

You are trusting a Greek translation... and that is not a good idea.

You are reading a Lexicon TRANSLATION, when you should be studying a REAL BIBLE.

Get a real bible, that you can READ, and study to show yourself approved.

If you can read the Greek then, get a real bible, and study to show yourself approved. @Eternally Grateful

slow down?

Sorry my friend. i do not trust an english bible completely. And there are some words than can mean many different things, and the only way we can see the truth is to look at the greek.

The bible was not written in english

 

[rwb]

yes 1 cor 12 is the baptism of the spirit thank you

But the HS coming into or on you is the anointing.

those are two different works of the HS in our salvation.

I don't see Scripture showing the need for "two different works of the HS in our salvation".

Hebrews 7:25 (KJV) Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.

 

[Behold]

slow down?

Sorry my friend. i do not trust an english bible completely. And there are some words than can mean many different things,

And that is the SAME situation, with 30 Greek Extant New Testament, manuscripts.
That is the same situation, you face, if you go to a Bible Book Store and by 8 different Lexicons, that do not agree on verses.


Just do this.....
Do not trust anyone, as your NT instructor.... or any commentary.... that tells you that the "Original Greek" is superior to the word of God (Bible)
Why not?
Because there is no Original Greek text.
Its all copies, and there are 30 NEW TESTAMENTS in Greek.

The only "originals" were the Apostle's letters, and we can't get those.. @Eternally Grateful

So, just get away from "study helps", and all this side track time wasting situation, and just read a real bible.
And be sure to listen to a teacher that is showing you what im showing you.

 

[marks]

I don't see Scripture showing the need for "two different works of the HS in our salvation".

Hebrews 7:25 (KJV) Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.

I agree with you, I see our being baptized into Christ being the baptism of the Holy Spirit, and anything afterward would be being filled with the Spirit.

Much love!

 

[Behold]

I believe this is the Biblical description.

He stated that you can be born again Twice.

Azim said:
""""I wonder if people view a second BORN AGAIN experience""""

Born again.......Twice? How about 40 times? 50?

 

[Hepzibah]

I can look it up. what words are you looking for?

forgiveness of sins

 

[amadeus]

To me it’s more than he doesn’t want to be seen with him. But considering Nicodemus comes to him at night… It reminds me of all the lamentations and psalms of the night season and cries unto God for help …those in darkness (troubled)seeking after the Light. Night could mean in a time of trouble, conflicted, tossed, broken hearted, in need, shrouded in darkness and seeking the way to be delivered out from the darkness of the night season …into the Day. Important is Nicodemus seeks…in the night to speak with Christ who is the Light that shines unto those who are in darkness. Yes, I think it is more than Nicodemus being afraid of being seen with Him which maybe that is true because of men being afraid to come to the light that their deeds which are evil be made known. Loving the darkness more than the Light, they refuse to come to the light. But Nicodemus sought Christ out in the night…makes more sense than Nicodemus sought Christ out in the daylight…because without Christ there is no light. (Which is their discussion “you must be born again of God”. So Nicodemus seeks in the night for the Light to speak to Him.

Amen, Sister in Christ!

I was asking about this statement

Jesus saw that he man was living a double life which caused his problems. He would have been constantly watching his tongue amongst the other Jews and even more so when he was a leader. What a terrible life!

Mixed messages by double minded men! Every man is still a liar when his own interpretations come into play... so every man in that remains double minded. James speaks of the double minded, while Paul speaks of the old man and the new man, and John the Baptist spoke of Him increasing while we are decreasing. Until there is no mixture in a man, that man will not always speak only the Truth. Jesus did... but He never had old ways and sinful habits and wrong beliefs to mix with God's Truth.

A Way [the Holy Spirit] has been provided for men to move up 'higher', but when people have set even some of their beliefs in concrete, they effectively quench the Holy Spirit in them at least part of the time. This is the problem as I see it.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I don't see Scripture showing the need for "two different works of the HS in our salvation".

Hebrews 7:25 (KJV) Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.

its just terms

the holy spirit coming in or being poured out on you is an anointing

You being baptized by God is the baptism..

they are two different events.

think of the holy oil being poured on the OT priests to anoint them.. this happened after the blood was shed to cleans them

 

[Eternally Grateful]

And that is the SAME situation, with 30 Greek Extant New Testament, manuscripts.
That is the same situation, you face, if you go to a Bible Book Store and by 8 different Lexicons, that do not agree on verses.


Just do this.....
Do not trust anyone, as your NT instructor.... or any commentary.... that tells you that the "Original Greek" is superior to the word of God (Bible)
Why not?
Because there is no Original Greek text.
Its all copies, and there are 30 NEW TESTAMENTS in Greek.

The only "originals" were the Apostle's letters, and we can't get those.. @Eternally Grateful

So, just get away from "study helps", and all this side track time wasting situation, and just read a real bible.
And be sure to listen to a teacher that is showing you what im showing you.

lol..

I do not look up the english word baptize

I look up the greek word from which it came

that way I know what it means as written. if everyone did that, we would have so much confusion as

Youy do not want help to help youi understand, thats fine.

but don;t tell me not to use every source I can

 

[Eternally Grateful]

forgiveness of sins

forgiveness - aphesin - to pardon, forgive, to release from to discharge

Sin - paraptom - transgression, sin, trespass, offense

Does this help?