7 Common Errors of Interpretation for Chapters 4-6 of Revelation

[ewq1938]

So you believe the rapture happens after jesus returns or after the millenial kingdom.

The day Christ returns at the 7th trump, before the start of the Mill.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Nope. Scripture says he comes at the last trumpet, not last vial.

So Jesus comes back and then pours the seven vials according to you. Okay then.

It is about being delivered from God's wrath. Rev 12 states Christians are intended to receive the wrath of satan.

Sorry, but Rev. 12 is about Satan seeking genocide against the Jews. Context matters. The woman is Israel. The church did not give birth to Jesus, Israel did.

He said last trumpet not last vial and the only last trumpet in any Christian/NT prophecy is the 7th. You are inventing an unknown amount of more trumpets to have a false last trumpet other than the 7th.

Well you are wrong because millions disagree with you. And no I am not inventing trumpets. I am referring to the feast of trumpets as a type of the rapture and that the final trumpet sound is called the "last trump:.

Nowhere in Scripture do you see the seventh trumpet called the last trump. But by your theology, you are forced to have Jesus returning while God is pouring out the vials!

Revelation 15

King James Version

​

15 And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God.

The bible calls the vials the last plagues, which means that these happen after the trumpets.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

The day Christ returns at the 7th trump, before the start of the Mill.

Well you are contradicitng yourself!

The rapture is not the resurrection. The resurrection happens first, then after it is fully completed the rapture takes place.

YOu say the rapture happens after the resurrection is fully completed.

And the bible describes when the resurrection is fully completed.

7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.

12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

The resurrection according to the bible is completed after the 1,000 years. so which of your statements do we reject?​

 

[ewq1938]

The resurrection according to the bible is completed after the 1,000 years. so which of your statements do we reject?​

I was speaking of completion of the first resurrection, not the second.

 

[ewq1938]

Sorry, but Rev. 12 is about Satan seeking genocide against the Jews. Context matters. The woman is Israel. The church did not give birth to Jesus, Israel did.

And if you read the full chp you will see his efforts fail then he goes on to start a war against Christians. It is found in Rev 13 and is successful as the saints are overcome. That war is the GT and is against Christians not Jews.

Well you are wrong because millions disagree with you. And no I am not inventing trumpets. I am referring to the feast of trumpets as a type of the rapture and that the final trumpet sound is called the "last trump:.

That is not a concept found in NT prophecy./ The only trumpets any prophet speaks of are the 7 of the end times which end with the Coming.

Nowhere in Scripture do you see the seventh trumpet called the last trump.

Wrong. Basic counting shows that the 7th of something is the last of them. There is no 8th trump.

But by your theology, you are forced to have Jesus returning while God is pouring out the vials!

No, he returns just before they pour.

The bible calls the vials the last plagues, which means that these happen after the trumpets.

Naturally when the 7th sounds, the vials pour.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I was speaking of completion of the first resurrection, not the second.

can you show me in scripture that the rapture happens after jesus returns and after the first resurrection after He has already returned to earth?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

And if you read the full chp you will see his efforts fail then he goes on to start a war against Christians. It is found in Rev 13 and is successful as the saints are overcome. That war is the GT and is against Christians not Jews.

Well then let us look at the chapter.

12 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:

2 And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.

4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.

16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.

17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

1.Only one woman in this chapter. Israel. Satan tries to destroy her child (Jesus)
2. That same woman (Israel flees to the wilderness for 3 1/2 years.
3. Vse 13 Satan [persecutes that same woman (Israel)
4. Vse 14 The woman (Israel is given wings ) to be cared for for 3 1/2 years.
5. Vse 15&16 the earth helps the woman(Israel) and swallows the flood
6. Vse 17 Satan is angry with the woman (Israel) and goes to make war with her seed (Israelites) which have been saved!


So where exactly is the church here??????????????

That is not a concept found in NT prophecy./ The only trumpets any prophet speaks of are the 7 of the end times which end with the Coming.

So Jesus returns and teh vials are poured out after He returns. Okay now we know where you stand.

No, he returns just before they pour.

Paul speaks of the rapture as something to be comforted by- not with your theology.

Jesus returns, god pours the last 7 vials on the earth.

Revelation 11:15
And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

So Jesus returns right before the antichrist takes world power and th emark is instituted.

Then the vials happen in REv. 16 while Jesus is on earth. So He is here while God is punishing the earth.

Sores break out on all who have the mark
Sea becomes blood and all fish life dies
All fresh water becomes undrinkable
Sun heats up and scorches mankind with great heat
antichrist throne city is plunged into a darkness that causes intense pain
Sixth vial dries up the Euphrates to make way for the kings of the east and three demons go out to gather worlds armies to battle in the great Day of God!
7th vial- great events hit the earth.

Then rev. 17&18 an angel shows John the judgment of the Babylonian false religious system (the great harlot) and the city of Babylon which was the capitol of the antichrist.

Then REv. 19 shows the physical return of Jesus with the saints from heaven!!!!!!! but wait how can they be in heaven if the rapture hasn't happened yet according to you???????

 

[ewq1938]

6. Vse 17 Satan is angry with the woman (Israel) and goes to make war with her seed (Israelites) which have been saved!


So where exactly is the church here??????????????

You didn't read it very well:

Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

You didn't read it very well:

Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Okay time for a basic grammar lesson. this is a compound sentence which does not follow the sharp-granville rule. so this means that they which keep the commandment and have the testimony of Jesus is a double reference to the remnant of her seed (Israel).

Now we know that believers ( I do not call them Christians as that refers to teh bride of Christ which is raptured before the trib begins) will be persecuted and even beheaded for being believers, but it is not based on the Rev. 12:17 statement. That is grammatically impossible and God is the god of grammar.

 

[ewq1938]

Okay time for a basic grammar lesson. this is a compound sentence which does not follow the sharp-granville rule. so this means that they which keep the commandment and have the testimony of Jesus is a double reference to the remnant of her seed (Israel).

Now we know that believers ( I do not call them Christians as that refers to teh bride of Christ which is raptured before the trib begins)

This is a problem. You are created two different kings of followers of Jesus, calling one believers and the other Christians. Any believer in Jesus is a Christian and of the church and Bride.

So, I was right when I said the war/trib is against Christians.

 

[6 Stories]

Nope. Two churches are not the same as two anointed people (the two olives trees)

In scripture, olive trees feed olive oil to the candlesticks so they can have a flame. To say the candlestick and the olive trees are the same is just wrong.

There is a reason why Rev 11 does not say the two witnesses are killed and lay in the street for 3.5 days. It's only one of those two witnesses who do, the two prophets which are two people rather than two churches which is a larger number of people.

Rev starts talking about the two witnesses and explains how there are 4 things that compose this concept, then it focuses on only part of that with the death of the two prophets.

3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.
6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.
7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.
8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.
9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.
10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.

We start with 2 witnesses in verse 3 and we end with 2 prophets in verse 10, therefore verse 4 does not refer to 2 olive trees plus 2 candlesticks; a total of 4 witnesses/prophets.

Verse 10 specifically shows how all of the pronouns between verses 3 and 10 refer to 2 and not to 4.

 

[6 Stories]

That's not what the bible says.

Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

The sign of the Son is directly tied to the second coming. The two prophets are already in heaven and have joined Christ's following army by the time of this verse.

Matt 24:30 "And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory."

I am going to brush my teeth and then I am going to go to bed.
This is a sequence of 2 different events that happen at 2 different times.

 

[6 Stories]

The only ones the coming false-Messiah will go after are those who 'refuse' to bow to the "image of the beast" IDOL that he will setup for the whole world to bow in worship to, or be killed.

I agree with this, but in war there are casualties on both sides. In order to kill those who refuse to bow, AC is willing to sacrifice his whole army. Mankind would be wiped out without God's intervention.

And that won't be until the very END of the "great tribulation".

I agree that it will take some time to put up this image of the beast, but why do you say that it won't be until the very End of the great tribulation? The reign of AC and the FP comes to an end at the very end of the great tribulation.

So study the plight that Daniel and his fellows went through with refusing to bow to Nebuchadnezzar's idol. Same idea for the END.

I agree with the comparison, but Nebuchadnezzar did not wait until the end of his rule to set up the image.

And even then, with those of us that refuse to bow to the coming Antichrist's "image of the beast", or refuse his 'mark', that does not mean all of us. If it did, then there would be no Church left on earth when Jesus comes to gather His saints.

Mark 13:13
13 And ye shall be hated of all men for My name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
KJV

Luke 21:17-20
17 And ye shall be hated of all men for My name's sake.
18 But there shall not an hair of your head perish.
19 In your patience possess ye your souls.
20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.
KJV

I also agree with this.

The fact remains that God will have to intercede in order for life to continue according to these words.

 

[6 Stories]

You have no Scripture evidence to treat that vision of the elders with crowns as having already being in effect. It's not, John was given a vision of a future event with those elders, and by the below verse you should have picked that understanding up...

Rev 5:9-10
9 And they sung a new song, saying, "Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for Thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by Thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;
10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.
KJV

The 4 living creatures and the 24 elders sing songs 1 and 2 below:

Song 1 Rev 4:11 " Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created."

This song reflects the fact that mankind was originally saved by faith in their Creator God. It would have been sung in heaven for everyone with faith in this Creator beginning with Adam. Mankind is not in heaven during from Adam until the ascension of Jesus into heaven.

Song 2 Rev 5:9-10
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;
10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

The new song reflects a new reality. The same heavenly creatures sing about the fact that mankind is saved by faith in their Redeemer God, Jesus. It has been sung in heaven since the moment of Jesus' arrival in heaven after he was a man. After Jesus' arrival, the spirits of mankind are allowed into heaven.

Song 3 Rev 14:2-3
2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:
3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.

This new song reflects another new reality. Not only the spirits, but also the bodies of the 144,000 are allowed into heaven.

Each song begins when the reality of it begins.

Might want to get busy and do that Old Testament homework in the prophets. Joel 2 wasn't quoted by Apostle Peter on Pentecost in Acts 2 for nothing.
About that earthquake on the 6th Seal of Rev.6:12, that's not the same great earthquake that happens when Jesus returns.

I agree. This is the earthquake that ends the period of great tribulation. It is the earthquake that occurs when the 2 witnesses arise.

You should break that Rev.6:13 verse down that happens next, because it is about the stars of heaven falling to the earth.

This verse is about the tear in the firmament that separates the waters above from the waters below. People on earth will get a glimpse into heaven just after the earthquake of Rev 6:12. The 2 witnesses/144,000 will be seen in heaven.

Per Rev.12:3-4, the "red dragon" (Lucifer) drew a third of the stars (angels) to earth at his rebellion in the old world which God destroyed.

Rev 12:3-4 is about Satan trying to kill the infant Jesus. See Matt 2.

At Rev.6:14 forward is actually about Jesus' coming.

I agree.

Thus the 6th Seal is in TWO parts. The first part is about the future Rev.12:7-17 events when Satan and his angels are booted out of the heavenly dimension down to our earth, in OUR earthly dimension.

Rev 12:7-17 is what happens in heaven during the first 4 trumpets. There is woe on earth after 4 trumpets, which is also seen in Rev 12:12 because Satan has been cast from heaven to earth. It will take Satan some time to form the last world empire, the last 3.5 years of that empire, Satan will rule. Only those 3.5 years are the great tribulation.

That is what will kick off the coming "great tribulation"...

Thanks

Some of that is WILD, and not Bible Scripture at all.

FACT: not all the 144,000 represent Jews...

Before Jesus returns, the 2 witnesses will die, be raised from the dead, and ascend into heaven. That is, they will become the firstfruits, the first of mankind since Jesus to arrive in heaven with their transfigured body. Only the 2 witnesses of Rev 11 fit the description of Rev 14:1-5.

"Stories"? Sounds like men's doctrine. The idea of 'selah' is written... in the Psalms. So I wouldn't be so quick to pass that idea off in favor of men's 'stories' instead.

Once you compare how each story ends, you won't be able to view the Revelation from any other perspective. You can't unsee it, once you have seen it.

Charts mean absolutely nothing if they don't align with Bible Scripture. And I guarantee your's do not, simply because the first part of the 6th Seal of Rev.6:12-13 is about Satan's coming at the end of this world, PRIOR to Christ's return. And I already covered that. That idea of the "untimely figs" of Rev.6:13 is a metaphor that not that many understand, so you've got a lot of company. Likewise with the Rev.12:7-9 event, many try to push that back in history when Satan first rebelled, which is an erroneous interpretation, though popular.

Like I said, per Rev.14 & 15, the new song, and song of Moses, are sung by Christ's elect AFTER His future return. Those are visions of future events that John was given to see.

The events of Rev 14 and 15 are in chronological order. Rev 14:1-5 occurs before Rev 14:14, the return of Jesus.
Likewise, the events of Rev 15:1-3 occur before Rev 16:21, the return of Jesus.
To be continued.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

This is a problem. You are created two different kings of followers of Jesus, calling one believers and the other Christians. Any believer in Jesus is a Christian and of the church and Bride.

So, I was right when I said the war/trib is against Christians.

Well you have a problem. IN Rev. 19, you said the church is raptured after teh first resurrection is complete (after you said just the resurrection is complete.) But in Revelation 19 we see the church, the bride of Jesus in heaven with her robes of righteousness!

5 And a voice came out of the throne, saying, Praise our God, all ye his servants, and ye that fear him, both small and great.

6 And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth.

7 Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.

8 And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.

The wife of Jesus in REv. 19 is already made ready! but you have part of the church still on earth struggling to survive and waiting for Jesus to return. So you have the bride ready in heaven and the bride not ready on earth!

For Jesus returns after this scene in heaven, before the first resurrection takes place.

John the Baptist was a believer in Jesus and he was not part of the bride. He himself said that he was but a friend of the bridegroom.

OT saints are not part of the church, nor are the tribulation saints. They are all saved and redeemed, but the bride of Jesus is limited.

 

[6 Stories]

The main purpose of Rev.7 is the 'sealing' of God's servants for the END of this present world. The 144,000 that are sealed in the first part of that chapter represent Christ's very elect of the seed of Israel.

I agree.

The "great multitude" mentioned later are the Gentiles in Christ's Church that are also 'sealed' with God's seal by The Holy Spirit. With them, John is shown a vision of their future time with Christ after His future return.

The great multitude died and went to heaven. Death is the means by which they came out of the great tribulation.

Not just the 144,00. The "great multitude" of Gentiles in Rev.7 represent firstfruits in Christ also...

James 1:18
18 Of His own will begat He us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of His creatures.
KJV

Rom 8:23
23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
KJV

There were 3 festivals that all Jewish males were supposed to attend, Passover, Pentecost, and Tabernacles.
Jesus was the firstfruits of Passover.
Christians are the firstfruits of Pentecost.
The 144,000 will be the firstfruits of Tabernacles.
Elijah will come at Passover when Jews leave their door open and set an extra place at the table for him. Start of GT.
3.5 years later, Elijah will rise into heaven during Tabernacles. End of GT.
The 2 witnesses/144,000/Elijah will be seen in heaven as the firstfruits of Tabernacles, the first of those in heaven with resurrected bodies.
Interestingly, the book of Jonah is read on the day of atonement, preparing Jews for the sign of the son of man - the death, resurrection, and ascension of the 2 witnesses.

The "spirits in prison" represent ALL... those who had died prior to Christ's death and resurrection, not only saints. Per Apostle Peter in 1 Peter 3 & 4, Jesus preached The Gospel to those in Satan's prison house, and led out of darkness those who 'believed'. Those became saints by their Faith on The Gospel of Jesus Christ. But all of those "spirits in prison" were then judged according to men in the flesh so they might live according to God in the spirit. That event was first prophesied in Isaiah 42:7 about the time of Christ's 1st coming.

The point being that they were not yet in heaven because heaven wasn't yet prepared by the slain Lamb.

Where's your proof that the "great multitude" of Rev.7 are the "dead in Christ"? That idea is not written there. Instead, John is given a future... view about those in the world to come. The idea that they came out of great tribulation is about their having gone through it, not necessarily having been killed by it.

They had to be in the great tribulation on earth to come out of it.
The whole seen in Rev 9-17 is in heaven.
How else do people leave earth and go to heaven?
It's not the rapture because the 30 minutes of silence in heaven is the lack of a song in heaven. It is the 30 minutes of the ascension of the 2 witnesses.
Then God the Father comes to earth in Rev 8:5 with thunders, voices, and lightnings, and an earthquake.
In sequence, Jesus follows God the Father to earth. This is when hail occurs after the thunders, voices, lightnings and earthquake.

And no, that "great multitude" does not... include Jews. The Jews among the 144,000 are the only Israelites of the seed that are 'sealed'. So I don't know why in the world you would try to push that idea of Jews among the great multitude.

Romans 11:25 " For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in."

Not all Jews have rejected Jesus. Jews who have believed in Jesus from the time of Pentecost have been sealed with the Holy Spirit just like Christians. Some of these Messianic Jews will also be killed during the period of great tribulation.

The 144,000 Jews will become Christians or Messianic Jews just like all other Jews who have been sealed with the Holy Spirit since Pentecost. They will become Christians before the new Roman Empire is blown in. They don't receive their special powers until they show themselves as Elijah and enter Jewish homes at Passover just as the GT is getting ready to begin. At evening, the Passover meal will be served. The next morning, the daily Lamb sacrifice will be stopped. Jews will flee.

 

[6 Stories]

Well for the church, the change takes place at the last rump (not the 7th trump of revelation) It is okay if you do not accept it, we all will see when it comes.

I believe there is a millennium between the trump (voice) of God in 1 Thes and the last trump (voice) of God in 1 Cor.

As for being seen being caught up? You are forming a conclusion based on other events. Just because Jesus and the witnesses were seen does not mean the people caught up in the rapture will be seen. Like I said, time will tell.

Do you have any evidence that the rapture will be invisible?

1 Thes 4:16-17
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: (Are these dead bodies coming out of the ground going to be invisible also?)
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. (How could the dead and the living going up in the air be a sign if nobody can see it?)

Why doesn't the Bible just say that Christians will disappear?

 

[6 Stories]

If you don't know what I mean, how can you get my point?

Even with 2 world wars, it was still closer to 10% with 90% from natural causes.

The point is that at the Second Coming it will be 25% of the population that suddenly dies of war, plague, and famine. Or simply the rapture removing people from the earth.

A government leader tries to take over the world through war. War brings famine and pestilence. Death from the government leader, war, famine, and pestilence, is limited to 25% of the population. No government leader has had the ability to bring death to more than 25% of the world population in any generation since the first century.

There will be a future government leader that will be able to bring death to the whole generation of people on earth, but God will intervene before he is successful.

AC will reign for exactly 42 months. During his reign, he will bring death to 1/3 of the world population as stated in Rev 9:13. "And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for to slay the third part of men." To believe that AC will kill 1/4 plus 1/3 of the earth is contrary to what is stated in Rev 9:13.

The time of the 6th trumpet from Rev 9:13 to Rev 11:14 contains the whole 42-month reign of AC. Chapter 13 of the Revelation covers this same period of time.

The rapture is not part of any of these verses.

 

[6 Stories]

The 7th trump is the last trump in prophecy.

The 7th trumpet comes from an angel.
The last trump is the voice of God the Father, just as the trump of 1 Thes 4 is the voice of God the Father.
Therefore, the 7th trump and the last trump are different.

Rev 1:10-11
10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,
11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last:

Jesus' voice is described as many waters. 1:15
"And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters."

 

[6 Stories]

We will bear the exact same image forever, glad I was born a pretty boy (LOL).

wooohooo!

Well, for starters Paul told us "I show you a mystery" and mystery comes from the Greek word musterion and half the word (muo the derivative) ) means God is silent by closing the mouth. So, God never gave the "Rapture to the Jews because their destiny is to rule with Jesus in the Kingdom Age, so why would God confuse them with a Rapture of the Bride of Christ? Israel is the bride of God, we are the Bride of Christ, Rachel was the preferred bride, Leah the forced bride. Jacob had two brides. In Revelation the 144,000 (5 million Jews or 1/3) have the Fathers name on their forehead. You guys fail to see the big picture because you get lost in the minutia at times. Romans chapters 9-11 explains it all, but Satan is good at whispering half truths.

So, what is the Fulness of the Gentiles? many actually think it means the Gentile rule, but if that is true then why is the Beast only said to rule for 42 months? People fail to understand there has been no Beast for nigh 2000 years, because the Beast was put forth by God over Israel for 490 years of penance, and 483 of those years passed with Jesus' death, they have only 7 years left once they are put back on the clock. But can you read Romans chapters 9-11 and tell when that will happen? Its there for all to see.

Let me give a quick synapsis. In Rom. 9 Paul tells how God called Abraham and promised a child and in Isaac shall thy seed be called. Then Isaac and Rebecca conceived and before either was born, God chose Jacob over Esau, (do you gets that this is ALL ABOUT SERVICE via God's choosing yet? That vet important later on in chapter 11). And God said the Elder shall serve the Younger (Israel will be an elder unto the Church, its a FORESHADOWING). Then Paul says God hardened Pharaoh heart so who can resist His will. (But he is referring unto SERVICE unto God). Later on Paul refers to God as the Potter who molds the clay vessel. Then in chapter 10 Paul quotes Isaiah and says "I was found of them that sought me not; I was made manifest unto them that asked not after me." So heading into chapter 11 its VERY CLEAR, Paul is talking about service unto God and how God choses as He so pleases, when He pleases and whom He pleases to serve Him.

In Ch. 11 Paul starts out by saying God has not cast his people away forever, but he later says Israel were cut off because of unbelief but if they turn from their unbelief they would one day be grafted back into God's family. Lastly, he says this:

Romm. 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. 26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

Let me break it down. Blindness IN PART means as a Nation only they are blinded, not as individual Jews, of course, God draws all men unto Him, but why couldn't Israel repent as a nation? The Diaspora, its hard to repent as a nation when you are no longer a nation !! So, until 1948 this was not even a possibility, they were as "Dead Men's Bones" just as Ezekiel 37 foretold they would be until the very end times. So, in order for Israel as a Nation to be grafted back in they have to turn from their blindness as a Nation, and they are now a nation, BUT.........they still will not repent until the Fulness of the Gentiles [Service] is come in. So, only when the Gentile Churches mission is complete will the 70th week begin. The church was not here for the 69 weeks, we will not be here for the 70th week, our mission is to spread the Gospel unto the world, that MISSION has to be complete by the time Israel's 70th week of penance falls on them. The Mortal Wound was Rome converting to Christianity. Only when the Church is gone does the Beast arise again. It takes a Beast over Israel before the 70th week penance can be completed.

Israel is blinded until the end of that 70th week. AC reigns for the 2nd half of that week, 42 months. The fullness of the gentiles comes in during the 2nd half of that week as stated in Rev 7:9-14
9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.
11 And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God,
12 Saying, Amen: Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. Amen.
13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation,

To me, "the fullness of the Gentiles coming in" during "the time of the great tribulation" seems pretty straightforward and contrary to your view.

So, you thinking God should have vast details of a "Peoples God had not known" makes ZERO SENSE brother, why would God want to confuse Israel with an event that is not targeted unto them for the most part? Israel's mission was to 1.) Birth the Messiah and 2.) Rule with the Messianic King during the Kingdom Age. The Churches mission was evangelize the whole world after Israel rejected God in person, Jesus Christ. Our missions do not cross paths via the timeline.

Where did the Beast leave off? Rome, where does it back back up? The exact same place.

THE WOUND WAS HEALED.

View attachment 41206
Rome Received the Mortal Wound above

The E.U. after the Rapture will Heal the Mortal Wound by conquering as Dann. 11:40-43 shows.
View attachment 41207

CONTINUED...........

I agree that the Roman Empire will be reborn. However, it will have 10 kings. The EU has many more than 10 kings.