Augustine was a false teacher who deceived many!
WHY not post something from God's Word?
Does God need man?
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Augustine was a false teacher who deceived many!
WHY not post something from God's Word?
Where they‘re right, they’re back. Where they’re wrong, they aren’t back.
I support going back to what scripture teaches.
What does Augustine say in the quote I posted that you disagree with?
See quotes from scripture in other posts of mine (and in posts others).
Even a blind squirrel finds a nut occasionally but this quote is not from the Lord... it's just his own blah blah
He was a pagan monk that claimed to become a Christians when the roman empire claimed to make Christianity it's state religion. He was involved in the watering down of Christianity during these times.
How about updating the one with augustine's quote and replacing his garbage with some scripture?
What exactly did he say in the quote that you object to?
What did he say in the quote that causes you to characterize it as garbage? What did he say in the quote that you believe is contrary to scripture?
St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
Interesting topic, thanks.
I read through page one responses.
But as soon as I read your OP the thought came to me about children.
When I found a mate to marry we had a discussion about whether we wanted children.
The question wasn't whether we needed them. No on does, I suppose. At least in the short-term.
Nice if they take care of you when you get old.
Anyway, it seems to me that we don't NEED our children until we HAVE them.
We become especially aware of this if something happens to them.
I think these emotions that we have for our children are God-given.
And as our heavenly Father, God feels that way about us as well.
Matthew 10:29-31 NIV
Are not two sparrows sold for a penny?
Yet not one of them will fall to the ground outside your Father’s care.[a]
30 And even the very hairs of your head are all numbered.
31 So don’t be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows.
/
I object to the reasoning and wisdom of men, coming from the blind mind of mankind... he was not quoting the Lord's Word.
Romans 3:4
Let God be true, but every man a liar
He teaches many false things so quoting him is highly irresponsible as it leads people to go read his stuff and get deceived.
You have obviously been indoctrinated by his demonic musings so you wouldn't be able to understand
So there‘s nothing specific in what he said in the quote I used which you object to.
You object to quoting someone who isn’t himself (or herself) quoting scripture?
You commented that “Even a blind squirrel finds a nut occasionally” -> implying that Augustine is a blind squirrel who occasionally says something that is correct?
I encourage people to read, widely, deeply, thoughtfully and critically. In my experience, it’s destructive cults that control what people can and can’t read.
I’ve read Augustine but I haven’t been indoctrinated by Augustine.
I encourage people to read what the Lord says... and throw all other writings in the trash, especially those of false teachers such as augustine.
That’s excellent.
Would you then advise your readers to throw your own writings in the trash?
Scripture itself preserves words of some false teachers. The biblical writers appear to have a different attitude toward reading those words than what you’re advising.
Having expressed yourself - which expression contained no quotation of the Lord - I ignored your advice, read what you wrote and commended you for it.
What you said about encouraging people to read what the Lord says was right and good. I found no fault with it.
What I did in response to what you wrote I also do in response to what others write.
I read all of what you wrote. I read it thoughtfully and critically. I agreed with it when I could and disagreed with it when I couldn’t.
What I didn’t do is advise others not to read what you wrote or to throw it in the trash.
My denial of your assertion (and other assertions which you’ve made about me) is unlikely to persuade you to change your mind.
That begs the question: Should you be reading what I write and quoting me?
Let God be true and every man a liar (Romans 3:4)
If anyone says things not backed up by what God says in His Word, then yes.
Yes, as an example of what NOT to believe and what NOT to do.
Augustine's doctrine is not of God and contradicts God's Word on many points, so he's a false teacher those being led by the true Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ... will discard and ignore
But, that doesn't explain how much a wood chuck could chuck IF a wood chuck could chuck wood!
Seeing you have made an idol out of the false teacher augustine... yes, others should ignore you and your recommendation that augustine is someone that should read which will cause them to be de3ceived .
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
As an earth-bound human, Paul was like all of God’s servants assigned to a particular ministry….he was told what he needed to know, when he needed to know it.….and to record what God's spirit told him to write.
It is true that he had visions like other servants did in the past, (like Ezekiel) but as to what “heaven” was, and where it was, no human was ever given that information succinctly, for the simple reason that it was beyond human comprehension at the time the Bible was written. Even today, with all our technical achievements, we would still not understand fully in our present imperfect state. So claiming to know fully what even the apostles were yet to experience is a bit presumptuous IMO. We know only what the Bible says, and it is sketchy at best.
The heavenly visions given to Ezekiel were difficult for him to describe in earthly terms, but he tried his best.
Where in Matthew is this mentioned?
Since Matthew was a Jew, and knew God’s name, (though it was forbidden for Jews to utter it, the divine name was still in their written text) and being a disciple of Jesus, he would not have followed that Jewish practice that was contrary to God's instructions to Moses (Exodus 3:15)…..Jesus said he came to make God’s name known to his disciples.
John 17:6, 26….
“I have made your name manifest to the men whom you gave me out of the world. They were yours, and you gave them to me, and they have observed your word. . . . .I have made your name known to them and will make it known, so that the love with which you loved me may be in them and I in union with them.”
We know that later translators followed that unsanctioned Jewish tradition probably because the pronunciation of the divine name was long lost…..but not the name itself, which in older Greek manuscripts of the Septuagint, God’s name was written in Hebrew characters in the Greek text. So they knew God’s name.
I find it hard to understand how anyone could come to that conclusion. If God is a “spirit” and spirits are invisible unless they manifest materially, (as angels did when delivering messages to God’s servants on earth) we cannot see them. God is invisible. (Col 1:15) How is that part of our reality?
The activity of the demons was prevalent in Jesus’ day (as they are today). Demons are also “spirits” who followed satan in rebellion and materialized in Noah’s day, causing havoc among the human race, leading God to take drastic action to eliminate their gigantic and vile offspring that came from their cohabiting with human women. By causing a flood of unthinkable proportions, God eliminated these freakish offspring and sent their errant fathers back to the spirit realm where they were kept under restraint by not allowing them to ever materialize again. Faithful angels had no problem appearing in physical form thereafter, however.
If the demons had not left their human bodies, they too would have drowned in the flood.
The worst they can do now is to take over the bodies of willing humans who like to dabble in the supernatural.…hence God’s law forbidding all forms of spiritism. (Deut 18:9-12)
God is all knowing (omniscient) but he is never said to be “omnipresent”. He has a location which he never leaves.….simply because he doesn’t need to. He can move about in that realm, as we see in the grand celestial chariot in Ezekiel's vision.....but he has never set foot on earth.
Please present a scripture that says otherwise. Jesus prayed to his “Father…in heaven”…..Jesus was in human form on earth at the time.
“All seeing” and “all knowing” doesn’t change his location. (1 Kings 8:30, 39)
Spirits are by their very nature “disembodied” from our human standpoint…..they dwell in a realm that humans cannot see or be present in, unless they are given the appropriate body…..yes, spirits have bodies but they are nothing like us.
The “chosen ones” will be given an appropriate body upon their resurrection so that they can dwell in the presence of God without it causing their death.
Can I ask where you get these ideas? Do you have a brotherhood who also accepts these concepts or are they just your own beliefs obtained from reading the scriptures for yourself?
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Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
All angels are spirits but they have different ranks and duties. Cherubs are the guardians and Seraphs attend to God at his throne. Angels relay messages to God’s servants, and are an army at the disposal of their Commander in Chief…Michael. (Matt 26:53; Rev 12:7-9)
The idea presented in the Bible is that Jesus is and always has been, “the only begotten son of God”.
Nowhere in all of scripture are we told to worship the son….he told us to worship only the Father. (Luke 4:5-8) The Greek word “pro·sky·neʹo“ corresponds closely to the Hebrew term “hish·ta·chawahʹ“ in expressing the thought of obeisance and, at times, worship. Context determines how the word is rendered…..if it is expressed towards God, it is “worship”, but rendered to a man, it is obeisance. Jesus was a man.
Why avoid the can of worms? Start another thread on this topic and let’s discuss it….we are at least in the same time zone…
Not the way I read that at all….God’s spirit produced the man who was born as Jesus Christ, son of a Jewish virgin, as it was prophesied….who had to be 100% human, or the ransom he paid would have been invalid. Mere humans cannot kill God.
Since God is immortal, he cannot die, but his spirit sons are not immortal in the same sense that God is….just as humans could attain “everlasting life” in their mortal flesh, dependent on their obedience to their Creator, so too the angels are subject to death if they disobey God as well. Satan and his demons will ultimately end their existence in the “lake of fire”…but not until God is finished with them at the end of the thousand year reign of the kingdom. (Rev 20:1-3)
They do, but not material bodies…..that is the nature of spirits, they have to materialize or else they would just be voices speaking out of thin air. We know that Gabriel spoke to Daniel who described him as “an able bodied man”…..Mary too was visited by Gabriel some 500 years later to inform her of the child she would bear. He appeared to her as a man. No wings. Do angels really need wings? Or are they to convey the ability to fly or to transport themselves to humans who only knew that birds could fly?
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
I don’t believe that God resurrects people only to judge and destroy them…what would be the point of that?
What is a resurrection after all? Didn’t Jesus and his apostles demonstrate what a resurrection meant to Jews back in the first century? What about Lazarus? Where did Jesus say he was before bringing him back to life? (John 11:11-14)
Since the Jews were never taught about immortal souls in their scripture, there was no excuse to later adopt that pagan belief from the Greeks….Jews were taught that resurrection was a return to life after a time spent in Sheol (the grave) which is the place from which Jesus calls all the dead after he has taken over rulership of this earth and cleansed it of wickedness. (John 5:28-29) For those in the grave, time has stood still…they are not in a conscious state. (Eccl 9:5, 10; Psalm 115:17) They will awaken to continue their lives as Lazarus did with no recollection of time, no matter how long they have slept.
Gathered where?
1 Thess 4:15-17…
“For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep.
For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.
Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord.”
Where are the “chosen ones” who are still alive when Christ comes as judge? His elect will meet their Lord where the ”clouds“ are….”in the air”…..it is then that they are “transformed”, being given a new spirit body so as to join their Lord to complete his bride.
Incidentally, why does the Lord have an archangel’s voice?
I looked up “ἁρπάζω” and I assume you are a believer in the rapture? Is this something done against their will?
Is it an evil force that causes a transformation that they do not want? Or is it something they look forward to?
What was your point?
I was actually trying to figure out if this was all your own work, or something others taught you….it matters.
No Christian is at liberty to interpret scripture for themselves in isolation from others….if God’s spirit was directing them, they would all be in agreement because God’s spirit unites people…it does not divide them. Christendom is a disunited mess….no real evidence of God’s spirit is discernible in any of it.
If Christ taught us to be preachers of his truth, then who has it? They all preach something different.
The “wheat” still exist even in a world overrun by the “weeds”....so who are they?
Luke 12:51
Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:
Division between those being led by the Spirit verses those being led by the flesh
Just as I don’t have much theologically in common with Augustine, I don’t have much theologically in common with you. Yet there is some theological common ground between us.
Your logic makes everyone, yourself included, an idolater.
Says the guy giving out quotes by a false teacher!
The irony is hilarious homie!
And you still give out quotes from this guy?
That's like giving out quotes by Adolph Hitler and then back peddling to say you don't have much agreement with Hitler!
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